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[bishoptl]

Yea i can understand it being close, but by no means does this video show what will actually be played when its released. the tech is insane, but I know not to be fooled by these types of tech demos.

What are you basing this on, exactly?

 

[llAuburnll]

oho

Ha. Was hoping that wouldn't get me in trouble. This thread is just pure gold. The title is glorious. Got a little caught up in the moment.

 

[Journey]

I never said we were currently half way through the generation currently. I simply stated, correctly that if this game is released after 21st November 2016 that it would be in the fourth year of the console.

I, personally believe thus generation will likely be 6 years long and we will get next gen consoles in fall 2019, which would put crackdown around the halfway point during the generation.

I think you need to separate which posters have stated what and try not to be confrontational, really, re-read my posts again.

I was responding to the guy that said we're already half way through the gen, thus claiming the tech doesn't have enough time to get used, and you stepped in to defend his statement. Why are you moving the goal posts for him? He said we're half way now, you're saying we will already be half way by the time Crackdown launches, and you believe the generation will end in 2019, so you're effectively moving up the goal post from the left (The guys said we're half way now) and the goal post from the other end by claiming this gen will be shorter than the last. You have great skills, 2 goal posts moved simultaneously!

 

[Miles Quaritch]

I'm going to laugh my ass off if this turns out to be as bad as Crackdown 2. All that tech, please don't be boring. I loved Crackdown 1

Transforming vehicles are back. It's simply impossible it was be as bad as CD2, which actually wasn't that bad.

People just like to hate on it, but it was a solid entry and introduced some really interesting and game changing aspects like rogue orbs, the wingsuit and more...

 

[dork]

Isn't really though, is there?

There's a handful of people talking about how cool something might be, getting shot to shit by a crowd of people who absolutely refuse to believe that anything from the company that makes Windows might actually be good.

As usual.

Love this post. Were all gamers, just be excited people

 

[leeh]

You realize the benefits of having a tech demo (I called it as such) to showcase to the public? For instance, this thread here. You don't have to give a damn about economic feasibility if you are following a larger strategic purpose with such a demo.

Do you honestly think they green lighted this without thinking about economics? Have you ever been in business before?

 

[GavinGT]

Transforming vehicles are back. It's simply impossible it was be as bad as CD2, which actually wasn't that bad.

People just like to hate on it, but it was a solid entry and introduced some really interesting and game changing aspects like rogue orbs, the wingsuit and more...

It wasn't a bad game, it just mixed up the formula in a few ways that really didn't work. Plus they thought they could get away with reusing the old city.

 

[Vinc]

I'm not technically savvy enough about this stuff to know if it's possible or not, but wouldn't the cloud tech basically offload some of the physics calculations to the cloud, then send it back to the xbox as pre-baked?

Kinda like how this pre-calculated physics trick was possible on an Xbox 360 (in Metro Last Light), except with data being sent from the cloud in real time:

It at least seems plausible to me, and pretty innovative at that. Can't wait to see it in action.

 

[omonimo]

What are you basing this on, exactly?

PR words, I suspect.

 

[Raide]

Transforming vehicles are back. It's simply impossible it was be as bad as CD2, which actually wasn't that bad.

People just like to hate on it, but it was a solid entry and introduced some really interesting and game changing aspects like rogue orbs, the wingsuit and more...

I put a load of hours into CD2, I just did not love it as much as CD1. Will be great to get those transforming vehicles back.




Also....Can we have a MP based map editor? Forge style maybe? Pwease!

 

[ironcreed]

Well, Azure is more than just for Xbox One. The investment is for many other businesses and ideas. It just so happen MS make and maintain the infrastructure and have a console to test things on.

While other people can hire the Azure hardware, MS are bound to favour their own teams and tech.

Of course, but Xbox One still falls in with those billions being spent on it as well. Again, there is obviously something to this and this game is starting to show it. All of the "power of the cloud" jokes are suddenly not so funny anymore.

 

[llAuburnll]

Love this post. Were all gamers, just be excited people

Innovations drive everyone. This is good for Sony and Microsoft fans both.

 

[cyberheater]

Well done MS. I saw the cloud based physics demo on youtube the other day and it was very impressive.

 

[moered6]

I'm going to laugh my ass off if this turns out to be as bad as Crackdown 2. All that tech, please don't be boring. I loved Crackdown 1

Original creative director With sumo digital working on this aswell, dont think so.

 

[A-V-B]

Sweet! The power of blast processing!

