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Dota 2 Beta Thread 4: Even Mike Ross Plays [Elder Titan]

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Übermatik;54044331 said:
Cheers. I just need to know whether we were all idiots and it was just a bad night, or if it's likely we were smurfed and they were a 5 stack.
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I just watched the mid match up and I can probably infer about the rest of the game. This is what getting outplayed is like.

The zues had a bad skill build as well.

Also you should have got bottle before boots, and then arcane boots.

Final thoughts on mid match up: You just have him 100% rune control because you don't know how to control the push with shockwave. You want to nuke the creeps, and hopefully him as well, to push your wave into his tower while the creep waves spawn. This way if he wants to get the rune he has to sacrifice exp to do it, otherwise you get to check it for free. Combine this with magnus bottle crow and you can nuke just as hard as he does, but when you give him all the runes with bottle he won't run out of mana. Just be happy he was nuking you for 100 on a 6 second cooldown at levels 1-2 instead of 85 on a 1.75 second cooldown while better controlling the wave. The latter would've been the case had he skilled chain lightning.
 
Übermatik;54045861 said:
Thanks man, means a lot. And I usually counter PL with wards in lane/dust and just get a gank and kill early.
Click to expand...

I'm writing this post on an observation by observation basis. All times are based on the game's time NOT the replay time:

-0:57 - Zeus went Bottle First. Harass the SHIT out of him and take all his last hits. He made a mistake doing that.

0:30 - Zeus just last hit with Lightning Bolt? Lol?

On a random note, your team's courier is awesome, never seen that one.

0:45 - Zeus is missing last hits, you have (on average) 18 more damage than he does. You have a huge advantage in getting farm here.

0:55 - Neither team has wards, Zeus beat you to the top Illusion rune barely. He just got a lucky guess there.

1:45 - Buy a Magic Stick and build it into a Magic Wand against a Zeus. He's spamming that level 1 (now level 2) Lightning Bolt on you, and he can keep that shit up all day and give you 15 charges real fast. You have three branches, it's 350 more gold and you can make a Wand, plus you get two inventory spaces without having to get rid of a Branch for anything.

2:17 - You are harassed out of lane, Zeus lucky guesses top (neither team still has wards) and gets the Haste rune up there. Remember Lightning Bolt is only 75 mana on level 1 and 95 on level 2. He can be fairly spammy with that thing if he's getting consistent rune access. If he drinks his bottle in front of him, throw a Shockwave at him to stop the regeneration. Beating you to all those runes will mean so much less if he can't use his bottle charges.

3:00 - Zeus popped his Haste Rune, tried to dive you, getting you down to almost nothing, and took two tower hits in the process. Zeus has 8 last hits and you have three. You need to make sure to get every single last hit, especially when Zeus goes away to check the rune. If there's multiple that there's no way you have time to get all of them before they die, don't be afraid to get them with the Shockwave. Assuming they give about 40 gold each, that's 120 gold you've gained in one split second at the cost of 90 mana. That's more than a sixth of a bottle, just from that.

3:25 - A very close call, Zeus tower dives you again, this time running all the way to your T2 and you have damn near no health, however when Zeus gets out of there he has almost nothing either. Honestly, I think you could have punished that and just skewered him toward your T1 and attacked him. He has no points in Arc Lightning, his Lightning Bolt was on cooldown, he only has his shitty little attacks, which you have a good chance of blocking some of the damage with the Stout Shield, and if he does that, then the T1 is now aggroed on him. You may have gotten that kill.

3:45 - Zeus waits for the creeps to get under his tower, then lucky guesses the Invisibility rune top again! Still no wards from either team.

5:00 - I noticed you bought boots. You missed an opportunity not getting a Wand, Bottle, or both. Against this Zeus, getting both would literally pay for itself with the kills you could have on this guy. Zeus is STILL only rocking the Bottle and is carrying nearly 900 gold!

5:30 - Zeus is camping bottom rune spot waaaaaay early for some reason. He has no health.

