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[Amir0x]

how do you figure? i hope your reasoning for this isn't because they're not leading in market / consumer mind share, because with that logic, Microsoft had no right to say "full force online" with xbox, or this new "HD Era" stuff they're preaching.

I'm not defending Microsoft here. Read the other thread, I'm just as skeptical as what they can do. I do, however, feel they will do better than Nintendo for one key reason - they understand the pulse of the consumer community a bit better than Nintendo does when it comes to consoles. I don't necessarily mean with the games they make (although obviously Halo 2 proved they can mass market like nobodies business), I mean in terms of how they sell their products. To be blunt, they're better than Nintendo here. And it's possible that they are also more adaptable than Sony in this regard. The MTV unveiling proves this. And no matter how idealistic we are about the gaming community, this is extremely important. It's even more important when you're intent on pushing your product in such a different direction.

Obviously, we don't really know how Nintendo will handle the Revolution push, and it's far too early to speculate as much.

what it comes down to is, Nintendo is creating their own system, and they can do whatever the fuck they please with it. they have just as much right as anyone else to say what direction the industry should go in. call me a fanboy if you want, but considering that they're responsible for most of the standards we have today, i'd straight up say they have more right than sony or MS to say what they feel the future of game design should be.

That's... not the point. I can release a product called "Shit on a stick" and try to market it, but if the industry doesn't believe it will sell or consumers don't like it, "Shit on a stick" is not going to be having any say on where the "objects on a stick" market goes.

It's clear from THIS generation of consoles that consumers are more than happy with the way things are, or else they would not continue to make this the industry grow as such astonishing rates. And I think the indications are that they will follow suite next generation. That's just a personal opinion, obviously, but I am confident that it is the correct assumption.

you're basing this on all the developer feed back i take it?

Well, all things equal -

We have a PS3, we have an Xbox 360 and we have a Revolution.

By all accounts, XB360 will be out by the end of this year. PS3 and Revolution will follow in 2006... supposedly. We already hear neverending plans from developers about what they will do for PS3 and what they will do for XB360. What's the reason Revolution has not even been mentioned in most plans from big developers? Saying you're supporting that system certainly wouldn't reveal what "big giant industry changing" plans Nintendo has in mind. But nothing (Note: I know it's not literally nothing. Camelot has announced plans. I believe Namco has said they intend to in passing, as has Capcom).

Once again, it's still early. I know that, you know that. We also both know that plenty of developers will pledge some form of support for Revolution. You'd have to be foolish to believe otherwise.

What I am suggesting is that the priorities here are clearly not leaning towards Nintendo's direction, and nothing except ideological banter from admitted hardline Nintendo fans indicates anything about why the entire industry would suddenly shift in Nintendo's general direction when they have not proven themselves the last two gens to be in touch with consumers in the console sector (comparative to Sony). You guys seem to be taken this as some sort of personal insult, but it's the truth.

Again, there's a lot we just don't know. And I'm sure your tireless faith in Nintendo and whatever insider info you have causes you to once more trumpet their great historic value. I myself am a huge Nintendo fan. But I am also not delusional, and truthfully I cannot see them ever guiding the direction the console-side industry goes again. Can I be wrong? Of course. I would not dare suggest otherwise. I just don't believe I am.

granted, they don't have the same consumer mind share as Sony or MS, but last time i checked, the numbers go back to 0 come next life cycle, and uh yeah, that's something that MS is totally banking on. why can't Nintendo?

No, see, that's the single most simplistic outlook you could possibly have. SALES wise, of course numbers go to 0. MINDSHARE wise absolutely does not revert back to zero. Consumers have a thing called brand loyality. It exists in essentially every major market that is around. It takes a major misstep or a change of incredible importance to cause consumers to lead off from that brand loyality and try something else out. I believe you feel that this "incredibly important" aspect is exactly why you feel Nintendo will win consumers back over. I, however, do not see consumers desire for such changes in the console sector. I don't see it in terms of the types of peripherals or games that sell, and the only market that really has shown such enthusiasm for these types of products has been the handheld sector with Nintendo's wildly succesive DS. And the handheld market has always been ruled by them, so we can't even properly quantify how much has to do with mindshare - just like Sony entering into the 256bit gen.

i hope you never develop a game, or run a videogame company.

