again, I think most cases where PC developers failing would have to come down to stiff competition and a closed environment with far more hoops to have to jump threw. But in reality console gaming isn't nearly as close ended as it use to be, plenty of indie devs seem to finding huge success on the console front just as they do on the PC front, just take a look at the vita and PS4 for example.
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DFC Intelligence Analyst: 'PC games have surpassed console games globally'
- Thread starter Poetic.Injustice
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again, I think most cases where PC developers failing would have to come down to stiff competition and a closed environment with far more hoops to have to jump threw. But in reality console gaming isn't nearly as close ended as it use to be, plenty of indie devs seem to finding huge success on the console front just as they do on the PC front, just take a look at the vita and PS4 for example.
Birgitte2004
Member
I don't see many console only gamers in this thread.
What I see is endless mocking by PC gamers of what they think console gamers might say.
While i agree about the indie movement being succesfull on other platforms, i think it's funny that the Vita in this case is counted as a console.
its a handheld console
You mean of what people said directly on the first few pages of discounting entire genres and then moved over into sale wars.
I tend to refer to handhelds as just that, rarely if ever add the word console to it because i personally do not consider them to be part of the same group of platforms (actual consoles), though not gonna fight you over it, i know many people call them handheld consoles.
Will be amusing if / when Nintendo launches that rumored hybrid platform thing.
If this is true then why'd it take so long?
There are far more PCs in the world than consoles. Graphically, it's close on the low to mid end but high end PC gaming defecates on PS3/360 consoles that most console owners have right now.
For the record, I'm a console only PC gamer in hiding with my lowly rMBP 13. I'll join the graphic snobs after I come up on a Viidock 4 or 5 if they release one.
There are far more PCs in the world than consoles. Graphically, it's close on the low to mid end but high end PC gaming defecates on PS3/360 consoles that most console owners have right now.
For the record, I'm a console only PC gamer in hiding with my lowly rMBP 13. I'll join the graphic snobs after I come up on a Viidock 4 or 5 if they release one.
Nintendo next system could actually be what gets them back on track, so I'm not sure if amusing is the word to use here.
back on topic:
good sales on the PC front is good for everyone
From what it's rumored to be, i'm not so sure, sounds like a nightmare for both them and the users.
Sorta related to this topic, why do folks keep using BF4's (or any BF for that matter) playercount as some sort of measurement as to how well pc gaming is doing? Some even tend to go as far as saying it's the most popular shooter on the platform it's not even the most popular shooter on consoles so why would it be on pc, i have seen this happen in multiple threads now.
BennyBlanco
aka IMurRIVAL69
did you read the thread or nah
Consoles overtook PCs with the boom of console AAA gaming as a lot of AAA PC games moved to consoles, but PC gaming found its own niche of games that wouldn't work on consoles.
Stallion Free
Cock Encumbered
My iPad is a handheld pc
That list is so disgusting, ugh!Found it:
That is insane
Absolutely.
Also, I'm now gonna instantly unsubscribe, 'cause this whole 'look my shlong is so long' thread isn't worth my time. PC gaming =/= PC gaming.
I think you missed the sarcasm... being most console games have become into nothing but corridor shooters with lame cutscenes and poorly made self serious plots.
Makes you wonder if people questioning MOBAS as games do actually understand the difference between a movie wannabe game and an actual game with mechanics, strategy, skill ceil and so on...
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BennyBlanco
aka IMurRIVAL69
high end and mid tier modern gaming PCs also defecate on the new consoles, and that gap will only get wider as time goes on
the upside to owning consoles has always been exclusives and not hardware muscle, but they are getting less and less appealing imo.
Right, its not like they're repeating sarcastically other people from the early pages, but we both know that since you read the thread.
charlequin
Banned
This is not even a remotely accurate generalization today.
