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[Lernaean]

Here is something to ponder about:
What if it is impossible to obtain hardware or software by legal means?

Not even sure you can get a ps2 anymore from stores or games for it for that matter.
In that respect I dont really hold it against people who emulate that stuff because you cant really get it any other way.
This applies to both, games and hardware.

Its actually thanks to the popularity of emulation that a lot of the great games from the past still live on.
The platform holders and devs dont really care about them anymore. At least not enough.

You are opening a completely different chapter which I somewhat answered when i said that preserving the old games for future generations is essential.
What I'm talking about is all the comments that go like 'yay, i'll get to play Bayonetta 2/MK8/Smash now'. No, it's not simple as that. The WiiU and its games are widely available everywhere right now. If you want to play WiiU games, the legal and most importantly ethical way is, you buy the box, you buy the games and play them, and if you want to emulate them, like i do, you rip your own games and do so.

 

[Alo81]

Unless you plan on pirating games, you will still need to buy a Wii U and the games you want to play, so... Nothing has changed.

No.

 

[Pokemaniac]

No.

Well a normal Blu-ray drive certainly isn't going to be able to rip those games.

 

[samn]

No.

you can sell the console afterwards I suppose

 

[ShirAhava]

wow this is happening a lot sooner than I expected.

 

[Golnei]

No.

Is there now a way to rip the games without the console? If nothing's changed in that regard, I don't think renting one would be a reliable proposition, and if you're borrowing one for the purpose of ripping games, you might as well just play them on it while you have it.

 

[Rich!]

Is there now a way to rip the games without the console? If nothing's changed in that regard, I don't think renting one would be a reliable proposition, and if you're borrowing one for the purpose of ripping games, you might as well just play them on it while you have it.

There is currently no way to rip games without the console, and even then the standard user cannot do it.

 

[caleb1915]

You have to admit tho, this is pretty fast work for an emulating software that involves some reverse engineering of hardware into virtual components, Even for a very early emulator.

 

[ArjanN]

Well a normal Blu-ray drive certainly isn't going to be able to rip those games.

Look, let's be real. Most people aren't going to rip their own games/dump their own bios anyway. Even if people have the games they're most likely still just going to download it somewhere because it's faster and easier than doing it yourself.

 

[Demise]

Here is something to ponder about:
What if it is impossible to obtain hardware or software by legal means?

Not even sure you can get a ps2 anymore from stores or games for it for that matter.
In that respect I dont really hold it against people who emulate that stuff because you cant really get it any other way.
This applies to both, games and hardware.

Its actually thanks to the popularity of emulation that a lot of the great games from the past still live on.
The platform holders and devs dont really care about them anymore. At least not enough.

You could ofc argue that you can get hardware and software second hand but how is that better than piracy for the dev or platform holder?
You just get a more authentic experience as an end user but thats it.
In many cases emulated versions are even better than the original ones. Usually just graphically because of AA etc, but in some cases even gameplay wise - for instance I played tekken 3 @ 53 fps because it was a much faster and enjoyable experience then.

This, I agree completely.

But if the game you emulate is still sold in store brand new, you have to buy it. That rarely happens though since emulators often show up when the console and the games are obsolete.

I would be ok to pay a certain amount to video game companies in order to buy a live-long license that allow me to play an emulated game legally. Let's say 10$ for Metroid Prime or 15$ for DQ8. But I do not see them apply prices like this, it would be much higher and people would continue to play the game illegally.

 

[lensoftruth]

for instance I played tekken 3 @ 53 fps because it was a much faster and enjoyable experience then.

Why would you play it at a slower FPS?

 

[Social]

Why would you play it at a slower FPS?

I was wondering that too... maybe his pc could only handle 53fps instead of the original game's 60?

 

[Vipershark]

There sure are quite a lot of people openly admitting to downloading game rips that aren't their own in this thread.
Just say that you're going to "borrow a Wii U from a friend for a while" like everyone else and drop the discussion on that, please.

There is a Wii U emulator. Be excited for the future.