I know, I know... you want ass controlled videogames and taste-bud activated input devices, but I think the consumers will continue to be satisfied with much of what we have now. The only difference, of course, is that possibilities will continue to be opened by advanced technology. And, as I said, Nintendo is in no trouble financially, so I'm sure they will carve their own unique, impressive niche whose games I will continue to love regardless of massive market success (by marketshare). And I'll appreciate that difference, because it's what makes Nintendo important to me.

But it's just not where I see the industry going. Where I see the industry going. And if I'm reading the signs correctly, I don't think many people disagree with me.

It's pretty hard for outsiders such as yourself or I, who have no clue what Revolution looks like or what MS potentially has up its sleeve to determine who developers think are important. The only thing important to developers is making money and in that sense, developers and publishers have no allegiance to anything but this:

$$$$$$$$$$

You said it. $$$$$$$$$. And third party developers have made more money with Sony than Nintendo these last two gens.

I realise there has been plenty of good games released this gen, but compared to the previous generation, we've been underfed. Not only has the number of AAA titles decreased, companies have also been less willing to try new ideas. If you don't see it, I'm not going to be able to convince you otherwise though.

You're damn right you're not going to convince me otherwise, since that's the damned silliest thing you've ever said. Yeah, perhaps we've been underfed if the only system you own is a Gamecube. I think it's impossible to ever be "overfed", but I think in all honesty we can EASILY say we've been fed just as good, if not BETTER than previous generations. The amount of stellar, quality titles reaches damn near overwhelming proportions at times, and this Fall it's set to get even worse. I don't even know how to respond to this except to say that your view on what makes a AAA game must be so narrow as to make your tastes completely irrelevant to any meaningful discussion on the issue.

NES and PS were not the lead platforms when they were released either. Similarly, what did the SNES and PS2 do for the future of the industry? Nothing at all... The industry moves in cycles, and it is time for change.

What did they do for this industry? Nothing at all? Well, I guess "nothing" can translate to "allowed us to play some of the best games ever made", which I guess translates into "making more money for companies in the industry". This applies to both SNES and PS2, you realize.

The industry moves in cycles, but no it is not time for such drastic change - at least according to the consumers. That is to say, it's no more time for change than that it had been at the start of this gen. We're still getting phenomenal titles, we'll always get phenomenal titles, and new control scheme or interesting novelty aside we always will. If you're in such a hankering for a change, then you hedge your bets on what you will. It's clear you already have, what with your rather interesting opinions on alternative "game"play types as it is.

Who will win? Well, I feel traditional style gaming will win, until which time it is needed to move forward to another type of gaming. The industry, or more specifically the consumers, have already decided. We'll see if they change their minds next gen, but I'm willing to place a vegas dollar down that they won't.

 

[Firest0rm]

What exactly supports his point. At this point in time, the consoles are about company ideologies and their purposes for their future as the company. It isn't just games to them. They want to leverage these consoles for other purposes. If that wasn't the case, all 3 would be pure gaming platforms like the Gamecube. They aren't though. We will stilll get the games, it's just a matter of what the console developer has in store for us. Microsoft has the PC stuff on it's side. Sony has their movie and music studios that could use some PS3 loving, and Nintendo.....err......they will always have Mario and Zelda...... That is basically the console wars now.

It supports his point that we shouldn't want to see MS have a majority/monopoly situation in the market. And my point is that I don't want to see any monopoly or an majority in the market next gen.

 

[Johnas]

Amirox, check the 360 leak thread. Thanks.

 

[CabbageRed]

“They just want the Windows platform to remain dominant.”

When MS wins, I wonder if the anti-MS crew might be happier. Windows is dominant in the PC world but you don't not see MS cranking out computers left and right. I wonder if they will simply then ensure that it is their API's and OS's remain the universal medium while leaving the hardware to their friends at Nintendo and whomever else would like to join in.

 

[Nerevar]

It supports his point that we shouldn't want to see MS have a majority/monopoly situation in the market. And my point is that I don't want to see any monopoly or an majority in the market next gen.

no, he seems to have some sort of ass-retarded idea that M$ (see! I'm so clever! They're a big corporation so I substitute the dollar sign for $!) dominating the marketplace is somehow worse than Sony or Nintendo.

 

[Pedigree Chum]

no, he seems to have some sort of ass-retarded idea that M$ (see! I'm so clever! They're a big corporation so I substitute the dollar sign for $!) dominating the marketplace is somehow worse than Sony or Nintendo.

