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[snap]

Shocked so many people are saying they gained.

We went from a GOP whose politicians were willing to defend Trumpers, give a stage to the alt-right and quietly push towards extremism as if it was nothing to one where its leaders condemn Nazism and White Supremacy, where Trump not lambasting the KKK put him under immense pressure, to the point where he folded.

Compare that to during the campaign when he refused to condemn David Duke, and then used lies to defend the fact that he didn't condemn that man.

I was stuck watching a lot of CNN this weekend, and in general they've now reframed the alt right to just be white supremacists, as CNN should've always done.

 

[Cat Party]

Loss.

None of this is new. These are not new ideas. America has been dealing with some version of this for awhile. Hell, just re-watch American History X. Of course, back in those days (and earlier) organizers had to be public. In the internet days, all dark holes are connected.

The incident over the weekend just reminded everyone that these guys do still exist as they scampered out of the filth they hid in and that they do pose a threat to american democracy.

I agree. Harder for so called moderates to deny they exist and are a problem.

They also showed the true face of white supremacy in this country.

 

[Ithil]

That's what I would do if I was a nazi.

Here's the problem with that goon's "plan", he is greatly overestimating the intelligence and age of his fellow /pol/ posters. The type of people making up this new alt-right supremacists are far too stupid and warped to be covert and dogwhistle.

They think in "memes" and idiotic internet slang, they learn everything about the real world through the lens of sites like 4chan or the_donald. They can only be overtly hostile and dangerous, loud and simple minded. They aren't interested in "long term plans", they want easy ego boosting perceived "wins" against libruls. It's only a sports game to them.

They aren't capable of the kind of careful, hidden racism and supremacism the GOP have practiced for many, many years.

 

[The Shadow]

Shocked so many people are saying they gained.

We went from a GOP whose politicians were willing to defend Trumpers, give a stage to the alt-right and quietly push towards extremism as if it was nothing to one where its leaders condemn Nazism and White Supremacy, where Trump not lambasting the KKK put him under immense pressure, to the point where he folded.

Compare that to during the campaign when he refused to condemn David Duke, and then used lies to defend the fact that he didn't condemn that man.

I was stuck watching a lot of CNN this weekend, and in general they've now reframed the alt right to just be white supremacists, as CNN should've always done.

There's a lot of defeatist on this board. Like, a lot. Everything is viewed with a negative filter, IE "It's all over".

But yeah, I agree. It's definitely a net negative for the alt-right. There's no in-fighting with a victory, like you see in alt-right groups now. The best measure is how Fox News reports on Trump, and even they seemed to be pointing out Trump's lack of response.

 

[televator]

Normies:
"Privilege is a buzzword."
"Both sides are annoying."
"I say all lives matter so how could I possibly be racist?"
"I stand for actual, really real, super legit equality; and against actual, really real, super legit racism."

It is a conscious strategy to subvert and highjack their way into political power.

 

[GodofWine]

The only thing they gained from widespread attention, mostly bad.

But they probably won't be reduced in numbers, and may grow from it.

Though, all the ones identified from pics sure seem to 'not want to be a nazi' anymore. So expect more hoods again, sigh.

 

[Acyl]

A bit of both,

Gain because there's no bad publicity so getting attention is exactly what they want, and regardless of the outcome they spin any attention as good.

Lost because they push away people who are in the middle with these psycho situations.

Regardless, someone freeze me and wake me up in 500 years when there's no white people and we are all the same skin color because fuck this. To that end, do your part! Date people from other cultures as often as you can and homogenize this damn planet.

 

[legacyzero]

Seems they're working on planning rallies in Boston and San Fran.

If they wanna try that shit in highly liberal territories, be my guest. More slobber-knocker footage for me to enjoy.

 

[SoundofSilence]

Overall, they gained nothing and lost any legitimacy they thought they had.

One big win for them though:

Trump still refused to label them terrorists. In Trump's worldview, only muslims are terrorists.

 

[Kai Dracon]

They're planning more rallies, but if they're now seen as a credible threat to life they're inviting real action taken against them.

