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[John Kowalski]

Vegan Mode will be best Hero Mode

 

[theSlacker]

I never bought that line of reasoning.

"Make your own difficulty in Zelda" always always ALWAYS feels cheap, fake, and not fun for me.

I am not NOT going to pick up that Heart Container.
I am not NOT going to stock the heck up on fairies.
I am not NOT going to use all the tools available for me to beat the game.

If there's gonna be a challenge, I want it to be real. I don't want the challenge to be pretend. And that's why Hero Mode has been such a successful addition to Zelda, because it's a real difficulty increase.

And I want Aonuma to keep breaking Zelda conventions, even if they're new ones. Expand Hero Mode beyond the damage increase.

I'm with you. In general as well I don't like the "you can choose not to use it" argument for other things as well. I would like the makers to actually make different modes/make things differently instead of relying on "well you don't have to use quest markers" or "well you can choose not to use items/pick up hearts".

 

[sinxtanx]

Vegan Nudist Mode

 

[theSlacker]

Vegan Nudist Pacifist Mode.

 

[viciouskillersquirrel]

I never bought that line of reasoning.

"Make your own difficulty in Zelda" always always ALWAYS feels cheap, fake, and not fun for me.

I am not NOT going to pick up that Heart Container.
I am not NOT going to stock the heck up on fairies.
I am not NOT going to use all the tools available for me to beat the game.

If there's gonna be a challenge, I want it to be real. I don't want the challenge to be pretend. And that's why Hero Mode has been such a successful addition to Zelda, because it's a real difficulty increase.

And I want Aonuma to keep breaking Zelda conventions, even if they're new ones. Expand Hero Mode beyond the damage increase.

Low % completion runs are totally a thing. They're tense, they're difficult and if you know what you're doing, they can be great fun.

Now I want to play Zero Mission again.

 

[maxcriden]

Vegan Mode will be best Hero Mode

Yesss! So there.

 

[sinxtanx]

Vegan Nudist Pacifist with Horse Allergy Mode

 

[Nickle]

I agree with Sinxtanx, I hate it when I have to impose my own difficulty on games, especially Zelda. At the very least give us the generic hero mode that halves our defense, the intern could probably do that in half a day.

 

[LegendofLex]

Low % completion runs are totally a thing. They're tense, they're difficult and if you know what you're doing, they can be great fun.

Super looking forward to speedrunning or low%ing this game.

And the only game I've ever cared to speedrun before is Ocarina of Time.

 

[Evil's Bane]

I still pretty firmly believe the difficulty in Zelda needs to be tightened up a bit even if they don't go with a hero mode or difficulty options. The games are supposed to be accessible, but they aren't supposed to be a cake walk like some of the newer games are. Don't be afraid to push the kids a little bit. It will be more rewarding for them that way.

 

[dragonzdogma]

I never bought that line of reasoning.

"Make your own difficulty in Zelda" always always ALWAYS feels cheap, fake, and not fun for me.

I am not NOT going to pick up that Heart Container.
I am not NOT going to stock the heck up on fairies.
I am not NOT going to use all the tools available for me to beat the game.

If there's gonna be a challenge, I want it to be real. I don't want the challenge to be pretend. And that's why Hero Mode has been such a successful addition to Zelda, because it's a real difficulty increase.

And I want Aonuma to keep breaking Zelda conventions, even if they're new ones. Expand Hero Mode beyond the damage increase.

Is Hero Mode available from the start?
Because I honestly don't have time to replay RPGS a second time around.

 

[Pappasman]

I'm going to play without any defensive armor, no heart containers, no items, and use only the branches as my weapons. Metal weapons are for cowards.

low% is the best.

I never bought that line of reasoning.

"Make your own difficulty in Zelda" always always ALWAYS feels cheap, fake, and not fun for me.

I am not NOT going to pick up that Heart Container.
I am not NOT going to stock the heck up on fairies.
I am not NOT going to use all the tools available for me to beat the game.

If there's gonna be a challenge, I want it to be real. I don't want the challenge to be pretend. And that's why Hero Mode has been such a successful addition to Zelda, because it's a real difficulty increase.

And I want Aonuma to keep breaking Zelda conventions, even if they're new ones. Expand Hero Mode beyond the damage increase.