 

[Cleve]

Emulator should have been called Dolphin U.

That would just lead to confusion and people thinking it was an accessory for dolphin.

 

[shockdude]

Dolphin devs may help for the new Emulator
https://twitter.com/Dolphin_Emu/status/654135680726134784

That's wrong. Apparently there are two WiiU emulators in development: CEMU and wiiu-emu.
CEMU is closed source and is the emulator being discussed in this thread.
wiiu-emu is open source and is the emulator the Dolphin devs "may" help out with.

 

[Pokemaniac]

Look, let's be real. Most people aren't going to rip their own games/dump their own bios anyway. Even if people have the games they're most likely still just going to download it somewhere because it's faster and easier than doing it yourself.

I don't doubt that, though with only a handful of people currently even able to perform the rips (the currently available Wii U exploits have been patched, and the Wii U does pretty aggressive auto updating), and many of them being against piracy, I doubt you'll find too many Wii U isos on the Internet right now in the first place.

 

[Brhoom]

That would just lead to confusion and people thinking it was an accessory for dolphin.

You aint slick XD

 

[morikaze]

C(afe)emu?

 

[AcademicSaucer]

Look, let's be real. Most people aren't going to rip their own games/dump their own bios anyway. Even if people have the games they're most likely still just going to download it somewhere because it's faster and easier than doing it yourself.

99.9% of the people that will use this emulator will be pirates, we at Neogaf are the 0.01% tho.

 

[joesiv]

This, I agree completely.

But if the game you emulate is still sold in store brand new, you have to buy it. That rarely happens though since emulators often show up when the console and the games are obsolete.

I would be ok to pay a certain amount to video game companies in order to buy a live-long license that allow me to play an emulated game legally. Let's say 10$ for Metroid Prime or 15$ for DQ8. But I do not see them apply prices like this, it would be much higher and people would continue to play the game illegally.

The one thing that is often not thought about is, used game sales can still affect supply and demand. Games that people hold onto, or are hard to find on the used market, the value goes up, perhaps to the point where people may just purchase the retail version. So there IS a related effect, even buying used games.

Piracy on the other hand, totally circumvents the retail market, new or used, and gives a false sense of lowered sales/demand. If sales are high enough, the effect is likely not felt, but for games that's sales are low, the effect is more obvious.

Take for example Xenoblade Chronicles for the Wii, because the print run was small, the game was very hard to find in north america, so the used price skyrocketed, I'll bet that Nintendo probably was aware that the demand far surpassed supply in this case. It could be argued that that might have contributed to why we got the 3DS version, and perhaps even getting X (at least in north america).

If it was easy to pirate the Wii game, that demand would be invisible.

Just some thoughts.

 

[Enter the Dragon Punch]

C(afe)emu?

there's only one emulator for the wii u

and his name

is JOHN CEMU

🎺🎺🎺🎺

 

[Stumpokapow]

Take for example Xenoblade Chronicles for the Wii, because the print run was small, the game was very hard to find in north america, so the used price skyrocketed, I'll bet that Nintendo probably was aware that the demand far surpassed supply in this case. It could be argued that that might have contributed to why we got the 3DS version, and perhaps even getting X (at least in north america).

If it was easy to pirate the Wii game, that demand would be invisible.

Just some thoughts.

It was easy to pirate the Wii game. It was widely available--over a year before the game even came out in the US, note--it was playable on both PC and on modified Wiis, it was easy to modify the Wii, and we know from download statistics of the homebrew channel that literally millions of Wiis were modified. I think the burden of proof is to argue otherwise.

The problem with your assertion is that it's tautological. Used market success is seen as evidence that piracy didn't impact the used market, because your measure of piracy is identical to your measure of piracy's effect. What happens in a world where you're wrong, piracy is easy, but there's still a vibrant used community? How would we know? Any time you make an argument, you need to engage with how you would know if you were wrong: what we would see in the world that's different. And if the answer to that is "No, I'm definitely right", then you're not making an argument

 

[lt519]

I'm not a fan of it, and had a huge thread about it earlier, link, that consoles still at market having emulators may not be piracy but is at a minimum unethical. There's still money to be had selling consoles (and the subsequent money people would spend on them) and circumventing that hurts Nintendo and their ability to fund future consoles/games.

