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[Trup1aya]

A 30fps-targetting game doesn't get to pull the "we were prioritizing responsive controls", sorry.

Imagine if it was 30fps AND had weighty animations. It would feel even more sluggish.

open world games on console CAN'T be 60fps (if they also intend to have decent world simulations) So why bog the responsiveness of the controls down even further with lengthy animations?

 

[hawk2025]

Imagine if it was 30fps AND had weighty animations. It would feel even more sluggish.

open world games on console CAN'T be 60fps (if they also intend to have decent world simulations) So why bog the responsiveness of the controls down even further with lengthy animations?

It doesn't need lengthy animations to have decent animations. This is nonsense -- no one's saying the agents should be dancing around like Geralt or doing things that would compromise the gameplay. But there's a CANYON of daylight between what we see in the videos and what can in any way be construed as animations that hinder gameplay like, say, The Last Guardian.

Your parenthetical edit regarding "decent world simulations" -- whatever that means -- again, only reinforces my point: no, they weren't focusing on responsive controls and consciously gimped animations to achieve that. This is an excuse.

 

[Doug Heffernan]

This game looks awful, what a shame.

 

[Diprosalic]

Jeez what a letdown.

How terrible must Scalebound have looked if they funded THIS for years.

 

[Yautja_Warrior]

It looks a lot like Crackdown 1 and that was a lot of fun.
I think a lot of people in this thread were practically born yesterday and have never played that game. The hate gets contagious and people think they have to ride that train.
From the people that hate what they see now, i think at least 50% are just echoing others.

The destruction is probably what will kill this game. If it's not what they promised it will be the only topic. That's totally on them though. But the rest of the game might still be a shitload of fun.

Yeah seems that way. I really hope they turn this around. Like you said, the first was great fun but I'm cautious about it now, with it being this close to release and Microsoft being pretty quiet on it, especially the whole destruction thing, which should have been a big showcase for it at E3.

 

[EvB]

Yeah seems that way. I really hope they turn this around. Like you said, the first was great fun but I'm cautious about it now, with it being this close to release and Microsoft being pretty quiet on it, especially the whole destruction thing, which should have been a big showcase for it at E3.

It’s not coming out until the middle of November is it?

 

[Always-honest]

Yeah seems that way. I really hope they turn this around. Like you said, the first was great fun but I'm cautious about it now, with it being this close to release and Microsoft being pretty quiet on it, especially the whole destruction thing, which should have been a big showcase for it at E3.

being cautious is good. And wise these days.
Everybody was expecting the destruction.

 

[dragonelite]

People have some weird expectations for this game. Other than the cloud destruction it was never gonna be a technical showcase.

I thought gameplay was the big thing?

This, since when has the crackdown series been known for its graphics.
People need to really learn expectation management to avoid let downs.

If it was naughty dog that made this then yeah i can understand people being let down by the graphics.

 

[Yautja_Warrior]

It’s not coming out until the middle of November is it?

7th November, so only 4 months away, not that long really.

 

[RedFury]

Sunset overdrive wasn't even out when this was announced

It's changed hands since then no? Would have been a good way to build a better relationship with MS, then maybe SO2.

Edit: On second thought I'm good with Spider-Man.

 

[ShapeGSX]

A 30fps-targetting game doesn't get to pull the "we were prioritizing responsive controls", sorry.

Prioritizing responsive control vs animation is a completely different thing from responsiveness from frame rate.

 

[Hello? This is Hailun!]

Will it wash away the rain?

Edit: Everything about this game looks like a placeholder. Yeesh.

Nothing reacts to him shooting it. Nothing.

 

[Black Mantis]

I think they should have done Sunset 2 instead and giving them the cloud tech to enhance the mp.

I hope people are not expecting mp to look the same as that gamescon demo, they clearly said that it had increased destruction for demo purposes.

Pretty sure Dave Jones said they increased the power of the weapons to speed up the destruction of the buildings for demo purposes.

It's changed hands since then no? Would have been a good way to build a better relationship with MS, then maybe SO2.

No, it's never changed hands.

 

[JigglesBunny]

Yup, that's Crackdown alright. Graphically pretty underwhelming but hopefully the destruction and physics compensate.

Looking forward to seeing some Multiplayer gameplay.

 

[RedFury]

Pretty sure Dave Jones said they increased the power of the weapons to speed up the destruction of the buildings for demo purposes.



No, it's never changed hands.

I thought Reagent Games was doing the brunt of the work which has now shifted to Sumo. Upon searching up who the devs are, damn thats alot of cooks in the kitchen.