I agree that damage increases aren't the best way to raise difficulty and improved/ aggressive enemy AI and enemy group diversity would be awesome with the zelda combat sandbox. But denying the hearts, fairies, etc. to adjust the game difficulty is valid. If you don't like it that's your problem, not the game's.

 

[maxcriden]

Is Hero Mode available from the start?
Because I honestly don't have time to replay RPGS a second time around.

It's not yet confirmed there will be one.

 

[dragonzdogma]

I'm going to play without any defensive armor, no heart containers, no items, and use only the branches as my weapons. Metal weapons are for cowards.

low% is the best.



I agree that damage increases aren't the best way to raise difficulty and improved/ aggressive enemy AI and enemy group diversity would be awesome with the zelda combat sandbox. But denying the hearts, fairies, etc. to adjust the game difficulty is valid. If you don't like it that's your problem, not the game's.

I think he saying he want BOTW to be balance in diffilty like the dark souls games,
not just in terms of enemies depleting your health faster, but how enemy react,a.i,enemy placement location, new boss patterns, ect.

 

[LegendofLex]

I'm going to play without any defensive armor, no heart containers, no items, and use only the branches as my weapons. Metal weapons are for cowards.

Not gonna lie, killing Steppe Talus with an unlit torch was reeeeeal satisfying.

Spoiler

It'd be a huge pain in the ass to use only crappy weapons, though, since they break after like 4 hits and you can't carry very many at once.

I think he saying he want BOTW to be balance in diffilty like the dark souls games,
not just in terms of enemies depleting your health faster, but how enemy react,a.i,enemy placement location, new boss patterns, ect.

Dark Souls is a game with a skill floor that's much higher than the skill ceiling of most Zelda games. And like Zelda games (and Breath of the Wild in particular), the game's own balance also comes largely from whether or not you want to max out your stats and take advantage of exploits or not.

 

[dragonzdogma]

Not gonna lie, killing Steppe Talus with an unlit torch was reeeeeal satisfying.

Spoiler

It'd be a huge pain in the ass to use only crappy weapons, though, since they break after like 4 hits and you can't carry very many at once.

Dark Souls is a game with a skill floor that's much higher than the skill ceiling of most Zelda games. And like Zelda games (and Breath of the Wild in particular), the game's own balance also comes largely from whether or not you want to max out your stats and take advantage of exploits or not.

True, I learned that from hitting those coocos to many times

 

[Vibed]

Low % difficulty isn't really an option though when you want to do everything your first time through (like me). That forces a choice when I just want a game that isn't a cakewalk.

 

[Joeshabadoo]

I'm with you. In general as well I don't like the "you can choose not to use it" argument for other things as well. I would like the makers to actually make different modes/make things differently instead of relying on "well you don't have to use quest markers" or "well you can choose not to use items/pick up hearts".

but I feel like in this game it's less 'choose not to use [insert item]' and more 'choose not to prepare as much' ie gathering crafting materials or hunting/cooking food or clearing out this otherwise non-crucial bokoblin encampment to get a couple extra throw away melee weapons and that sweet buffed longsword in that chest. Not as much solving a single puzzle or series of puzzle to get a discreet item that will help you going forward, but gathering spoils from general adventuring that will help you continue to adventure and not die. You will then encounter complex puzzling scenarios that will be easier or harder for you depending on the amount of preparation you've put in.

personally I will be playing this game very much like a survival game and my goal is not to die

 

[TheCongressman1]

The nice thing about this game seems to be that to have an easier time, you have to actively work towards it. Rather than being handed a heart container, you have to hunt and gather. Even that would make a huge difference to me. I hate having to ignore heart containers, but I have no problem deciding to venture off without stocking up on food.

 

[Joeshabadoo]

^exactly^

 

[ReyVGM]

I would really love if this game has multiple endings depending on what you do, or longer/expanded endings if you complete more story quests.

There have been Zelda games with different or expanded endings before, but the approach has been mild, to say the least.

 

[R00bot]

The nice thing about this game seems to be that to have an easier time, you have to actively work towards it. Rather than being handed a heart container, you have to hunt and gather. Even that would make a huge difference to me. I hate having to ignore heart containers, but I have no problem deciding to venture off without stocking up on food.

Yep, so lazy players like me will get a harder challenge.