Many of these people don't seem to realize how thin the ice is they're standing on. Maybe it's because so many of them come from a bubble of internet-driven fantasy. But if they keep showing up with shields and crowbars looking for people to beat up, they are going to open doors even they wish had stayed closed.

 

[Shaanyboi]

They were always there, and always had their goals in mind. They just got called out. The people silently approving or defending this shit were always going to do so, and will continue to do so. They just know they can't be as obvious about it. But their goals remain as real as ever.

 

[minor effort]

Seems they're working on planning rallies in Boston and San Fran.

If they wanna try that shit in highly liberal territories, be my guest. More slobber-knocker footage for me to enjoy.

A counter-demonstrator was murdered and another was savagely beaten by a gang of these nazis.

Watching them occasionally get some impromptu dental work makes for good viewing, but don't underestimate the stakes of nazis showing up in numbers.

It's good that people unafraid to punch back are showing up to resist, but nazis easily have the edge in horrifying brutality.

 

[Valhelm]

Your "power level"?

Is this common parlance in the alt-right community? If so, what does that even mean?

It means how radical somebody is. People use it in alt-right and far left online spaces. It's originally a Dragonball Z reference I guess.

 

[tearsintherain]

They were gaining ("these guys are a bit weird but not so bad") until that one guy decided to drive his car into a crowd and killed someone, then they lost big time.

 

[VariantX]

They gained public support from the white house, but that's about it. They were always there, festering in the shadows before, but always there. They lost a good bit of their ability to hide their hate behind bullshit. They gained attention, but they also gained attention and energized people against them. If there are folks still saying both sides, its because they don't want to admit they have some extremely shitty people who hold abhorrent views in their ranks and want to paint both sides as the same thing so they can feel better about where and who they stand with instead of doing the real hard work of cleaning their own fucking house. I expect all these meetings to eventually get changed to Trump rallies so they can have that plausible deniability they crave so much.

 

[Abstrusity]

No, they lost. They might feel like they won, so this might still keep happening, but they definitely lost. They're emboldened regardless.

 

[JustenP88]

It's good for short term morale as the president has shown that he is one of them.

Bad long term because, much like alt-right nerds, this ideology can't thrive when exposed to the sun. There's a treasure trove of disgusting shit on the internet that the media could bring to light that might make every quiet white dude who spends all his free time jerking off and playing video games behind closed doors get permanent side eyes. I genuinely believe there's a bunch of old, naive morons out there who think the left is just throwing out "Nazi" and "white supremacist" as flailing insults. Too bad the internet keeps receipts.

Am I a piece of shit for thinking a prominent news/media figure reading excerpts from the Daily Stormer 'article' about Heather Heyer while a picture of that little weeaboo punk in a "Make America Great Again" hat is displayed prominently on screen would be powerful and poignant? It reads like something ISIS would put out after killing people from the west. An ISIS press release mocking victims following an attack would absolutely get press coverage. Why should this be different? I know that's a real touchy road to go down, but I'm looking around today and I really don't feel like the country felt the impact of what happened this past weekend.

Imagine, someone from ISIS releasing some shit like that alongside a picture of him in an "Obama '08" hat. Absolute insanity would ensue.

Bin Laden wouldn't have been able to walk down any street in America post-2001 for more than 30 seconds without being recognized and swarmed. Names, faces, slogans, symbols. Once the average American recognizes these on sight and sound, I don't think the extremists will have any choice but to scatter back to their holes. Pressure will mount more and more for the President to dissociate from the base that got him the Republican nomination. Something will have to give.

 

[And_Gignac]

The Neo Nazi / Alt Right fantasy for future political power lies on the myth that most white people will sooner or later join their cause when they get enough of being "oppressed" by liberals / leftists / minorities.


This weekends event destroyed that notion. No one, outside of 4chan trolls, is standing up for the supremacists. They have finally isolated themselves.

 

[Nafai1123]

A counter-demonstrator was murdered and another was savagely beaten by a gang of these nazis.

