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Bjork talks about her experience with Lars Von Trier.
- Thread starter torre_avenue
- Start date
Pai Pai Master
Banned
I hate this meme now because half the people who spout it don't know what it actually means, they just want to say a funny term.
Doctor Decimate
Member
When a guy writes a bad character on a piece of paper he's the real villain but an abusive director is just "injecting realism" huh
Master Of Illusion
Member
The guy who insists on shooting unsimulated sex scenes?
Who'da thought...
Who'da thought...
King Tubby
Member
Milkshake duck is itself a milkshake duck now. Am I milkshake ducking it right?
Again, Kubrick was all round sbusive to actors.
Nothing suggests he was sexist towards Shelly Duvall. Cruel, yes. But he was also cruel to Scatman Cruthers and Jack Nicholson. So until actual stories come out about him, can we stop acting like he's anything to do with these recent scandals?
Doctor Decimate
Member
Which doesn't really change the fundamental stupidity of shifting the blame to King and his fictional characters here when there's like...real people here? It doesn't matter if Kubrick was equal opportunity abusive or not. The point is that these are people and those are things on a piece of paper.
I don't think it's fair to frame Kubrick as abusive. He was definitely a very tough director to work but I don't think there is any stories of him abusing or harassing for the sake of things. I think there is difference between directors who are perfectionist like Kubrick, Fincher, and Haneke and those who are abusive on set like Von Trier or David O Russel.
Kubrick pushed all his actors to the limit be they male, female, white, coloured or whatever (apart from kids, everything I've rea notes he was very protective of children). Being demanding and strivin for perfection isn't remotely abuse in the sense Bjorn is talking about and it's pretty dangerous to veer into this territory with no evidence.
Most performers sang his praises despite the tough environment and many felt rejected because (a few exceptions aside) he rarely re-used the same actors.
And to be blunt King is straight up wrong. He half assed his characters in The Shining and shied away from painting his leads in a bad light particularly Jack Torrance. Kubrick never pulled punches really and merely showed true mysoginy in the characters an their actions. Accurately portraying real mysoginy isn't being mysoginistic yourself.
There's never been any accusation of note Kubrick was in any way sexist or racist nor any hint in his work. If anything he shows his disdain for humanity's failings by shoving our face in clear examples of how racist or mysoginistic or cruel or evil we can be to express his contempt for such base behaviour.
Mind you he did damn near blind poor Malcom Macdowell in that chair with his eyes propped open so there's no doubt he'd push everyone really far to try and create the perfect image and film.
I have heard it used twice in real life by non-GAF users. It's happening.
As long as she keeps the n-word out of her mouth she's cool with me.
Lars Von Trier should stop making movies. There are so many stories of him abusing his actresses, if he needs to be a vile human just to get a certain performance for his Art he shouldn't be allowed to make it.
Kubrick was definitely abusive to the point of being irresponsible. People can dress it up all they want as being a single-minded perfectionist but that led to him being emotionally abusive of Duvall.
He wasn't alone. Numerous directors from that era pushed all kinds of boundaries.
He wasn't alone. Numerous directors from that era pushed all kinds of boundaries.
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
lol. Wooden Allen most likely molested his seven-year-old daughter, and married his wife's adopted daughter, but sure, he's a champion of women's rights 🙄
Yah but what's more irresponsible is opaquing the real sexual abuse of Weinstein or Bjorn's points about Lars VonTrier with another topic that has nothing to do with it. Whether Kubrick pushed actors too far is an interesting conversation but it has no place in a topic about sexual abuse and runs the risk of having people starting to propagate the idea he was some kind of sexual abuser.
The guy aimed for perfection and any actor working with him knew it particularly from his early films onward. It was tough for some actors for sure but hardly predatory abuse happening in secret thar left real long term scars. Nicholson noted his first thought when Kubrick died was you bastard now we can't make another film together.
There's a thread that would be interesting on this but it's off topic for this conversation. And as I'm guilty of being diverted by it I'll stop now too.
Harrison Bergeron
Member
Yeah there are plenty of characters like this in the arts who are celebrated as creeps. Wonder if Terry Richardson is going to finally get some flak too.
I honestly don't see any sort of dilemma as you can both acknowledge the art and the scumbag as separate entities
You have to separate the art from the artist. Roman Polanski directed some of my favorite movies but he's a vile piece of shit.
Sweeney Tom
Banned
Hitchcock immediately comes to mind
Hasphat'sAnts
Member
My man Woody made a movie about how great it is for a 40 year old man to fuck a 17 year old.
Let's get real here.
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
Wasn't that what he did in real life too? He married his wife's daughter when she was 21, but he probably had sex with her and groomed her long before that.
Hasphat'sAnts
Member
He also fondled his 7 year old adoptive daughter, but since no one believes the victim, it's just Woody being Woody.
Yep, that's what I do anyway. Fassbinder is a great director but he was a notoriously cruel to those around him.
It's just not nice to think about the torment people had to face in order to make the film.
llien
Member
User you were responding to didn't forget to read, unless you mean reading between lines.
There is no direct statement that says that in OP.
Allegedly. Circumstances (revenge, a panel of psychologists, appointed by US prosecutors and the police, concluding that Dylan had not been molested) are far too unclear to make your statement so categorically.
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
Right, I brought that up before too.
Fuck Woody Allen.
Not quite
Moreover, 20 years later Dylan still maintains her story. Woody Allen denies it and there has never been concrete legal proof, so believe whoever you like, but considering everything else we know about Woody Allen, I believe Dylan.
Snowman Prophet of Doom
Member
Yes, it's not as if there's a shit-ton of countervailing evidence and contradictory testimonies that suggest that, at the very least, there is a reasonable doubt as to his guilt, if not put the weight of things on the side of his innocence.
Edit: Moreover, your reading of Manhattan is fucking grossly wrong (his character is not supposed to be a good person, even if he is likable), but that's neither here nor there.
Monocle
Member
It's some posters' way of trying to make fetch happen. I.E. a dumbass meme that doesn't deserve to catch on because it sounds lame.
torre_avenue
Banned
At best bad enough for his daughter to warrant protection from him, at worst a molester. Great.
BiGBoSSMk23
A company being excited for their new game is a huge slap in the face to all the fans that liked their old games.
Can we PLEASE remove this fucking bullshit from the discussion of serious issues?
It's not funny.
You're not clever.
And it's stupidity shows extremely poor taste in most topics it's brought up.
OT:
This guy is a fucking weirdo. That much was evident from his films, but that shouldn't mean he'd be an abusive sexual predator by default. But, hey...
I really hope no more renowned weirdos turn out like this.
It would cast another negative shade over the already stigmatized oddball/creative/loner stereotype. (Thinking of Refn, specifically lol)
He truly is disgusting. I'm confused people needed further elaboration to understand this, it seemed pretty clear to me. And the woody defense force is pretty vile too.