Exactly, any company dominating gaming completly is bad for consumers. Full stop.

 

[trmas]

I'd like Sony to win Japan, because I highly suspect M$ will win the US this time.. American gamers are for the most part stupid

Look at Halo sales as confirmation

 

[Nerevar]

I'd like Sony to win Japan, because I highly suspect M$ will win the US this time.. American gamers are for the most part stupid

Look at Halo sales as confirmation

:lol

it's like clockwork.

 

[duckroll]

Oh hell we might as well have this topic retitled: "Xbox360 whining within (and maybe something about a Xbox360 RPG)" at this point now. :lol

 

[Amir0x]

Oh hell we might as well have this topic retitled: "Xbox360 whining within (and maybe something about a Xbox360 RPG)" at this point now. :lol

That's a shitty title, duckroll. You can totally be more imaginative than that!

 

[Jonnyram]

Yeah, perhaps we've been underfed if the only system you own is a Gamecube. I think it's impossible to ever be "overfed", but I think in all honesty we can EASILY say we've been fed just as good, if not BETTER than previous generations.

Au contraire, if you only had a GC, you probably had more games to play than last gen, if you only had an N64 back then. I'm referring to the fact that every genre, except 3D action games, has seen less releases this gen than last gen. Hack'n'slash games were all the rage this gen, but RPGs, racing games, shooters, sims, puzzlers, fighters, etc. took a back seat. I am, of course, factoring in the Saturn, which you may have forgotten about.

The amount of stellar, quality titles reaches damn near overwhelming proportions at times, and this Fall it's set to get even worse. I don't even know how to respond to this except to say that your view on what makes a AAA game must be so narrow as to make your tastes completely irrelevant to any meaningful discussion on the issue.

Like I said, there's just less this gen. I'm not complaining about a lack of any single thing (except creativity perhaps), but last gen had far more volume AND quality.

What did they do for this industry? Nothing at all? Well, I guess "nothing" can translate to "allowed us to play some of the best games ever made", which I guess translates into "making more money for companies in the industry". This applies to both SNES and PS2, you realize.

They just extended what was already created, by adding better graphics and sound. If the same thing kept happening every gen, we wouldn't have 3D games and analog sticks now. Don't assume that what we have now is the ultimate solution and will never be improved upon. That's such a pessimistic way of looking at things.

The industry moves in cycles, but no it is not time for such drastic change - at least according to the consumers. That is to say, it's no more time for change than that it had been at the start of this gen. We're still getting phenomenal titles, we'll always get phenomenal titles, and new control scheme or interesting novelty aside we always will.

So, essentially, what you're saying is we don't need gimmicks, and I agree. But remember when everyone thought dual analog was a gimmick (Ape Escape)? You probably still think touch screen gaming is a gimmick too, and who am I to argue with you. But changes will happen, because they need to.

Who will win? Well, I feel traditional style gaming will win, until which time it is needed to move forward to another type of gaming. The industry, or more specifically the consumers, have already decided. We'll see if they change their minds next gen, but I'm willing to place a vegas dollar down that they won't.

What exactly is "traditional gaming"? Can something that has been around for less than 10 years be considered "tradition"? Even though you say Pokemon is still a fad...

I get the feeling you've honestly misunderstood my post as a pro-Nintendo rant. I actually believe it will be Microsoft that redefines gaming next generation, not Nintendo. I know nothing about the Revolution, like yourself, but I'm not ruling it out, because it has potential to surprise us. Microsoft has shown that they know how to put a nice package together, and I think the things they are doing with Live will bring online to the masses next generation.

 

[Amir0x]

Au contraire, if you only had a GC, you probably had more games to play than last gen, if you only had an N64 back then. I'm referring to the fact that every genre, except 3D action games, has seen less releases this gen than last gen. Hack'n'slash games were all the rage this gen, but RPGs, racing games, shooters, sims, puzzlers, fighters, etc. took a back seat. I am, of course, factoring in the Saturn, which you may have forgotten about.

I still don't know what you're talking about. I mean, this generation isn't even over and I've probably played more RPGs and racing games than I did last generation. I'd actually need to see a dedicated breakdown to believe this, in fact. I'd wager it's more that you just have avoided these things, because I can name more than 40 RPGs at least off the top of my head - and that's without even breaching the water (and not knowing those games that only release in Japan). And that's but one genre.