Watching them occasionally get some impromptu dental work makes for good viewing, but don't underestimate the stakes of nazis showing up in numbers.

It's good that people unafraid to punch back are showing up to resist, but nazis easily have the edge in horrifying brutality.

Which is why we need to show them that they don't. We have the numbers to overpower them, we can put the fear into them. Show up en-mass? Get beat the fuck down.

 

[Con_Smith]

Meh I disagree. Nazis and racists have already known that what they say is socially unacceptable. They knew the shit storm they were getting themselves into. All they did was show to all of the undercover racists at home that there is a physical movement of people and that they are not alone. It emboldened the people that were on the fence. It also allowed all of these different groups to meet together and expand their networking. They are getting fairly organized and more militia like with a growing stockpile of weapons. These people are already insane, think they are being marginalized, and are ready for violence. Imagine how much more crazy they are going to get after they've lost their jobs and their webpages are being taken down.

Overall, Charlottesville has shown that they make up less than .001% of the population and it likely isnt going to rise significantly anytime soon. However, just because a movement isn't going to gain enough traction to become a political influence. Doesn't mean that the alt-Reality isn't estranged, capable and willing to commit domestic terrorism and extreme violence. An Alt-Reality group already overthrew and occupied a government facility for over a month earlier this year. There are also way too many both sides idiots that are now both siding Nazism.


So yes Nazism lost traction of Charlottesville and it's evident this one want have a Tea Party surge like in 2010. However, I think it gained traction in proving that they are a real movement that needs to be taken seriously and they will provoke future conflicts.

While I agree for the most part with your assessment, I think people are discounting the growing unrest and just weighing the benefit of the racists. PoC are getting more motivated and just in the last few days we've seen a surge in more public push back and organization against these idiots.

Did they get a chance to get their message out and show they are a force, no matter how negative the depiction is? Yes they did. Did they also light more fire under the asses of the disenfranchised? Well if the remarks from Boston and the work in Durham is any indication yeah. We can't keep putting all our attention on these fucks just like we can't just pay attention to the WWC. Their deeds may embolden their cause but it's not as if it isn't doing the same for people who are growing sick of the fuck shit.

 

[mas8705]

Would have been seen as both sides bickering as what has happened had it not been for the one guy who ran over a bunch of anti-protesters with his car and killed one.

That basically set off the keg and has now led to where we are now where the tactic isn't to glorify them (to some anyway), but to expose them and have them get taken down through alternative methods like what we have seen up to this point from Godaddy to others losing their jobs.

The only way I can say that they have "gained" anything is how you have the other side deciding to go tearing down statues and stomping on them as if to say that "We will stomp out White Supremacy!" This isn't to say that a statue has more value than a life (far from it), but when you literally have violent actions being met with violent actions, we just reach a stalemate where both sides are basically intolerable in their own right if one apparently murders while the other vandalizes.

Overall though, I'll say loss. It takes one person to ruin everything, and that was exactly what happened. Otherwise if the assault with a car didn't happened, it would have been just both sides getting into yet another argument and nothing getting accomplished until the next time we would repeat this song and dance.

 

[minor effort]

Which is why we need to show them that they don't. We have the numbers to overpower them, we can put the fear into them. Show up en-mass? Get beat the fuck down.

And that's good, but cities need to also get more proactive about making sure nazi rallies never get approval in the first place. These people mean violence. I was referring more to the passive "hey let them show up wherever and get hit" stance.

Putting the fear in them is necessary and good, but nazis will always have the edge in dehumanizing others. It's something to keep in mind.

 

[Brinbe]

They've always been there, but now they've proven brave enough to climb outta their gutters. I say its better that they make themselves known, because they'll be shown that the majority have no tolerance for their hateful bullshit.

What happened to that march organizer the other day is what needs to happen to all of them. Send them running scared.

 

[blakep267]

Overall loss. They could've maybe spun it and not been condemned from everybody but the death of Heyer made them universally be condemned. So it's a loss

 

[funkystudent]

I just wonder what the moderate Trump voter who just wanted to have a protest vote and give the middle finger to Clinton think of it all

 

[Skyball Paint]

Whatever they gained from the attention, it's currently impossible to quantify.