Its not really surprising. There is nothing stopping the PC train. The platform is million times more diverse than anything offered on console platforms
-Cheap games
-Backwards compatibility
-Tons of indie titles
-Lots of new early access games
-Very good MOBA games
-Tons of F2P games
-Tons of MMO games
-Best performing multiplats
-Mod longevity/replayability
and most importantly some of these games I mentioned have very dedicated gamers who give very long term support to devs and communities of these games. People can shit on these f2p/mmo games all they want but there is no denying the community support for these games is amazing on a global scale. Much more amazing than anything you will ever see on consoles. The multiplayer communities on consoles are usually dead after few months of release of most games. Community support for some PC games lasts years if not decades (eg. EVE, WOW)
Seriously its so dumb when people say Battlefield is supposed to be some PC measuring tool. Its never been the most popular FPS on PC nor will it ever be. It has always been and always will be Counter Strike. The steam numbers for 1.6 + Source + GO on daily basis for PC destroy all the console Battlefield numbers combined. (and that is coming from 160+ million PS360's sold) People need to do away with this mentality.
-Cheap games
-Backwards compatibility
-Tons of indie titles
-Lots of new early access games
-Very good MOBA games
-Tons of F2P games
-Tons of MMO games
-Best performing multiplats
-Mod longevity/replayability
and most importantly some of these games I mentioned have very dedicated gamers who give very long term support to devs and communities of these games. People can shit on these f2p/mmo games all they want but there is no denying the community support for these games is amazing on a global scale. Much more amazing than anything you will ever see on consoles. The multiplayer communities on consoles are usually dead after few months of release of most games. Community support for some PC games lasts years if not decades (eg. EVE, WOW)
Seriously its so dumb when people say Battlefield is supposed to be some PC measuring tool. Its never been the most popular FPS on PC nor will it ever be. It has always been and always will be Counter Strike. The steam numbers for 1.6 + Source + GO on daily basis for PC destroy all the console Battlefield numbers combined. (and that is coming from 160+ million PS360's sold) People need to do away with this mentality.
jim-jam bongs
Member
I wish you were still subbed, because I would love to know what the fuck you are even trying to say here.
LiquidMetal14
hide your water-based mammals
f2p and the open nature of PC is the reason. While impressive folks need to temper the praise and realize how many PC's are capable of gaming in any capacity.
It's actually a compliment to consoles which are far more limited in numbers vs the general PC.
It's actually a compliment to consoles which are far more limited in numbers vs the general PC.
I don't understand the point of consoles anymore. Building a PC is like a new Lego set, and you get bang for your buck with sales and no online-gaming charge. Graphics cards have HDMI output for 1080/60 and surround sound. You can easily setup a 360 pad/Dualshock 3/4. Wireless Keyboard/Mouse are easy to get used as well. This is MY view, and it's not malleable.
bane? no. what you're seeing is a reaction to the sentiment that these mechanically neutered and ultimately casual games are somehow transcendent experiences which no gamer could possibly be without.
"Gaming" does not have a single spec requirement. Almost any PC from the past 4+ years can run League of Legends without any trouble, which is why it's a huge deal worldwide. There's a continuous gradient between low end and high end, not a sharp divide between gaming and non-gaming.
Or maybe they're actually just fun games to play.
edit:
what are some of these "transcendent experiences" you speak of?
The point of consoles is convenience of setup, low entry point, relative bang-for-buck value, and guarantee of game performance for the life of the console. More recently they've sort of evolved to become media centers, some would argue too much so for the XB1. Consoles are devices designed to fit into living room media centers rather than a desk. There are people who use their PCs in their living room setup but they are not the norm. While graphics are always a big bonus, these are the real practical reasons put forth for anyone considering a console - games aside, and closed vs open ecosystems aside.
On the other hand, spending a couple hundred dollars more on a PC will give you a machine that can do many, many more things and offer greater performance, a completely open environment vs the walled gardens of a corporate-controlled platform, and many more games.
When we come down to the root of everything, the quality and diversity of game titles, it becomes very murky and subject to personal taste and opinion. The birth of consoles gave birth to controllers, and controllers changed the way people play games. Similarly, the rise of mobile gaming changed the way games can be played. PC can play all of these or could theoretically - you just have to attach a controller or you can emulate the touch screen with a mouse click. The thing is this diversity of how games are played and by proxy how they're designed wouldn't have come about if consoles and controllers never existed, if history hadn't developed in the way that it did.
So when I see shit like "consoles are unnecessary" or "PC is dead" or other such spiteful, hateful comments, I think those people are incredibly narrow-minded and have no idea why gaming is able to appeal to as many people as it does, or why it's evolved the way it has.