 

[Black Mantis]

I thought Reagent Games was doing the brunt of the work which has now shifted to Sumo. Upon searching up who the devs are, damn thats alot of cooks in the kitchen.

That's what I thought too, but a Sumo dev said they'd been involved with developing the SP from start.

 

[blakep267]

I thought Reagent Games was doing the brunt of the work which has now shifted to Sumo. Upon searching up who the devs are, damn thats alot of cooks in the kitchen.

Nah. From what I understand reagent and cloudgine aren't doing the heavy lifting. That's Sumo digital for the SP and Ruffian for the MP

Cloudgine brought the cloud processing tech to the table.

 

[RedFury]

Nah. From what I understand reagent and cloudgine aren't doing the heavy lifting. That's Sumo digital for the SP and Ruffian for the MP

Cloudgine brought the cloud processing tech to the table.

Speaking of Ruffian wasn't CD2 a solo effort from them? So we got sumo for SP and Cloudgine, Ruffian, and Reagent for MP. I was under the impression that the game at the beginning was heavily revolving around the cloud. It was later that it became a more traditional game/CD. I thought this game only made it back because of the leveraging of cloud features.

 

[Pathfinder]

I'm sick of all the SP footage.

MP with cloud-based destruction is going to be where it's at. Lemme at it.

 

[Brad Grenz]

Nah
https://youtu.be/EWANLy9TjRc

The current game is a significant downgrade from that visually, not even counting the destruction which they have not shown recently and was made multiplayer only.

I dont know where you got that from, but it certainly wasn't.

That trailer was in engine, but pre rendered and never ran in real time on Xbox hardware.

 

[blakep267]

Speaking of Ruffian wasn't CD2 a solo effort from them? So we got sumo for SP and Cloudgine, Ruffian, and Reagent for MP. I was under the impression that the game at the beginning was heavily revolving around the cloud. It was later that it became a more traditional game/CD. I thought this game only made it back because of the leveraging of cloud features.

I think there was always going to be a traditional standard SP game. But the main enticing pitch was for the MP cloud mode. This was known in 2015

 

[GuitarAtomik]

That trailer was in engine, but pre rendered and never ran in real time on Xbox hardware.

Who's talking about the trailer? They're referring to the footage you just quoted.

 

[DaleinCalgary]

It doesn't look horrible, it looks like crackdown. This was a game with no depth, poor graphics but fun for it's time because those orbs that kept calling for you.

 

[Comrade Crunch]

The current game is a significant downgrade from that visually, not even counting the destruction which they have not shown recently and was made multiplayer only.

It was never made multiplayer only, it was always multiplayer only.

 

[Kssio_Aug]

It looks a lot like Crackdown 1 and that was a lot of fun.
I think a lot of people in this thread were practically born yesterday and have never played that game. The hate gets contagious and people think they have to ride that train.
From the people that hate what they see now, i think at least 50% are just echoing others.

The destruction is probably what will kill this game. If it's not what they promised it will be the only topic. That's totally on them though. But the rest of the game might still be a shitload of fun.

I agree about the hate being contagious (the hate and the worship for most games are contagious through gaming forums).

But I don't think that a disappointement about what they have shown is unjustifiable. The animations are bad, graphics are just ok because they're cell shaded (which helps to give it a better look), there are some serious pop-in issues, and the gameplay presents nothing new nowadays. When Crackdown 1 was released, destruction mayhem in open world games was kinda of new... but now we live in days which open-world games are much more common and enhanced, including others with similar intentions (such as Just Cause 2 / 3 and Saints Row 3 / 4).

That said, maybe the game doesn't look a disaster, but I also see absolutely nothing that justifies a hype above avarage for this, other than carrying the name of Crackdown. Not nowadays with so many options, not with the pointed issues, not for 60 dollars. At least not the campaign (we will see about the MP).

And about the destruction being always for multiplayer, I think they failed in spreading that message. I just knew about the destruction being exclusive for the multiplayer after this E3 presentation, when some people started saying that it was no surprise. I participate of different Xbox communities where people was also surprised with the lack of destruction in the SP mode. I'm not saying I don't believe it was always like that, but maybe by the fact that they used to talk about this game just to talk about the destruction, I could swear this was part of single player mode as well.

 

[Pathfinder]

And about the destruction being always for multiplayer, I think they failed in spreading that message. I just knew about the destruction being exclusive for the multiplayer after this E3 presentation, when some people started saying that it was no surprise. I participate of different Xbox communities where people was also surprised with the lack of destruction in the SP mode. I'm not saying I don't believe it was always like that, but maybe by the fact that they used to talk about this game just to talk about the destruction, I could swear this was part of single player mode as well.

No, destruction has been part of the multiplayer mode for years now.