Spoiler

RIP lazy players who can't git gud

 

[LegendofLex]

The nice thing about this game seems to be that to have an easier time, you have to actively work towards it. Rather than being handed a heart container, you have to hunt and gather. Even that would make a huge difference to me. I hate having to ignore heart containers, but I have no problem deciding to venture off without stocking up on food.

Basically, to max yourself out in Breath of the Wild, you have to grind.

Which is what I've been saying.

 

[TheCongressman1]

Basically, to max yourself out in Breath of the Wild, you have to grind.

Which is what I've been saying.

Exactly.

But yeah, we're not quite sure how treasure and rewards works. We may still end up bombarded with heart containers (plz no).

 

[Joeshabadoo]

I really cant see this game allowing you to up the heart count to the 15-20 range permanently as others have. Better and better elixirs and food items to give you some bonus hearts that are gone when they're gone? better and better armor to decrease damage taken? limited fairy use? perhaps a maximum of doubling your total permanent heart number? sure

 

[lwilliams3]

I really cant see this game allowing you to up the heart count to the 15-20 range permanently as others have. Better and better elixirs and food items to give you some bonus hearts that are gone when they're gone? better and better armor to decrease damage taken? limited fairy use? perhaps a maximum of doubling your total permanent heart number? sure

When we have enemies that can give more than double the damage of your base health in the beginning area, I think it's too soon to say that you can't permanently get 20 hearts. There are probably a lot of "elite" enemies wandering around like that 72hp Blodkin, and it wouldn't surprise me that the game has dlc challenges as well.

 

[BY2K]

I'm betting the Master Sword, the Hylian Shield and the Hero's Tunic (the green one) will be like the ultimate set and you'll have to work for it.

You actually get the Master Sword somewhere in the game as part of the story, but it's busted to hell and you have to re-forge it to full power or something.

 

[PtM]

But denying the hearts, fairies, etc. to adjust the game difficulty is valid. If you don't like it that's your problem, not the game's.

That's like, your opinion, man. No reason to shit on theirs.

 

[Nickle]

So what are ya'll hoping for in terms of dungeons?

Personally, I would be really disappointed if there were only 4 dungeons as that old rumor states. Even if the shrines give us a ton of puzzles, I love the classic Zelda gameplay loop (find new area>explore>find the area's "problem">interact with NPC's to unlock path to dungeon>play dungeon>repeat). With only 4 dungeons, I feel like there will be too much aimless wandering in between dungeons.

I also hope that there is somewhat of a dungeon order, much like LTTP or the original LoZ. ALBW got too easy towards the end and there wasn't enough narrative, so I'd prefer it if there were a "suggested" dungeon order with increasingly difficult dungeons. You'd still be able to sequence break, and it would feel more rewarding to be in a dungeon that the game doesn't "want" you to be in.

As for dungeon types, I'd really love a river, beach, or underwater dungeon, maybe 2.

 

[ika]

I would really love if this game has multiple endings depending on what you do, or longer/expanded endings if you complete more story quests.

There have been Zelda games with different or expanded endings before, but the approach has been mild, to say the least.

Yes, this is one of my personal wishes for this game since Aonuma said we could finish the game (defeating Calamity Ganon) from the start without completing the main plot, even not knowing what happened to Hyrule or who are you and why you awoke from a 100 years slumber...

Different endings would be cool (some negative/sad ones if we don't finish the main story) and the possibility of continuing playing the game after a "fake" ending without starting from the beginning.

The only problem I see is how many new branches in the timeline this could cause lol...

So what are ya'll hoping for in terms of dungeons?

Personally, I would be really disappointed if there were only 4 dungeons as that old rumor states. Even if the shrines give us a ton of puzzles, I love the classic Zelda gameplay loop (find new area>explore>find the area's "problem">interact with NPC's to unlock path to dungeon>play dungeon>repeat). With only 4 dungeons, I feel like there will be too much aimless wandering in between dungeons.

I also hope that there is somewhat of a dungeon order, much like LTTP or the original LoZ. ALBW got too easy towards the end and there wasn't enough narrative, so I'd prefer it if there were a "suggested" dungeon order with increasingly difficult dungeons. You'd still be able to sequence break, and it would feel more rewarding to be in a dungeon that the game doesn't "want" you to be in.

