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[The Antitype]

One console has weaker hardware. Games on that console run at lower resolutions. Why are so many people not making the link between those things?

The confusion seems to be from the perception that the different in hardware doesn't account for a performance gap that wide. I think everybody with sense acknowledges that the PS4 is more powerful, the disagreement seems to be about what practical impact that amount of difference will make, and how much of the difference right now is skewed by bad Microsoft software support, late dev kits, etc.

Xbox 360 can run games at native 1080p, we know that already from Forza 5 and NBA 2K14, etc. Hell, Activision is rumored to be working on 1080p native patch for Xbox 360 right now, which - if true - again demonstrates the console is powerful enough to do it, they just didn't have the tools/time.

We'll see what happens. If the sum total difference between the consoles is that one will be pushing third party games at 1080 native while the other is upscaling from 720 or 900, that's a difference 70% of the population probably wouldn't even notice. From a PR standpoint, it would be something that Microsoft would have to counter though.

Given we're already hearing about major differences with several launch multiplats I can't really see where this idea might come from tbh.

Maybe we disagree on just how large the practical difference on screen is between a game running 1080p native and 720p upscaled is.

Honestly, given the natural inclination of 3rd parties to make one version as lead and then port with minimal differences (and given the similarities of the architecture), I wouldn't be shocked if a 720p upscaled to 1080p native was the biggest difference you saw in third party games.

If I'm wrong then I'm wrong. I'm covered either way.

 

[Replicant]

Probably not the kind of effects you're hoping for:

 

[Glorified G]

Xbox 360 can run games at native 1080p, we know that already from Forza 5 and NBA 2K14, etc. Hell, Activision is rumored to be working on 1080p native patch for Xbox 360 right now, which - if true - again demonstrates the console is powerful enough to do it, they just didn't have the tools/time.

PS3 ran ridge racer 7 and nba 07 at native 1080p at launch. A couple of games running at that res doesn't mean anything. Fact is different games have different engines and certain developers will feel the trade offs will be worth it or not.

 

[YesManKablam]

None, it seems the only thing it has more of is price.

 

[fatgamecat]

PS4's greater GPGPU/compute capability means it will likely have better 'effects' over the gen. If by effects you mean physics, voxels, fluid simulation, hair, etc.

If you just mean AA/resolution, PS4 also has the edge due to ~50% more GPU power available for games. And the faster unified memory, can't forget that.

 

[Waaghals]

I assume the reason for the low resolution is a result of developers running out of space on the EDRAM (or whatever it is called), adding more effects might require even more room.

So even if the move to 720p leaves the XBONE with unused GPU resources they may still be prevented from putting that to use.

Maybe, in some months , they can solves this and a lower resolutions might result in new and better graphical effects, but probably not at launch.

Of course this is just me speculating - I have no formal expertise or inside sources.

 

[Pain]

These games weren't designed with 720p on mind so no, PS4 version will be better on all areas.

Unless it's an exclusive, the lower resolution won't lead to better effects.

 

[Bundy]

So, aparently several Multiplatform games will run at 720p on the XBone for whatever reason, is it possible that as a result some developers manage to add better effects to said games? What if the PS4 version of BF4 runs at 1080p but the fps go below 60 at times and it is locked on the XBone? What about that polygon dude who said people would be surprised when they so both versions? Maybe the XBone version is blurier but with more bells and whistles? Kinda like when you compare a game locked at 30fps vs one locked at 60fps, and the 30fps game looks better as a result?

Clearly i have no idea if that is possible but that's why i'm asking. If it were the case would you chose the 720p over a 1080p game?

lol
No!

 

[Y2Kev]

Not enough voxels.

holy shit

 

[BRocknRolla]

I can understand why you might think that a possibility, but it assumes that by dropping the res to 720p, everything suddenly chugs along at peak performance with more power to spare. I don't know that it would be the case. Dropping the res is probably only one step in the optimization process for most games and it probably doesn't free up so much that suddenly a lot more is possible.

Even if more effects were possible though, I'd still choose the higher resolution.

 

[Rulp]

No chance.

 

[Pinbot]

Has it been confirmed that Xbone has issues running stuff at 1080p? I mean, properly confirmed?

If not, why is this thread happening...

Lulz

 

[StuBurns]

Thinking about it, this will happen I imagine.

Let's say for example CoD Ghosts was 1080p on PS4, but they barely got it there, and it's 720p on XBO, but the developers have a lot more wiggle room (but not enough to make a notable bump in resolution), so that extra performance could be used for nicer AF or something, right?

 

[Skeff]

Has it been confirmed that Xbone has issues running stuff at 1080p? I mean, properly confirmed?

If not, why is this thread happening...

Lulz

As in there is a large amount of software releasing next month running at 720p? yes.

Thinking about it, this will happen I imagine.

Let's say for example CoD Ghosts was 1080p on PS4, but they barely got it there, and it's 720p on XBO, but the developers have a lot more wiggle room (but not enough to make a notable bump in resolution), so that extra performance could be used for nicer AF or something, right?

