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[Raide]

what happends if i play this disconnected from the internet?

Xbox One bursts into flames and your Credit Card is instantly billed to replace it.

 

[glaurung]

what happends if i play this disconnected from the internet?

Game is replaced with Crackdown 2.

 

[Synth]

I was responding to the old title.

It was a poor post regardless. Any console game can be 1080p/60fps as long as it's not doing anything ambitious. 1080p/60fps was achieved at the PS3's launch with Ridge Racer 7... does that mean that the PS4 being the most powerful console results in 1080p/60fps game across the board? The extra performance is nearly always used instead to make improvements elsewhere... in Crackdown's case this is full physics destruction.

Posts like the one you made add nothing to the discussion, and just come off as reactionary... I'm pretty sure you wouldn't walk into a thread titled "Game X shows PS4 is the most powerful games consoles ever" and then state an assumption that means 1080p/60fps... especially not if the whole topic existed because that game is doing something no other game has.

Communication between the bone's CPU and the cloud is several orders of magnitude slower than between CPU and graphics. Bandwith is also several orders of magnitude smaller. And what this means is there's precious little the cloud can do to boost the One's or any other consoe's capabilities in graphics, physics or AI outside of a few extremely specific situations.

This works because the interval between shooting at a building and it crumbling down doesn't have to be instantaneous or even consistent, you won't be able to tell the difference between a physically accurate chain of events and one affected by a few seconds of lag between calculations and rendering: it looks 'good' either way. It's just a nice little gimmick.

The fact that it doesn't have to be instantaneous is precisely the reason is works well for stuff like physics and AI. In many cases these don't have to have instant responses... especially AI, where instant response is actually undesirable and a fake "thought delay" is often deliberately added. It doesn't need to be as quick when all it needs is an answer. Posting on here is incredibly slow compared to your own thought processes, but if something gives you a physics problem that'll take you hours to work out, then it'd probably still be quicker to post it here, and get the answer from someone that can work it out in a matter of minutes. Same thing applies here.

 

[jimboton]

I think you're selling the tech short with "a few seconds of lag."

I hope it works better than that most of the time but I bet it can go beyond 1 sec in a worst case scenario. We'll see I guess. Even a couple hundreds of milliseconds is way too much for most applications.

 

[Saint of Killers]

If this proves to be a good solution, more games will make use of it and more use of it, to a point where they want to use it also in single-player.

Ah. I see. Thank you for explaining.

 

[justgames7604]

I was not impressed with the Crackdown physics demo. All I could see was the more detailed destruction from Infamous Second Son, combined with the architecture challenges of Red Faction Guerrilla.

At least Guerrilla developers explained how they realized very soon that they would need to build physically plausible buildings - because simple boxes would collapse under their own weight.

I see none of that in Crackdown 3. It's all to do with micro-destruction, not macro. Adding more smoke effects to a building falling down does not make for a better game. I remain skeptical.

All the buildings have a steel super structure present, seen in all the videos. All the blocks and pieces break apart, all those tiny parts are interactable. The rubble can be broken again and again, while remaining interactable with eachother and players, piling up on eachother. Also all the rubble remains, all of it.

Its so detailed and huge nothing comes close.

Also the building explode because they have physical gas lines, like a real building.

 

[Alx]

Like the learning AI (devs were eveb talking about a neural network there) in Forza?

Neural network aren't something extraordinary actually. Well, they do sound cool since it makes you think of artificial brains, but in the end it's one of the most common tools in adaptive AI. Chances are you've used many different softwares using NN without even noticing it.
Which doesn't mean that you can't make impressive things with those, of course.

 

[glaurung]

Its so detailed and huge nothing comes close.

I will be convinced only when I can play this myself, in the form of a finalized product. Until then I restrain any hype.

 

[LyleLanley]

Do you think you will need Gold to get access to the cloud servers?
That would be somewhat nasty lol

Though I could easily imagine that a hypothetical PC port would not offer the cloud computations as the Gold subscription could be seen as some sort of entry fee to make up for the increased server costs per game. (though I guess they could allow players with a beastly CPU run the physics locally)

The cloud-based physics are only in online multiplayer so yes, you would need Gold.

 

[monreader]

Just out of curiosity, how much would you pay for a graphics card that could achieve what was shown in the demo?