6:15 - You beat him to the double damage rune AND get the kill on him, good job.

7:06 - Buy TPs! TP back to your lane after you went back to base. If you had a bottle you could have bottled that DD and used the bottle charges, waited til next rune for more, and you would be fine! Also, try bottle crowing. Just bring the courier near you, put the bottle on the courier. Select the courier, and hit Q, (Shift + D if there's items you need to get as well), Shift + F. Remember, just hitting D with the courier will only make it go far enough into the fountain to get items, but not refill the bottle. It has to go all the way in with Q to refill the bottle.

8:00 - Still no wards, Zeus gets the Invisibility rune top after coming off of a gank top, and heads through the jungle. Zeus and Slark go hunting for Ursa, and kill their prey. Necrolyte comes to try to help, but is too late, he should have just stayed out, he couldn't save Ursa and was there too late anyway. He gets killed by Slark.

9:00 - You try to head off Zeus, don't have enough mana for the RP. You do have a bottle now, but it's not enough.

10:00 - Zeus TPs in, Lightning Bolt and then tries to ult you as you run away. It's not enough to kill you. He still has no points in Arc Lightning.

12:00 - Good RP on Slark and Slardar, but you only end up Skewering Slardar and a creep two feet, because you only have two points in Skewer, and you misclicked it. I would say forgo the point in Empower early, as no one has the damage yet to make it that useful. Having more points in Skewer is better. Slardar gets his stun on both of you, Slark is right there, and outlevels both of you. Slardar runs because his health is low, but sees an opportunity and comes back now that his stun is off cooldown, comes back to stun you and Ursa. You both die. Ursa should have been soloing Roshan since he has Vlads now (nobody has wards, he could have done it even without a Smoke first). Necrolyte shows up, ults Slardar, but the level 1 ult is not enough to kill him. He proceeds to shit his pants and Slark jumps him.

13:45 - Ursa is soloing Rosh, Zeus has Mana Boots and Double Damage rune activated. You have to be careful with that. Now he has one point in Arc Lightning. His ultimate is off cooldown, he is able to kill you. He also has three levels ahead of you now.

16:30 - Slark is running rampant all over you guys. Necrolyte is out of position all the time, not sure what he's doing in the river while Slark is tower diving you guys. He comes up and kills Necrolyte again.

At this point, Slark is too huge for you guys to handle individually. You need to "5 man dota" this guy as they say.

14921E72BF497444D7FEA186665F61D74E4CB4F6
Click to expand...

20:00 - I notice you have Treads. Get Arcane Boots on Magnus, unless you are serious about doing a hard carry Magnus, you really need that extra Mana. In this situation, Ursa and Necrolyte need to be the ones carrying. You and Axe are the teamfight guys.

23:01 - Kunkka is more reliable late game that Slark, and he has a Shadow Blade and Crystalys now, probably going to have Daedalus soon. Those splashes are going to really hurt.



From there everything spirals out of control. I only saw one ward all game, and it was at about 34 minutes above your ancients. You guys could (and probably would) have won this with wards.

"Thunder as applause" This must be a call for that "Joke's on you I pretended to be stupid." comic.
 
Procarbine said:
I just watched the mid match up and I can probably infer about the rest of the game. This is what getting outplayed is like.

The zues had a bad skill build as well.

Also you should have got bottle before boots, and then arcane boots.

Final thoughts on mid match up: You just have him 100% rune control because you don't know how to control the push with shockwave. You want to nuke the creeps, and hopefully him as well, to push your wave into his tower while the creep waves spawn. This way if he wants to get the rune he has to sacrifice exp to do it, otherwise you get to check it for free. Combine this with magnus bottle crow and you can nuke just as hard as he does, but when you give him all the runes with bottle he won't run out of mana. Just be happy he was nuking you for 100 on a 6 second cooldown at levels 1-2 instead of 85 on a 1.75 second cooldown while better controlling the wave. The latter would've been the case had he skilled chain lightning.
Click to expand...