 

[MajorMane]

I'm really hoping this all turns out to be more truth and less PR talk. From what I've seen from the videos from Gamescom, it is impressive and the fact that they said this:

Jones says that his team are optimising the game for a 2-4mbps connection.

excites me and my crappy internet connection.

 

[SomTervo]

Yeah that's totally what I meant...

Cloud stuff, lol.

Still pretty neat .

... Unsure if you're being sarcastic/facetious, but I'll give you the benefit of the doubt here.

(PS yes it's "cloud stuff" but in no way does it compare to Onlive or Gaikai. That's like using "sports stuff" to describe baseball and skateboarding as the same thing)

 

[sirap]

Transforming vehicles are back. It's simply impossible it was be as bad as CD2, which actually wasn't that bad.

People just like to hate on it, but it was a solid entry and introduced some really interesting and game changing aspects like rogue orbs, the wingsuit and more...

I don't know, I thought it tried too hard to be Prototype...

 

[Mihos]

so its streaming the physics data. its not a video feed, but it's still streaming.

Kind of like any MMO or things like Everquest Next tracks all the environmental destruction, positional data, and loot table database stuff server side... but renders that data locally. It's a neat application of the tech, but it's not really new tech. It certainly is a little misleading to say it is making it the most powerful console ever. Just like me logging into AWS to perform my calcs for work doesn't change the power of the PC I logged in on. Persistent world stuff is much more exciting cloud tech to me than just partical counts on a scripted event.

 

[bishoptl]

Ha. Was hoping that wouldn't get me in trouble. Didn't mean any implications.

Sure you did. That's alright, though.

 

[Raide]

Of course, but Xbox One still falls in with those billions being spent on it as well. Again, there is obviously something to this and this game is starting to show it. All of the "power of the cloud" jokes are suddenly not so funny anymore.

I am glad its a game that shows it off and not something else. Sure its a tech demo at this point but if they can do even half of what they showed in an actual game, it will be damn fun to play.

I am assuming any game that uses servers could potentially use something similar to offload physics etc.

 

[llAuburnll]

Sure you did. That's alright, though.

I edited that part in. But took it back out. Of course I did.

You've made some solid points though in here, to be fair.

 

[Ricky_R]

Penello was right all along. Who's going to be the designated member that will apologize to him?

 

[Horp]

I have developed a solution for a client (business application) that uses a serverside GPU render farm to render configurations in Octane (similar to VRay, think 3ds max).
The application that utilizes the serverside renderer is an iOS app (including iPhone).

iPhone new stronkest konsole confirmed!!!!

 

[ElTorro]

Sure, but that's a shitty business plan for a middleware company if they only intend to have MS as a client.

It remains to be seen if they really want to sell that middleware, or if they plan to develop technologies for game streaming and more conventional uses of an online infrastructure, like, for instance, a resource manager that scales the resource allocation of a backend providing dedicated servers for multiplayer based on game-related heuristics.

My prediction is that this "hybrid" usage I was talking about makes no economic sense. Long term, game streaming and more flexibel resource allocation for conventional online infrastructure tasks will remain. I am one of those who think that the move towards game streaming is only hindered by the availability of high-quality networking and reliable QoS-based routing.

That's my prediction. Everyone may call me out on that in 5-10 years, if it doesn't come to pass. Same if, from now on, a majority of games will do things like Crackdown and especially for single-player as well.

Do you honestly think they green lighted this without thinking about economics? Have you ever been in business before?

See here.

You realize the benefits of having a tech demo (I called it as such) to showcase to the public? For instance, this thread here. You don't have to give a damn about economic feasibility if you are following a larger strategic purpose with such a demo.

 

[BronsonLee]

Oh, goddamnit Mocoworm, I'm on mobile and I still knew you made this damn thread.

Though really I should blame Gamesradar for their terrible article title!

This looks very cool, though. KILL DEM BUILDINGS

 

[AmaterasuOni]

Just like any other game being run on a dedicated server, when the server goes down the game goes down.

Ok. So it's just "DRM"-always online thing?

 

[Dynasty]

I don't get it, people loved the destruction in Horizon, the sandbags deflating in Uncharted 4, people love the destruction in RFG. People have been waiting for a good Superman/Godzilla game and this tech they showed could allow that. Why so much downplaying? This is my next gen moment.

 

[LiquidGotti]

Obviously, but its a vertical slice from the game that they converted into a tech demo. I think you are just attempting to troll for the sake of it.

Bish, even responded to you.

