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[El Topo]

How does games like Planescape Torment or Baldur's Gate 2 not hold up today?

Have you seen some of the recent reviews for the enhanced edition of Baldur's Gate 2? Imbalanced, poor AI, too much content and/or bad pacing, spotty voice acting, inconsistent difficulty. I fear modern gamers might not appreciate the game as much as older generations.

I never said it's wrong, it's just funny how its a recurring thing that happens in every top X.

Oh, absolutely.

 

[Ratrat]

Dark Souls starts out with shit gameplay till you start leveling up also

You just outted yourself as an awful player. Leveling and armor are not nearly as important as skill. This is a game people play naked with a ladel or even fists.

 

[krYlon]

Would have been nice if they included at least one proper adventure game on the list. Classic PC representation in general is dire but that's Edge for you.

It's really strange all round. On the front cover they put something like "The Best Modern Games" and so fair enough if their focus is on the flavour on the month, but then they still include stuff like A Link to the Past, Tetris and Earthbound.

I feel like Edge is very confused in general these days like they're trying to refind their identity.
The special edition is also very poor value for £12 by the way. Though the £5 online voucher improves that somewhat.

 

[andymcc]

Not to be a asshole but what's "kneejerk" about it? I could see what your saying if it was titanfall or another online multiplayer after one week. But mario maker isn't going change significantly in a month well those would.

yeah but the game is pretty much hinged on its community involvement. at the time this list was culled, i'm sure the best online stages they had were a bunch of automatic "DON'T PRESS ANYTHING" rube goldberg style stages. the game has had a significant turn around in level quality in the last few days as novelty has worn off and people are getting better with the toolset.

again, this is why a gestation period is sort of crucial to these lists.

 

[TRI Mike]

Terrible list imo. A list like this is extremely subjective especially for a medium as wide and varied as gaming, there are too many important stuff left out and it includes too much recent games that are just there because of hype.

 

[Gbraga]

Dark Souls starts out with shit gameplay till you start leveling up also

This makes no sense at all.

 

[The Baron Count]

I'm not going to comment much on the list itself, because I disagree wholeheartedly with tons of shit on there and that's fine, it's their list.

I will say I find the need for sites to make lists like this now incredibly distasteful. Maybe I am misremembering this, but I really feel like when an old well loved publication like EGM or something made lists like this back in the day, their motivation was to make a grand statement that they could stand by. It seems like they took them very seriously and had to be able to back up their choices under scrutiny.

Nowadays it seems like the higher ups at these companies are basically just demanding these kinds of lists me made because they are surefire ways to get people talking. I have definitely heard of that very demand coming down from the top at a few sites out there.

Doesn't seem meaningful anymore.

 

[brandonh83]

But in a way that is wrong too cause old game created the mechanics, which in turn got polished by new games....so the question is who is the greater one? The old or the new?

I think what it boils down to is that top whatever lists shouldn't be so specific. At that point it turns into "top 100 games of all time but x and y and x and y variables are at play." What does that make it? It makes it a super personalized, criteria-driven list. I think it's okay and even more focused to have some criteria for a list, but it seems to shun and ignore many factors and ultimately ends up feeling adjusted with so many personal attributes that it doesn't feel like something terribly objective. I'm to assume that Chrono Trigger isn't on the list because they felt like it doesn't "hold up." Is that because they find it to be too simple? Tetris is pretty simple and ancient, and it's in the top ten. Again many things about this just seem to be weird and off, even acknowledging the criteria.

Not to be a asshole but what's "kneejerk" about it? I could see what your saying if it was titanfall or another online multiplayer after one week. But mario maker isn't going change significantly in a month well those would.

You're not being an asshole, and I honestly don't have the answer. It doesn't feel right to me, but that's not really an argument so I'll let it go.

 

[Zia]

What is the argument against Super Mario Maker making the list? It's The Dream Game of anyone that grew up with an NES or SNES and spent lazy Sundays hashing out levels on graph paper. It feels like the final word on 2D Mario. I know it's new but it's not like some unknown thing.

It's really strange all round. On the front cover they put something like "The Best Modern Games" and so fair enough if their focus is on the flavour on the month, but then they still include stuff like A Link to the Past, Tetris and Earthbound.

Those games are some of the most playable games ever made. Earthbound is a little dated mechanics-wise but nobody else has touched it thematically and it still has that chunky, pleasing aesthetic.

 

[andymcc]

This makes no sense at all.

maybe if he said "the game starts out shit because i was shit and didn't learn the mechanics" it would make more sense.

 

[Anth0ny]

i don't understand how super mario maker, a tool that a bunch of nerds can use to make their own crappy levels, ranks above super mario 3d world, a masterpiece made by a team of the best mario makers on the planet

 

[Lion Heart]

Now this is a real list.

Not sure why they felt they needed to put so many modern games on this newest list. Like... that top 4 probably belongs on the list but as the top 4 games of all time? Come the fuck on.