If a developer is choosing effects over resolution they would have done the same on PS4 as well.

 

[nhlducks35]

Thinking about it, this will happen I imagine.

Let's say for example CoD Ghosts was 1080p on PS4, but they barely got it there, and it's 720p on XBO, but the developers have a lot more wiggle room (but not enough to make a notable bump in resolution), so that extra performance could be used for nicer AF or something, right?

Nicer AF? Are you telling me that all next gen games don't have 16x AF standard?

 

[VFX_Veteran]

OP,

I very seriously doubt this is the case. The PS4 is just a little too much more powerful in it's graphics processing. I would say that even though the X1 is at a disadvantage with throughput, it could very well match the graphics features of the PS4. Just not at 1080p with the same framerate.

 

[VFX_Veteran]

Nicer AF? Are you telling me that all next gen games don't have 16x AF standard?

How would we know this? Most of the current gen games don't really give those kinds of details. We could tell though by looking at sharp angled planes that recede into the distance.

 

[StuBurns]

Nicer AF? Are you telling me that all next gen games don't have 16x AF standard?

It was a random example.

The point being, somethings are far less costly than resolution, so it's possible a target resolution would be lower on XBO, but achieved with more room to spare.

 

[Ryuuga]

Aliasing is not an effect sorry

 

[spannicus]

Not really sure since none of us really actually know for a fact what the heck is going on with both systems outside of he said she said. We'll know in a few weeks though and then Gaf will break

 

[Jack_AG]

 

[SmoothRunningGun]

It has a significantly weaker gpu (-500 gflops) so no.

 

[Foghorn Leghorn]

None, it seems the only thing it has more of is price.

2 X HDMI.

Unless they lower it to 640p or something there won't be more bells and whistles.

 

[thesuperfunk]

Somewhere between Bob Hope and No Hope.

 

[Zacxx201]

The Xbox One is new hardware. It's supposed to be next gen.
If your hardware comes out of the gate running 720p and costs $100 more than the PS4 which is running the same third party games at 1080p then something has gone wrong.

 

[FuturusX]

PS4's greater GPGPU/compute capability means it will likely have better 'effects' over the gen. If by effects you mean physics, voxels, fluid simulation, hair, etc.

If you just mean AA/resolution, PS4 also has the edge due to ~50% more GPU power available for games. And the faster unified memory, can't forget that.

But what about the cloud?...Surely the cloud can provide those added effects

 

[lucius]

"It will have more balanced effects"

- Eurogamer's super secret developer source

 

[RayMaker]

I think a DEV will have certain priorities.

For DICE and BF4

The first priority is 60fps
The 2nd will be the graphically setting(i'am guessing the equivalent of ultra on the PC)
and lastly they will choose a resolution and AA solution that make the 2 previous points possible.

So in the X1's case 720p made there goals possible, and it has turned out the PS4 can do 1080p while achieving the first 2 goals.

 

[EGM1966]

Yeah probably. Why not? Obvious now I think about it.

 

[netBuff]

Yeah probably. Why not? Obvious now I think about it.

What? And why wouldn't a developer just lower the resolution of the PS4 version (900p or any other resolution) and add these effects to that version as well if they were already willing to make that kind of trade off with one version?

 

[hodgy100]

It's an impossibility I'm afraid.

 

[FuturusX]

holy shit

I know right! Reso is a great launch title no question about it.

 

[Aureon]

Pretty likely.
1080p is roughly 2mil pixels, while 720p is 900k pixels.

On a very, very napkin math, disregarding simulation, it would seem that a 40% power differential would mean the xbone has some wiggle room to fill.

 

[EGM1966]

What? And why wouldn't a developer just lower the resolution of the PS4 version (900p or any other resolution) and add these effects to that version as well if they were already willing to make that kind of trade off with one version?

I was being sarcastic. I think there's as close to zero chance as the laws of probability allow and am amazed at the implied desperation to even think there could be coupled with making a thread to ponder the surely outside chance of such an occurrence.

 

[Darksol]

About as likely as the DS4 light washing out your TV screen

 

[88random]

Aliasing is not an effect sorry

*dead

 

[Radec]

About the same chances the bobcats will go to the playoffs.

 

[PeregrinSe7en]

If your into particle effects:

Resogun

im blown away

 

[klaus]

What? And why wouldn't a developer just lower the resolution of the PS4 version (900p or any other resolution) and add these effects to that version as well if they were already willing to make that kind of trade off with one version?

Because the architectures are indeed not identical and different factors may limit performance? Granted both systems' architectures are rather similar, and the PS4 has a clear raw power advantage, yet it is absolutely possible that some developers are (mainly) struggling with the ESRAM the One has - its size limit can very well lead to a lower resolution in order to avoid having to move stuff around. So it may indeed be the case that some juice / fillrate is now left for rendering additional effects or up the IQ a bit (which in most cases wouldn't need any more ESRAM space). Of course this should only be a matter for launch games, since devs should quickly learn how to utilize the ESRAM cleverly - and of course in general the PS4 versions of future games will still look better, but it will be interesting to see how things pan out in the long run..