Hylian7 said:
I'm writing this post on an observation by observation basis. All times are based on the game's time NOT the replay time:

-0:57 - Zeus went Bottle First. Harass the SHIT out of him and take all his last hits. He made a mistake doing that.

0:30 - Zeus just last hit with Lightning Bolt? Lol?

On a random note, your team's courier is awesome, never seen that one.

0:45 - Zeus is missing last hits, you have (on average) 18 more damage than he does. You have a huge advantage in getting farm here.

0:55 - Neither team has wards, Zeus beat you to the top Illusion rune barely. He just got a lucky guess there.

1:45 - Buy a Magic Stick and build it into a Magic Wand against a Zeus. He's spamming that level 1 (now level 2) Lightning Bolt on you, and he can keep that shit up all day and give you 15 charges real fast. You have three branches, it's 350 more gold and you can make a Wand, plus you get two inventory spaces without having to get rid of a Branch for anything.

2:17 - You are harassed out of lane, Zeus lucky guesses top (neither team still has wards) and gets the Haste rune up there. Remember Lightning Bolt is only 75 mana on level 1 and 95 on level 2. He can be fairly spammy with that thing if he's getting consistent rune access. If he drinks his bottle in front of him, throw a Shockwave at him to stop the regeneration. Beating you to all those runes will mean so much less if he can't use his bottle charges.

3:00 - Zeus popped his Haste Rune, tried to dive you, getting you down to almost nothing, and took two tower hits in the process. Zeus has 8 last hits and you have three. You need to make sure to get every single last hit, especially when Zeus goes away to check the rune. If there's multiple that there's no way you have time to get all of them before they die, don't be afraid to get them with the Shockwave. Assuming they give about 40 gold each, that's 120 gold you've gained in one split second at the cost of 90 mana. That's more than a sixth of a bottle, just from that.

3:25 - A very close call, Zeus tower dives you again, this time running all the way to your T2 and you have damn near no health, however when Zeus gets out of there he has almost nothing either. Honestly, I think you could have punished that and just skewered him toward your T1 and attacked him. He has no points in Arc Lightning, his Lightning Bolt was on cooldown, he only has his shitty little attacks, which you have a good chance of blocking some of the damage with the Stout Shield, and if he does that, then the T1 is now aggroed on him. You may have gotten that kill.

3:45 - Zeus waits for the creeps to get under his tower, then lucky guesses the Invisibility rune top again! Still no wards from either team.

5:00 - I noticed you bought boots. You missed an opportunity not getting a Wand, Bottle, or both. Against this Zeus, getting both would literally pay for itself with the kills you could have on this guy. Zeus is STILL only rocking the Bottle and is carrying nearly 900 gold!

5:30 - Zeus is camping bottom rune spot waaaaaay early for some reason. He has no health.

6:15 - You beat him to the double damage rune AND get the kill on him, good job.

7:06 - Buy TPs! TP back to your lane after you went back to base. If you had a bottle you could have bottled that DD and used the bottle charges, waited til next rune for more, and you would be fine! Also, try bottle crowing. Just bring the courier near you, put the bottle on the courier. Select the courier, and hit Q, (Shift + D if there's items you need to get as well), Shift + F. Remember, just hitting D with the courier will only make it go far enough into the fountain to get items, but not refill the bottle. It has to go all the way in with Q to refill the bottle.

8:00 - Still no wards, Zeus gets the Invisibility rune top after coming off of a gank top, and heads through the jungle. Zeus and Slark go hunting for Ursa, and kill their prey. Necrolyte comes to try to help, but is too late, he should have just stayed out, he couldn't save Ursa and was there too late anyway. He gets killed by Slark.

9:00 - You try to head off Zeus, don't have enough mana for the RP. You do have a bottle now, but it's not enough.

10:00 - Zeus TPs in, Lightning Bolt and then tries to ult you as you run away. It's not enough to kill you. He still has no points in Arc Lightning.