It's even more fascinating because MOBAs originated from RTS - namely StarCraft.
South Korea was the first to adopt RTS (StarCraft) as a national sport. LoL at least is well on its way to establishing itself as the premiere eSport in NA, if it hasn't done so already. This is one thing that I would say is only possible because of the open nature of PCs as a platform - not that consoles are lesser for it though. I said it in a previous post, but IMO there isn't necessarily a huge overlap of players between PC and consoles from my observations.
In that case we're in agreement. I dislike the big-budget third-person-action-adventure experience that has been pushed so much in the 7th generation. The trend towards photo-realism and cinematic experiences over all else has left a sour taste.
MutonCommander
Banned
Not even remotely true. According to Ars Technica's Steam estimates and other available data on console game sales, for games like Borderlands 2, Portal 2, Skyrim, Saints Row 3, Metro 2033, Dead Island, Just Cause 2, BioShock Infinite, XCOM, Tomb Raider, Dark Souls, Hitman Absolution, Dishonored, the PC SKU was either the best selling one or very close to the console SKU numbers.
In fact, of the top-100 best selling games on Steam the only multiplatform ones that seem to have sold much better on consoles are the Call of Duty games and other bro shooters like Far Cry 3. Not exactly a surprise.
TyrantGuardian
Member
I just love it when people come in and proclaim that literally the hardest of core games like LoL and Dota 2 aren't "real games" and clump them in with Zynga mobile titles because they can't tell the difference between a business model and game design. Or maybe I'm just annoyed over a strawman, but it sure doesn't feel like it.
I'm surprised analysts didn't pick up on this sooner. The PC market is just raking in money, and it's doing so over every price point/"quality letter grade" (what a bizarre concept) on a wide variety of sales platforms. I think the terms renaissance and Golden Age apply, but I have also been playing Civ 5 lately, so excuse me if hyperbole
I'm surprised analysts didn't pick up on this sooner. The PC market is just raking in money, and it's doing so over every price point/"quality letter grade" (what a bizarre concept) on a wide variety of sales platforms. I think the terms renaissance and Golden Age apply, but I have also been playing Civ 5 lately, so excuse me if hyperbole
charlequin
Banned
What makes you think this hasn't already happened? Valve and Blizzard, two of the biggest PC-oriented devs in existence, both make games that will run on toasters. LoL will play on pretty much anything. Most of the hip indie games on PC will run fine on even a system with integrated graphics. Graphically intensive titles are a pretty small part of the PC market already.
PC gaming is dead
In one traditional sense it is. You'll never see a game on the scale of Grand Theft Auto V solely on PC without it being subsidized by console development. It's not so much about League of Legends, Dota games, but the fact it's because of consoles that PC gamers get versions of Assassin's Creed, Mass effect type games. These are games that cost over hundreds of millions of dollars and require several hundred employees etc. Motion capture, cinematics, score, voice over artists. Who knows where the industry will go though.
SW:TOR was a PC exclusive game that cost literally hundreds of millions of dollars to make. Wasn't much of a game but it totally disproves your point.
Speaking of which, Star Citizen is PC exclusive and its budget has passed $40 million entirely through crowdfunding. Shows that the community desire for "AAA" type games is really there in PC land.
It also:
a) tanked horribly and went F2P
b) it's a MMO game, which, on consoles, aren't really popular
Anyway, even though it's good for the industry, it's not good for me. I don't like these types of games. And their rising popularity means more clones in the same way Call of Duty made almost every other shooter cater to CoD audience. I don't want that.
AFAIK, they want to make console versions (I heard about PS4).
And, well, Star Citizen is a space sim - another genre not popular on consoles.
MutonCommander
Banned
So, what exactly is your argument here?
How does it disprove my point? The studio was BioWare Austin, created solely by EA to make that Star Wars game. They even took guys like Drew Karpyshyn off of Mass effect 2 to write the story for it. In the end, the game failed to catch on, and there were several rounds of layoffs.
Additionally, that game didn't get near the same amount of attention that games like Mass Effect got. And EA and even BioWare are primarily console focused now.
