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#DarkSoulsDowngrade and #YOULIED \\ a.k.a You got some splainin' to do, Namco
- Thread starter Havel
- Start date
AstroNut325
Member
The first rule that was discussed in my management class a long while back was to set customer expectations appropriately right from the beginning. Not doing so can have catastrophic effects later on and will likely ruin customer relations.
It seems like the video game industry doesn't understand the basic tenants of customer expectation management. And that, my friends, is down right pathetic.
It seems like the video game industry doesn't understand the basic tenants of customer expectation management. And that, my friends, is down right pathetic.
We wont hear anything, they are hoping people wont learn about this, the 2 weeks after release are key for them, the less they acknowledge it the better.
You see no problems here, be honest
Reveal
1. Amazing Lightning
2. Atmospheric shadows/Lightning reflected on the ground/walls/characters etc
3. Torches on walls and other details throughout
Retail
1. All stuff on the reveal completely gone or reduced (worse blur, smoke effects)
2. Weird green/grey hue everywhere
Im missing tons of stuff in the comparisons too, they are completely different
The funny thing is that when DS2 was revealed, a lot of the comments I read were
Stage 1: "WOW THAT CGI HOT!"
Stage 2: "Well damn, a huge step up from the original!"
Stage 3:"Not doing too hot on polys or textures anymore, but damn the lighting is fine"
Stage 4: "Well what do you guys want the game is just fine without the lighting and torch gameplay that they advertised "
Ghost_Protocol
Member
To those saying the game is fine on consoles....are you playing on PS3? The framerate is garbage right from the beginning
Yep, no major changes in sight.
The lighting is clearly different, but it's impossible to see if the textures are drastically different without similar lighting... as is they look pretty similar.
I'm not saying you don't have the right to mad as hell, but I cannot see sufficient justification for what I see as an overreaction. I'll be expressing my opinion as much in other places as well. (probably an article, which is why I'm trying to gather as much information as possible about this.)
This is what confuses me the most, since the Network Test was done on PS3's right? I don't remember people saying the framerate was atrocious in the network builds.
Edit: DS2 with the lighting all fucked up destroys the atmosphere as much as playing Amnesia in a fully lit room full of cute kittens and puppies playing around.
This isn't a 'movement'. It is about getting an honest answer about dishonest claims until release.
I just unlocked the dynamic lighting guys.
Dynamic Lighting is still in the game. From just tuned down the necessity of using torches and dynamic light sources as it causes performance issues on console.
Not the point of the thread. This is a false advertising and should not just pass like it's nothing. what was showing, hyped and people to believe it's what the game look like turn not ture at all. and Gearbox and SEGA got sued for Colonial Marines downgrade it wasn't because the game sucked but was because it was downgraded completely then the first demo so the same as this situation.
That's because you have people in this forum, shaming their fellow customers, for the honor of a game developer.
And I don't see how all the downgraded features coming back for the PC is a good thing, when they showed the game off a month before release on PS3, with the bells and whistles.
It's embarrassing that people here will willingly give up their rights to play a good game.
Phatosaurus
Member
It's a joke, bro. I put a lit matchstick in the hand of the DSII knight figurine and "unlocked" dynamic lighting (IRL). :/
Red Liquorice
Member
I just started playing, and whilst I think it looks amazing - I mean right from the start it's pretty jaw dropping imo - The first time I lit one of the permanent stone torches I got a blip in the framerate, so it's pretty obvious why they did what they did. Not excusing them hiding it up to release, just an observation after playing it a very short while.
Krusenstern
Banned
You're right. Let's all shut up, bend over and take it.
You don't understand what this is about, do you?
This isn't a "movement" and neither is it embarrassing to call FROM and Namco out on false advertising.
Are you joking?
You don't understand. For some people it is way more fun and cathartic to complain about things on message boards than to play videogames.
There is a mystery here that it would be interesting to get to the bottom, but I find how indignant people are being over it more than a little absurd.
Even if so, a response would be fair. I appreciate sincerity. If they came out and said "well, we had to pull back on some of this stuff due to (insert reasons here)" I'd be absolutely content. Nobody here is saying the game is bad, but that this sudden change deserves a response.
Playing ghost about it does nobody any fucking favors, and to me, this is the issue. This information is only being raised by consumers, not the developer or publisher.
XANDER CAGE
Member
Graphics #Seriousbusiness!!