Nah not trolling at all. Just giving my thoughts on the game. everything I've said boils down to it being a tech demo. I just go in further saying that it most likely wont even be like that when the game releases. People have opinions, you don't have to be mad at mine.

And yes Bish responded to me, and i responded back to him as well......What does that do? what was that even mentioned for? lol smh

 

[Skeff]

I was responding to the guy that said we're already half way through the gen, thus claiming the tech doesn't have enough time to get used, and you stepped in to defend his statement. Why are you moving the goal posts for him? He said we're half way now, you're saying we will already be half way by the time Crackdown launches, and you believe the generation will end in 2019, so you're effectively moving up the goal post from the left (The guys said we're half way now) and the goal post from the other end by claiming this gen will be shorter than the last. You have great skills, 2 goal posts moved simultaneously!

What's wrong with you? I don't care what some other poster said. I didn't say that and I wasn't defending him I was making a point that it would be about half way through the generation. And it's not just my opinion on a 6 year generation, I would say that would likely be the consensus. In fact ea, Sony and AMD have all said as much:

http://www.mweb.co.za/games/view/ta...orter-lifespan-than-previous-generations.aspx

http://www.kitguru.net/gaming/matth...t-shorter-console-life-cycle-this-generation/

What is people's obsession with goalposts and defending and arguments? This is supposed to be a forum for discussion.


Edit: last post on the subject, I'm out of this thread.

 

[Pillville]

All that tells me is that there is indeed something to this. No way are they going to invest that much money into the cloud, only for it to be a bunch of bullshit like so many want to believe. I mean, some pretty smart people work at Microsoft and I don't think that they would be spending billions working on and promoting this just for smoke and mirrors.

MS didn't create Azure just for games. It's a competitor to other cloud platform providers like Google and Amazon. They really want high scale web applications hosted on there. Games logic is just another thing it can host.

MS is pushing Azure hard for all software developers (not just game devs). You can't even start a new project in Visual Studio without it trying to get you to host your app/site/db/etc on their Azure servers.

 

[Wynnebeck]

Sure you did. That's alright, though.

Is this the Nu Bish? Old Bish would have slapped his ass down for being fresh.

 

[ElTorro]

Something has to be done locally to be able to hide latency, or improve image quality on a purely streaming solution. Even if they receive multiple possible in advance streams and chose the right one given a certain input. Otherwise you end up with a completely working solution using the cloud, but that won't appeal to anyone because the experience won't ever match a local running app or game.

Latency is actually not a big principal issue with game streaming. In fact, the latency of streaming can be rather easily offset by low-latendy displays and running the game at higher frame rates.

I am saying that is not a principle issue, because the current architecture of the Internet is not really suited for providing reliable QoS-constraints. However, research agendas that strive to change that are underway all over the globe. It remains to be seen when and how they will improve the situation, but improve it will. And then game streaming will provide all the benefits of the cloud without the downsides of distributed systems that I described.

 

[gai_shain]

Ok. So it's just "DRM"-always online thing?

yes if the multiplayer in CoD or whatever is going down because the servers were blown up is drm so is this.

 

[GavinGT]

Ok. So it's just "DRM"-always online thing?

Yes, online multiplayer games requiring a constant internet connection constitutes DRM.

The game has an offline campaign, if that's what you're getting at.

 

[bishoptl]

You won't see this take off for SP applications. The always-online justification only passes muster in MP situations, which is why Crackdown 3's messaging around this feature is the correct way to go about it.

 

[JaggedSac]

It remains to be seen if they really want to sell that middleware, or if they plan to develop technologies for game streaming and more conventional uses of an online infrastructure, like, for instance, a resource manager that scales the resource allocation of a backend providing dedicated servers for multiplayer based on game-related heuristics.

My prediction is that this "hybrid" usage I was talking about makes no economic sense. Long term, game streaming and more flexibel resource allocation for conventional online infrastructure tasks will remain. I am one of those who think that the move towards game streaming is only hindered by the availability of high-quality networking and reliable QoS-based routing.

That's my prediction. Everyone may call me out on that in 5-10 years, if it doesn't come to pass. Same if, from now on, a majority of games will do things like Crackdown and especially for single-player as well.

My mistake, they aren't working only with MS. They are working with Epic, Havok, and NVidia. Certainly doesn't seem like a tech that would be in any way relevant to game streaming.

"a resource manager that scales the resource allocation of a backend providing dedicated servers for multiplayer based on game-related heuristics"

You are describing the role of a cloud service provider. If a 3rd party has to step in and manage that, that provider has failed.

