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[jarrod]

Wasn't that the same line of thinking that many people had with the Xbox? Now, look what Microsoft has done for Western 3rd parties (that Nintendo has failed to do since the N64)...provide a solid platform where 3rd parties can enjoy healthy sales. And maybe that's what the Xboy will provide as well.

US 3rd party million sellers by platform...

Nintendo 64
-Namco Museum 64 (Namco)
-Star Wars Episode I: Racer (LucasArts)
-Star Wars: Rogue Squadron (LucasArts)
-Tony Hawk's Pro Skater (Activision)
-Turok 2: Seeds of Evil (Acclaim)
-WCW/NWO Revenge (THQ)
-WCW Vs NWO: World Tour (THQ)
-WWE No Mercy (THQ)

Xbox
-Grand Theft Auto Double Pack (Rockstar)
-Madden NFL 2005 (Electronic Arts)
-Madden NFL 2006 (Electronic Arts)
-Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic (LucasArts)
-Tom Clancey's Splinter Cell (Ubisoft)


...revisionist historians tend to undercount N64, but the fact is it was the first Nintendo platform not to lose any American userbase and it had a hugely successful American run, much moreso than Xbox even.

And for fun, here's another US 3rd party million seller list for a successful Nintendo platform...

Game Boy Advance
-Dragon Ball Z: Legacy of Goku (Atari)
-Finding Nemo (THQ)
-Frogger's Adventure: Temple of the Frog (Konami)
-Namco Museum (Namco)*
-Pac-Man Collection (Namco)
-Sonic Advance (THQ)
-Spyro: Season of Ice (Vivendi)
-The Incredibles (THQ)
-Yu-Gi-OH! Eternal Duelist Soul (Konami)


*means over 2 million!

 

[jarrod]

You know that Microsoft currently develops Diddy Kong Racing for the DS? Why would Microsoft develop games for their competitor?

Because it was worked into Rare's buyout clause, who by the way still have an excellent relationship going with Nintendo. I think you're always going to see Rare made games on Nintendo handhelds...

 

[Baron Doggystyle von Woof]

please don't turn this thread in another sales thread

 

[TigerKnee]

Well, Microsoft has been getting buddy-buddy with iRiver lately. So I wouldn't be surprised if they provided Digital Content for this iRiver device. It's getting released in both Korea and America soon, though the US version is lacking WiMax/WiBro.

That actually looks pretty darn spiffy

 

[Shiggy]

Because it was worked into Rare's buyout clause, who by the way still have an excellent relationship going with Nintendo. I think you're always going to see Rare made games on Nintendo handhelds...

Where did you get that? There's no such clause, it's always a new contract. As long as Microsoft doesn't comepete on the handheld market, they are allowed to produce games for Nintendo (or Sony) systems.

 

[heavenly]

C'mon, Jarrod. Although I would agree that the N64 had a nice American run for 3rd parites, the N64 carts significantly reduced any sort of major profits. This generation...Western 3rd parties exclusive and multiplatform software can compete with Sony's head to head. Nintendo can't claim that outside a select few titles, if I'm not mistaken.

 

[jarrod]

C'mon, Jarrod. Although I would agree that the N64 had a nice American run for 3rd parites, the N64 carts significantly reduced any sort of major profits. This generation...Western 3rd parties exclusive and multiplatform software can compete with Sony's head to head. Nintendo can't claim that outside a select few titles, if I'm not mistaken.

Er, Xbox sales aren't exactly competing "head to head" with PS2 stuff either... PS2 has more games over 3 million in the USA than Xbox does 1 million even.... outside a few isolated incidents (invaraibly ones where the Xbox release is far superior) PS2 SKUs basically always outperform their Xbox counterparts.

Yes an optical medium makes a difference in the publisher's bottom line (which is why Xbox has like 20 times the games N64 did), but platforms like N64, GBC and GBA have provided gigantic western bases that have proven to be enticing and healthy markets for other publishers. Xbox really isn't the dramatic market wonder that wetsern media tends to make it out as, it's a platform that sold less than N64 (Nintendo's oft pointed to "failure") in every market and lost 4-5 billion USD in the process. :/

 

[heavenly]

Er, Xbox sales aren't exactly competing "head to head" with PS2 stuff either... PS2 has more games over 3 million in the USA than Xbox does 1 million even.... outside a few isolated incidents (invaraibly ones where the Xbox release is far superior) PS2 SKUs basically always outperform their Xbox counterparts.

Yes an optical medium makes a difference in the publisher's bottom line (which is why Xbox has like 20 times the games N64 did), but platforms like N64, GBC and GBA have provided gigantic western bases that have proven to be enticing and healthy markets for other publishers. Xbox really isn't the dramatic market wonder that wetsern media tends to make it out as, it's a platform that sold less than N64 (Nintendo's oft pointed to "failure") in every market and lost 4-5 billion USD in the process. :/

I'm not talking about how much Xbox, the console, sold in America in comparison to N64. I'm talking about a platform where Western 3rd parties can bank on some healthy profits. Titles need not sale 1 million+ to garner some nice pocket change, but NPD charts have shown since the Xbox's inception that most Western 3rd parties could count on pulling in 300K+, whereas thte Gamecube couldn't provide nor promise that. Why do you think Western 3rd parties stop making games for the Gamecube...because their games will just not sale nor return any kind of profit.

