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Dota 2 Beta Thread 2: Real Talk Discouraged [Magnus, Teams, 6.75b, 150+ Shop Items]
- Thread starter Artanisix
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CornBurrito
Member
He's just really hard to play and needs a great early AND mid game to be effective. Needs item/level advantage as well, at least that's how I always see him. If he has that he's great, if not he doesn't offer that much anymore besides initiation.
I'm 6-0 with Storm spirit, at least in pubs i find him at his best when there's some good offensive warding: you can just ball in, pick off someone in the jungle and get the hell out.
As for skillbuild there's the pretty standard from lv1 to lv5 remnant, overload and three points of vortex, this works because with three points on vortex you're guaranteed to pull them on the remnant, then you can either max out remnant or overload. You can also do a max remnant first with only a point on vortex but you should do it only if you're extremely confident in your skill because you have to drop it directly on them after the ball.
It's very important that you sneak in a single autoattack after every skill to get the overload bonus damage.
Itembuilds it really varies, if you have a good early game you can rush bloodstone (get arcane and disassemble) which is my favourite build, bkb if there's lots of disables in the other teams. If they have stuff that go through bkb like Beastmaster's roar linken's might be a better choice also because the most important thing to get on Storm is mana regen so you want to get at least Sheep/Orchid every game.
As for skillbuild there's the pretty standard from lv1 to lv5 remnant, overload and three points of vortex, this works because with three points on vortex you're guaranteed to pull them on the remnant, then you can either max out remnant or overload. You can also do a max remnant first with only a point on vortex but you should do it only if you're extremely confident in your skill because you have to drop it directly on them after the ball.
It's very important that you sneak in a single autoattack after every skill to get the overload bonus damage.
Itembuilds it really varies, if you have a good early game you can rush bloodstone (get arcane and disassemble) which is my favourite build, bkb if there's lots of disables in the other teams. If they have stuff that go through bkb like Beastmaster's roar linken's might be a better choice also because the most important thing to get on Storm is mana regen so you want to get at least Sheep/Orchid every game.
Bjern Fita
Member
OK GAf,
does someone have the patience to explain to me (as I must be slow or something) why the fuck it is so unintuitive to buy goddamn items in this game?
And why there's not enough coaching/teaching to explain it? Is all QA focused on balance right now?
I want to buy something, and sometimes right-click will buy it, and sometimes right click puts in in my stash. I assume dropping it from the stash gives my money back but no, suddenly I've wasted all my money. I specifically set up my hot-key to take stash but that does nothing.
I know i must be doing something really fucking dumb to cock up the game like this, but for fucks sake, LoL was so easy to buy stuff...
Thanks in advance to the kind soul who can help me with this.
Cheers
(auto purchase is set to off)
does someone have the patience to explain to me (as I must be slow or something) why the fuck it is so unintuitive to buy goddamn items in this game?
And why there's not enough coaching/teaching to explain it? Is all QA focused on balance right now?
I want to buy something, and sometimes right-click will buy it, and sometimes right click puts in in my stash. I assume dropping it from the stash gives my money back but no, suddenly I've wasted all my money. I specifically set up my hot-key to take stash but that does nothing.
I know i must be doing something really fucking dumb to cock up the game like this, but for fucks sake, LoL was so easy to buy stuff...
Thanks in advance to the kind soul who can help me with this.
Cheers
(auto purchase is set to off)
...it's not really that hard..
If it's in your stash get the courier to bring it to you. How does dropping it from your stash waste money? Do you just leave it on the ground without selling it? Because if so, right click > sell.
I don't see what the problem is, do you have 6 items all the time and don't have any free slots or something?
Your item will go in your stash if you aren't at the shop. If you are at the shop, then it is immediately placed in your inventory (if you have the space). When you buy items out of range of the shop, use the courier to deliver them to you.
Oh, also if you sell an item back within 10 seconds of purchase, then you get your full money back. Any longer and you get the sell price, which is much less.
Oh, also if you sell an item back within 10 seconds of purchase, then you get your full money back. Any longer and you get the sell price, which is much less.
I H8 Memes
Member
Right click to buy. If it went into your stash then either your inventory was already full, or you were not close enough to the shop to buy. When you go back to the shop by the fountain the stash will have a "grab all" option under it. You can either grab all or just the items you wnat from the stash.
The shops in the other areas of the map wont usually allow you to buy things that go right into your inventory. Some things like town portal scrolls are an exception.
Bjern Fita
Member
does shopping at the secret stash change anything? When you mention the courier it's assuming the team has one correct? It must be purchased?