12:00 - Good RP on Slark and Slardar, but you only end up Skewering Slardar and a creep two feet, because you only have two points in Skewer, and you misclicked it. I would say forgo the point in Empower early, as no one has the damage yet to make it that useful. Having more points in Skewer is better. Slardar gets his stun on both of you, Slark is right there, and outlevels both of you. Slardar runs because his health is low, but sees an opportunity and comes back now that his stun is off cooldown, comes back to stun you and Ursa. You both die. Ursa should have been soloing Roshan since he has Vlads now (nobody has wards, he could have done it even without a Smoke first). Necrolyte shows up, ults Slardar, but the level 1 ult is not enough to kill him. He proceeds to shit his pants and Slark jumps him.

13:45 - Ursa is soloing Rosh, Zeus has Mana Boots and Double Damage rune activated. You have to be careful with that. Now he has one point in Arc Lightning. His ultimate is off cooldown, he is able to kill you. He also has three levels ahead of you now.

16:30 - Slark is running rampant all over you guys. Necrolyte is out of position all the time, not sure what he's doing in the river while Slark is tower diving you guys. He comes up and kills Necrolyte again.

At this point, Slark is too huge for you guys to handle individually. You need to "5 man dota" this guy as they say.



20:00 - I notice you have Treads. Get Arcane Boots on Magnus, unless you are serious about doing a hard carry Magnus, you really need that extra Mana. In this situation, Ursa and Necrolyte need to be the ones carrying. You and Axe are the teamfight guys.

23:01 - Kunkka is more reliable late game that Slark, and he has a Shadow Blade and Crystalys now, probably going to have Daedalus soon. Those splashes are going to really hurt.



From there everything spirals out of control. I only saw one ward all game, and it was at about 34 minutes above your ancients. You guys could (and probably would) have won this with wards.

"Thunder as applause" This must be a call for that "Joke's on you I pretended to be stupid." comic.
Click to expand...

Thanks both of you for your advice, it really helps. I was kicking myself at getting boots first - I always go bottle asap with Magnus, but I was so preoccupied and pissed at Zeus' spell spam that I lost sight of my item build and just bought boots when I saw I had the gold. And yeah, mana boots would have been a wiser pick. I think I got carried away with lashing out at the other team and trying to counter, when we should have looked at better co ordination. And yes, our support(s) weren't great at all. Little to no wards all game like you say. I think, then, it was just a bad game, and I was pretty tired.

It's only the tird (?) time I've played Magnus, and my other two were wins - and big wins at that - so I got pretty upset when I was getting forced form lane.

Thanks for the tips though, means a lot, and hopefully this won't happen again! :D

Oh, and this comic? :P

hey-guys-look-how-retarded-i-am-jokes-on-them.jpg
 
Übermatik;54052524 said:
Thanks both of you for your advice, it really helps. I was kicking myself at getting boots first - I always go bottle asap with Magnus, but I was so preoccupied and pissed at Zeus' spell spam that I lost sight of my item build and just bought boots when I saw I had the gold. And yeah, mana boots would have been a wiser pick. I think I got carried away with lashing out at the other team and trying to counter, when we should have looked at better co ordination. And yes, our support(s) weren't great at all. Little to no wards all game like you say. I think, then, it was just a bad game, and I was pretty tired.

It's only the tird (?) time I've played Magnus, and my other two were wins - and big wins at that - so I got pretty upset when I was getting forced form lane.

Thanks for the tips though, means a lot, and hopefully this won't happen again! :D

Oh, and this comic? :P

hey-guys-look-how-retarded-i-am-jokes-on-them.jpg
Click to expand...

Yes, that one.
 
Hylian7 said:
Good stuff.


From there everything spirals out of control. I only saw one ward all game, and it was at about 34 minutes above your ancients. You guys could (and probably would) have won this with wards.

"Thunder as applause" This must be a call for that "Joke's on you I pretended to be stupid." comic.
Click to expand...

Thunderous applause, indeed. Very interesting read up, Hylian. I enjoyed it.
 
