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Boston Red Sox Fire Cheater Alex Cora

Daxter32jak

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As someone not into sports, watching from a distance, how did he cheat? Steroids and such?
Back in 2017 while he was bench coach (equivalent to assistant manager or vice manager) to now former manager, AJ Hicks, he along with other Astros players and field employees orchestrated a rigging scheme where the broadcast camera that people at home see when watching the game was being fed to an illegally installed tv in their clubhouse/locker room.

From that angle, the viewer at home (and Astros players in the clubhouse with their illegally installed tv) can see what the back catcher is signaling to its pitcher as to what pitch to throw next (fastball, curve ball, change up etc etc).

What would happen next is absolutely insane. Players from the Astros team would then bang on a garbage can or make some other apparent loud noise to let their batter know what pitch is coming. From what was discovered, the loud banging would usually happen to slower pitches like the breaking ball or change up and alerting their batter to not swing., then no bang to alert their batter that a predictable fast ball is about to be pitched. MLB hitters typically prefer fastballs as they are much more predictable in their line of flight and remain a constant speed from pitcher release to the back catchers glove.

In 2017, the Astros won the World Series.
 
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The Elite

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Back in 2017 while he was bench coach (equivalent to assistant manager or vice manager) to now former manager, AJ Hicks, he along with other Astros players and field employees orchestrated a rigging scheme where the broadcast camera that people at home see when watching the game was being fed to an illegally installed tv in their clubhouse/locker room.

From that angle, the viewer at home (and Astros players in the clubhouse with their illegally installed tv) can see what the back catcher is signaling to its pitcher as to what pitch to throw next (fastball, curve ball, change up etc etc).

What would happen next is absolutely insane. Players from the Astros team would then bang on a garbage can or make some other apparent loud noise to let their batter know what pitch is coming. From what was discovered, the loud banging would usually happen to slower pitches like the breaking ball or change up and alerting their batter to not swing., then no bang to alert their batter that a predictable fast ball is about to be pitched. MLB hitters typically prefer fastballs as they are much more predictable in their line of flight and remain a constant speed from pitcher release to the back catchers glove.

In 2017, the Astros won the World Series.
And Alex Cora was the manager of the Red Sox in 2018. Guess who won the World Series that year.

From what I have read about the 2018 season it seems that the Red Sox were utilizing the replay room for sign stealing.

Cora should be banned for life.
 

ManaByte

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Back in 2017 while he was bench coach (equivalent to assistant manager or vice manager) to now former manager, AJ Hicks, he along with other Astros players and field employees orchestrated a rigging scheme where the broadcast camera that people at home see when watching the game was being fed to an illegally installed tv in their clubhouse/locker room.

From that angle, the viewer at home (and Astros players in the clubhouse with their illegally installed tv) can see what the back catcher is signaling to its pitcher as to what pitch to throw next (fastball, curve ball, change up etc etc).

What would happen next is absolutely insane. Players from the Astros team would then bang on a garbage can or make some other apparent loud noise to let their batter know what pitch is coming. From what was discovered, the loud banging would usually happen to slower pitches like the breaking ball or change up and alerting their batter to not swing., then no bang to alert their batter that a predictable fast ball is about to be pitched. MLB hitters typically prefer fastballs as they are much more predictable in their line of flight and remain a constant speed from pitcher release to the back catchers glove.

In 2017, the Astros won the World Series.
Video of it:
 
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synchronicity

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If you fired all the cheaters in professional sports, it would be a ghost-town. All these things are done for appearances. The cheaters are getting fired by cheaters.
 

cr0w

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Curious as to the other 8 teams that are rumored to be being investigated right now. It's gonna be a fucking bloodbath.
 

Daxter32jak

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I do love how complex and simple the cheating was at the same time
As an avid baseball fan for my entire life, I’ve never felt more embarrassed for the sport. It raises some serious and I mean, SERIOUS concerns for the integrity of the game.

And you’re absolutely correct, it seems so easy to do but the background work to set it sounds so devilish. On top of that, from the back catcher giving signs to the pitcher delivering the signaled pitch is about 3-5 seconds. For the Astro’s to let their batter know what’s coming and whats not in that short time frame is unbelievable.
 
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I mean it's good that the managers and GM was fired, but by not disciplining any players in this fiasco or vacating the WS titles MLB has basically left the door wide open for this to happen again in the future. Because if you asked any fan or team owner if they would trade their manager/GM and a few draft picks for a world series the answer would be a resounding "Hell Yeah!" from both. They should have at the very least fined every player who was on the team and then suspended every player who could have been proven to have actively participated in it for at least 15-30 games. Just SOME kind of deterrent to keep teams from trying it in the future.