If I turn on auto buy does that mean the items i right click while in lane will be bought once I'm back in range of a shop? Do i have to activate the shop to auto-buy them?
thanks again
Does selling an item recoup the full cost of it?
Would all of this have been explained to me if I wasn't dumb enough to click the initial 'yes I've played some MOBAs (LoL to 30) before'? Think maybe it's time for me to actually contribute to a beta and give some feedback.
(my inventory is not full)
If I turn on auto buy does that mean the items i right click while in lane will be bought once I'm back in range of a shop? Do i have to activate the shop to auto-buy them?
thanks again
Does selling an item recoup the full cost of it?
Would all of this have been explained to me if I wasn't dumb enough to click the initial 'yes I've played some MOBAs (LoL to 30) before'? Think maybe it's time for me to actually contribute to a beta and give some feedback.
(my inventory is not full)
what's this? /me goes to joindota!!
botolf, conceptor let's do this! we can represent CANADA!
secret shop and side shop have different items than the main shop. if you use the main shop window, and you buy something, if it has the parts in the side/secret it'll pick it up. since you are new, i would suggest just clicking on the shop keeper and seeing what he has that way so you dont buy things to the wrong place
no idea what auto buy does
selling an item within the first few seconds of having it recoups the cost fully, which can be used to correct accidental purchases. otherwise, items resell for half their value, outside of a few items that you dont really need to worry about (divine rapier, half used tangos)
on another note, i'm sure they will add tutorials later, but at this time just remember its a beta, and mess around with bots until you grasp these basic mechanics
To my knowledge, no there is no tutorial so there isn't any instructions for this.
I'm not familiar with auto-buy unless you mean dragging items into the little box on the bottom right corner. If that's the case, you still have to right click them to purchase but when you have the funds for an item it will be highlighted and you'll receive an audio cue. These items will be put into your stash if you're in line to be retrieved by the courier.
And yes, the courier needs to be bought every game. Someone should always buy a courier - preferably the support but if you're in the low skill bracket it'll probably be up to you to do so.
Selling an item within... like ten seconds of purchase will refund it. Otherwise, you get less value from selling an item.
The secret shop carries items that are not available anywhere else. They are needed for the more powerful items and in order to buy from there you must be within range (or the courier must be). If you're not and you try to make a purchase, the game will remind you where the shops are by pinging the map.
Sell price is 50% for normal items, 70% for recipes. I think there is also a stipulation where you can't sell back the Gem of True Sight.
Bjern Fita
Member
Cheers for the info, I assumed it was balance/technical testing now as in my opinion as a moderately intelligent who has played an other MOBA to a reasonable level; this game is fucking inpenetrable...
At least I've just been subjecting others to my shitty skills in bot games. Could very well be that this just isn't for me too.
It just shits me right off that after reading up on guides/new-comer info, I still can't function in a game properly. I guess if there's a beta you could assume there's a high level of experience in it's DOTA (but then why the hell did you give me one Valve? You already know my PC is good enough to play it, and you're not even making it easy to give feedback that I think this game is too poop-socky, even at newbie levels...)
Thanks again for trying to help, see you in a year!
At least I've just been subjecting others to my shitty skills in bot games. Could very well be that this just isn't for me too.
It just shits me right off that after reading up on guides/new-comer info, I still can't function in a game properly. I guess if there's a beta you could assume there's a high level of experience in it's DOTA (but then why the hell did you give me one Valve? You already know my PC is good enough to play it, and you're not even making it easy to give feedback that I think this game is too poop-socky, even at newbie levels...)
Thanks again for trying to help, see you in a year!
Gully State
Member
I hate being able to buy items when you're dead but not being able to sell. Sometimes I make a mistake and buy the wrong item but can't sell it back. Ideally they should allow you to both buy/sell when dead or neither at all..
Don't turn on Auto Buy, it doesn't really work well. It will literary buy all your items for you automatically, and you won't have any input.
There are three type of shops. The main shop, which contains most of the normal items. The Secret Shop, which contains items you can't get in the normal shop. And the Side shop, which has a limited selection of items.
When you buy an item within range of the shop, it will go into your inventory. If you buy it away from the shop, it will go to the stash (This allows buying items away from the base). You can use an Animal Courier to move items around.
For the secret shop items though, you must have a unit in the shop range to buy them, and the items won't be transferred to your stash if you don't have room for them. You can ether go there in person, or send the courier.
You do not start with a courier, but one can be bought for the team for 150 gold. It is highly recommended that someone on the team gets one right at the start. At any point in the game, someone can pay 220 gold to upgrade the courier so it can fly.
