BennyBlanco
aka IMurRIVAL69
Yeah it's ass. Path tracing or nothing for Pragmata and re9.
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Capcom raytracing is a disgrace. Pragmata on ps5 pro has noteable artifacts issue.
- Thread starter Karim
- Start date
Danjin44
The nicest person on this forum
People acting this game unplayable and to me that's fucking idiotic.
People praise Cyberpunk's ray tracing and yet to this day game is still filled with bugs often you see NPCs walking on air or random T pose during cutscenes or even UI bugging out so I have to restart the game.
Shit like that bothers more than petty stuff you guys complaining about.
Naw that's just juvenile cope. This is just the devs being terrible with rt. The standard rt was clearly very low priority and effort and they basically just used the Nvidia path tracing tech covering the high end and called it a day. There are several games on the ps5 pro that look much better without even close to this level of lackluster rt. Look at ac shadows an open world game and tell me the pro can't do any better.
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
If I'm not mistaken, Pragmata uses a mixture of SSR + RT reflections, and RE Engine has always had poor SSR.
Capcom's RT might not be the best, but it sure as hell helped RE2 and 3 remakes with how bad the SSR were.
Capcom's RT might not be the best, but it sure as hell helped RE2 and 3 remakes with how bad the SSR were.
nkarafo
Member
Such heavy artifacting is inexcusable. It's like a graphical glitch.
If you can't render an effect properly then don't use it, it's as simple as that.
Venom Snake
Member
Expect something better perhaps?
I have many games on ps5 pro that use RT at much higher quality than this.
The cheap hardware argument is no longer applicable in this case and may only work for those who choose to be arrogant.
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Shogmaster
Sloppy seconds
There's no RT on PS5 and Series X.
Venom Snake
Member
Pragmata On Consoles: Fine on PS5/Series X - But PS5 Pro Is The Best Way To Play
Series S runs well, but image quality and features take a big hit.
www.digitalfoundry.net
Summary:
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TKOFromTokyo
Member
I think it's totally fine to enjoy a game if it doesn't bother you or if you don't notice. I also think it's perfectly fine to share your opinion on something that is an issue for you. I don't understand why we all can't have different viewpoints.
adamsapple
Or is it just one of Phil's balls in my throat?
There is, the resolution modes have the same RT as the Pro, hell the reflections are actually sharper cause they're tied to native resolution before upscaling.
Danjin44
The nicest person on this forum
My issue isn't people have different views point, my problem is the hyperbolic nature of the argument.
There people here who think game is unplayable because of it including OP.
I don't how the fuck you guys enjoy any game with that type mind set?
Venom Snake
Member
Relax buddy, it's just another day on the internet. The game is fine, we know that.
But if you need something like path tracing to make it look normal, you've kind of screwed up. That's it.
uncreativename
Gold Member
Hopefully one day GPUs will be powerful enough to path trace everything without denoising at all
YeulEmeralda
Linux User
To be honest even on a 5080 you need frame gen for PT. Shit's heavy yo.
uncreativename
Gold Member
I think a big part of that depends on your display. I'm still using my old faithful 1080p 60fps-ish non-HDR monitor and I can play these newer games at max on my 4080 without any framegen or upscaling. None of them even provide the option to play without denoising, though, so clearly I need that.
Lokaum D+
Member
It really suck to be graphic whore.
yep, its preferable to eat any and every shit devs throw at us cause reasons.
Jinzo Prime
Member
Too bad I can't use the path tracing feature on an AMD GPU. Thanks Capcom.
Barakov
Gold Member
So I started to play Pragmata. First area was wow amazing IQ but going further
And it's lot worse to see in first person but I'm not that good to make capture. I don't know if it's a thing of the update but I have really big trouble to play it. It's not everywhere but when appears is very visible. I really start to regret to have raytracing in capcom games because it's clear to me they are completely incompetent to handle this tech. Now I can only hope the pssr2 forced will continue to be update by sony to at least to mitigate the issue but I have zero faith in capcom for this stuff.
Sorry for the typo in the title.
T4keD0wN
Member
Denoising is even more necessary with RT unless you want a flickering, noisy mess, no amount of rays per pixel will change that, a power of thousand 5090s wont help much besides being able to accumulate more temporal data at higher framerates, but thats if devs account for that (they wont) and then youll trade stability for ghosting and youve got another problem.
The more RT effects the more important denoising becomes, especially for GI, with path tracing (all effects) youll need it the most. Denoising is not your enemy, youd get a completely unusable image without it, what you truly want is "good" input for the denoiser, high quality denoising and high quality AA after.
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viveks86
Gold Member
Why? The solution to a shit denoiser is not no denoiser. Capcom's implementation of a path tracer is technically the least robust version of path tracing in any shipped game. The only reason it even looks great is the artwork and the primary rays already being rasterized. Every aspect of it is outdated except DLSS RR. Without RR, the whole thing will fall apart.
For everything, including primary rays, to be path traced AND for it to look clean enough to not need a denoiser, you can probably get 1 frame per minute on a 5090 with optimizations. You and I may not be alive to see 60 fps in real time on a silicon based gpu on any consumer grade hardware.
Meanwhile, viable path tracing and denoising solutions are available right now and will reach a point where this is a non-issue in just a couple of years. If you prefer to be alive to see it, you gotta embrace denoising.
uncreativename
Gold Member
I didn't mean that I hate denoisers. I totally agree with you that they're obviously essential right now and they will be for a long time, and the better ones do do a good job. I'm just saying that I also think it'd be great if GPU power got to the point where we could do without this.
Feel Like I'm On 42
Member
I've been saying this the game looks like crap on the Pro because that boiling artifact is everywhere and rt reflections also look like smeared crap.
