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[Zabka]

Funny how the combination New York and Wal-Mart in Google Mapd gives me a long lists of shops in New York.

You don't understand New York

 

[Muffin1611]

I feel like Germany, like France, is a bit of an extreme case. I've visited Germany plenty of times, most of them being wined and dined and the expense of a major corporation. The food of the average restaurant is usually fairly plain.

There's nothing wrong with it, but it's nothing to rave about. Barring some rare exceptions*, most German food served at restaurants is simple, mild and not very surprising. Just like the kind of stuff you'd make at home, but maybe more nicely set. Other than foreign restaurants (there are some killer Vietnamese and Indian restaurants in Berlin), German food that really makes you go "wow" tends to start at fancy pants grade restaurants. At least in my experience.

My girlfriend travels to Germany for a few weeks every now and then due to work and she always complains about restaurant food being very monotone and plain to the point of demanding a local feast for whenever she comes home. Oddly enough, the kitchen/cafeteria at her factory serves food that happens to be considerably tastier and much more varied than the local restaurants (!). Go figure.

*America and Germany are tied for the best beef I've ever had.

That's true for sure. German restaurants tend to be "meh" in my experience. I've eaten really well made German food mostly when it was homemade by my parents or other relatives. And one or two restaurants that were better than the rest.

We have a local pancake restaurant with plenty of German-style variations and those are great. So more specialized restaurants tend to be better as well.

 

[Rocketz]

I love food threads on GAF.

 

[shnurgleton]

Funny how the combination New York and Wal-Mart in Google Mapd gives me a long lists of shops in New York.

NYC doesn't have a single Wal-Mart.

 

[balladofwindfishes]

Funny how the combination New York and Wal-Mart in Google Mapd gives me a long lists of shops in New York.

Search for Wegmans in New York, and get back to me

 

[Thelonelykoopa]

Time to terrify Europeans with how we bastardized bread. This is Zucchini bread which is a dessert bread made with Zucchinis

Look at it and tremble lol Its also delicious.

 

[MilkyJoe]

European grocery stores are kind of sad. They are small with bad selection. I expect that this is largely about density -- you just can't build a huge grocery store with a parking lot that goes for miles in a European city. Every store is pretty small and has to stock the basics, so there's just no room for much more. Now, you can still find most things, eventually. But if you want decent meat you've got to go to a separate butcher shop, etc.

Yeah I found this too, so it must be people go to the markets. In the UK we have produce sections like below, with fish counters, butchers, bakeries, all under the same roof, even in the smallest of supermarkets. Renting a villa on Europe changed my expectation of having a cooking adventure to just eating out every night.

 

[Funky Papa]

Time to terrify Europeans with how we bastardized bread. This is Zucchini bread which is a dessert bread made with Zucchinis

Look at it and tremble lol Its also delicious.

That's cake.

That's a courgette cake.

 

[Hitmeneer]

It is the European Beer vs American Beer topic all over again. Europe claims a kitchen with long tradition and America claims to have fusion / innovation.

Europe is very diverse. In Italy you will find mostly traditional restaurants and they will make amazing local dishes. Pizza from Napels, FRESH buffalo mozzarella from the south of Italy (orgasm ensured), Florentine Steak in the Chianti region (who dares to claim that only Americans do grill well, obviously never stayed in Tuscany), etc. etc. But it is very difficult to find fusion or ethnic places in Italy. There are good places for it, but they are difficult to find.

Instead, the original Dutch kitchen is boring, thus in the Netherlands you will find amazing fusion and ethnic restaurants, while most standard restaurants are based on the Italian & French kitchen. But I never had Italian food as in Italy. And this is most likely to be said also of America, because it is difficult to find all ingredients fresh, of high quality and without paying an insane amount of money.

 

[Strangelove77]

We have food from all over the world in the US. Cuz immigration and shit.

 

[NR1]

You can literally find anything and everything in American. It's a cultural melting pot. I got these grasshopper tacos not that long ago.

You just have to know where to look and get out of your normal social circles to find it. There are TONS of ethnic enclaves all over the place. My wife is Vietnamese, so she shows me all the Asian grocery stores and restaurants around and I show her all the BBQ, burger joints, and other places.

 

[PdotMichael]

You don't understand New York

I understand New York just fine.