Because in my opinion this was so much worse than steroids. Steroids affect a single players performance which CAN change the outcomes of games, but this affected the performance of an entire team basically and absolutely affected the outcome of not only games, but a world series. MLB should have been far more harsh in their approach.
 

Rock And Roll

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Curious as to the other 8 teams that are rumored to be being investigated right now. It's gonna be a fucking bloodbath.
I think all the murmurs about the Jays were true but it's been so long, who knows if they kept doing it.

Edit: I would also like to add the 2018 Sox won 108 games, that's the most by a rookie manager ever. So Cora cheats on the Astros and on the Red Sox as well, but I think what we've been told with the video replay room cheating is the tip of the iceberg. I wouldn't be surprised if there was a lot more going on. Winning that many games in a tough division with the mastermind behind the Astros scandal just seems a bit too coincidental.
 
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DeepEnigma

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I think all the murmurs about the Jays were true but it's been so long, who knows if they kept doing it.

Edit: I would also like to add the 2018 Sox won 108 games, that's the most by a rookie manager ever. So Cora cheats on the Astros and on the Red Sox as well, but I think what we've been told with the video replay room cheating is the tip of the iceberg. I wouldn't be surprised if there was a lot more going on. Winning that many games in a tough division with the mastermind behind the Astros scandal just seems a bit too coincidental.
The Yankees were right behind them with 100 as well in that division. 103 for the Astros as well.
 

Rock And Roll

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The Yankees were right behind them with 100 as well in that division. 103 for the Astros as well.
Absolutely no doubt in my mind the Yanks were also doing. I'm just saying I think Boston had something next level going on because it's Cora and they went nuts out of nowhere. Plus there seems to be something really severe coming in terms of punishment.
 

DeepEnigma

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Absolutely no doubt in my mind the Yanks were also doing. I'm just saying I think Boston had something next level going on because it's Cora and they went nuts out of nowhere. Plus there seems to be something really severe coming in terms of punishment.
I am just trying to think of the other supposed 8 or 9 teams, even though I think this was done by the whole league, just some less efficient methods that others. Staff from teams have been caught in the stands relaying via camera phones before as well in the past.
 

Rock And Roll

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I am just trying to think of the other supposed 8 or 9 teams, even though I think this was done by the whole league, just some less efficient methods that others. Staff from teams have been caught in the stands relaying via camera phones before as well in the past.
I think any team with a potent offense is suspect AF right now, which is sad because this is exactly like the steroids issue. There were players who weren't using but still getting looked at funny because their stats were good and it was all around them. Cheating like this hurts the whole sport and casts suspicion on anyone good. That's really shitty for baseball.
 

DeepEnigma

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I think any team with a potent offense is suspect AF right now, which is sad because this is exactly like the steroids issue. There were players who weren't using but still getting looked at funny because their stats were good and it was all around them. Cheating like this hurts the whole sport and casts suspicion on anyone good. That's really shitty for baseball.
Guys batting sub .250 but over 40 bombs are pretty frequent now, which gives one pause of "all or nothing" swings on knowing which pitch is coming.

Their BA doesn't line up with a smart hitter, but rather a fed one that can't figure out the pitcher / batter chess match for themselves.
 
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Chiggs

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You're being naive if you think the Dodgers didn't partake in this as well. It was an easily accessible technology that was not monitored.
I look forward to the sweeping investigation that implicates the Dodgers. Until that time, I, of course, will just have to file your comment away as unsubstantiated speculation.

On a side note, there sure does seem to be a ton of this circulating around in what, at least to me, appears to be an attempt to muddy the waters.

"Well, everyone is doing it, so there!"
 

NickFire

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Sox fan here, and a bit worried about the future of our draft picks. With Cora's pedigree from the prior year, the difference in performance between year 1 and 2 is worrisome. Hoping there was no cheating cause the Yankees have already set a pretty high bar to catch up to, and the Sox have already stated shedding payroll is a concern. I don't care how they try to walk that back, just saying it is bad news IMO. And shedding payroll without top draft picks would be really bad IMO.
 