Why the hell Capcom does this need to be upscaled from 864p on the PRO?
What pisses me off so much is they knew RE9 was a mess on the Pro with its RT yet they didn't do a damn thing to prevent the same situation in their next game!
Pro owners need to speak up because this type of thing should be unacceptable ...another game where Pro owners are getting a shit effort for the Pro.
Why the hell Capcom does this need to be upscaled from 864p on the PRO?
What pisses me off so much is they knew RE9 was a mess on the Pro with its RT yet they didn't do a damn thing to prevent the same situation in their next game!
Pro owners need to speak up because this type of thing should be unacceptable ...another game where Pro owners are getting a shit effort for the Pro.
Feel Like I'm On 42
Member
This is the real problem with Pragmata on the Pro! Why the fuck is it 864p on Pro when the Pro uses the EXACT SAME SETTINGS as base ps5? This is the type of port that Pro owners should be up in arms over.
The boiling isn't just confined to RT reflections either ...it's practically everywhere but especially noticeable on chain fences and mesh patterns.
Capcom fuckin sucks man. Removing the OPTION of using RT in re9 is also unacceptable. Now, we have an inconsistent looking game where the lighting is super flat in the second half. Let people choose!
I've stopped playing both games as its such a bummer to spend $150 and see this result on two hyped games that were supposed to be "oh so great" on the Pro according to the shysters at DF.
Especially after the fantastic PSSR2 update ...boy these games are a stain on that tech. Even if its not the fault of pssr. Looking at Alan Wake 2 which is also 864p using pssr2 which now looks stable and has some of the best rt reflections on the console.
TastyPastry
Member
i agree with you OP. as soon as i entered the second area of the game it was flickering so bad i thought my pro is dying. it's just not excusable and the clowns over at DF said this game was another "win" for ps5 pro. there are lots of games with good RT implementation (cyberpunk for example) so i don't know how capcom managed to fuck it up. this would have been my goty so far otherwise but the RT noise here is so bad it really destroys my fun. is the base ps5 ps5 version also shimmering like crazy? if not capcom needs to let us turn off RT but we don't even have the option as far as i can tell.
i wonder if playing the game on PS6 will change things but i definitely don't want to buy the game again when i already spent 75€ for the deluxe version like an idiot
Bojji
Gold Member
Unless they patch in PT from PC version or upgrade their base RT tech, PS6 version will look the same - it will even retain fixed 864p resolution.
Dynamic resolution Capcom - have you heard about it*?
* - PC version has it for some reason (but unusable, only works with TAA/TAAU)
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TrebleShot
Member
Isn't PT exclusive to NVIDIA and PS5 PRO ain't got the juice for the AMD. denoiser maybe next gen.
Shogmaster
Sloppy seconds
Pragmata On Consoles: Fine on PS5/Series X - But PS5 Pro Is The Best Way To Play
Series S runs well, but image quality and features take a big hit.
Summary:
Shit, I thought we were talking about RE9. I have RE9 on my brain...
Shogmaster
Sloppy seconds
Yeah, brain fart. I was thinking RE9 for some reason. Replaying it for the 11th time right now...There is, the resolution modes have the same RT as the Pro, hell the reflections are actually sharper cause they're tied to native resolution before upscaling.
The boiling artifacts it's the last annoying issue for my eyes, and seems reduced with the last patch, mostly is visible in motion. But the more annoying broken rendering is this crappy pixelation around the character when you move above some ground reflective surface. It's really awful and very visible, seems to look a broken youtube video. It's not everywhere but in different spots it's really apparent. Capcom should just disable raytracing reflections in such surface and problem solved but more likely will disable everything in big portion of the area of the game as they did already RE9 knowing them because they are lazy as hell in such stuff and surely won't check the broken spots singularly.
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Previously RE more likely used raytracing just for the indirect lighting not for the whole GI. Otherwise you would see the same horrid denoiser artifacts.
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Kuranghi
Member
Do you get a 30fps lock with those settings on a 5080? Is RR on?
I watched a video of 5090 running 4K DLAA PT w/ RR and it was getting 37fps in the base hub so I assumed a 30fps lock in high gpu intensity areas would be impossible on any card.
I dont know how much DLAA and RR would affect performance if you dont have them on though.
PontificationEngine
Member
Their denoiser definitely needs some work.
Cr1ptkeeper
Member
Their RT implementation on console was the best for RE2-3 remake and Village. No artifacts and an overall clean image. Too bad RE2 has the broken black levels.
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Gonzito
Gold Member
What? No fucking way. Raytracing in those games is trash. Reflections in particular look awful, like one quarter of the resolution. Awful
And the denoiser in Re Engine is a joke
Chuck Berry
Gold Member
So I started to play Pragmata. First area was wow amazing IQ but going further
And it's lot worse to see in first person but I'm not that good to make capture. I don't know if it's a thing of the update but I have really big trouble to play it. It's not everywhere but when appears is very visible. I really start to regret to have raytracing in capcom games because it's clear to me they are completely incompetent to handle this tech. Now I can only hope the pssr2 forced will continue to be update by sony to at least to mitigate the issue but I have zero faith in capcom for this stuff.
Sorry for the typo in the title.
Damn. Worst game of the year CONFIRMED.
Gonna uninstall now. Thanks for saving me the time hombre.
Cr1ptkeeper
Member
Have you recently played RE2-3? The reflections are perfectly fine. At least playing on a tv, maybe it's more noticeable on a monitor.
Gonzito
Gold Member
Absolutely both before Requiem. With Pathtracing and Raytracing. Reflections are really bad.
From Digital Fraud in Village technical review, at least they were right this time