 

[jarrod]

I'm not talking about how much Xbox, the console, sold in America in comparison to N64. I'm talking about a platform where Western 3rd parties can bank on some healthy profits. Titles need not sale 1 million+ to garner some nice pocket change, but NPD charts have shown since the Xbox's inception that most Western 3rd parties could count on pulling in 300K+, whereas thte Gamecube couldn't provide nor promise that. Why do you think Western 3rd parties stop making games for the Gamecube...because their games will just not sale nor return any kind of profit.

I wasn't talking GameCube, I was talking N64... a platform that provided dizzying profits for companies like Acclaim, Midway, Take 2, THQ and Activision, all despite it's cost exhorbant mask ROM media. Again, your take on what Nintendo has or hasn't "failed" to do is just incorrect.

 

[heavenly]

I wasn't talking GameCube, I was talking N64... a platform that provided dizzying profits for companies like Acclaim, Midway, Take 2, THQ and Activision, all despite it's cost exhorbant mask ROM media. Again, your take on what Nintendo has or hasn't "failed" to do is just incorrect.

Well, in this industry of making profits, it's not about what you did for me in the past (NES, SNES, N64), but what have you done for me lately (Gamecube).

Now, only Sony and Microsoft provides a safe haven for Western 3rd parties. Unless they (W3P) begin to take major risks and consistently provide their best efforts and franchises on Nintendo's home consoles, I just don't see their fortunes changing anytime soon.

So, to keep this discussion on topic, maybe Microsoft sees that opportunity for (W3P) in the handheld sector. And that's where they may succeed.

 

[jarrod]

Well, in this industry of making profits, it's not about what you did for me in the past (NES, SNES, N64), but what have you done for me lately (Gamecube).

Now, only Sony and Microsoft provides a safe haven for Western 3rd parties. Unless they (W3P) begin to take major risks and consistently provide their best efforts and franchises on Nintendo's home consoles, I just don't see their fortunes changing anytime soon.

So, to keep this discussion on topic, maybe Microsoft sees that opportunity for (W3P) in the handheld sector. And that's where they may succeed.

Well... why would GameCube even be used for comparison if (in keeping this on topic) you're talking about potential opportunities in the handheld sector? Wouldn't "what have you done for me lately" mean it be more appropriate to look at GBA/DS?

 

[heavenly]

Well... why would GameCube even be used for comparison if (in keeping this on topic) you're talking about potential opportunities in the handheld sector? Wouldn't "what have you done for me lately" mean it be more appropriate to look at GBA/DS?

Outside a few games here and there, GBA & NDS were/are not saviors for W3P's. PSP had that sparked at launch, as most systems do, but now it's losing steam fast. Still, PSP has the most potential (sales-wise) for W3P currently...just look at EA's games. They're selling alot more than their NDS' iterations. Nintendo just can't win in this aspect. People buy Nintendo platforms for Nintendo games. I doubt they will ever return to the glory of the NES & SNES for W3P's...too much competition nowadays. And their misinterpreted image doesn't help them either.

I believe Microsoft thinks they have the most potential to provide W3P's with a platform they can bank on for healthy profits...consistently. And it just may work. Although, I would hate to see them flood the market with another hardware.

 

[koam]

xboy sounds like a transvestite product's.

The only thing that will be a "DS killer" is Nintendo when they decide to pull the plug on it. Much like sony with the PS2.

 

[M3wThr33]

One handheld to rule them all!

 

[jarrod]

Outside a few games here and there, GBA & NDS were/are not saviors for W3P's. PSP had that sparked at launch, as most systems do, but now it's losing steam fast. Still, PSP has the most potential (sales-wise) for W3P currently...just look at EA's games. They're selling alot more than their NDS' iterations. Nintendo just can't win in this aspect. People buy Nintendo platforms for Nintendo games. I doubt they will ever return to the glory of the NES & SNES for W3P's...too much competition nowadays. And their misinterpreted image doesn't help them either.

Are you kidding? THQ's basically the powerhouse they are today because of their success on various Game Boys. Actvision, Square Enix, EA, SEGA, Atari, Namco, Konami, Capcom, Bandai, Vivendi, Disney... all these publishers have had multiple million sellers on the Game Boy platforms, there's been a wealth of Game Boy software sales beyond Nintendo. GBA has nearly double the 1st party million sellers Xbox boasts, which is actually proportional to it's increased userbase.

Again revisionist history seems to have reared it's head, as every Game Boy is about as "Nintendo dominated" as NES/SNES were. The fact is Nintendo's catalogue has always led their platforms, just as SEGA always led their machines... though really, when you get down to it Xbox seems rather 1st party dominated as well (Halo, PGR, Fable, Forza, Rare, etc) to a much larger degree than PlayStation anyway.

As for PSP, well it seems rather split. As you've mentioned, EA's made huge gains in the handheld market as a result and GTA is doing rather well... but then, that seems to be the majority of "progress" there. Most other publishers aren't seeing numbers they didn't managed on Nintendo "dominated" handhelds.

