Where did I say near optimal? I said "closer". Devs told us the same in the beginning iirc. Sony SDK was better than MS XDK.
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Digital Foundry: Microsoft gives more CPU power to Xbox One developers
- Thread starter ElTorro
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Where did I say near optimal? I said "closer". Devs told us the same in the beginning iirc. Sony SDK was better than MS XDK.
XGoldenboyX
Member
I work with plenty of programmers, and most comments I got is that PS4 is easier and more performant to work with !
Uh...Sony have given out quite a few SDK updates throughout last year. Maybe you just didn't hear about them?
Sony has a team dedicated to improving performance and working with third parties. ICE team or something like that. They've also been refining their low level ("close to the metal") drivers and API's or what have you while MS has only been talking theirs up ("close to the metal" coming soon with DX12!", while Sony has been fostering this heavily since the PS3 days and really strongly with the PS4) - which should be available on the X1 sometime later this year. In other words, on the console front, MS has been well behind for a long while.
I chalk it up to people not knowing the nuances of how these two companies have been working the past three or four years.
NickFire
Member
Only 2 days into the year we got our first. What's the over under line on how many official statements, "leaks" or DF / Polygon articles we will have in 2015, along the lines of MS either giving more power to devs, or their sdk updates making the One more powerful? I'd put that number at 8, and that is treating different articles on DF or Polygon covering the same topic as 1 article.
I think the performance advantages will get bigger. Yes the XB1's SDK was bad, but the specs are what they are. The reserves just made everything worse. Giving back developers GPU and CPU power doesn't change what we already knew since before the systems launched.
http://n4g.com/news/1626846/ps4-sdk...new-tech-and-features-game-developers-can-use
Improvements to the camera, CPU/GPU physics simulations and GPU compute. You just don't hear about them because the media doesn't treat every PS4 SDK update, or any news of PS4 improvements, as something big like do they do with XB1. Claiming stupid stuff about closing the gap or getting more powerful.
Heh. It's funny what people can perceive by this huh?
MeachTheMonster
Banned
This goes against conventional knowledge and Historical precident.
The "gap" has always gotten smaller as devs learn the hardware not larger.
And here you claim it can't get smaller due to fixed hardware, but then you claim it will get larger. How does that make sense? You just said the hardware is fixed.
http://n4g.com/news/1626846/ps4-sdk...new-tech-and-features-game-developers-can-use
The Sony SDK update was reported on in the same manner. It's focus was not primarily on performance, therefore the articles weren't about performance.
And this thread is about a leak from a hacker group. It has nothing to do with what Microsoft or Sony have/have not reported.
I think so too, devs will hit the ceiling on XBO before PS4 so whilst the gap will appear to close it'll only be a temp thing - then as these consoles get long in the tooth the gap will really stretch in PS4s favour.
Because of the MrXmedias of this world
NickFire
Member
As a Red Sox fan who has seen countless people leave Boston, only to be trashed in the press shortly after by "credible sources", "club house insiders", etc., I will never dismiss the possibility of controlled leaks. Not saying this happened, but when dealing with MS, I'm never surprised anymore.
Please give an example where lesser hardware closed a gap on stronger hardware...you think devs aren't going to 'learn' the PS4 or something!?
MeachTheMonster
Banned
For a guy who doesn't post here, his name sure is evoked a lot to justify the same type of idiocy he perpetuates.
His name should be a banned term IMO
MeachTheMonster
Banned
Simple. PS4's hardware is more powerful. Developers will get more out of it. But you knew you that already.
Which is my point about the way these are treated by the media.
I never said anything about MS.
MeachTheMonster
Banned
This doesn't make your logic make any more sense.
If "the gap can't close due to fixed hardware" is a valid statement
Then
"The gap can't widen due to fixed hardware" must be a valid statement as well.
They are treated as they are. The Sony SDK update was primarily about ShareFactory, Themes, YouTube and Share Play. So that's what people reported.
You implications of some concerted effort by the media to report these things differently, just isn't supported by facts
what are you talking about!? you need to be more specific than list a few console names
Think of it like cars, one accellerates faster than the other, but the other has a higher top speed - on a long race which car will win?
MeachTheMonster
Banned
Go read up on it.
You asked which weaker consoles closed performace gaps over the course of the gen. I provided you with the answer.
MeachTheMonster
Banned
Consoles are not cars. But to use your analogy, its not always the car with the most HP that wins the race.
no, you need to ellaborate, listing a few consoles means nothing
they are both engines with advantages and disadvantages - the bottom line is that XBO will hit a ceiling before PS4.
MeachTheMonster
Banned
360 was more powerful than PS3
PS3 lessened the perfromance gap as the gen went on
Same for Wii, PS2, ect
Lone Wolf
Member
I have no idea if you are correct or not, but how did you come to this conclusion?
wrong
MeachTheMonster
Banned
Devs will NEVER hit a "ceiling" with hardware. There's always more optimization and advanced techniques to be found out if resources permit.