As for dungeon types, I'd really love a river, beach, or underwater dungeon, maybe 2.

I'll be kinda disappointed if we only get four main dungeons in what it seems will be the biggest Zelda game so far. In a tiny map (Majora's Mask) with a big emphasis in the central town quests and the three day limitation, four dungeons is ok, but not in Breath of the Wild, IMO... Even with more than 100 Shrines... The map has around 15 giant provinces... If only 4 of those has a big temple/dungeon/tower, part of the fun exploring will be gone since you can see Shrines in the distance and all the entrances are identical and most of the provinces will consist mainly in wilderness, some shrines and maybe a small village and a cave or two... also, with only four dungeons the locations will be very predictable (Death Mountain, Gerudo Desert, Snow Peak, some Forest or Coast Area...)

 

[Skittzo0413]

So what are ya'll hoping for in terms of dungeons?

Personally, I would be really disappointed if there were only 4 dungeons as that old rumor states. Even if the shrines give us a ton of puzzles, I love the classic Zelda gameplay loop (find new area>explore>find the area's "problem">interact with NPC's to unlock path to dungeon>play dungeon>repeat). With only 4 dungeons, I feel like there will be too much aimless wandering in between dungeons.

I also hope that there is somewhat of a dungeon order, much like LTTP or the original LoZ. ALBW got too easy towards the end and there wasn't enough narrative, so I'd prefer it if there were a "suggested" dungeon order with increasingly difficult dungeons. You'd still be able to sequence break, and it would feel more rewarding to be in a dungeon that the game doesn't "want" you to be in.

As for dungeon types, I'd really love a river, beach, or underwater dungeon, maybe 2.

I'd be okay with 4 big "dungeons" only if there is much more variety in the shrines than we've seen so far. Not just in shrine puzzles, but:

-Interior aesthetics
-Length
-Story importance
-Entrance style (I would hate if they were all the exact same conspicuous shrine entrance we've seen)
-Enemy variety

And probably more that I can't think of. Like, I wish some of the shrines would just be standard mountain caves that aren't as gamified as the shrines appear to be (although I suppose we don't know for sure yet if those don't exist in addition to shrines).

I think the shrines (and potentially these other small caves/interiors) can serve as an adequate replacement for dungeons if they have enough variety in these areas. Otherwise they will get old very quickly, and only having 4 dungeons outside of the repetitive shrines would be fairly disappointing.

 

[OrbitalBeard]

I'm completely fine with four dungeons, so long as each one is unique and full of great moments you won't normally experience in the overworld.

100 shrines + 4 dungeons = A happy Orbital

 

[Neff]

It's not a Zelda thing.

...

The fact that you've taken optional game mechanics designed explicitly to give players a cheap way to win if their skills aren't that great as mandatory requirements is of course going to give you an easy experience if your skill level doesn't demand that you use those mechanics.

It kind of is a Zelda thing because they used to be very skilfully-balanced games of challenge which increased along with the resources available to you, and it was down to the player to make sure they kept up, because if they didn't, they'd have a much harder time. The more recent Zeldas tend to favour upgrades as a safety net for less experienced players rather than something which is actually needed, and I think that's what people are wanting the series to embrace again.

Personally, I would be really disappointed if there were only 4 dungeons as that old rumor states.

I think I would, too. Unless they were utterly fucking amazing and incredibly varied, and can be revisited multiple times while still offering something fresh and new, I'm going to want more than just four. A Zelda dungeon is significant for me- an ordeal of tension, focus, thrills, catharsis and renewed expectation all in one. It's a cycle I relish over and over, and I want to enjoy that cycle as many times as possible. Four isn't a lot. It's part of why I can never get on with Majora's Mask.

 

[what-ok]

Nintendo used to have challenging games around the time of the NES Kid Icarus and Zelda II. The challenge is not so much these days. They like having people complete their games without having to git gud.

 

[TheMoon]

It's not a choice. It's a puzzle.

"Hmm I wonder what will give me more HP ignoring or picking up the HP increasing item"

and it's a very easy puzzle to solve

I literally can't enjoy the game if I try to avoid that

You're not choosing between picking up the HP+ item or not picking up the HP+ item. You're choosing between stuffing your inventory with nothing but/mostly HP+ items before the next battle over only using what you happen to come across.