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SlimySnake

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Absolutely no doubt in my mind the Yanks were also doing. I'm just saying I think Boston had something next level going on because it's Cora and they went nuts out of nowhere. Plus there seems to be something really severe coming in terms of punishment.
The Yankees were right behind them with 100 as well in that division. 103 for the Astros as well.
anyone who watches yankees play everyday and swing at sliders down and away every fucking time knows they dont steal signs.

judge strikes out looking at fastballs on the outside corner like a 100 times every year. stanton chases sliders 9 times out of 10. voit had a really really bad month where he kept taking pitches right down the middle. if he knew a fastball was coming, there is no way hes taking that. sanchez will swing at pitches in the dirt more often than he would swing at pitches in the strike zone.

i WISH they were stealing signs because watching them hit is depressing. i had more fun watching the replacements play than judge, sanchez and stanton.
 
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Lionel Richie

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I look forward to the sweeping investigation that implicates the Dodgers. Until that time, I, of course, will just have to file your comment away as unsubstantiated speculation.

On a side note, there sure does seem to be a ton of this circulating around in what, at least to me, appears to be an attempt to muddy the waters.

"Well, everyone is doing it, so there!"
It's not an attempt to muddy the waters, have you looked at what the Red Sox are being accused? It's not nearly as sophisticated as what the Astros were doing, it's such a simple scheme that honestly it borders on negligence by the MLB. You do you I guess, I suppose it must be frustrating to get so close to winning it all and failing again and again.
 

Daxter32jak

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Absolutely no doubt in my mind the Yanks were also doing. I'm just saying I think Boston had something next level going on because it's Cora and they went nuts out of nowhere. Plus there seems to be something really severe coming in terms of punishment.
I don’t think the Yankees are that smart to have put together such an intricate plan like that. As an avid Yankee fan, I can attest that most players on board with the Yankees are obsessed with personal records so I’d see the Yankees in another steroid scandal (ie, Alex Rodriguez, Jason Giambi, Roger Clemens etc etc) before something like a wired camera set up allegation.
 

Chiggs

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I suppose it must be frustrating to get so close to winning it all and failing again and again.
Well, uh, yeah? Of course. Was that supposed to be a witty comeback?

Here, let me try my hand:

"I suppose it must be frustrating to provide free of charge internet damage control for yet another New England sports team involved in a cheating scandal."
 
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Lionel Richie

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Well, uh, yeah? Of course. Was that supposed to be a witty comeback?

Here, let me try my hand:

"I suppose it must be frustrating to provide free of charge internet damage control for yet another New England sports team involved in a cheating scandal."
I'm a Red Sox fan, I'm not going to defend the Dodgers here man lol. It sucks that this happened, it's not like I'm in denial and think that what they did is okay. It was not okay. They deserve punishment like the Astros got. However, it's important not to bundle them here, they're both completely different situations. Heck, we don't even KNOW what truly happened with the Red Sox. The investigation isn't finished. By the looks of it what the Red Sox did was far less intrusive than what the Astros did. This could be getting overblown thanks to Cora's connection with both teams.
 

Rock And Roll

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I don’t think the Yankees are that smart to have put together such an intricate plan like that. As an avid Yankee fan, I can attest that most players on board with the Yankees are obsessed with personal records so I’d see the Yankees in another steroid scandal (ie, Alex Rodriguez, Jason Giambi, Roger Clemens etc etc) before something like a wired camera set up allegation.
I'm not saying they copied the camera set up, I'm just saying there's allegations around the league about teams using technology to steal signs. Other teams haven't done it to a science like Houston, but when I say other teams are doing, I mean they're using technology to try to gain an edge. I think some of them are better at it than others.
 

SlimySnake

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It's not an attempt to muddy the waters, have you looked at what the Red Sox are being accused? It's not nearly as sophisticated as what the Astros were doing, it's such a simple scheme that honestly it borders on negligence by the MLB. You do you I guess, I suppose it must be frustrating to get so close to winning it all and failing again and again.
they were still stealing signs using the footage from tv installed in the tunnel. yes, they didnt bang any trash cans, and only relayed the signs from second base, but they didnt guess the signs from second base. they figured out the signs in the tunnel using illegally obtained footage and used that.
 

Lionel Richie

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they were still stealing signs using the footage from tv installed in the tunnel. yes, they didnt bang any trash cans, and only relayed the signs from second base, but they didnt guess the signs from second base. they figured out the signs in the tunnel using illegally obtained footage and used that.
Every single team in the league has access to that footage, there was absolutely no control whatsoever on what it was used for aside from a weak memo. You can't possibly convince me the Red Sox were the only team in the league to use the replay room for that purpose.