Racing games are in some sort of explosion, not only are there just as much as last gen but it's possible it has got to the point where there's so many it's blurring together Shit, in the last few months we've got (or are getting) three RACING SIMS (Gran Turismo 4, Enthusia, Forza) and that's only one little aspect of the racing world.

I think this is pretty obviously a perspective thing, because I can see no way that this is true, ESPECIALLY when you factor that we still have a year and a half left of solid releases on PS2 and Gamecube (and less so for Xbox).

Like I said, there's just less this gen. I'm not complaining about a lack of any single thing (except creativity perhaps), but last gen had far more volume AND quality. They just extended what was already created, by adding better graphics and sound. If the same thing kept happening every gen, we wouldn't have 3D games and analog sticks now. Don't assume that what we have now is the ultimate solution and will never be improved upon. That's such a pessimistic way of looking at things.

I just strongly disagree. This generation was just endlessly better. For the most part this happens to be because it took already established gameplay types and expanded on it and made it better, but I just don't think this is being honest. Maybe because it felt "new" back then (I still remember the feeling I got - that "click" - the first time I played Mario 64), but imho the quality on the whole is at least 2 to 3x better this gen than last.

Creativity will always be an issue, even with new interesting gameplay ways. Using DS as a prototype, we can see plenty of developers are still releasing completely unimaginative shit. That's never going to change. And on regular ol' consoles we're also still getting plenty of cool, interesting concepts (like Katamari Damacy and Pikmin), although it's almost definitely a bit less pronounced.

Volume + Quality = This gen, imho. But this IS my favorite generation by far, something else that's not really a secret

I do assume we have the best way to play games, I'm not going to lie. That isn't pessimistic, that's actually super optimistic - that means we're at an ideal period. That doesn't mean there isn't alternate, equally enjoyable ways to play games or ideas that will even help enhance or suppliment the current ways we play games (some of the pre-ideas we have for Revolution, if plausible, actually sound pretty cool and advancing - just not industry changing in terms of consumer marketshare). I just don't think nothing is going to surpass this control scheme (changing how we play games fundamentally, like adding analog controls and how every game now uses that), until we get into like fully 3D worlds where we're immersed by actually entering into virtual landscapes with our minds or something

So, essentially, what you're saying is we don't need gimmicks, and I agree. But remember when everyone thought dual analog was a gimmick (Ape Escape)? You probably still think touch screen gaming is a gimmick too, and who am I to argue with you. But changes will happen, because they need to.

I didn't say we don't need gimmicks. I'm actually in the opposite camp, I believe we do need gimmicks. Gimmicks are cool, neat creations. I just don't think we need gimmicks as a central driving force, as some replacement for current trends.

As for touch screen gaming... no I don't believe it's a gimmick. I believe certain uses of it are gimmicky, but the touch screen concept is not a gimmick imho. I still am not fond of what they did to Electroplankton or playing virtual pet products using the touch screen, but I'm a fairly vocal supporter of NDS. I prefer it to PSP (currently).

What exactly is "traditional gaming"? Can something that has been around for less than 10 years be considered "tradition"? Even though you say Pokemon is still a fad...

I said every popular game/thing is a fad, but as already established in that other thread that perhaps wasn't the right word to use for something that has been popular for so long. It wasn't actually meant as an insult to the particular property, my low opinion of the series aside.

I mean, traditional gaming doesn't exactly need to be ritualistic or something. I'm not meaning it's some innate, unchanging thing. I just don't think "traditional" gaming as we know it today will change in any meaningful way for at least another two generations, despite Nintendo's best efforts. I'm not saying other companies won't adopt some of Nintendo's brighter ideas, I just don't think they will be leading the way, and I don't think a lot of their ideas will be adopted as well because of this.

I get the feeling you've honestly misunderstood my post as a pro-Nintendo rant. I actually believe it will be Microsoft that redefines gaming next generation, not Nintendo. I know nothing about the Revolution, like yourself, but I'm not ruling it out, because it has potential to surprise us. Microsoft has shown that they know how to put a nice package together, and I think the things they are doing with Live will bring online to the masses next generation.

I'm not going to lie, I did have that underlining feeling that it was a pro-Nintendo rant (which is fine, actually - I just thought it wasn't allowing you to read the consumer market clearly)... the whole "It's time for a change!" thing just sounded like you were reading off of Iwata's talking points. But with added clarity, I don't think following Nintendo's ideology is wrong at all. I just don't think it's going to be the ideology that wins with consumers.