 

[Muffin1611]

What's GAFs opinion on the Rosinenschnecke btw

 

[Westbahnhof]

Time to terrify Europeans with how we bastardized bread. This is Zucchini bread which is a dessert bread made with Zucchinis

Look at it and tremble lol Its also delicious.

I like Zucchinikuchen. Which is cake.
Do you really call this bread?

What's GAFs opinion on the Rosinenschnecke btw

It's okay, while I like raisins, I prefer raisinless Nussschnecke.

 

[balladofwindfishes]

I understand New York just fine.

You picked the one state in the country with probably the most well known and largest chain of grocery stores that are not Wal Mart.

I don't think you could have possibly picked a worse state as an example.

And if you're talking about NYC, there isn't even a Wal-Mart in NYC...

 

[Skellig Gra]

I think Europeans have a legitimate idea of what is American food by what America has marketed around the world. Everyone knows America is Coke, McDonalds, America processed cheese poured on everything, bacon, bacon, bacon, bacon, and more bacon, with a side of Ranch. You can't fault outsider when that is what we tell everyone what we eat. If you look at American cooking shows- it all about how much butter you can stuff in there, how many layers of cheese and bacon you can add, with a half pound of fries, all one a serving platter for one.

Can you find, good, quality food in America? Absolutely. But culturally, that is not what America projects around the world.

Also, I disagree that the idea that eating "good" food is the norm in America. With the wage disparity, the majority of the people are surviving on Wonderbread knock offs, processed cheese foods, and salt/sugar laded processed foods. Even in large cities, where the variety is the highest, the majority still eat poorly.

I know the majority of everyone I know didn't eat good food on a regular bases until were adults. Many of my family eat shit tier food because that is what they can afford. So the idea that America is nothing but fries, burgers, hotdogs, pizza, "tacos", mac and cheese, and chicken nuggets is closer to the truth than "my urban store carries all the finest cheeses and breads too!"

I don't blame foreigners for getting that impression. I often lament to Europeans when I'm abroad that our worst foods seem to be our most popular exports for whatever reason. I think there is a generational divide when it comes to eating poorly. If you go in to a McDonalds these days its very significantly skewed to olderish people. Places like Panera Bread are always mobbed with younger people/families with kids. There is a significant movement for healthier food for the next generation. As a relatively new parent I was blown away at all the healthy stuff specifically marketed towards young kids.

 

[Thelonelykoopa]

That's cake.

That's a courgette cake.

Well yeah thats kind of the point but we call it bread alongside others like Bannana bread.

 

[Westbahnhof]

Well yeah thats kind of the point but we call it bread alongside others like Bannana bread.

I mean, when it comes to naming, we are in no position to complain.
Leberkäse, with Leber meaning liver and Käse being cheese, usually contains neither.

 

[Futureman]

I understand New York just fine.

well as others have pointed out there are no Wal-Marts in NYC. Someone isn't going to take a train out of the city just so they can get low quality produce at Wal-Mart.

 

[Muffin1611]

I mean, when it comes to naming, we are in no position to complain.
Leberkäse, with Leber meaning liver and Käse being cheese, usually contains neither.

The whole Pfannkuchen/Berliner naming debacle gets me every time.

 

[MsKrisp]

Geez even my local walmart (the one that actually sells fresh groceries, because not all of them are supercenters) sells stuff like broccolini. I won't shop there, but they fucking have it. Even Walmart isn't all wonderbread and ketchup y'all

 

[Coriolanus]

I think it would be through fermentation of the dough for one or two days. Or using "masa madre", I don't know how to translate that. Bakeries have a "mother dough" they keep pretty much forever by adding flour and water. They pick portions of that dough and mix it with the new fresh dough to kickstart the fermentation process.

Or it could be something else. I don't know wtf I'm talking about.

you only need lukewarm water to activate instant yeast. It'll nom juuuuust fine on flour starches.

Masa madre/levain is more for taste reasons.

People are exposed to their surroundings, and while fine dining restaurants are not rare, there's an overabundance of low quality and fast food restaurants all over America. So you are not wrong, but it's also easy to understand why some visitors get funny ideas about American food. The same is also true if you are an American visiting the usual European tourist trap, since those restaurants are all about serving quickly and cheaply or so-so at grossly inflated prices.

Tourists are also prone to have bad experiences with food since many of them just want something cheap and quick/on the go unless they are eating at their hotel/having a night out. Many of them don't mingle with the locals. And unless you are visiting some town in Southeastern Asia or other place with a strong culture of street food, you are just setting yourself for disappointment.