Here's an article from Gaming Bolt from 2015 explaining the decision in more detail.

http://gamingbolt.com/crackdown-3-d...-destruction-wont-be-present-in-single-player

Basically, they didn't want to go the always-online route. Can you blame them? They'd have caught more hell doing it that way.

 

[mikey1123]

This game is going to bomb hard.

 

[spannicus]

damn yall are pretty down on the game over a few videos? no ones seen multiplayer and the graphics are ok for what it is. whats the problem? wont say its the best looking game but its not the worse. sure itll look good downsampled and at 4k on a decent tv.

 

[black070]

Looks very dull.

 

[Wamb0wneD]

damn yall are pretty down on the game over a few videos? no ones seen multiplayer and the graphics are ok for what it is. whats the problem? wont say its the best looking game but its not the worse. sure itll look good downsampled and at 4k on a decent tv.

The animations are below average, so is the draw distance. The lighting looks ok at times but at others it doesn't mesh well with the textures and makes the artstyle look dull. Enemies don't flinch or anything while getting shot and the fact we haven't seen any of the destruction we have been promised so far simply doesn't bode well.
Metroid Prime would look good downsampled and at 4k on a decent tv. That's a 15 year old game.

 

[spannicus]

The animations are below average, so is the draw distance. The lighting looks ok at times but at others it doesn't mesh well with the textures and makes the artstyle look dull. Enemies don't flinch or anything while getting shot and the fact we haven't seen any of the destruction we have been promised so far simply doesn't bode well.
Metroid Prime would look good downsampled and at 4k on a decent tv. That's a 15 year old game.

i hear you. still time to be polished. gonna wait closer till launch to make my mind up on it.

 

[Papacheeks]

This game is going to bomb hard.

Yup.
Unless multiplayer is the real deal. Which I don't think it is. So far in terms of exposure MS does not feel confident in this game.

Wouldn't be surprised if it gets reviewed in 2 different parts because of different Dev's being involved.

 

[Tonky]

Honestly looks like a remake of the original Crackdown, with very little major updates or improvements made to the core gameplay. Shame, I was really looking forward to this.

 

[ResoRai]

Some nice news:http://wccftech.com/crackdown-3-much-shine-last-months/
"Much shine in the next few months" apparently. Say they way C1/2 BC and some other stuff.

My guess is that you eliminate the finer lighting shades and along with it the more nuanced results of modern shader stuff like ambient occlusion or subsurface scattering and hints of convex shapes in the 2D image.

Yeah actually I think that's it, thanks! I may have found a different way to go about it.

The current game is a significant downgrade from that visually, not even counting the destruction which they have not shown recently and was made multiplayer only.



That trailer was in engine, but pre rendered and never ran in real time on Xbox hardware.

Er, the alpha gameplay is running on the xbox one and it was multiplayer only from the beginning. You must have not been paying too much attention to the game till recently.

I commented earlier about the visual changes compared to the alpha, which did look better in some aspects than what we see now. They seemed to have changed up the art style (cel-shading, textures) in the most recent footage.
I'm working with cel-shaded materials in UE4 and when using them I can't make use of PBR. One of the drawbacks is no reflections unless I alter the material to include "faux" reflections (which is really just a blob of white light lol) that tries to mimic what the lighting you'd get from say a wooden floor or a metal door. Or make it so the material would be able to have reflections, roughness/metallic properties, but the look of the cel-shaded material would change drastically a lot of the times and actually lose it's "cel-shaded" look ending up more "cartoonish-looking". They seem to lack detail in their cel-shaded style that the alpha had because of this. Just a bit of rambling I guess, was kind of interested. Their style doesn't look to go together well sometimes imo. Looks nice sometimes though.

 

[Brad Grenz]

Who's talking about the trailer? They're referring to the footage you just quoted.

My original response was to a poster who asked about the trailer. Please actually follow the thread of conversation before trying to correct people.

 

[cakely]

Imagine if it was 30fps AND had weighty animations. It would feel even more sluggish.

open world games on console CAN'T be 60fps (if they also intend to have decent world simulations) So why bog the responsiveness of the controls down even further with lengthy animations?

Metal gear solid V would like a word with you.

 

[Justified]

Any reason they are not showing Multiplayer videos/gameplay?

 

[Yearsoflurking]

Any reason they are not showing Multiplayer videos/gameplay?

Marketing rollout

 

[Wamb0wneD]

i hear you. still time to be polished. gonna wait closer till launch to make my mind up on it.

Yeah i really hope they do. The marketing so far doesn't help i guess and I'm really wondering what Microsoft is thinking by making this a showcase title for their 4k machine.