Vegan Mode will be best Hero Mode

Veggie Mode for me. Because if there's Lon Lon Milk in the game, I will bathe in it!

Is Hero Mode available from the start?
Because I honestly don't have time to replay RPGS a second time around.

As has been said before earlier on this page: we don't even know if Hero Mode even exists. And if it does, historically it will not be available from the start in a new game. They only do that for re-releases.

Nintendo used to have challenging games around the time of the NES Kid Icarus and Zelda II. The challenge is not so much these days. They like having people complete their games without having to git gud.

You haven't been playing a lot of Nintendo games this century, I guess.

 

[OrbitalBeard]

Nintendo used to have challenging games around the time of the NES Kid Icarus and Zelda II. The challenge is not so much these days. They like having people complete their games without having to git gud.

Games were created under completely different circumstances 30 years ago. If Kid Icarus wasn't extremely difficult, you could finish the game for the first time in under an hour.

And Nintendo still releases plenty of challenging games anyway. The average Nintendo release isn't any less challenging than what you'd see from any other major publisher.

 

[what-ok]

True. Things change and the focus of Nintendo has changed too. I will continue to play games without a doubt, but I'm always looking for a fun and CHALLENGING experience. It is just my observation and first hand experience that Nintendo's first party releases haven't posed much of a challenge since I was a child. My two cents.

 

[OrbitalBeard]

True. Things change and the focus of Nintendo has changed too. I will continue to play games without a doubt, but I'm always looking for a fun and CHALLENGING experience. It is just my observation and first hand experience that Nintendo's first party releases haven't posed much of a challenge since I was a child. My two cents.

Well, if you don't find games like Punch-Out!! Wii, Sin and Punishment: Star Successor or Donkey Kong Country: Tropical Freeze to be challenging, you're simply a better than average player.

 

[BY2K]

Is there even gonna be heart containers in this game? Not that I think you'll only be able to increase your health temporarily, but I'm guessing the method to increase your health will require either a recipe or crafting that requires a rare ingredient.

 

[TheMoon]

Is there even gonna be heart containers in this game? Not that I think you'll only be able to increase your health temporarily, but I'm guessing the method to increase your health will require either a recipe or crafting that requires a rare ingredient.

I don't think anyone asked them on video or anything.

Regardless, permanent upgrades to anything have so far been completely off the table as far as official info goes. Maybe because that wasn't fully decided at that point.

 

[OrbitalBeard]

I don't think anyone asked them on video or anything.

Regardless, permanent upgrades to anything have so far been completely off the table as far as official info goes. Maybe because that wasn't fully decided at that point.

It'd be pretty surprising if that type of thing hadn't been finalized by June of 2016. This game is deep in production.

They probably just aren't ready to talk about that stuff yet.

 

[TheMoon]

It'd be pretty surprising if that type of thing hadn't been finalized by June of 2016. This game is deep in production.

They probably just aren't ready to talk about that stuff yet.

They love to flip flop things around

Sure the info-rollout plan is more likely but I wouldn't put it past them to wait on demo feedback about the survival-aspect.

 

[OrbitalBeard]

They love to flip flop things around

Sure the info-rollout plan is more likely but I wouldn't put it past them to wait on demo feedback about the survival-aspect.

Yeah, that's certainly possible.

 

[what-ok]

Well, if you don't find games like Punch-Out!! Wii, Sin and Punishment: Star Successor or Donkey Kong Country: Tropical Freeze to be challenging, you're simply a better than average player.

(=

Good examples(s)

Oh, I did love Punch-Out, but not memorable and I had totally forgot about it. I never got into any of the modern DK games since the days of the arcade original purely because of aesthetic reasons. I know that's whatever, but it's not my cup of tea.
Was Sin and Punishment a Nintendo first party game? If so, that is what I am talking about. More of that please. Just speaking for myself here, but it is Great!

I apologize for going off topic, but the point of my rant is that I want this new Zelda to more challenging. That is all.

 

[TheMoon]

Yeah, that's certainly possible.

I could also see a scenario where perma upgrades are part of the normal game and are turned off in a potential Hero Mode or the requirements for them are changed. Could be interesting as well.