 

[GG-Duo]

there's actually a spot with digital distribution that microsoft can swoop in here...

 

[Zeed]

I bet they'll call it the Xpod.

 

[adamsappel]

For the life of me, I can't remember the name of the magazine I saw today (I think it was European, with a model holding an HD display in front of her naked torso; I actually ran my finger over her chest, I swear just because I thought it was a sticker!), but inside there was an artist's concept of the Microsoft handheld. The blurb said it would have a touch-screen a half-inch bigger than the PSP. It was way too large and looked more like the Sega Nomad than a sleek sexy DSL or PSP.

 

[heavenly]

Are you kidding? THQ's basically the powerhouse they are today because of their success on various Game Boys. Actvision, Square Enix, EA, SEGA, Atari, Namco, Konami, Capcom, Bandai, Vivendi, Disney... all these publishers have had multiple million sellers on the Game Boy platforms, there's been a wealth of Game Boy software sales beyond Nintendo. GBA has nearly double the 1st party million sellers Xbox boasts, which is actually proportional to it's increased userbase.

That's because THQ releases more games than EA...I wonder if their bottomline is even profitable, due to the license's fees they have to pay out. Do their games sale over 300K consistently?

I don't recall (not a stats guru) Atari, EA or Activision having multiple games sale over 300K on the GBA or NDS?

Again, it's all about what have you done for me lately? NDS, currently, is not a great platform for W3P's. Maybe the DSL will change that overtime, but right now...NO.

If Microsoft truly takes the best of both worlds (NDS & PSP) in the design of their portable game player, and additionally includes the Xbox Live Anywhere service, I believe they will definitely give Nintendo a run for their money in the U.S. market.

 

[Defensor]

I'd buy it.

 

[D3VI0US]

I think the move into handhelds is more about getting a piece of the digital music market than it is about wanting to enter the handheld market. MS is just using games as a way to differentiate themselves from the ipod and it is a really attractive proposition for most people.

People say it wouldn't be profitable but it has the potential to crush the ipod if you think about it. It would most likely use the "Plays for Sure" standard which is probably some kind of protected wma files. MS gets a cut of every song and video sold not to mention revenue from games. There are a ton of benefits to MS jumping in the game and if they really bring the right features they can potentially make a huge splash in the market.

This months Edge does mention that MS will offer mobile versions of its Live Arcade games (included in the home console version price), so maybe they see an opportunity to provide content for two devices at once (All xboy games downloadable through XBLA and compatible with 360), though that would require changes to their 64meg size limit presumably.

That's what I gathered from the Live Anywhere presentation too, that the games would be cross platform. I mean how cool would it be to buy a Live Anywhere version of Tetris, pay for it once, and be able to play it on you 360, PC, Xboy, cellphone? Given that it's "Live" text and voice messaging and digital downloads seem likely. I'd love an mp3 player that also played games that I already bought off XBLA. The details are a long way off but I don't understand the hate personally.

I don't game on the go but I always take my ipod and my cellphone with me. If I could have games on my MP3 player I would game on the go and DS and PSP don't offer good music solutions which would be my primary concern. Gaming would be a secondary feature but a considerable advantage over the ipod, not to mention a PSP style screen but a bit more portable.

 

[soundwave05]

Yeah I think overall the problem MS is having is iPod ... iPod is probably driving them batsh-t insane right now.

Especailly if a real iPod Video is coming ... Apple could rally the movie studios behind them much as they have the music labels. That would make iTunes/iMovies (?) the lead provider for online music and movie content.

I don't think MS really gives a crap about the DS or PSP. Apple is the much bigger threat, if they did have a handheld that plays games it would be for the express purpose of giving their MP3 player extra functionality.

 

[adamsappel]

And isn't the lack of sales for EA titles on the DS mostly due to the fact that they're really shitty? We may be stupid ("A different color? Here's a hundred more dollars!"), but we're not that stupid.

 

[Matt]

That's because THQ releases more games than EA...I wonder if their bottomline is even profitable, due to the license's fees they have to pay out. Do their games sale over 300K consistently?

I don't recall (not a stats guru) Atari, EA or Activision having multiple games sale over 300K on the GBA or NDS?

Again, it's all about what have you done for me lately? NDS, currently, is not a great platform for W3P's. Maybe the DSL will change that overtime, but right now...NO.

If Microsoft truly takes the best of both worlds (NDS & PSP) in the design of their portable game player, and additionally includes the Xbox Live Anywhere service, I believe they will definitely give Nintendo a run for their money in the U.S. market.

3rd parties made (and continue to make) a shitload on the GBA, and the DS as well. And if Sony, THE overall worldwide leader in video games couldn’t unseat Nintendo, what makes you think dinky Microsoft can?

 

[soundwave05]

That actually looks pretty darn spiffy

That does look cool.

The next DS iteration should be like that.

 

[FiRez]

:lol So is Halo expected to push the Xboy as well?

why not?

I would buy it in day one if it had a polygon perfect port of Halo:CE with online play
*drools*