I think you didn't quite understand what I meant by my comment. I didn't say that there won't be PC exclusives anymore, or that there won't be big budget titles. I was merely saying, primary games development is now done on consoles with PC getting a port. That its hard to believe any non-moba, F2P game would be greenlit as a PC exclusive, AAA with several hundreds of millions of dollars, big marketing budget etc. without there being a plan to port for consoles anymore. Didn't really mean to get into a back and forth here. Heck, PC isn't even getting Destiny from Bungie, a game that would probably be perfect for PC gaming with its connectedness, large worlds, MMO style public events etc.
You mean argument in PC vs console discussion? None?
I prefer consoles because of my gaming preferences. Most popular games on PC don't really fit them. I tried to get into MOBAs but I don't really get their popularity. I like to watch others play them though.
Wiktor
Member
That would be pretty hard. The ammount of titles avaible on consoles is pretty miniscule compared to PC.
You'll never see a game on the scale of Grand Theft Auto V solely on Xbox or solely on PS without it being subsidized by the platform-holder.
Wiktor
Member
Since they stopped using gloriouc B and C- list actors and went for lame polygonal puppets.
Wiktor
Member
Actually it's pretty much the only place where you might see an exclusive like this. GTAV would never be made as exclusive to one platform. PC is the only place where exclusives with insane budgets might happen at all and even there they're extremely rare.
And SEGA's biggest titles are on PC now, things change.
Big MMO's have higher budget than pretty much any console AAA game besides GTA. Saying " this game is console exclusive" doesn't really show anything besdies the fact that PC and consoles are in fact very different and so are their audiences. Heck Riot alone has over 1000 employees, and that's for just the support of one game.
If you only follow console focused media, you'll mostly hear about console focused games. and yes, even GAF is still very console focused, even if there was a bit of a shift lately.
my dear lord this thread has descended into a compete generalisation from both sides (All PC gamers play MOBO's only) to greats as " every console game is a 3rd person,corridor cinematic shooter" I mean really I thought Gaf was the most informed gaming site there is... I think I will have to leave this as the sheer vitriol with which any comment from both sides is jumped on and attacked is pointless.
Good sales for either is good for us all but so many attitudes in here are what will kill a lot of the industry off , " i like game/platform A so everything else is crap and should just die!" I mean really??!!?
So much salt you would think it was a Nvidia sponsored
Good sales for either is good for us all but so many attitudes in here are what will kill a lot of the industry off , " i like game/platform A so everything else is crap and should just die!" I mean really??!!?
So much salt you would think it was a Nvidia sponsored
/s In case I get jumped on for it too!
SenjutsuSage
Banned
Nope, not buying this one tiny bit.
And I'd rather play a strategy game with deep mechanics on a PC than a 4 hour linear FPS on a console. Whats your point except for making a stupid generalisation?
How does any of this disprove SW:TOR a GTAV scale created exclusively for PC? After all, you said it would "never" happen.
Doesn't matter in the end, because it should that at least someone thought that super big games on PC could work. And it would work, if they understood the market (a lot) better.
DodgyGeezerFella
Member
Do we ever get hard sales figures for the majority of PC games these days ? Feels like people are just pissing in the wind with how healthy or unhealthy the PC market is, and the usual defending PC positivity and boo'ing criticism.
While its obvious MMO's, MOBA's and for other genre's, the PC is the place to be, but i guess what a lot of Gaffers are saying, the kind of games ... the "traditional" type's (Is that a PC enough term ?), that's the only revenue that really matters as that's the kind of revenue from games that matters to them. I know i see revenue charts like this and think "Well, i want another PC exclusive FPS shooter in the vein of Crysis ?" which we don't get anymore.
Of course, without real sales data, i just find these charts kind of meaningless. Everyone knows MMO's, MOBA's and flash games are making serious bank.
While its obvious MMO's, MOBA's and for other genre's, the PC is the place to be, but i guess what a lot of Gaffers are saying, the kind of games ... the "traditional" type's (Is that a PC enough term ?), that's the only revenue that really matters as that's the kind of revenue from games that matters to them. I know i see revenue charts like this and think "Well, i want another PC exclusive FPS shooter in the vein of Crysis ?" which we don't get anymore.
Of course, without real sales data, i just find these charts kind of meaningless. Everyone knows MMO's, MOBA's and flash games are making serious bank.