 

[MightyHedgehog]

trmas, you're mental, man.

 

[trmas]

thank you

 

[VALIS]

I'd like Sony to win Japan, because I highly suspect M$ will win the US this time.. American gamers are for the most part stupid

Look at Halo sales as confirmation

You gotta be the most naive and simple minded pantload to come around in a while. First team all-star.

 

[FiRez]

I'd like Sony to win Japan, because I highly suspect M$ will win the US this time.. American gamers are for the most part stupid

Look at Halo sales as confirmation

why bother /*rolleyes

 

[acidviper]

looks like a fun Japanese game. Will they port that stateside?

 

[super-heated plasma]

I'd like Sony to win Japan, because I highly suspect M$ will win the US this time.. American gamers are for the most part stupid

Look at Halo sales as confirmation

So far we have "M$" as a big meanie corporation picking on the little guys, Sony and Nintendo, who just want to use their companies to bring some joy and happiness to the people of the world,but that bully "M$" just won't let em if they have anything to say about it!

And now Japanese gamers are so much smarter than the dumb americans, because an unpopular genre in Japan was'nt as well recieved over there. Making Cortana fourteen and wearing a mini skirt may have helped, though.

This is why we need to get back to the way of 'Survival Of The Fittest'

 

[imastalker co.]

ok ok. i've just had too much to drink.

anyways, my final points for the time being....

Ami0rx:
"So you have no frame of reference,
Donny. You're like a child who
wanders in in the middle of a movie
and wants to know--"

"Forget it, Donny. You're out of
your element."

straight up, no offense or anything, i mean, i've ever tried shooting the shit with you over AIM, i think you're an alright guy, but there's no point in having discussion with you at this point til after E3. just about every single last thing you said is pre-revolution, and really, that's what makes all the difference.

Jonnyram:
high five for the most part, and cute kid man.

 

[etiolate]

Xbox is the most ethnocentric console out there. No one will buy it in Japan because it's big and American. And in the US, the Xbox owners just don't buy Japanese games unless they objectify japanese women.

I just don't know what will change this.

 

[Amir0x]

ok ok. i've just had too much to drink.

anyways, my final points for the time being....

straight up, no offense or anything, i mean, i've ever tried shooting the shit with you over AIM, i think you're an alright guy, but there's no point in having discussion with you at this point til after E3. just about every single last thing you said is pre-revolution, and really, that's what makes all the difference.

No problem with you either, but this post says very little to me except that you have faith in Nintendo no matter the odds. No matter what Nintendo reveals, it's not going to change how consumers have operated these last ten years or how much support developers put behind one or another systems. Money drives this point. If Nintendo's Revolution is a money creation machine and shoots out yen and euros and shit, then we can have another talk about the ramifications of such a device. We're talking about a company that made a console that consumers outright rejected over two machines that were a hundred dollars more expensive and for one machine that was even less powerful.

I have no doubt that Nintendo will show us why we need this thing and how they will use it to enhance whatever games they make. But you're way too idealistic for your own good, Johnny Nighttrain. You know I'm totally on board for the goods, but you always seem like you're floating on cloud nine to me

 

[Folder]

NES - Revolution
SNES - Evolution
N64 - Revolution
GameCube - Evolution

Talk about company line...
That is the exact brief given to PR employees at Nintendo.

 

[Porridge]

Well getting back to the topic at hand, I like Toriyama! His designs are cute and charming I think and Chrono was a hell of a game, so here's hoping Uematsu and Mitsuda are collabin' on the soundtrack.

 

[Amir0x]

Well getting back to the topic at hand, I like Toriyama! His designs are cute and charming I think and Chrono was a hell of a game, so here's hoping Uematsu and Mitsuda are collabin' on the soundtrack.

I assure you Toriyama had nothing to do with the awesome of Chrono Trigger. The game was great despite his designs, not because of 'em

 

[Porridge]

I assure you Toriyama had nothing to do with the awesome of Chrono Trigger. The game was great despite his designs, not because of 'em

it was toriyama who designed those characters, and buddy they trounce chrono cross'. the whole look of CT is classic, don't try to belittle his work on that game

 

[Jonnyram]

Well getting back to the topic at hand, I like Toriyama! His designs are cute and charming I think and Chrono was a hell of a game, so here's hoping Uematsu and Mitsuda are collabin' on the soundtrack.