You don't get to truly appreciate local cuisine until you've lived somewhere for a while.

yes to both of the bolded. Have seen this quite recently with a friend having a layover in madrid. Fucker wanted to eat something, and was heading to McD's. After much cajoling,
convinced the bastard to go eat at a local place. Went straight for a tapas tourist trap near the airport that was charging something like 8 euro per goddamn tapa. That'd legit be the sum of his spanish food experience, had i not convinced the fool to go somewhere else.

Much better luck when one can spare the time and go where the 40+yo locals eat.

Is bread in the US really sweet?

if you go to, say, a publix bread aisle, it won't smell of bread. it'll smell sweet as hell.
Mind you, they'll most likely have serviceable bread somewhere in the store, so it's not all bad.

 

[Westbahnhof]

The whole Pfannkuchen/Berliner naming debacle gets me every time.

I do not use either of those words, I'd call them "weird thick Palatschinken" and "Krapfen".
What naming debacle?

Go to a Carrefour in France and you will find exactly the same though.

Or any proper Merkur(for example) in Austria.
I don't think there is any country where you won't find stores with good options.

 

[Hrothgar]

Yeah I found this too, so it must be people go to the markets. In the UK we have produce sections like below, with fish counters, butchers, bakeries, all under the same roof, even in the smallest of supermarkets. Renting a villa on Europe changed my expectation of having a cooking adventure to just eating out every night.

Go to a Carrefour in France and you will find exactly the same though.

The one thing I really miss here in the Netherlands is the huge meat selection you could find there, because our supermarkets are indeed small in comparison. I would have to go to a specialized butcher to find the same here, maybe even having to place an order for a nice cut. Fish is easier, as every (bi)weekly market will have tons of fish stands.

 

[Chococat]

I don't blame foreigners for getting that impression. I often lament to Europeans when I'm abroad that our worst foods seem to be our most popular exports for whatever reason. I think there is a generational divide when it comes to eating poorly. If you go in to a McDonalds these days its very significantly skewed to olderish people. Places like Panera Bread are always mobbed with younger people/families with kids. There is a significant movement for healthier food for the next generation. As a relatively new parent I was blown away at all the healthy stuff specifically marketed towards young kids.

Totally agree with you. GAF skews younger, and doesn't realize just 20 years ago, variety was not a thing in America. People were still in the after WWII mindset processed food helped us win the war, processed food is good for everyone. The move back to fresh foods, quality foods, and healthier options is a newer phenomenon.

Look at the fight in school districts trying to switch from processed pizza and nuggets to healthier scratch made food and salads. Parents are rebelling against the health food as much as kids. That's American food culture right there.

Many here are confusing what the average person eats daily (aka America food culture) with what foods can be found in America (aka variety). The two are not the same.

 

[MistakenMobius]

Frankly why go to a super/hyper market when you can go to a proper market 2 or 3 times a week to get fresh stuff?
Let's face it, there is an European pride of going no to specialist shop rather to globomarkt.

 

[BannedEpisode]

People should learn not to generalize.

I had literally the best and worst pizza of my entire life in a span of 3 days in Italy.

Also come on with the American Kraft Singles thing, acting like that is the only "cheese" available makes you look more stupid than anyone. Wisconsin farms produce some fantastic cheese and dairy.

 

[Funky Papa]

European grocery stores are kind of sad. They are small with bad selection. I expect that this is largely about density -- you just can't build a huge grocery store with a parking lot that goes for miles in a European city. Every store is pretty small and has to stock the basics, so there's just no room for much more. Now, you can still find most things, eventually. But if you want decent meat you've got to go to a separate butcher shop, etc.

This may be different depending on the country, but you are not meant to make the bulk of your food purchases at the grocery store. That's what the actual markets are for. Grocers are good for buying vegetables, some canned tuna or toothpaste when you run out of them. Those without access to local markets tend to visit larger supermarkets/hypermarkets such as Auchan or the larger Carrefour or Mercadona shops, which are better stocked (but still more expensive than the market).

American supermarkets are a class of their own. They'll make most Europeans feel like a Cold War refugee staring at the shelves of a modern day LIDL. My first exposure to an American supermarket was a Best Market in a very fancy area of NY and just the amount of different types of cereals and soft drinks blew my mind.

