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Deleted member 47027
Unconfirmed Member
The underlying problem goes beyond games to the whole "the darker you are, the uglier you are" - which is a goddamned shame, because it's not true.
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Why do you think they changed her skin tone?
Colorism.
So they based one character's appearance on the mo-cap actor, but not the other.
Crossing Eden
Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
Maybe because she had the best audition because that's how casting for a role is supposed to work. Are you saying that it would've been better to choose a dark skinned actress just because she looks more similar to the concept art instead of making slight adjustments to the character design because of better motion capture technology?
IblisGinjo
Member
I never played Virtua Fighter after that. Vanessa was my main.
VF3 says hi
What makes them look better now
You should check out his MGS1 stuff. He uses a range of colours.
Should've been 1st post
OT - It is indeed a problem that needs to be addressed, where's Kotaku?
PS: Hopefully they dont change my main man Eddy Gordo, I'm cool
Sword Familiar
178% of NeoGAF posters don't understand statistics
It's possible. No one said it was a natural tan. Could be using a spray tan or similar product.
Tried googling it and came up with this picture (maybe slightly NSFW). I'd say it's about the same, or even a bit darker than Vanessa's.
Doesn't prove anything of course, but the same could be said about most people's assumptions in this thread.
foxuzamaki
Doesn't read OPs, especially not his own
Sheva looks pretty close to the concept art when you remove the puke green filter from everything.
Am I missing something? Sheva still looks really lightskinned compared to her concept art
Lord_Balkan
Member
They aren't two different people. It just looks like Jade is ethnically ambiguous (which makes sense since she is from Edenia). There are many people (south-east Asians) with that skin tone. Also, Jade was lighter in MK2 than MK3.
This is also MK2 / MK3 Jade concept art. (The MK3 concept art is official and done by John Tobias) I think it is a pretty big leap in logic to assign an ethnicity / race to her based on this.
This is also what Jade looks like in-game
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Your VF example is pretty shocking / outrageous, but I don't think MK is a strong enough example.
I don't think they would do a guy like that. Might make him more aggressive but not lighter.
Sakura
Member
Haven't people already stated that they based the likeness of the in-game model on the actor for her...?
Ploid 3.0
Member
Cannot wait for this game. Love that character model, they better not bleach her skin for DA:I 2 haha.
Monster Zero
Junior Member
I just wish games had more options for black hair, either cornrows or an Afro!
D
Deleted member 47027
Unconfirmed Member
Any of you saying it might be a tanning issue with Vanessa:
DoktorEvil
Banned
Where is this presented in game to the player? In the notes?
Yup. She is my favorite character in VF4Evo and they really fucked her up in the transition to VF5. That said, the skin tone change is by far the least bad of the changes they made. VF5 character customization (at least in Final Showdown) allows you to set the skin tone relatively close to the original.Very disappointing. Another example - and a very glaring example - the badass and amazing Vanessa from Virtua Fighter 4:
The real tragedy is the model change. She had sharp, distinctive facial features; they got softened to a generic mess and eyes enlarged so that she looks like an entirely different person. And obviously she was muscular, ripped and super-strong, which made her stand out and fit her fighting style - all that got toned down, while breast size was substantially increased. None of this can be fixed with customization.
Also, while she has a variety of costumes in VF5, the default A and B costumes both go out of their way to emphasize boobs in a way that is just clownish. VF4 default costumes were both cool, and each one was thematically tied into one of her two stances, reinforcing the idea of the dual origins of her fighting style (military combatives + vale tudo). Going by the costumes, her style in VF5 is porn-fu:
Actor Bill Duke Talks Dark Girls and Colorism: http://youtu.be/tYZ6RWBAcDM
Sheva's appearance was based on Michelle Van Der Water. She didn't do any of the acting. She was picked because of her looks. She had the best audition because, clearly, she was how they wanted Sheva to look.
But why her and not the others? How does making her skin lighter to match her mo-cap actor improve the game?
captainpat
Member
The sad part is that there are a couple pieces of fanart of her whitewashed.
Also happened with Connor in AC3. Not sure if the original plan was for him to be darker skinned, but that's some serious white washing. He's practically lighter skinned than his British-born father. The "mixed race" excuse makes it even worse because of the supposedly "consensual relationship" between his parents. But that's a whole other even uglier form of the white washing of history. Lightening a character's skin color usually hides another form of cultural and political violence (as it does in this case).
Some of the spinning in this thread...
"Ohh, Sheva is lighter than her concept art! That's racist" (even if the concept art was made by the exact same company). Then someone shows another character in the same game that actually became darker... "Ohh, Sheva is lighter than her concept art! That's sexist!" (wut).