I had a pretty poor game yesterday, going like 2/6/4 as a carry. The whole time this QoP was harassing me about my play and was getting pretty nasty.

Today the guy adds me as a friend and apologizes for acting the way he did. I've never had anyone do that, must've taken a lot of guts. Usually people who are like that aren't the type to friend you and apologize.
 
I've been looking for 1-3 people to run DOTA 2 publics with, as I usually get shit teammates (a.k.a PL who rushes Dagon).

Steam ID: ForeGod

Please hit me up if interested, Thinking about making a new account so My W/L and overall account can be better. Thanks/
 
Wait, how much of a timelag is watching a friends game on? Because I can apparently totally still chat with him while seeing where every enemy was on the map. I mean, I didn't, but apparently I could
 
Fore God said:
I've been looking for 1-3 people to run DOTA 2 publics with, as I usually get shit teammates (a.k.a PL who rushes Dagon).

Steam ID: ForeGod

Please hit me up if interested, Thinking about making a new account so My W/L and overall account can be better. Thanks/
Click to expand...

dagon pl is neew meta duh

The Technomancer said:
Wait, how much of a timelag is watching a friends game on? Because I can apparently totally still chat with him while seeing where every enemy was on the map. I mean, I didn't, but apparently I could
Click to expand...

isnt it 2 min of delay?
 
The Technomancer said:
Wait, how much of a timelag is watching a friends game on? Because I can apparently totally still chat with him while seeing where every enemy was on the map. I mean, I didn't, but apparently I could
Click to expand...

Should be two minutes watching as a Dota TV spectator. No real tactical advantage to be had besides ward spots I suppose. Rosh or other positions would be outdated by the time they would get the info from you.

Aselith said:
All Mirana game in atoD 2. :)
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First one was Timbersaw. PotM game was more interesting though.
 
I didn't know Enigma was latino. . .

http://www.joindota.com/en/news/8451-ddos-attacks-plague-g-1-qualifier
the best solution put forward so far, in this writers opinion, is to play the games in secret and rebroadcast the results for now
Click to expand...
Ewwwww. The whole appeal of this e-sports is watching the shit live.



Late night dota?
Looks like the 1AM remake is a go-go on joindota.
Not updated on the g12p site, but it does let them play the follow up game on time.

Ayesee better have some more stories queued up.
If you missed them this morning - they are pretty good.
http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLzBGa3wiw1p6joiZqe4SxnQ7MBf38358u
 
Oh my fucking god I hate Keeper of the Light, he requires NO SKILL to make his lane partner an unholy terror. At least with something like Shadow Demon its possible to screw over your allies with Disruption, but KotL just gets to break heroes who were balanced around their low mana. Tonights example: Undying
 
Too many panels.

It's cute.

He's never there for me though.
 
The Technomancer said:
Oh my fucking god I hate Keeper of the Light, he requires NO SKILL to make his lane partner an unholy terror. At least with something like Shadow Demon its possible to screw over your allies with Disruption, but KotL just gets to break heroes who were balanced around their low mana. Tonights example: Undying
Click to expand...

Oof, that's rough. He must have stolen more strength than he knew what to do with.
 
Fore God said:
Just played a game where a lone druid didn't skill his syllabear, Yea I think I'm done solo-queuing.
Click to expand...

He really was the Lone Druid. #oldjoke

Is it becoming some kind of trend for Lunas not to max Lucent Beam? I've seen it twice within the last week. One's defense for it was "You're stupid and don't believe that I can outfarm PL." You can outfarm him alright, and you can do it with leveling Lucent Beam.
 
Fore God said:
Just played a game where a lone druid didn't skill his syllabear, Yea I think I'm done solo-queuing.
Click to expand...

I've had that once. Game was bad.

Hylian7 said:
He really was the Lone Druid. #oldjoke

Is it becoming some kind of trend for Lunas not to max Lucent Beam? I've seen it twice within the last week. One's defense for it was "You're stupid and don't believe that I can outfarm PL." You can outfarm him alright, and you can do it with leveling Lucent Beam.
Click to expand...