 

[Coriolanus]

Frankly why go to a super/hyper market when you can go to a proper market 2 or 3 times a week to get fresh stuff?
Let's face it, there is an European pride of going no to specialist shop rather to globomarkt.

i feel that this might be more related to distance and shopping method than to anything else. If you're going to a place by car, you can load up more stuff in one go (and most likely dont have to climb some fucking stairs on the way back), whereas if you're in an european downtown, you're most likely going about your business on foot, and as such, will shop in smaller quantities and much more frequently. Thus there's also no point in having these huge selections in stores.

 

[Alligatorjandro]

America has better pigs.

 

[RocknRola]

Yeah I found this too, so it must be people go to the markets. In the UK we have produce sections like below, with fish counters, butchers, bakeries, all under the same roof, even in the smallest of supermarkets. Renting a villa on Europe changed my expectation of having a cooking adventure to just eating out every night.

???

We have those everywhere too, along with the smaller local shops.

The thing about local shops is that what you find there is 9/10 times actually local (usually from the local region too). In the bigger markets, it's a mix (from the EU, South America, North America, Africa, Asia and local produce too) but with a whole lot more variety.

 

[Skellig Gra]

Frankly why go to a super/hyper market when you can go to a proper market 2 or 3 times a week to get fresh stuff?
Let's face it, there is an European pride of going no to specialist shop rather to globomarkt.

Well how do all those stores stay in business if no one goes to them?

 

[#sorrynotsorry]

Tons of amazing food here in the US. Avoid Texas BBQ, obviously. They think meat doesn't 'need' sauce, but that's like saying fries don't 'need' to be dipped in anything.

BBQ doesn't need sauce. That said, I'm from Texas and have been to literally dozens of the best BBQ places all over the state. All of them had BBQ sauce. All of them. Now I will say I think it's a bit too sweet in some places and I prefer vinegar-based sauce, but it's definitely there.

European cuisine is far too bland for the average American. And vice versa. That's where this whole issue arises. And, frankly, if you don't know where to go here there is a lot of really bad food. But there's also some of the best food.

American Italian is better than traditional Italian.
Same with Chinese.
And Mexican.

Why? Because that cultural fusion works to create big flavors that are really wonderful.

The bottom line is that Europeans need to try good Texas BBQ. That's the best in the world.

 

[balladofwindfishes]

Frankly why go to a super/hyper market when you can go to a proper market 2 or 3 times a week to get fresh stuff?
Let's face it, there is an European pride of going no to specialist shop rather to globomarkt.

I do go to the market occasionally, but I'm not going to a market when it's 0 degrees (Fahrenheit!) and there's a half an inch of ice on the ground.

 

[elrechazado]

Totally agree with you. GAF skews younger, and doesn't realize just 20 years ago, variety was not a thing in America. People were still in the after WWII mindset processed food helped us win the war, processed food is good for everyone. The move back to fresh foods, quality foods, and healthier options is a newer phenomenon.

Look at the fight in school districts trying to switch from processed pizza and nuggets to healthier scratch made food and salads. Parents are rebelling against the health food as much as kids. That's American food culture right there.

Many here are confusing what the average person eats daily (aka America food culture) with what foods can be found in America (aka variety). The two are not the same.

In 1997 there wasn't food variety in America? What am I reading.

 

[disco]

That's true for sure. German restaurants tend to be "meh" in my experience. I've eaten really well made German food mostly when it was homemade by my parents or other relatives. And one or two restaurants that were better than the rest.

We have a local pancake restaurant with plenty of German-style variations and those are great. So more specialized restaurants tend to be better as well.

I (British) have met many Germans that say "I mean, English food, ugh - what's that about" and it's like ... "...are you kidding me? You want to suffocate with me with BREAD and potatoes and meat instead?".

Tbh, English and German cuisine is pretty similar but I do think there is a lot more global variety available in the UK than in Germany. I do miss my airfreighted prawns and asparagus... Bit sick of gherkins out of a jar and what's in season.

Similarly I think it's way easier to eat healthier food on the go in the UK. Salads on the go in Germany are just iceberg lettuce, sweetcorn and tuna - what is this? 1998? Everything else is more bread than filling and fruit selections are simple and expensive.

Both nations seem to benefit from migrant cuisine quite heavily though. Indian food in Germany is absolutely appalling and very expensive (in both cases the opposite in the UK) whilst it's Turkish food is incredible. 'Continental' fish restaurants are more of a tradition in Germany too which I enjoy. Living in Dusseldorf I can also attest to it having Europe's best collection of Japanese (and Korean) restaurants.