The ICE team exists and you can follow Cort (postgoodism on Twitter) to sometimes get some interesting info.
They needed the team because PS3 would have had way worse multiplats than it still had in comparison to 360.
By saying this 360 delivered a very good low level api for 360, along with a very much praised debugger, called PIX.
With the XDK for Xbox One, MS was behind by quite a good amount but you can read how much they improved in the leaked docs by changing to the mono low-level driver for Xbox One and by improving the libs month by month.
But I chalk it up to you not knowing the nuances of how MS has been working for the past year.
MeachTheMonster
Banned
PS4 has more 'resources/power/etc' so it's natural to think XBO will be restricted sooner than PS4, as the games released already show...but as these consoles get more 'long in the tooth' the PS4 has more chance of keeping up.
so why bring out PS4?
It's not the truth as all, PS3 had a monster CPU but lesser GPU but ovall was more powerful - any devs who had issues would be because they didn't get to grips with cell.
WRT Witcher 2 - you means devs hit a ceiling? I thought they didn't do that!?
MeachTheMonster
Banned
That's the "resources" part
At a certain point, stronger hardware makes it cheaper and easier to make performance gains.
MeachTheMonster
Banned
No. Not by any stretch of the imagination was the PS3 more powerful overall.
They hit the resource "ceiling" in order to get acceptable performance they would have had to use more resources than would have been worth it.
Are you being thick?????
Both hardware are fixed yes. But the PS4 has a large GPU advantage. You can get more performance out of the PS4. You're reading what i said the wrong way. On purpose i think.
If you don't see how these SDK and tool updates are being blown out of proportion. I don't know what to tell you.
Handy Fake
Member
You're getting yourself tied in knots here, mind.
Lol, what?
You console gamers really do take this "optimizationz!" thing way too far sometimes.
Matt has even told us MS has been doing a really good job improving their stuff. While Sony hasn't.
Edit: I was incorrect about his statements regarding Sony.
Handy Fake
Member
When was his last post on the subject?
I'm not trying to get embroiled in the argument, I'm genuinely curious.
Don't bother man. Just look at his post history.
Quick glance:
- The Order is more like an interactive movie amirite
- MS release date parity is justified
- Traded in my PS3, no regrets!
- Gap continues to shrink
- PS3/360 gap was bigger than PS4/X1
- Nobody is buying consoles for indie games
- PS4 users just want to feel better when they say the hardware is superior
- VR won't be as successful as Kinect
- Lists like every Xbone exclusive in the "Have you found your "This Is Next Gen" game yet?" thread
Funny as shit. And before you ask, yes, I'm bored.
orthodoxy1095
Banned
Dammit Bish. I had just subscribed to this thread.
Not necessarily funny but MS continuing their campaign to try and play the power game vs the PS4 gets old and has been old. The PS4 is and will continue to be the most powerful this gen and aside from a completely rebuilt Xbox that won't change no matter how much they tinker with the Xbox One. It's simply beating a dead horse at this point and articles like this assume Sony won't or couldn't follow suit negating any gains made here. I'm sure as the tools continue mature and dev's gain familiarity with both platforms that both consoles will improve and be better than they are now.
qa_engineer
Member
I just went through his post history while stuffing my face with a sammich at my desk. Surprised he lasted so long.
He wasn't be argumentative either, wasn't even down on Sony. Let me find his post.
http://m.neogaf.com/showpost.php?p=145248370
Handy Fake
Member
Ah nice one mate, cheers. I enjoy Matt's posts. Yeah there's not a great deal in that, and it's hardly surprising that MS are pulling out all the stops at the minute.
I could care less about this argument, but I hate lies. MS has "team dedicated to improving performance and working with third parties". Working closing with developers and third parties is basically their entire business model. Has been since the original XBox. And they don't tie their console developers to DirectX API's either (i.e. you can already use the things exposed by DirectX12 on the XBoxOne today). Stop spewing Sony PR.
Ugh. Your kind of proving that you don't know anything about technology by saying this sort of thing.
PS3 and 360 had advantages and disadvantages for each, with many of the 360's strengths serving it well in general development, hence multiplatform superiority. But PS3 had a higher potential ceiling in terms of actual power when devs coded for its strengths.
Wii never bridged any gap with 360 so i don't know what that even means.
Neither did PS2 to Xbox.
Its even more the case this gen. Both consoles have the exact same parts, the PS4 just has stronger versions(outside of the CPU) and easier to use for development. There's nothing in software that can bridge a hardware difference, if there was, the GPU manufacturers would have gone out of business by now because then, who needs a new GPU?
Even if you want to say that better drivers gives you better performance in games with the same GPU, its the same for an even more powerful GPU.