 

[Synth]

Just out of curiosity, how much would you pay for a graphics card that could achieve what was shown in the demo?

Not a lot if there were only one game that'd make any use of it tbh.

 

[monreader]

Not a lot if there were only one game that'd make any use of it tbh.

Thanks for the reply!

 

[biteren]

im not upset at all about this, the game looks fine, im surprised they even doing destructible enviorments at all.

 

[Alx]

The 100% destruction is only for multiplayer, so not for singleplay or co-op campaign. Multiplayer is set for 99 players, why only show 4 here?

I'm pretty sure they were considering between 8 and 20 players, bigger numbers including the risk of letting them destroy the whole map too quickly.
Also 4 people for a demo is plenty enough, you need to pay, feed and lodge those people, you know...

 

[Sho_Nuff82]

I hope it works better than that most of the time but I bet it can go beyond 1 sec in a worst case scenario. We'll see I guess. Even a couple hundreds of milliseconds is way too much for most applications.

I'll find the post, but the devs are aiming for the feature to work on very modest Internet connections. In the current build, any lag isn't really perceptible, just like a bullet hole in a a shooter on a dedicated server.

If I understand correctly, the game's physics engine is always running despite the packets received - the game physics wouldn't lag so much as your framerate would crash under the load.

 

[Ushay]

I feel like there is one important piece of information some people dont know about. Press actually got to play the multiplayer part of the game, destroying a part of the City with 4 players. They even let me use debug mode and fly around by Pressing the Start button and look at the buildings crashing down from wherever I want.

Because it was asked in this thread: I was actually standing right in the middle of a building crashing down and every piece of debris acted realistically and reacted to my body being there. It also stayed there afterwards so I was able to climp on top of the pile of debris(or blow it further apart)

What were your thoughts on the demo?

 

[Septic360]

what happends if i play this disconnected from the internet?

What do you think will happen? The same thing that happens when you play multiplayer games...

 

[llAuburnll]

I feel like there is one important piece of information some people dont know about. Press actually got to play the multiplayer part of the game, destroying a part of the City with 4 players. They even let me use debug mode and fly around by Pressing the Start button and look at the buildings crashing down from wherever I want.

Because it was asked in this thread: I was actually standing right in the middle of a building crashing down and every piece of debris acted realistically and reacted to my body being there. It also stayed there afterwards so I was able to climp on top of the pile of debris(or blow it further apart)

Nice try, Mattrick.
Really though, any more details?

 

[Doffen]

I was not impressed with the Crackdown physics demo. All I could see was the more detailed destruction from Infamous Second Son, combined with the architecture challenges of Red Faction Guerrilla.

At least Guerrilla developers explained how they realized very soon that they would need to build physically plausible buildings - because simple boxes would collapse under their own weight.

And if you actually watched the demo you can hear David Jones talking about how the buildings are bult with steel, glass, concrete, etc with every floor accessible. He even points out when the superstructure is exposed.

I see none of that in Crackdown 3. It's all to do with micro-destruction, not macro. Adding more smoke effects to a building falling down does not make for a better game. I remain skeptical.

So a collapsing a skyscraper is now considered micro-destruction?

 

[gai_shain]

what happends if i play this disconnected from the internet?

What happens if you play multiplayer and disconnect from the internet?

 

[Doffen]

What happens if you play multiplayer and disconnect from the internet?

My team loses.

 

[wachie]

That new title.

 

[Syntsui]

This will be the perfect excuse for always online games from now on.

 

[Prine]

What happens if you play multiplayer and disconnect from the internet?

I mean seriously. The range of reasoning from some posters is alarmingly poor, infantile almost. What happens to matchmaking when i disconnect from the internet? What do you think?!

This will be the perfect excuse for always online games from now on.

So like MMOs? Or online multi player? What is Titanfall without the internet?

 

[scabro]

xbox one threads on gaf never fail to deliver

 

[justgames7604]

This will be the perfect excuse for always online games from now on.

Yea always online games need that excuse to keep making more of them.
Destiny *shakes fist*
Dota *shakes harder*
the hundreds of arena, mmos and ARTS *shakes till oblivion*

 

[Black_Stride]

If this doesn't work, it's bad.
If this works it's also bad.
It's a lose-lose situation for consumers... I don't see how anyone can be happy about it.