 

[Mivey]

I'm not a fan of it, and had a huge thread about it earlier, link, that consoles still at market having emulators may not be piracy but is at a minimum unethical. There's still money to be had selling consoles (and the subsequent money people would spend on them) and circumventing that hurts Nintendo and their ability to fund future consoles/games.

The only people for whom this, assuming they would gladly pirate it, work, are people
1) from the future: That emulator is nowere near stable to run the majority of games
2) with a monster rig: Currently running games at fullspeed work require some sort of super comupter.

2) means they would need to spend so much more then just buying a WiiU that it should be a rather small minority
And 1) implies people with time machines, which I think would have larger consequences than just for a Nintendo console.

 

[Nerrel]

Look, let's be real. Most people aren't going to rip their own games/dump their own bios anyway. Even if people have the games they're most likely still just going to download it somewhere because it's faster and easier than doing it yourself.

Most people I'm aware of on Dolphin's forums have ripped their own games. It's more reliable than downloading since you can be assured you're getting the version you want, the format you want (not compressed/scrubbed), that it's a verified rip, and that it doesn't contain viruses or spyware of some sort.

It doesn't take much time to set a Wii up with CleanRip and it only takes 10-20 minutes per disc. Depending on your internet, that's likely faster than finding and downloading an ISO. And again, it's safer and more reliable. You know exactly what's in that rip.

 

[petran79]

The only people for whom this, assuming they would gladly pirate it, work, are people
1) from the future: That emulator is nowere near stable to run the majority of games
2) with a monster rig: Currently running games at fullspeed work require some sort of super comupter.

2) means they would need to spend so much more then just buying a WiiU that it should be a rather small minority
And 1) implies people with time machines, which I think would have larger consequences than just for a Nintendo console.

Even pirating will not help boost Wii U's popularity....

 

[joesiv]

It was easy to pirate the Wii game. It was widely available--over a year before the game even came out in the US, note--it was playable on both PC and on modified Wiis, it was easy to modify the Wii, and we know from download statistics of the homebrew channel that literally millions of Wiis were modified. I think the burden of proof is to argue otherwise.

Honestly, I don't know much about the piracy on the Wii, I was under the impression that homebrew != piracy. I also was under the impression that the Wii's emulation required physical media to rip, and that you couldn't share those rips, but perhaps I'm wrong (I've never done it).

The problem with your assertion is that it's tautological. Used market success is seen as evidence that piracy didn't impact the used market, because your measure of piracy is identical to your measure of piracy's effect. What happens in a world where you're wrong, piracy is easy, but there's still a vibrant used community? How would we know? Any time you make an argument, you need to engage with how you would know if you were wrong: what we would see in the world that's different. And if the answer to that is "No, I'm definitely right", then you're not making an argument

All I know is, if there were no games on the used market (sold out), I would have no choice but to buy new, or not play the game. However, if piracy was an option, obviously that's an option.

Piracy reduces the "cost" of entry, which reduces the market value, and also demand. I don't see how that can be incorrect.

 

[chrislowe]

Why would you play it at a slower FPS?

PAL tekken 3 was 50fps. thats why I modded my PS1 to play NTSC games.

 

[Alo81]

I'm not a fan of it, and had a huge thread about it earlier, link, that consoles still at market having emulators may not be piracy but is at a minimum unethical. There's still money to be had selling consoles (and the subsequent money people would spend on them) and circumventing that hurts Nintendo and their ability to fund future consoles/games.

The games are the software, the consoles are the hardware. Software being designed to only work on certain hardware shouldn't stop consumers from trying to use the software on whatever hardware they see fit.

If the only reason you want a system is to play its games, and you can play those games elsewhere, legally, and at a higher quality on something you already own it would be silly to buy new hardware for a lesser or equal experience.