Read the OP

 

[Sayad]

Dark Souls starts out with shit gameplay till you start leveling up also

You might want to play the game, it's pretty good and a SL1 character will play exactly like a SL120 character in it, long as they can wear the same equipment.

 

[Hibiki Kurosawa]

A lot of games I love are on there, so that's cool I guess, but it's still a very odd list. Feels too random and I understand that they say games need to hold up today, but even with that criteria in place this list feels veeeery off.

 

[Nocturnowl]

Nocturnowl, you're from the UK. Explain Edge/Eurogamer's commitment to LBP over DKC2/Yoshi's Island/SMB3/Sonic2&3&K/Mega Man 2&9/etc

Media Molecule must have some dirt on Edge, like some shady UK underworld dealings, in exchange for silence Edge continue with their LBP 10/10 series charade lest their writers kneecaps get mysteriously broken. MM like to pretend they're all cheerful and happy what with their handicrafts, sickeningly saccharine and pleasant presentation but that's just one hell of a smokescreen.

The fact Tearaway also made the list only solidifies this theory further (okay, I kinda like Tearaway).

 

[Nozem]

Both Fez and Rez are in, as they should.

 

[Screaming Meat]

Say, that's a nice list.

 

[Hoo-doo]

Dark Souls starts out with shit gameplay till you start leveling up also

Nope. The game gets better when the player gets better, nothing else.

The gameplay loop is superb.

 

[Zia]

Both Fez and Rez are in, as they should.

My bae.

 

[Anth0ny]

Read the OP

it's still wrong

/fightbetweenOOTandTLOUavatars

 

[ogbg]

For what it's worth, the top 10 games in the list have an average metacritic rating of 94.4 (I excluded Tetris since I'm not sure if that was even reviewed on release), which is in the top 0.46th percentile of all games listed there, so it's not exactly flying in the face of popular opinion.

 

[Stereogatari]

No mention of MGS3 in the list at all. Null and void.

Correct.

 

[LordBaztion]

That's a pretty sad list.
Don't they want to add Artorias of the Abyss on 5th and BB DLC on the 6th?

 

[krYlon]

Those games are some of the most playable games ever made. Earthbound is a little dated mechanics-wise but nobody else has touched it thematically and it still has that chunky, pleasing aesthetic.

So that would be "games to play today" not "modern games". They did a list like that in 2009. Maybe that's what they meant.

 

[Cheat Code]

i don't understand how super mario maker, a tool that a bunch of nerds can use to make their own crappy levels, ranks above super mario 3d world, a masterpiece made by a team of the best mario makers on the planet

You what.

 

[Griss]

I strongly like the idea of a list without nostalgia or historical significance taken into account.

That said, I still don't know how you compare a game like Dark Souls to Gran Turismo, you know? These lists can only really have any meaning when broken down further into genres.

 

[redcrayon]

Would have been nice if they included at least one proper adventure game on the list. Classic PC representation in general is dire but that's Edge for you.

It's really strange all round. On the front cover they put something like "The Best Modern Games" and so fair enough if their focus is on the flavour on the month, but then they still include stuff like A Link to the Past, Tetris and Earthbound.

I feel like Edge is very confused in general these days like they're trying to refind their identity.
The special edition is also very poor value for £12 by the way. Though the £5 online voucher improves that somewhat.

Well, I suppose they said 'the best modern classics', and what they mean is games that stand up today, outside of historical significance or starting a franchise/genre. LTTP is still one of the best games ever made nearly 25 years later, it's effortlessly replayable and accessible to today's audience. I still play it on a yearly basis. I don't think the Zelda developers have ever bettered it personally, it throws you immediately into everything that's great about Zelda without hours of slow pacing at the start.

 

[Anth0ny]

You what.

aw hell son

it's better than a stage creation tool

 

[Chibot]

This is one of the worst top 100 lists I've seen. Metroid Prime at 65? No mention of Fina Fantasy VI or VII? No Chrono Trigger? This is a list a hip uncle makes. He's trying but it's just not working.

 

[Scientist Supreme!]

yeah but the game is pretty much hinged on its community involvement. at the time this list was culled, i'm sure the best online stages they had were a bunch of automatic "DON'T PRESS ANYTHING" rube goldberg style stages. the game has had a significant turn around in level quality in the last few days as novelty has worn off and people are getting better with the toolset.

again, this is why a gestation period is sort of crucial to these lists.

We don't know when this list was made do we? Anyway, giving it a spot on the list may be due tools and presentation of game then its online feature. Which,to me anyway, is a valid way to look at it.

You're not being an asshole, and I honestly don't have the answer. It doesn't feel right to me, but that's not really an argument so I'll let it go.

Fair enough.

 

[gaiages]

They're talking about Saturn Bomberman.

Oh, well, that makes it a little better in that light.

throwing games that are less than a year old on a list like this is ridiculous. less than a fucking month is insanity. not far enough removed from the hype.

Especially for a title that's reliant on community content, which we have barely seen anything of yet.