So basically you can blow visually unimpressive shit up. Mkey...

\\

What the fuck is going on here.
Is the Xbone hate that deep that people cant help themselves but hate.
This is beyond console war-ism.

both of you guys need to grow some balls get back in this thread and expand on your comments if you dare.

So is it playable without the cloud?

what happends if i play this disconnected from the internet?

I would assume so in most cases, but if the destructibility is solely dependent on the cloud then wouldn't a lack of connection render the game unplayable?

You guys seem to have missed a very important point.
The full destruction is only in MP, MP is only playable online.....so if you disconnect from the net you would be disconnected from the game. The online session i mean.

Cloud computing only for Multiplayer online multiplayer.

If you want to play single player, go HAM, cloud computing doesnt affect it at all.

How long will the attempts to downplay and discredit go on?


Amazing scenes.

The Xbox One is seemingly public enemy number 1 on GAF, it cant do anything right, even when its doing shit right.

 

[FunkyDealer]

Anyone else wanting a new Rampage?

 

[-MB-]

It's time for Blast Corp 2

That would be an awesome idea, loved the first, and this is perfect for such a sequel.

 

[Coin Return]

Anyone else wanting a new Rampage?

Rampage, Godzilla...anything with large reptiles destroying a city would be nice.

 

[bj00rn_]

So a collapsing a skyscraper is now considered micro-destruction?

Hey, give him some credit; he just made up a completely new word, albeit nonsensical.

 

[biteren]

ahh ok, i see how it works now!

 

[GrayDock]

What I would like to know is the scalability of this tech, because both bandwidth and latency change over time and will impact the flow of the data, impacting the simulation.

What happens when your latency go from (e.g.) 30ms to 150ms for say 5 seconds? Less debris? Kicked out? Slowdown?

 

[Trup1aya]

I hope it works better than that most of the time but I bet it can go beyond 1 sec in a worst case scenario. We'll see I guess. Even a couple hundreds of milliseconds is way too much for most applications.

Why would the lag be any greater in this scenario, the making a wall collapse in, say, battlefield4? In both cases, the host machine is processing the physics and sending it to a client... The key difference here is that there is more significantly information being sent... That increase in the amount of information is covered by having adequate bandwidth... Which anyone who can stream YouTube in Hd should have...

When it comes to latency, it's a safe bet that most people will have a better ping to an Azure server than they do to whoever is hosting their Peer-you-peer battlefield match...

In short lag, should be less than what console gamers have already become used to..

 

[Tom Penny]

Nintendo and Sony better step up their game or get left behind.

 

[PhatSaqs]

Nintendo and Sony better step up their game or get left behind.

This should definitely benefit gaming as a whole going forward.

 

[kyser73]

yes, or what happens if like 16 players online demolishes 16 different houses next to each other.
A window that breaks into like 1000 pieces when crashed to the tarmac, and lots of concrete smashing down, into smaller pieces.

What happens to the framerate then?... or will it be pre-defined parts of the building that will crash, so it will be more or less "pre-animated" anyway? with not that many parts that needs to be rendered?

Theoretically nothing will change, as Cloudgine will scale server demand to meet the physics requests on the fly - which is the whole point of the exercise, that being the engine demands can be scaled on demand.

Nintendo and Sony better step up their game or get left behind.

By licensing Cloudgine & buying compute time on GCC or AWS.

 

[Tumle]

All the buildings have a steel super structure present, seen in all the videos. All the blocks and pieces break apart, all those tiny parts are interactable. The rubble can be broken again and again, while remaining interactable with eachother and players, piling up on eachother. Also all the rubble remains, all of it.

Its so detailed and huge nothing comes close.

Also the building explode because they have physical gas lines, like a real building.

I think it looks good
But I'm thinking if all the rubble stays there won't therebe more things to render and at what point will the gpu cave in on it self? The more ruble you make the more surfaces there is to render or no?
Edit:
Ok never mind I see it's getting answered right above me

 

[glaurung]

Why would the lag be any greater in this scenario, the making a wall collapse in, say, battlefield4? In both cases, the host machine is processing the physics and sending it to a client... The key difference here is that there is more significantly information being sent... That increase in the amount of information is covered by having adequate bandwidth... Which anyone who can stream YouTube in Hd should have...