Uematsu has already said he's been asked by Sakaguchi to work on his projects as they have a good relationship in the past. No idea about Mitsuda though.

 

[Cragstar]

having said that, we've been playing roughly the same kind of games for the last 10 years now. do you want more of the same with prettier graphics for the next 5 years (making that 15 years of the same kind of design), or do you want more of the same, and then some?

ThongyDonk got banned for saying this and sarguing with Amir0x!
Not that i want jonny banned i love him. Just the same people starting the arguments and others replying get banned?
Go figure.


Anyway Jonny whats IRD?
Not infra-red

 

[Amir0x]

it was toriyama who designed those characters, and buddy they trounce chrono cross'. the whole look of CT is classic, don't try to belittle his work on that game

"Buddy" they trounce Chrono Cross? Are you trying to make your case or be an apologist for Toriyama? Seriously, saying his designs were better in CT than the character designs in CC is not so much a statement of praise as it is a freakin' given, considering how the characters in CC were designed

Toriyama's art is really horrible. And after a while, all his characters just begin to meld together in some sort of terrible collage of ugly. But hey, art is subjective man. That said, Toriyama is definitely up there in my list of Japanese artists I least respect.

ThongyDonk got banned for saying this and sarguing with Amir0x!
Not that i want jonny banned i love him. Just the same people starting the arguments and others replying get banned? Go figure.

This statement just categorically denies every aspect of that discussion we had in that thread, to the point where it seems you're intentionally being ignorant.

 

[Cragstar]

^^^ YEah you're right. for some reason the last page wasn't showing when i first came in. Now i've read the last page. so forgive me please

So which one of you jonny's writes for UK NOM??

 

[Porridge]

"Buddy" they trounce Chrono Cross? Are you trying to make your case or be an apologist for Toriyama?

Im making my case, but you don't like it because you don't like toriyama's work.

which is fine, but looking at Chrono Cross just makes you realize how integral his visuals were to CT. if you hate Toriyama so much, well then I don't see how you could even play Chrono Trigger as he is all over that game, visually.

 

[Amir0x]

which is fine, but looking at Chrono Cross just makes you realize how integral his visuals were to CT. if you hate Toriyama so much, well then I don't see how you could even play Chrono Trigger as he is all over that game, visually.

That is some real silly logic right there

Yes, his ugly character murals are all over the place. It doesn't prevent the game from kicking ass, of course. Thus my statement "the game is great despite his art, not beause of it." Additionally bad art is MUCH more painful in later generations, as greater technology allows for a more direct representation of someone's artistic vision. At least in Chrono Trigger it only went so far because of those same limitations, imho.

But we're harping on a dumb thing anyway. I personally think DBZ is possibly the worst thing ever to leave Japan and that people who watch it are closet masochists (that's a joke, btw), but that's beside the point. None of this will make BLUE DRAGON suck or be great, so I'm just hoping it's non-intrusive and the gameplay elements and story (*sigh*) can help elevate it to a level I can enjoy.

^^^ YEah you're right. for some reason the last page wasn't showing when i first came in. Now i've read the last page. so forgive me please

Oh, there's no hard feelings. That was just like the third time you said that about that discussion so I thought you might be friends with Thongy and trying your best to defend him against my meanie assault

 

[bitwise]

Oh, there's no hard feelings. That was just like the third time you said that about that discussion so I thought you might be friends with Thongy and trying your best to defend him against my meanie assault

i think he is ThongyDork.

 

[funcojoe]

My brain hurts after reading this entire thread.

 

[Amir0x]

i think he is ThongyDork.

 

[Porridge]

That is some real silly logic right there

no it's not, it's my opinion. but thank you for considering it silly

Yeah, it's trendy to rag on DBZ and I personally don't dig it much either, but I guess I'm just puzzled because I've never met anyone put-off by CT's look.

 

[Amir0x]

no it's not, it's my opinion. but thank you for considering it silly

No, saying that liking Chrono Trigger is odd considering his art is all over it is silly any way you slice it. Your opinion or not, it's damned silly.

 

[Porridge]

No, saying that liking Chrono Trigger is odd considering his art is all over it is silly any way you slice it. Your opinion or not, it's damned silly.