What's plain as day, is that they failed to stop the removal of Confederate monuments.

It means how radical somebody is. People use it in alt-right and far left online spaces. It's originally a Dragonball Z reference I guess.

Used to simply refer to hiding one's nerdiness, looks like it's been Pepe'd.

 

[Imm0rt4l]

I want to say lost, but I see a lot of moderates/liberals who are still on that "both sides suck" bullshit. Galvanized the left though.

 

[Nafai1123]

And that's good, but cities need to also get more proactive about making sure nazi rallies never get approval in the first place. These people mean violence. I was referring more to the passive "hey let them show up wherever and get hit" stance.

Putting the fear in them is necessary and good, but nazis will always have the edge in dehumanizing others. It's something to keep in mind.

Yeah I don't disagree. There needs to be movement on all fronts to squash these Nazi's. Ban them from the major social media outlets to force them back into the depths of the internet where they'll have trouble recruiting. Out them as Nazis and get them fired from their jobs. Prevent them from organizing en-mass by any means necessary, and in those cases where they manage to, strike such fear into them that they question whether to do it again. There is no single answer to the question. Everything must be done to reject these pieces of shit from our society in every way possible.

 

[JustenP88]

I want to say lost, but I see a lot of moderates/liberals who are still on that "both sides suck" bullshit. Galvanized the left though.

As evidenced a couple posts above you. "Was totally both sides until someone died, now the Right looks bad"

Fuck that trash

"Now people are tearing down statues and making the Nazis mad so that's bad"

Fuck that trash too. Mealy mouthed mother fuckers don't get to claim moral high ground. This isn't some shit you can fence-sit on.

 

[Shoeless]

I think it's safe to say this is a loss in the long term. They martyred someone, and that someone was also white. No moderate is going to be able to approve that publicly, even if privately they agree with her death. If they'd been thinking politically, they death of a supremacist would have gained them sympathy, but instead there are videos now of people saying "It's justified she died, she couldn't get out of the way, and I'm ready to kill people."

There's just no way an "indecisive moderate" can actually say "Well, maybe they're not so bad," when stuff like that comes out. They have to pick a side.

 

[Deleted member 17706]

I think it was a big loss. They really showed their asses to the world, managed to kill a couple of people, and I think all of that really disgusted most people. We'll see.

I'm sure they are galvanized now that more of the world knows about them and hates them, but I don't see this leading to a dramatic increase in people relating with their views.

 

[StarVigil]

There are no winners in this. It's good that people distance themselves from the alt right. But it's disheartening that this is even happening in 2017. People died. And your president is only thinking about his ratings on tv.
To quote machines with more heart than those racists: This cannot continue.

 

[Not]

Too early to tell.

 

[Jag]

There are no winners in this. It's good that people distance themselves from the alt right. But it's disheartening that this is even happening in 2017..

I agree, but these people are out there. In greater numbers than people may have realized AND they are motivated enough to physically act. They are organized and dangerous. They have been exposed and people should wake up to the danger they pose.

 

[Morrigan Stark]

http://www.clickhole.com/blogpost/my...ist-viole-6489

Goddamn I love this.

 

[QuantumZebra]

There was a lot of worrying about the Nazi march and Trump's failure to condemn them plus of course the murder but now we're seeing story after story of people and companies all over the US moving against the Nazis.

Do you think the march or the backlash had the bigger effect in the end?

I'm on the "they lost" side, they shocked the nation but only made it vigilant. Like a vaccination with small doses of the pathogen.

The backlash.

We've been in this almost drunken stupor since Trump won... Reality has become so fucked up and weird that a rational, level-headed person (like I view myself to be, lol) would not be wrong in wondering if that "we're in a simulation" theory is true and the computer is going haywire.

I know that the South Park creators copped out of criticizing Trump, but they weren't wrong in saying reality is too messed up to parody now. It's literally insane what is happening in our government and with shit worldwide (NK, Brexit, Syria, Russia, etc.).