 

[redcrayon]

This is one of the worst top 100 lists I've seen. Metroid Prime at 65? No mention of Fina Fantasy VI or VII? No Chrono Trigger? This is a list a hip uncle makes. He's trying but it's just not working.

I had to laugh at Her Story making it in at the end.

 

[flyinpiranha]

Good list of games, not of "all-time" though.

Driveclub being the best racing game of all time was a surprise.

 

[brandonh83]

I strongly like the idea of a list without nostalgia or historical significance taken into account.

But then it turns into "here's my favorite recent things" list rather than a legitimate, objective, taking all things into account list. It's very tailored. It's cute that Tetris was thrown in there in the top ten to make it look otherwise though.

 

[Plinko]

Edge overrating the LittleBigPlanet series again?

SHOCKING NEWS

Also, Super Mario 3D World belongs nowhere near that list.

 

[Zia]

So that would be "games to play today" not "modern games". They did a list like that in 2009. Maybe that's what they meant.

They didn't say modern games, they said modern classics, which in my mind indicates the classics at this point in time, ie the "games to play today" versus a bunch of new games.

 

[Regiruler]

Where the fuck is galaxy 1

 

[Firemind]

This is one of the worst top 100 lists I've seen. Metroid Prime at 65? No mention of Fina Fantasy VI or VII? No Chrono Trigger? This is a list a hip uncle makes. He's trying but it's just not working.

To be fair, I wouldn't want to play FFVI or VII today. Chrono Trigger, eh. Even LttP feels dated if it weren't for its immaculate level structure.

 

[silva1991]

Dark Souls starts out with shit gameplay till you start leveling up also

LOL no. the gameplay doesn't change at all. you only get a better gear that has a different moveset.


and then of course level up like any other rpg and ..... get gud


you really know nothing about the souls games.

 

[Vincent Grayson]

No RPGs until Skyrim at 25? What the fuck.

 

[Arion]

Bloodborne ahead of phantom pain and witcher 3 and no fallout in sight. We know what Edge's GOTY is gonna be.

 

[iconoclast]

I don't agree with a few of the game choices and pretty much all of the ordering, but that's always going to be the case with any top X list. At least this one is more interesting than the run of the mill Mario/Zelda/Metroid/Tetris/FF/TLOU lists that you always see.

It would be interesting if the people complaining posted their own lists, though.

 

[Ratrat]

Maybe he has a secret version of Dark Souls with skill trees and unlockable movesets.

 

[Balb]

Which version of Bomberman are they talking about?

 

[Magic Mushroom]

Bloodborne ahead of phantom pain and witcher 3 and no fallout in sight. We know what Edge's GOTY is gonna be.

And deservedly so.

 

[Dragon Puncher]

Pretty terrible list, half of these games are modern and novel now, but wouldn't even be considered on a top 100 made in 5 year times.

Also if you make a list filled to the brink with games that are only a few years or even months old, where the fuck is Rocket League!? The legit best multiplayer game to come out this year.

 

[Cheat Code]

aw hell son

it's better than a stage creation tool

Technically you can play stages too.

LOL no. the gameplay doesn't change at all. you only get a better gear that has a different moveset.


and then of course level up like any other rpg


you really know nothing about the souls games.

Well yeah they called Bloodborne "Bloodhound". They aren't even similar names.

Maybe he has a secret version of Dark Souls with skill trees and unlockable movesets.

Oh yeah a skill tree that would significantly improve Dark Souls.

LEVEL UP!!! SKILL POINT UNLOCKED!!!

WOULD YOU LIKE A SLIGHT DAMAGE BUFF OR A BIT MORE HEALTH!!!

 

[krYlon]

Well, I suppose they said 'the best modern classics', and what they mean is games that stand up today, outside of historical significance or starting a franchise/genre. LTTP is still one of the best games ever made nearly 25 years later, it's effortlessly replayable and accessible to today's audience. I still play it on a yearly basis. I don't think the Zelda developers have ever bettered it personally, it throws you immediately into everything that's great about it without hours of slow pacing at the start.

Yeah, I completely agree with A Link to the Past. Though I have seen a few people say that it hasn't aged well and Link's Awakening has aged better (I don't agree).
But, and I guess it's subjective and Edge have explained their criteria, I also think a lot of the Lucasarts adventure games are just as accessible and I have seen people pick those games up and play them a lot easier than say Demon's Souls that's for sure!
And I would argue that Earthbound is no more accessible than Planescape:Torment.

I think at the end of the day it depends what you're conditioned to. Also, I know Edge have always championed gameplay>all (though puzzle solving to me is gameplay too) so that's why they may not include some of those games but then they include Journey and Her Story

 

[Magic Mushroom]

It would be interesting if the people complaining posted their own lists, though.

I think it would be even more interesting if the people complaining would read the actual write-ups. Cause you know, context.

 

[xDUMPWEEDx]

I'm surprised they don't have The Order: 1886 in the top 5.