 

[OrbitalBeard]

(=

Good examples(s)

Oh, I did love Punch-Out, but not memorable and I had totally forgot about it. I never got into any of the modern DK games since the days of the arcade original purely because of aesthetic reasons. I know that's whatever, but it's not my cup of tea.
Was Sin and Punishment a Nintendo first party game? If so, that is what I am talking about. More of that please. Just speaking for myself here, but it is Great!

S&P2 was developed by Treasure, but funded and published by Nintendo, yeah. I'm also fairly certain it's a Nintendo IP.

 

[TheMoon]

(=
Was Sin and Punishment a Nintendo first party game? If so, that is what I am talking about. More of that please. Just speaking for myself here, but it is Great!

Yes. Throw TW101 and Bayonetta 2 into that mix as well. New Super Luigi U is also balls hard. Fire Emblem still has all its difficulty options and playing Pikmin 3 or Star Fox Zero as intended is also no slouch. Nevermind some of the stuff they throw at you in the various Mario games. In both Xenoblades you can get wrecked fast if you don't pay attention, etc.

 

[Nickle]

Posted this theory on a Zelda subreddit, want to know what you guys think. I basically think that there will be an alternate world because we haven't seen many Shrines and there are supposed to be over 100 of them:

Nintendo has confirmed that there will be over 100 Shrines in BOTW. There is also a rumor floating around that says that there will be around 120-130 shrines (I am skeptical of this rumor as a whole, but this number seems very possible). I've come up with some evidence to show that it would be extremely difficult to fit 100+ shrines on the current Overworld, and that there must be some sort of alternate world, such as a dark world or alternate time period.

We have seen a sizable portion of the world from all the footage that Nintendo has released, but we've probably seen a maximum of 20 shrines. Shrines shine with an orange light, so they are relatively easy to spot, and we've gotten a pretty good idea what the central part of the map looks like thanks to multiple different camera views. Unless there are 100+ shrines hidden in the corners of the map, it's unlikely that all of them would fit on the current map.

The Shrines don't just function as a trial to get an item, they are also fast travel points. On the Great Plateau, the shrines are placed strategically so that you can access most parts of the area with relative speed by traveling to the closest shrine. I imagine the Shrines will be strategically spread out in other regions, too, as they are much larger and would take longer to traverse without a fast travel system. Based on the Shrines' brightness and their function as fast travel spots, it is unlikely that they are intended to be carefully hidden, which is also why I find it suspicious that we haven't seen a huge amount of them.

Based on our knowledge of the world map, it's pretty much confirmed that there are 15 regions. If we assume that there are 100 shrines, then the last 14 regions would share 96 shrines, which averages out to a little less then 7 shrines per region. If we assume that there are 130 shrines, then there would be an average of about 9 shrines per region. Based on the footage we have already seen, I would challenge you to find even 7 spaces to put shrines in the regions surrounding the Great Plateau.

Here's the kicker: if you take the number of Shrines in the Great Plateau (4) and multiply it by the number of regions (15), you get 60. If you assume that there is an alternate world that has the same number of Shrines and regions, then the total number of Shrines would be 120. This is a nice clean number that fits very well into both what Nintendo and the GameExplain rumor have said about the number of Shrines.

So there's my evidence that Breath of the Wild will have an alternate world. I'd really like to know what you all think about this theory, especially if you have evidence against it.

 

[TheMoon]

you're not the first with the alt-world theory^^

 

[Deleted member 465307]

Posted this theory on a Zelda subreddit, want to know what you guys think. I basically think that there will be an alternate world because we haven't seen many Shrines and there are supposed to be over 100 of them:

What is this 120-130 shrine rumor?

I think that's an interesting idea you raise. So many Zelda games have that duality in the world or play experience that I was wondering where it would come from in this game. However, this game is also heavily inspired by the original, which didn't have that mechanic. I was also skeptical that, with a world that big, Nintendo would really want to make two of them.

However, I hadn't considered the argument you made, so that has me thinking maybe they will work something out. It's also possible that the same 50/-60 shrines you anticipate will have a "second version" where the shrine challenges are entirely new, like if Super Mario Galaxy's second playthrough had been Super Mario Galaxy 2's levels.

I imagine this game does have some kind of surprise that they haven't shown yet, whether Link or the world transforms or something completely different.