Yes. The souls games have never been known for its graphics. The gameplay is among the best around. I would have bought the game no matter what. When you look at the reviews all over and the response from players this game has done something special. its a game not a big budget special effect movie
Stone Ocean
Member
SniperHunter
Banned
didnt they say they made a next gen engine for this game?
maybe it only runs well on next gen systems and high end pc's?
maybe it only runs well on next gen systems and high end pc's?
Sorry I haven't followed this at all but is there any evidence that the PC version is downgraded, or is it still believe to be as in this gif?
If the doorframe has those bricks on it in the PC version but not in the PS3 version I will be amazed.
IIRC they said they made the engine with next gen in mind but would not comment as to if a next gen version was in development.
The framerate was just as crappy in the network test on PS3.
It's the third entry in a hugely popular series. To say that FROM, a company formed in 1986, doesn't know what they did was dishonest, is taking credit from where credit is due.
Everyone knows the game is good, it's the fact that they talked about features in the game to sell to returning customers, and in the end, pulled it out, and sold a basic repackage of the first one.
Please read the thread.
How are we supposed to know this happened, when no one is talking about it!? And the people here are shaming the person bringing up this issue! What happens if he had your attitude, and we just allowed FROM to lie to us?
We have an industry predicated on graphic fidelity, they know this. If they can't bring it, why lie about it?
Krusenstern
Banned
Sorry I haven't followed this at all but is there any evidence that the PC version is downgraded, or is it still believe to be as in this gif?
Most likely downgraded because this reveal demo is probably just a portion of the game built entirely for marketing from another team.
Again. it's about deceptive advertising, not graphics, not how good the game is or not. They showed something completely different, give journalist completely different demo to play and led people to believe it's what the game going to be like just to change that completely and show it just a week before the release.
Haunted
Member
But it could be even more awesome. You seem like you like awesome, but don't you like more awesome?
Well, I definitely won't buy the console version. :lol
I agree, from what I've seen the animation has really seen a downgrade compared to the first game.
It probably won't have the pitch blackness since that vastly changes the way the game plays.
I can't speak for everyone but to me this isn't an overreaction because:
1) Gameplay has been affected by these cuts. Uselessness of the torches and the removed spell charging make for an objectively worse game.
2) Emphasis on the torch mechanic was an advertised feature and one I was excited about because it could have made for a whole different kind of game. Yes I was looking forward to that.
3) Game was advertised with the old lightning up to close to the release. This is blatant false advertising.
4) ^ Game is still being advertised with the old footage.
Krusenstern
Banned
SniperHunter
Banned
stupid of them, they should have just ported the pc version and called it a day.
ThatGayWolf
Member
Do you have a source for that, or is that purely out of your ass conjecture? (not that dynamic lighting is still in, in a reduced capacity, but that there is an appreciable framerate difference)
Luckily you are here, on a message boards, judging other people, probably because you find it more fun than playing videogames.
D
Deleted member 22576
Unconfirmed Member
Its posts like this that leave me smugly vindicated for thinking this outrage is unbecoming and stupid.
Just from watching youtube videos.
A couple of the walkthroughs I was watching, the frame rate would drop whenever the player would walk into a room with a dynamic light source.
Lol why come into a thread and complain about people complaining?
Hahahah nice one.
You don't have to buy the game. Game demos and trailers usually (and I think they should always) have disclaimers talking about how the footage or demo is not final and is subject to change. As someone who posts on NeoGAF, you should, above anyone, know this. If they have these screenshots on the back of the box, I think you could probably cry "false advertising." I don't know if they had that kind of disclaimer when they showed the videos, but I think it's in the best interest of all companies to do that, because things can totally change. Think of movie trailers that show scenes that aren't actually in the movie. Is that false advertising as well?
The other key here is to stop preordering and stop rushing out to get a game the second it releases. If you're so concerned about consumer rights and getting jacked over by companies, why not wait to see what other consumers say about a product and then make your decision to buy or not to buy? You should know you're sensitive about these kinds of issues in games, so why not set yourself up for success by being a little more prudent about your game purchases?
All valid points, though as I understand it the torch mechanic is still in the game, just at a reduced emphasis.
Also, I'm not sure if this would count as 'false advertising' from the courts perspective, would be interesting to see this litigated.
I believe he perfectly understands, and just doesn't give a shit. Because FromSoft.
Nothing tastes better than sucking corporation dick.
How late were they showing that dragon footage and other footage from the original reveal video? I really didn't follow much of the media in the lead up to the game.
See, you don't understand.
For some people, it is way more fun and cathartic to complain about people complaining on message boards than to play video games.
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