I think seeing a bunch of legit neo-Nazis goose-stepping around and showing off flipped a switch in people's heads and reminded them that this is real life. We have a bunch of psychos running around feeling empowered cause their oompa loompa has all but said its great to be a bigot, and the backlash is started to pick up snow, soon to be an avalanche.

 

[MogCakes]

I mean you can try to play the subversion game and think nobody of consequence can counter you, but these guys are in for a rude awakening called the internet

 

[Gutek]

They committed an act of terrorism.

Not really sure how that can be considered a win without some serious mental gymnastics.

Well, actually it was Obama that committed an act of terrorism.

http://m.neogaf.com/showthread.php?t=1419824

 

[Deleted member 125677]

Nazism is a dead, moronic and completely impotent ideology. It's a cry for help, an ideology of and for losers, and as such in a perpetual state of neverending losing.

Sadly, that is exactly what makes it - and other terrorist ideologies - so dangerous.

 

[capitalCORN]

Nazism is a dead, moronic and completely impotent ideology. It's a cry for help, an ideology of and for losers, and as such in a perpetual state of neverending losing.

Sadly, that is exactly what makes it - and other terrorist ideologies - so dangerous.

Nazism views comformity and complicity not as loyalty, but as a contemptuous weakness. Every level of fascism looks down on the one below it.

 

[Steeped in a Sea of Games]

Everyone seems to be labeling Trump as a white supremacist sympathizer, so I say that's progress in a positive direction.

 

[Lubricus]

The Daily Storm is moving to the dark web. I imagine they will lose some readers since you will need the Tor browser (or Orbot on Android) to access the site.

Supporters of Daily Stormer took to Twitter on Tuesday to tell people they could gain access to the website on the Dark Web, a portion of the Internet that is not indexed by popular search engines. It can only be seen with a special browser, which hides the identity and location of the users.

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-virginia-protests-idUSKCN1AV0WT?il=0

 

[yanipheonu]

It's certainly not an unqualified success.

Frankly it seems like they lost more than they gained. There seems a paradigm shift in open anger and disdain of their viewpoints. Not to mention the expedited destruction of the statues.

Though with most historical events, it'll take time to really see what the outcome will be. Could be the "step too far" that begins a downward trend for the Alt Right, could be the first step in a longer conflict. No one knows at the moment.

 

[Nafai1123]

The Daily Storm is moving to the dark web. I imagine they will lose some readers since you will need the Tor browser (or Orbot on Android) to access the site.



http://www.reuters.com/article/us-virginia-protests-idUSKCN1AV0WT?il=0

Good, this is exactly what we should be doing to any and all Nazi supporting outlets on the internet. Drive them into the darkness so they can't recruit as easily.

 

[Slayven]

The Daily Storm is moving to the dark web. I imagine they will lose some readers since you will need the Tor browser (or Orbot on Android) to access the site.



http://www.reuters.com/article/us-virginia-protests-idUSKCN1AV0WT?il=0

That is going to kill their viewer numbers

 

[Vicetrailia]

The left showed that it's willing to tango in the face of violence. When things get real they respond. We saw a large supremacist crowd (etching towards maxing out), but it pales in comparison to what the left can accomplish. Not looking good for Nazis even though they have the white house at face value. Everyone else will get tired of them including local governments, the police and moderates.

 

[Raven117]

I agree. Harder for so called moderates to deny they exist and are a problem.

They also showed the true face of white supremacy in this country.

Exactly. This wasn't some dark corner of the internet...this was downtown Anywhere, U.S.A. The average american (hell, even the vast majority of Americans) are not going to stand for Neo-Nazi's parading down main street with a swastika flag. (Even an average Republican).

 

[Frost Walrus]

In the short term, I'd say they lost.

In the long term, I'm a bit more skeptical. Just how many Americans are willing to stand by Nazism?

 

[Acorn]

Lost by far. I don't know how this is a question, the mainstream is now aware that these fucks exist and in a significant number so no more denial.

 

[capitalCORN]

They gained a reputation for murder, and lost their stance as simply an ideology.