Not saying it will happen & I am not a dev on either system, but people flat out denying the possibility are oversimplifying things. You can't just go by a few numbers when talking about tech stuff - makes me cringe when people claim "the PS4 is stronger, so it's simply not possible".

 

[bigboss370]

Thinking about it, this will happen I imagine.

Let's say for example CoD Ghosts was 1080p on PS4, but they barely got it there, and it's 720p on XBO, but the developers have a lot more wiggle room (but not enough to make a notable bump in resolution), so that extra performance could be used for nicer AF or something, right?

No.

.

 

[AllenShrz]

Not enough voxels.

This thread is useless except for this gif.

 

[Respawn]

Yes, the technically superior console will have the worse looking games. This makes a lot of sense.

Developers aren't choosing 1080p for some imaginary milestone that requires sacrifices in the effects budget. It either is able to run it properly or it can't. The PS4 just has a natural advantage because of it's hardware.

haha I love your post. Always to the point.

 

[boi]

I asked this before a while ago and it is still unclear to me: Why is the Xbox One not able to run games in 1080p while there were already Xbox 360 games being able to? Shouldnt the increased processing power mean that making the game 1080p is a smaller marginal part compared to last gen? Somebody knows this?

 

[Mobius and pet octopus]

I asked this before a while ago and it is still unclear to me: Why is the Xbox One not able to run games in 1080p while there were already Xbox 360 games being able to? Shouldnt the increased processing power mean that making the game 1080p is a smaller marginal part compared to last gen? Somebody knows this?

Forza 5 is in native 1080p. Other games will be upscaled to 1080p. It is the developer's choice whether they want 1080p native or upscaling to 1080p. Games that aren't native 1080p will still look good. The reason a dev may choose less than 1080p native is for other graphical effects which could be higher resolution textures for example.

 

[Nightengale]

I asked this before a while ago and it is still unclear to me: Why is the Xbox One not able to run games in 1080p while there were already Xbox 360 games being able to? Shouldnt the increased processing power mean that making the game 1080p is a smaller marginal part compared to last gen? Somebody knows this?

Do you like the idea of having 4k games with pixels the size of your fist?

Hitting 1080p is pointless if your graphic settings have to be turned down to low for it. It'll have a bigger visual impact difference.

 

[PeakPointMatrix]

Not enough voxels.

What the shitting fuck.

Killer Instinct with 2 Jago fireballs coliding

Nothing on ps4 looks as good

I would looove your response to this.

 

[killatopak]

As long as it runs in 10fps.

 

[EGM1966]

I asked this before a while ago and it is still unclear to me: Why is the Xbox One not able to run games in 1080p while there were already Xbox 360 games being able to? Shouldnt the increased processing power mean that making the game 1080p is a smaller marginal part compared to last gen? Somebody knows this?

The resolution depends on the amount of content/effects/code being processed. Both the PS3 and 360 could run games in 1080p fine provided they were designed to keep the effects, visuals, AI, etc. to a level that allowed it.

All games could be 1080p if they managed their design correctly. However, early on with PS3/360 (and probably with PS4/XB1 or at least XB1) games featured content/code that required too much of the processing power to allow for 1080p (or even 720p) and therefore resolution was lowered.

There is no magic setting that means 1080p is a given. It would be relatively easy to code a game that the PS4/XB1 would struggle to display in 1080p.

People need to stop assuming there is some linear relationship - it's down to the game itself and how well it's optimized vs the available resources (which are of course finite by nature)

 

[Thrakier]

So, aparently several Multiplatform games will run at 720p on the XBone for whatever reason, is it possible that as a result some developers manage to add better effects to said games? What if the PS4 version of BF4 runs at 1080p but the fps go below 60 at times and it is locked on the XBone? What about that polygon dude who said people would be surprised when they so both versions? Maybe the XBone version is blurier but with more bells and whistles? Kinda like when you compare a game locked at 30fps vs one locked at 60fps, and the 30fps game looks better as a result?

Clearly i have no idea if that is possible but that's why i'm asking. If it were the case would you chose the 720p over a 1080p game?

Are you trying to legitimate your choice before you bought? That post and thought is pretty much insane if you ask me.

 

[DCharlie]

holy shit

jesus - i was confident in cancelling my US preorder as i could just wait for the JPN release but now? wibble.

Are you trying to legitimate your choice before you bought? That post and thought is pretty much insane if you ask me.

well, given all the -crazy- going on then there could strangely have Sony mandating 1080P and MS not, therefore there could be a strange reality where what is said sort of might happen but Occam's razor just seems to be slicing towards "Ps4 is just stronger for games processing" - all other questions regarding extra bells and whistles are still up for debate