Their style doesn't look to go together well sometimes imo. Looks nice sometimes though.

Yeah this, it comes across as rather inconsistent.

 

[GuitarAtomik]

My original response was to a poster who asked about the trailer. Please actually follow the thread of conversation before trying to correct people.

I did. You replied to this post (more specifically the person quoting this post):

Which looks exactly like the 17 minutes of gameplay posted and says "In-game footage" right there at the bottom.

 

[GlassBurrito]

Actually Ruffian came on board about a year ago or so to help Reagent, who is a really small team. Sumo is doing most of the heavy lifting on this game, as with a healthy staff at Microsoft.
Reagent - Dave Jones's game company
Cloudgine - Another Dave Jone's game tech company
Sumo Digital - Single Player Dev
Ruffian - Crackdown 2 devs brought on to help with MP

Reagent, Cloudgine and Ruffian are all in Dundee as well.

Interesting since this article published in Oct 2013 seems to imply otherwise since Duncan Harris, a Lead Programmer at Ruffian was working on a then unannounced project for Microsoft using Unreal Engine 4 from 2012-2013. and according to Crackdown 3's Wikipedia page, its using UE4.

 

[CalamityPixel]

Didn't want to make a new thread, but here is his character in the game.

No idea if it is pre-rendered or real time; I suspect prerendered.

Great interview and he talks about Overwatch's Doom Fist.

http://www.highsnobiety.com/2017/07/20/terry-crews-interview/?format=amp

 

[flaxknuckles]

Didn't want to make a new thread, but here is his character in the game.

No idea if it is pre-rendered or real time; I suspect prerendered.

Great interview and he talks about Overwatch's Doom Fist.

http://www.highsnobiety.com/2017/07/20/terry-crews-interview/?format=amp

This throws lemon in the eyes of the defenders of the game graphics who say the game can't look any better because it is cel-shaded. Too bad it's a cutscene.

 

[CalamityPixel]

This throws lemon in the eyes of the defenders of the game graphics who say the game can't look any better because it is cel-shaded. Too bad it's a cutscene.

He is playable. But I'll be getting the game just for the Terry cutscenes lmao

 

[RedFury]

Didn't want to make a new thread, but here is his character in the game.

No idea if it is pre-rendered or real time; I suspect prerendered.

Great interview and he talks about Overwatch's Doom Fist.

http://www.highsnobiety.com/2017/07/20/terry-crews-interview/?format=amp

Lame, missed opportunity. Should have been a papa bear tattoo. Looks good though. To speak about graphics lack of destruction in SP sucks but if they manage to hit the fidelity in that destruction gif above I'm good (no that 17min video does not match it).

 

[ElBoxyBrown]

Didn't want to make a new thread, but here is his character in the game.

No idea if it is pre-rendered or real time; I suspect prerendered.

Great interview and he talks about Overwatch's Doom Fist.

http://www.highsnobiety.com/2017/07/20/terry-crews-interview/?format=amp

My interest rises. Honestly I just need to see some mission progression.

 

[Bits N Pieces]

Ill be tuning into SDCC this weekend and will watch the panel with Terry on it.

Really hope they show off the multiplayer!

 

[Trup1aya]

It doesn't need lengthy animations to have decent animations. This is nonsense -- no one's saying the agents should be dancing around like Geralt or doing things that would compromise the gameplay. But there's a CANYON of daylight between what we see in the videos and what can in any way be construed as animations that hinder gameplay like, say, The Last Guardian.

Your parenthetical edit regarding "decent world simulations" -- whatever that means -- again, only reinforces my point: no, they weren't focusing on responsive controls and consciously gimped animations to achieve that. This is an excuse.

What are you on about? Show me a single open world game that is 60 fps on consoles... I'll wait...

There's a reason for this. Simulating an open world is more taxing on the cpu than in most other genres. What does this simulation consist of? Countless AIs, traffic patterns, constant loading of different textures of a variety of vehicles and building textures, etc. It's impossible to handle all of that convincingly on these weak cpus so they cap the framerate at thirty. Its not an excuse its a fact.

Regarding animations, there is no excuse for having bad animations. But properly conveying weight takes frames- frames that are less available at 30fps. so prioritizing conveying weight over responding to new user inputs makes controls feel unresponsive.

 

[Finaj]

Didn't want to make a new thread, but here is his character in the game.

No idea if it is pre-rendered or real time; I suspect prerendered.

Great interview and he talks about Overwatch's Doom Fist.

http://www.highsnobiety.com/2017/07/20/terry-crews-interview/?format=amp

Weird. Even if that is prerendered, it doesn't even look like the same engine.

 

[Clauss]

Yikes