If you buy an item by mistake, you can resell it within 10 seconds to get your money back. Normally, items resell for 50% of their value (Recipes resell for 70%, but this doesn't come up too much)
I H8 Memes
Member
Courier and side shops are important for 2 reasons. First, no need to wait until you die to buy a valuable item, and second, when you die you lose a considerable amount of gold. If you have already bought the item then it will still be in the stash, with the courier, or in your inventory.
There are rare items that are lost or dropped when you die even if they are in your inventory. Like the divine rapier.
There are rare items that are lost or dropped when you die even if they are in your inventory. Like the divine rapier.
Just to note, "Considerable amount of gold" is your level * 30.
The two you will drop upon death are divine rapier, and Gem of True Sight (Unlike LoL, where you just loose the buff, you drop the item that causes the true sight, and it can be picked up by anther player or destroyed)
The two you will drop upon death are divine rapier, and Gem of True Sight (Unlike LoL, where you just loose the buff, you drop the item that causes the true sight, and it can be picked up by anther player or destroyed)
I H8 Memes
Member
What does this mean? Is that your level multiplied by 30? Like if you are level 4 you would lose 120 gold?
I wondered how Tobi and co-casters were able to determine if a player had enough money for a buy back.
Expected both of those, they are both consistent and stable teams. (orange a bit less consistent mainly because they still compete in dota 1 as well)
I would expect CLG and coL over many other teams as well, since they have had stable rosters and good performances.
This pretty much sums it up. Though isn't half of mtw the old Virus? Maybe that'll improve their chances.
Just remember he is mainly a ganker, he is a pretty crappy carry.
The game tells you
The amount needed to buyback is displayed in the box now.
The amount to buy back is 100+Level*Level*1.5+GameTimeInseconds/4, and is displayed in the box.
Now, how much money you will lose on death is not shown in the box. It is your unreliable gold - 30*level. If you have more reliable gold then buy back, your good. If not, you are going to need to know how much unreliable gold you need stocked up.
Yeah, I knew it displayed the cost for buyback, but I didn't think it included the gold you'd lose from death. But they seemed to be able to calculate it pretty quickly while casting.
wakajawaka
Member
omg I didn't know that you could get 100% the gold if you sell quickly... awesome!
This would be really stupid. If selling while dead was possible, I'd just buy the most expensive item possible before dying and then sell it back after I died, losing no gold.
Gully State
Member
Which is why I said that they should get rid of store transactions completely rather than being able to do one but not the other...
So I shouldn't be able to use the courier to buy something for me at the secret shop while I'm dead because you can't buy the right items, makes sense.
Um the hell are you on? You have 10 seconds to sell an item to get a full refund or you sell for 50%.
The_Player
Member
If he had ability to sell things while being dead, he would just sell stuff within 10 seconds after death, losing pretty much nothing.
Makes no sense still. You're not one gold richer nor poorer.
You're supposed to be poorer when you die.
It'd be cool if people mentioned THAT first.
It would provide a stupidly simple method for players to insure 90% of their unreliable gold, and completely agnostic of whatever they're building.
About to die? Flip the shop open and buy as many clean increment items as quickly as you can to drain your bank account. 500~ = Bracer, 1k = Ogre Club, 2k~ = Ultimate Orb, and so on. Would only take seconds, and would thoroughly break the reliable/unreliable gold system. Sure, you lose some time on the map to gain experience, but would you honestly care all that much when fleeing into those trees for a few seconds gives you enough time to save nigh all of your gold?
Gully State
Member
I believe it's the US East servers...I unchecked it for mm and went solely US West...Everything works now..
close to the edge
Member
He's really hard. On the other hand, he's so fun to play. If you get a fast Bloodstone with a few charges, you're pretty much set for the rest of the game. He's similar to Tinker in that he needs an almost flawless first 10-15 minutes or he'll have a really hard time. (with Storm it's a little longer because he doesn't just need BoTs and Soul Ring to be effective but either a Bloodstone or Orchid or something like that) Depending on the enemies, you can go for a BKB or a Linken's afterwards. I see him played as an initiator in a lot of pro games, but I'm really bad at that. You need to be able to judge when to jump in and on who.. I like him more as a ganker, picking of single enemies is fairly easy with him.
Golden Sun
Neo Member
just had a game as lycan where they warded 4/5 of the camps and would not leave the jungle 
is there anything I can even do about that
is there anything I can even do about thatjust had a game as lycan where they warded 4/5 of the camps and would not leave the jungle
Lane. Lycan is strong anywhere, jungle just lets him get his bkb+necro quicker. (Bonus is they've wasted 400 gold on wards that now do nothing.)
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