Of course, that's not where WiiU emulation is at right now, but even if it were the console doesn't need to be a requirement to play a game.

 

[M3d10n]

Honestly, I don't know much about the piracy on the Wii, I was under the impression that homebrew != piracy. I also was under the impression that the Wii's emulation required physical media to rip, and that you couldn't share those rips, but perhaps I'm wrong (I've never done it).

You are wrong. The Wii was widely pirated. The vast majority of units can be modded with simply placing some files on the SD card and people would stuff USB HDDs full of ISOs downloaded off the internet. Also, mod chips for playing burned DVDs were available shortly after launch.

I'm not a fan of it, and had a huge thread about it earlier, link, that consoles still at market having emulators may not be piracy but is at a minimum unethical. There's still money to be had selling consoles (and the subsequent money people would spend on them) and circumventing that hurts Nintendo and their ability to fund future consoles/games.

It will take many, many years before this emulator can be a viable replacement for an actual Wii U (or the NX console, if it includes Wii U BC). The Wii U will be long dead(er) by then.

The only instances where a viable emulator was available during the system lifespan were the GBA and the Wii. Their sales didn't seem to suffer much from that.

 

[jabberwocker]

You are wrong. The Wii was widely pirated. The vast majority of units can be modded with simply placing some files on the SD card and people would stuff USB HDDs full of ISOs downloaded off the internet. Also, mod chips for playing burned DVDs were available shortly after launch.



It will take many, many years before this emulator can be a viable replacement for an actual Wii U (or the NX console, if it includes Wii U BC). The Wii U will be long dead(er) by then.

The only instances where a viable emulator was available during the system lifespan were the GBA and the Wii. Their sales didn't seem to suffer much from that.

N64-ultrahle would like a word.

 

[mrlion]

The only instances where a viable emulator was available during the system lifespan were the GBA and the Wii. Their sales didn't seem to suffer much from that.

Umm no? N64 and PSX emulators were way ahead of its peak during their system lifespans...Hell even the NES emulator was already viable during the lifespan even Nintendo made their own emulator for developers.

The only emulators that were not viable were the last gen's when architectures, though not really that advanced, were complex such as the PS3's Cell.

 

[Rich!]

Umm no? N64 and PSX emulators were way ahead of its peak during their system lifespans...Hell even the NES emulator was already viable during the lifespan even Nintendo made their own emulator for developers.

The only emulators that were not viable were the last gen's when architectures, though not really that advanced, were complex such as the PS3's Cell.

Don't forget Game Boy.

Most people I know IRL played Pokémon Gold first a considerable time before the western release via a translation of the Japanese ROM on a PC emulator. There were loads of emulators around, and they all performed at full speed.

 

[joesiv]

You are wrong. The Wii was widely pirated. The vast majority of units can be modded with simply placing some files on the SD card and people would stuff USB HDDs full of ISOs downloaded off the internet. Also, mod chips for playing burned DVDs were available shortly after launch.

Crazy, that world of piracy, it makes me sad. Thanks for the correction.

 

[petran79]

You are wrong. The Wii was widely pirated. The vast majority of units can be modded with simply placing some files on the SD card and people would stuff USB HDDs full of ISOs downloaded off the internet. Also, mod chips for playing burned DVDs were available shortly after launch.

It will take many, many years before this emulator can be a viable replacement for an actual Wii U (or the NX console, if it includes Wii U BC). The Wii U will be long dead(er) by then.

The only instances where a viable emulator was available during the system lifespan were the GBA and the Wii. Their sales didn't seem to suffer much from that.

Most 6th gen and above emulators even today require a very good PC to run the majority of 3D games smoothly and even then there will be slowdowns.

It is really less hassle and saves more energy to buy an old console and mod it instead.
When I was testing Dolphin emulator, computer was going to get fried!

 

[Dr. Buni]

Crazy, that world of piracy, it makes me sad. Thanks for the correction.

Why? That's weird.