When it comes to latency, it's a safe bet that most people will have a better ping to an Azure server than they do to whoever is hosting their Peer-you-peer battlefield match...

In short lag, should be less than what console gamers have already become used to..

 

[AP90]

What the fuck is going on here.
Is the Xbone hate that deep that people cant help themselves but hate.
This is beyond console war-ism.

both of you guys need to grow some balls get back in this thread and expand on your comments if you dare.








You guys seem to have missed a very important point.
The full destruction is only in MP, MP is only playable online.....so if you disconnect from the net you would be disconnected from the game. The online session i mean.

Cloud computing only for Multiplayer online multiplayer.

If you want to play single player, go HAM, cloud computing doesnt affect it at all.




The Xbox One is seemingly public enemy number 1 on GAF, it cant do anything right, even when its doing shit right.

This. People should be excited about this, but instead trying to rip it to shreds instead. If it was another console maker implementing this... It might be a different story.

People will hopefully be eating crow when it releases and ill be having some popcorn with that show.

 

[Syntsui]

Yea always online games need that excuse to keep making more of them.
Destiny *shakes fist*
Dota *shakes harder*
the hundreds of arena, mmos and ARTS *shakes till oblivion*

Why are you being that dense? You understood pretty the point I made.

 

[NinjaFridge]

This. People should be excited about this, but instead trying to rip it to shreds instead. If it was another console maker implementing this... It might be a different story.

People will hopefully be eating crow when it releases and ill be having some popcorn with that show.

SonyGAF amirite?

 

[mocoworm]

I was not impressed with the Crackdown physics demo. All I could see was the more detailed destruction from Infamous Second Son, combined with the architecture challenges of Red Faction Guerrilla.

At least Guerrilla developers explained how they realized very soon that they would need to build physically plausible buildings - because simple boxes would collapse under their own weight.

I see none of that in Crackdown 3. It's all to do with micro-destruction, not macro. Adding more smoke effects to a building falling down does not make for a better game. I remain skeptical.

You need to think beyond Crackdown. Loosen your mind. The potential applications of this tech are mindblowing.

Here is a thread with people discussing other possibilites:

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1092066

 

[justgames7604]

Why are you being that dense? You understood pretty the point I made.

Youre making it out to be that this is some needed excuse to make online only games. Its clearly not.

 

[glaurung]

You need to think beyond Crackdown. Loosen your mind. The potential applications of this tech are mindblowing.

Red Faction Guerrilla 2 with this technology on 8th generation consoles would be bowel-shattering.

Maybe the Crackdown 3 is too early to showcase. Maybe that is why these couple of videos do nothing for me.

 

[SolidusDave]

You guys seem to have missed a very important point.
The full destruction is only in MP, MP is only playable online.....so if you disconnect from the net you would be disconnected from the game. The online session i mean.

Cloud computing only for Multiplayer online multiplayer.

If you want to play single player, go HAM, cloud computing doesnt affect it at all.

Is there a technical reason why they can't implement the cloud computed destruction also in single player? Seems weird to restrict it to online-only.

 

[mocoworm]

Is there a technical reason why they can't implement the cloud computed destruction also in single player? Seems weird to restrict it to online-only.

Design choice probably. Like ppl have said, orb collecting would be no fun if you had blown up everything you can climb up to get to them.

There would be no technical limitations to them implementing this into a campaign if they chose to.

 

[glaurung]

Is there a technical reason why they can't implement the cloud computed destruction also in single player? Seems weird to restrict it to online-only.

I expect the multiplayer sessions are limited to much smaller physical location (invisible walls). That is how they can allow for detailed destructibility.

In single player, the entire world is open to you. Managing destruction would be unfeasible. Plus game mechanics breaking issues - what would stop you from blowing a hole in the wall of the main bad guy and killing him outright? They have to gate your campaign somehow.

 

[Prine]

Why are you being that dense? You understood pretty the point I made.

What point about always online are you making with CD3? And how is connectivity requirement different from other online games?

 

[Syntsui]

Youre making it out to be that this is some needed excuse to make online only games. Its clearly not.

It's the perfect excuse to make every single xbone exclusive game always online because ''we need the cloud to process this amazing AI/environment/some other bullshit, otherwise the experience would not be the same''.