 

[LookAtMeGo]

I'm trying to understand this more. So physics would be one of the better things to use this for right? And maybe AI or some dynamic weather or something? Is it not used to push extra detail in images or push for more polygons or FPS because of a latency issue? Or does it just work best to handle things that rely more on the CPU and not the GPU?

 

[Signet Son]

The cloud





Is real.

 

[llAuburnll]

MS didn't create Azure just for games. It's a competitor to other cloud platform providers like Google and Amazon. They really want high scale web applications hosted on there. Games logic is just another thing it can host.

MS is pushing Azure hard for all software developers (not just game devs). You can't even start a new project in Visual Studio without it trying to get you to host your app/site/db/etc on their Azure servers.

This is true. It's even an option in the settings when you are setting up new mvc apps and when you publish projects.

 

[Mihos]

Ok. So it's just "DRM"-always online thing?

I know you probably meant that to be funny, but I don't doubt that more than once that hasn't been listed as a 'Pro' during the decision making process on whether or not to invest in this. Moves more towards the whole 'games as a service' future everyone is pushing, also.

 

[gamechanger87]

You won't see this take off for SP applications. The always-online justification only passes muster in MP situations, which is why Crackdown 3's messaging around this feature is the correct way to go about it.

I think their justification for it is two-fold:

1) People hate always online
2) Full city destruction doesn't fit into a campaign where you are supposed to save the city, and makes orb collecting irrelevant considering the fact that the city doesn't rebuild every night.

 

[Torment]

so its streaming the physics data. its not a video feed, but it's still streaming.

.....No there is no streaming involved. You are passing data through a pipe which then calculates that data and sends it back with the new computations. Streaming would be if it allowed that signal to be shared with another device.

 

[dakun]

I don't get it, people loved the destruction in Horizon, the sandbags deflating in Uncharted 4, people love the destruction in RFG. People have been waiting for a good Superman/Godzilla game and this tech they showed could allow that. Why so much downplaying? This is my next gen moment.

first time i post about this game.. while i'm impressed with the tech, i don't believe and it doesn't look like something that wouldn't be possible without the always-on stuff on a current gen console.
All this "20 times the computational power of your Xbox One" is nice PR talk at best. in my opinion i should add

 

[Signet Son]

You won't see this take off for SP applications. The always-online justification only passes muster in MP situations, which is why Crackdown 3's messaging around this feature is the correct way to go about it.

Not initially. But eventually..yes we will

 

[Podge293]

Well, time to bring back the always connected requirement, right ?

like every online multiplayer game ever created?

 

[Apathy]

Meh its a clickbait title and article, but since the demo and videos over the past 72 hours there have been a lot of drivebys claims that this is all a like and smoke and mirrors.

Guess it's console warriors or people that can't grasp the technology in their head and should be called out but yeah click bait pr speak is big in the article.

Well, neither of the other two console makers have access to anything close to Azure (Microsoft servers) so the xbox is the only console that can do something like this unless someone else wants to spend a shitload of money renting someone elses server farms

Umm ok, good point, just don't see how it had to do with what my post said. Just because Azure servers are accessible to the xbox division does not make them special, also it doesn't make a pre built box more powerful. Again, server side calculations by a scalable server is great technology but it isn't downloading ram to your xbox.

 

[ironcreed]

MS didn't create Azure just for games. It's a competitor to other cloud platform providers like Google and Amazon. They really want high scale web applications hosted on there. Games logic is just another thing it can host.

MS is pushing Azure hard for all software developers (not just game devs). You can't even start a new project in Visual Studio without it trying to get you to host your app/site/db/etc on their Azure servers.

I know, but Xbox is still part of that ecosystem and this game is starting to show that they are not just blowing smoke up everyone's ass with what can be done in gaming with it. There is something real going on behind this.

 

[Raide]

I'm trying to understand this more. So physics would be one of the better things to use this for right? And maybe AI or some dynamic weather or something? Is it not used to push extra detail in images or push for more polygons or FPS because of a latency issue? Or does it just work best to handle things that rely more on the CPU and not the GPU?

Hrmmm...I guess you could do A.I. CD3 is basically offloading physics to servers. The more explodes, the more servers wind up. If they had a game where the A.I is complex, they could potentially do the same thing.

Dynamic weather as well would potentially work that way but it would have to probably be an open-world game where weather could be different all of the zone/world etc and have servers keeping track of that.

The cloud stuff seems to favour things that take CPU cycles to calculate, so math based things really.

 

[Castef]

What happens when you're offline?

It becomes like Infamous.