Most 6th gen and above emulators even today require a very good PC to run the majority of 3D games smoothly and even then there will be slowdowns.

It is really less hassle and saves more energy to buy an old console and mod it instead.
When I was testing Dolphin emulator, computer was going to get fried!

Depends heavily on the game.

 

[M3d10n]

Umm no? N64 and PSX emulators were way ahead of its peak during their system lifespans...Hell even the NES emulator was already viable during the lifespan even Nintendo made their own emulator for developers.

The only emulators that were not viable were the last gen's when architectures, though not really that advanced, were complex such as the PS3's Cell.

By viable I meant "as a console replacement". N64 emulators had terrible compatibility outside from SM64 and OoT for years. Bleem! and Virtual Game Station indeed came out well before the PS2 and had fantastic compatibility, but they both came out in 1999, five years after the PS1 launched.

The GBA was emulated less than one year after launch.

 

[Rich!]

The GBA was emulated less than one year after launch.

Incorrect.

The GBA was emulated BEFORE its launch.

http://www.zophar.net/gba/gbaemu.html

gbaemu was released before the GBA itself and was able to emulate the Yoshis Story tech demo that was leaked amongst other things.

 

[Dictator93]

Incorrect.

The GBA was emulated BEFORE its launch.

http://www.zophar.net/gba/gbaemu.html

gbaemu was released before the GBA itself and was able to emulate the Yoshis Story tech demo that was leaked amongst other things.

that is amazing

 

[Vuze]

Incorrect.

The GBA was emulated BEFORE its launch.

http://www.zophar.net/gba/gbaemu.html

gbaemu was released before the GBA itself and was able to emulate the Yoshis Story tech demo that was leaked amongst other things.

Whoah, didn't know that. That's amazing.

 

[Izcarielo]

Look, let's be real. Most people aren't going to rip their own games/dump their own bios anyway. Even if people have the games they're most likely still just going to download it somewhere because it's faster and easier than doing it yourself.

This. I dont know how people are being so obtuse about it xD
If I wanted to emulate my games on Pc do you really think I would dump my Bios and all that instead of downloading it?

 

[ArjanN]

This. I dont know how people are being so obtuse about it xD

It was just people reacting too defensively to other people being glib about not needing a Wii U anymore.

 

[ss_lemonade]

Why would you play it at a slower FPS?

I know some people who frameskip on purpose because it makes the game feel "faster" for them. Maybe that's the case here?

 

[PGamer]

Darksiders II in-game in Cemu.

 

[Demise]

Darksiders II in-game in Cemu.

Oh my... It was true, they really have a Wii U emulator that is that advanced ? Good job for keeping it secret.

I know the demo can look rough, but it seems that all the "hard" work of emulating have been done. Prop to them.

 

[Tagyhag]

Let him dream. It is not likely that this emulator will work decent in the next two decades. And at that point in time it makes not a difference anyway.

You do know how many years two decades is right?

 

[GamerJM]

Why? That's weird.

Because some developers didn't make as much money as the potentially would have, which can be significant for more niche releases?

Incorrect.

The GBA was emulated BEFORE its launch.

http://www.zophar.net/gba/gbaemu.html

gbaemu was released before the GBA itself and was able to emulate the Yoshis Story tech demo that was leaked amongst other things.

Negative months is still less than a year from launch, so he was technically correct.

why do you make posts like this

 

[Atwa]

Still not even playable, will be years.

 

[Rich!]

Negative months is still less than a year from launch, so he was technically correct.

why do you make posts like this

The hell. He said, and I quote, The GBA was emulated less than one year after launch.

So no, he was not technically correct and neither are you. And I make posts like those because I like letting people know facts they may not know before - and people appreciate that, as you can see in the replies made in response to my post.

 

[Piston Hyundai]

The hell. He said, and I quote, The GBA was emulated less than one year after launch.

So no, he was not technically correct and neither are you. And I make posts like those because I like letting people know facts they may not know before - and people appreciate that, as you can see in the replies made in response to my post.

there's no award for being right