Overall - I don't want to sound too negative, but I do miss my Blighty diet (which more so is just the global choice of London) after living here 6 months.

 

[Fafalada]

What's GAFs opinion on the Rosinenschnecke btw

It's passable, but you can do so, so much better in Germany

 

[MilkyJoe]

???

We have those everywhere too, along with the smaller local shops.

As Europe has many member nations, if it does not apply, you can safely assume you are exempt.

 

[MistakenMobius]

Well how do all those stores stay in business if no one goes to them?

Well family, people living in the countryside.
Don't forget that the Europe has a higher density of inhabitant in general than the US so people lives in city and are probably less reliant to buy mega groceries.
For example go to the super market every 2 day to buy food to cook and I want to be able to carry everything on foot. My fridge is always nearly empty.

 

[Chococat]

Also come on with the American Kraft Singles thing, acting like that is the only "cheese" available makes you look more stupid than anyone. Wisconsin farms produce some fantastic cheese and dairy.

When I think America cheese, there are three types- the highly processed singles like Kraft or Cheddar or processed mozzerala. Finding a flavor outside of those three, that is accepted by the public at large, is hard. You have to go to the deli case for those.

 

[Pandora012]

Funny how the combination New York and Wal-Mart in Google Mapd gives me a long lists of shops in New York.

NYC doesn't have a walmart. The closest walmart is in New Jersey. New York state on the other hand has walmart stores.

 

[Coriolanus]

In 1997 there wasn't food variety in America? What am I reading.

he's arguing in the sense that processed foods were the main types of food available in america then. Is variety wrt focus on fresh, local stuff.

I mean, probably didn't apply anyway if you lived in a decently-sized city, but with food deserts being a thing to this day...

 

[Skellig Gra]

Well family, people living in the countryside.
Don't forget that the Europe has a higher density of inhabitant in general than the US so people lives in city and are probably less reliant to buy mega groceries.
For example go to the super market every 2 day to buy food to cook and I want to be able to carry everything on foot. My fridge is always nearly empty.

Yeah people living in cities have less space to store food too so that is a consideration as well.

 

[cromofo]

nvm

 

[balladofwindfishes]

When I think America cheese, there are three types- the highly processed singles like Kraft or Cheddar or processed mozzerala. Finding a flavor outside of those three, that is accepted by the public at large, is hard. You have to go to the deli case for those.

Loads of Americans buy and eat jack or colby cheese. Both American cheeses in origin. Both are sold in packets right next to cheddar and mozzarella.

Pretty much every American knows what pepper jack cheese is, and has likely eaten it before.

 

[Fritz]

As Europe has many member nations, if it does not apply, you can safely assume you are exempt.

??? I am German, we have them too, so do Spain (as we just heard), Italy, France, the Netherlands, Austria, Sweden and Denmark. I know since I have shopped at such in all these countries.

 

[Kill3r7]

he's arguing in the sense that processed foods were the main types of food available in america then. Is variety wrt focus on fresh, local stuff.

There is no denying that processed foods or takeout is how most of us were fed growing up. If both parents worked, you were lucky if one of them had time to prep dinner. That said, it is important to remember that this was not everyone's experience. Plenty of families ate food make from scratch and enjoyed a lot of variety even as far back as the 60s.

 

[sojour]

The white bread I had was yes, but that was 10 years ago since I was last there. The white bread is not like European white bread at all, it seemed to be loaves made of McDonalds hamburger bread, but slightly sweet.

If you think American bread is sweet, don't try Asian (I guess, Hong Kong style?) bakeries. It's all basically cake.

 

[Skellig Gra]

Loads of Americans buy and eat jack or colby cheese. Both American cheeses in origin. Both are sold in packets right next to cheddar and mozzarella.

Pretty much every American knows what pepper jack cheese is, and has likely eaten it before.

Provolone is another common one. Although not as common as the aforementioned.

 

[Futureman]

When I think America cheese, there are three types- the highly processed singles like Kraft or Cheddar or processed mozzerala. Finding a flavor outside of those three, that is accepted by the public at large, is hard. You have to go to the deli case for those.

it's hard to go to the deli case?

Trader Joe's is pretty common in the US and their cheese section has dozens of varieties.