No, that's just awful. Unless you're going for some odd pseudo-jungle build early with glaives and aura, but in 999 cases out of 1000 you should max lucent beam first to have the most impact with early eclipses and to just have the extra damage on the nuke for chasing people down.
 
CarbonatedFalcon said:
I've had that once. Game was bad.



No, that's just awful. Unless you're going for some odd pseudo-jungle build early with glaives and aura, but in 999 cases out of 1000 you should max lucent beam first to have the most impact with early eclipses and to just have the extra damage on the nuke for chasing people down.
Click to expand...

That's what I thought, because Glaives and Blessing scale and no damage * x% = not much
 
Still can't creep block effectively when solo mid, gotta practice that, and gotta practice my micro with visage, chen, etc. Got a long way to go until becoming decent...
 
And of course immedietly after I get a great game as Jakiro alongside a Tidehunter, KotL, Lion and Riki. Supports too strong! By the end there was nothing their Lycan and Nightstalker could do against us, whenever Lycan popped his BKB we just used three Meks to stay alive and then hit him with a billion stuns and slows at once.
 
The Technomancer said:
And of course immedietly after I get a great game as Jakiro alongside a Tidehunter, KotL, Lion and Riki. Supports too strong! By the end there was nothing their Lycan and Nightstalker could do against us, whenever Lycan popped his BKB we just used three Meks to stay alive and then hit him with a billion stuns and slows at once.
Click to expand...

Hate to burst your bubble but that's a lot of wasted cash. Mek's don't stack, so in reality the second and third Meks are doing nothing but wasitng cash.
 
Start time 1:00 AM EST *Live*
Casters: LD & Blaze, Ayesee

streams --> http://g1.2p.com/dota2/
widescreen -->http://g1.2p.com/dota2/caster/widescreen-bts.shtml

streams --> http://g1.2p.com/dota2/
widescreen -->http://g1.2p.com/dota2/caster/widescreen-ayesee.shtml

All best of 3 elemination. Phase 1 losers are eliminated, Phase 2 losers sent to lower bracket.

West Qualifiers: Phase 1
14016

World #3 Dignitas
WTS, fogged, Aui_2000, Universe, Sneyking
vs
16575

World # 35 QPAD (new team hence the lower ranking, but lots of good players)
Captain Wagamama
Select, Sing, Mini, jrx

Get rid of your mis-matched axe gear here. . . .
izPdsc85OoR5k.png


Western Qualifiers: Phase 2
4 EST
#4 Liquid vs #25 AL

8 EST
#9 Fnatic vs #17 KP
 
Hylian7 said:
Hate to burst your bubble but that's a lot of wasted cash. Mek's don't stack, so in reality the second and third Meks are doing nothing but wasitng cash.
Click to expand...

Yeah, our communication wasn't the hottest, but don't the active heals work if they happen one after the other?

EDIT: Apparently it doesn't! Lame!

G-Unit said:
Ward
Click to expand...

KotL wasn't really the problem, it was just that Undying's Decay was able to be spammedevery time I entered creep range.
 
The Technomancer said:
Yeah, our communication wasn't the hottest, but don't the active heals work if they happen one after the other?



KotL wasn't really the problem, it was just that Undying's Decay was able to be spammedevery time I entered creep range.
Click to expand...

jigga thats nothing, I was spectre in a lane with wr against kepper and axe... now thats gasta... they destroyed us early game but... I we did just enough to hold us until late game. tranquil boots are your friend

http://dotabuff.com/matches/152300637
 
Hopefully I'm not stepping on any toes asking here. Are there still keys to get access to the game? OR do you need to just purchase the early access pack at this point? Thanks!
EDIT: Didn't read the OP. I guess I just need to ask. Anyone got an invite lying around?
 
Nightstalker is so fun when you start snowballing. No one can run from you, you run around destroying everything and tanking towers.
 
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