No, but it isn't just his "character murals." It's the little character models, and the worlds they adventure in, the people they meet, etc. The miniature actions the characters do. The game is just so overwhelmingly Toriyama that I'm just suprised you still like it, even after putting him on your list of least-respected Japanese artists. but okay okay. at least we are both looking forward to Wanda

 

[trmas]

BTW, I was kidding about American gamers, but there doesn't appear to be a wink icon. I wasn't kidding about that piece of worthless crap Halo though (my opinion). And yes, M$ is definately the big "bully" in this scenario.

90+% of my gaming library is games made by the Japanese companies. The only real exceptions are Bioware and sometimes Rare. Psychonauts is a step in the right direction, but I don't expect such a brilliant game to sell worth a damn here in the US.

US gamers tend to live for GTA, Halo, and sports games. Look at the sales charts for confirmation. It's too bad, too.

 

[imastalker co.]

Talk about company line...
That is the exact brief given to PR employees at Nintendo.

huh....maybe i should take up that job with their marketing department then....

Anyway Jonny whats IRD?
Not infra-red

it's short for Nintendo Integrated Research & Development. they made Ice Hockey, Punch-Out! series, and the first Pilotwings, amongst others.

Amir0x:
call me a fanboy if you want dude, but im just calling it how i see it.

 

[Mooreberg]

US gamers tend to live for GTA, Halo, and sports games. Look at the sales charts for confirmation. It's too bad, too.

well if you look at the games that have really hit "blockbuster" status this gen and sold over 3 million copies, it's GTA, Halo, Gran Turismo, and Madden. But there's plenty of games from other genres that have sold very well. If publishers had to just rely on the games that could crack three million and sales and site at the top of the charts for months, there wouldn't be many game companies left.

 

[jarrod]

well if you look at the games that have really hit "blockbuster" status this gen and sold over 3 million copies, it's GTA, Halo, Gran Turismo, and Madden.

And Pokemon!

Using multiplatform stuff, we could also count NFSU, MOH, Tony Hawk, Spider-Man, Namco Museum and others probably.

 

[Amir0x]

call me a fanboy if you want dude, but im just calling it how i see it.

I'm not calling you a fanboy, although it's no secret where you lean; I'm just saying you're not calling it out how you see it because if you were you'd be a lot more hesitant, regardless of what neat thing Nintendo has in store. But you have faith, which can be a lot different from the cold hard facts

 

[nitewulf]

Toriyama's art is really horrible. And after a while, all his characters just begin to meld together in some sort of terrible collage of ugly.

i agree with this. i got totally disinterested after i heard that toriyama was involved, and the art proves my suspicions. i expected these two MW games to actually have good art...well one down...
however, CT is one of my alltime fav rpgs...and i dont give a crap about DQ, so if this game is like CT rather than DQ...who knows.
but the fact remains, CT looked fantastic due to the detailed 2d graphics, the backdrops were fantastic. the generic characters could be overlooked. but toriyama in 3d will be all kinds of suck...its inevitable. i just hope the environments turn out to be gorgeous.

 

[belgurdo]

but toriyama in 3d will be all kinds of suck...its inevitable

Nitewulf=fail

 

[Amir0x]

see, i sort of think that proves his point belgurdo!

But to each his/her own!

 

[nitewulf]

see, i sort of think that proves his point belgurdo!

exactly. i have seen DQ7 screens before you know...it looks like DBZ, bleargh!!!

 

[The Bookerman]

I sense nothing good will come out of this game.

Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles anyone?

 

[Amir0x]

I sense nothing good will come out of this game.

Final Fantasy Crystal Chronicles anyone?

How did you make that connection? :|

 

[Porridge]

It's a real shame Tobal's sequel didn't come to America, as that game, to me, is still the best example of Toriyama's style in 3D.

The reason DQ8 looks dated is because they used a played-out form of cel-shading. I mean, what companies program into their games is their business. toriyama provides the basis

I have a hunch Blue Dragon isn't going to look even remotely like DQ8. I imagine the characters and worlds can and will look much better than the CG Tobal cinemas

 

[The Bookerman]

How did you make that connection? :|

The setup's pretty similar to FF Crystal Chronicles.

Game Cube gets a spinoff of FF, everybody's excited, once the game hits, boom, Bomb.

Toriyama brings a "new?" franchise to Xbox 2... everybody's excited... but if the game sucks....

Even if Toriyama is attached to the project, if the game sucks, it won't sell.