Seriously. In many games the skin being lighter is usually a visual limitation. If the game tends to be dark, making your character too dark is going to have him blend in a bit too much, or you won't be able to see certain expressions that the developers wanted. Going for a lighter skin isn't usually as much a racist thing, as it's just for visual clarity in the game, and how the game manages contrast and lighting.
"Ohh, Sheva is lighter than her concept art! That's racist" (even if the concept art was made by the exact same company). Then someone shows another character in the same game that actually became darker... "Ohh, Sheva is lighter than her concept art! That's sexist!" (wut).
Seriously. In many games the skin being lighter is usually a visual limitation. If the game tends to be dark, making your character too dark is going to have him blend in a bit too much, or you won't be able to see certain expressions that the developers wanted. Going for a lighter skin isn't usually as much a racist thing, as it's just for visual clarity in the game, and how the game manages contrast and lighting.
More specifically she's Ethiopian/French and is an exchange student in japan.
Leafhopper
Banned
Then you would have people that claim that is just stereotyping. Which is a shame.
Sounds like a capcom character alright.
Hip Hop
Member
got a chuckle out of this one.
Monster Zero
Junior Member
Lol, wasn't the backstory for Dark Sakura in Marvel vs Capcom 2 was that she had a tan?
Crossing Eden
Hello, my name is Yves Guillemot, Vivendi S.A.'s Employee of the Month!
Oh so it's Jill turning into Julia Voth. Just pointing out that the actual actress also has the same skin tone as Sheva does in-game.
Thanks for sharing your perspective!
TheBlackMarvel
Member
Ok then.
http://streetfighter.wikia.com/wiki/Elena
"Elena is the young daughter of a small African tribe. Her father, the patriarch of the tribe, has a doctorate from a French university. Elena was raised in the vast nature of Africa and she aspires to study abroad like her father did before her."
"In her ending, Elena ends up being transferred to a high school in Japan as an exchange student".
Exactly. It's internal hatred to a certain degree. Either the media is echoing these views(unlikely) or have already precipitated them.
holy crap, didnt know about virtua fighter.... this is mind blowing, but everyone loves white only stuff in games. its sad to see most people dont want to see them in games. have a look at korea/china/japan. you wont find any of this stuff included in this games. they clearly take people from the west as their role model and of course east asian looking persons in games.
i really would like to know why this is such a heavy issue to include the option into the games.
is it because of the mass who clearly doesnt want them to be in games?
is it because devs dont want them in games?
are devs just too lazy to include them in games?
is it the publisher who tells them to do so?
is there a lobby behind all this?
i dont have a clue, but sad to see this trend going on and on..
i really would like to know why this is such a heavy issue to include the option into the games.
is it because of the mass who clearly doesnt want them to be in games?
is it because devs dont want them in games?
are devs just too lazy to include them in games?
is it the publisher who tells them to do so?
is there a lobby behind all this?
i dont have a clue, but sad to see this trend going on and on..
ThoughtsOfSpeaking
Banned
Don't bother. Reading this thread, people don't want to talk about the larger issue, just take pot shots at japanese developers for giving black girls white hair.
Talk about missing the point entirely.
The sex appeal probably. Went from bodybuilder to lingerie model. The actual character model is also more dated looking.
PhoenixFyre
Member
They're not wrong. I said above how I ran into that very problem. Especially in a game like Res Evil where there are dark moments, a darker character can lose a lot of definition. If I remember right, the tribesman in RE5 all appeared in well lit areas. They wouldn't have to go through the dark bits like Sheva did.
Was about to say that. It's kind of scary
Sakura
Member
How should I know why? Why don't you ask Capcom?
Maybe when they were designing a new, main character, one of the protagonists for the game, they thought to base the model off someone because why not, and didn't bother for the lesser characters?
Why does it have to improve the game? It says they were using her likeness for the model. Why does there need to be more of a reason? Maybe some guy just thought she was cute and said 'Hey let's make the character look like her!' I don't know.
All I am saying is it is hardly the same situation as some other examples posted.
edit:it seems it's not even her mocap actress. Maybe like how TLOU uses someone's likeness but not mocap or voice acting.
Rawket Lawnchair
Member
Happens in real life too.
Any of you saying it might be a tanning issue with Vanessa:
To clarify, i'm not saying Vanessa lost her tan, i'm saying that the original design is a piss poor attempt to have a black character in the roster.
Doesn't justify the whitewashing though.
Irving is modeled after a real person, and so is Jill.
They most likely modeled Sheva after her because they did the same with Jill, and they wanted that extra press and fanboy oohing for modeling their new, big female lead after a real women who is very attractive, to imply she's just as important as Jill is.
PetriP-TNT
Member
This doesn't look black, this looks like solarium gone wrong
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