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News Drama Business Epic asks for injunction to restore Fortnite to the App Store while the court case proceeds

NinjaBoiX

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Aug 2, 2009
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The gall of these guys. They force the issue in the first place, then go crying to teacher when they inevitably see profits tumble.

“We want the court to give us preferential treatment while you decide if we can force Apple to give us preferential treatment.”



This says it all really, from the Eurogamer article:

In a letter dated 10th July 2020 and included in Epic's filing, Douglas G. Vetter, Vice President & Associate General Counsel for Apple said: "Surely Epic must understand that Apple is entitled to a return on its investment and the use of its property. After all, Epic takes great pains to protect its own investments and intellectual property.

"Yet somehow, you believe Apple has no right to do the same, and want all the benefits Apple and the App Store provide without having to pay a penny. Apple cannot bow to that unreasonable demand."
 

ReBurn

Member
Dec 6, 2008
12,301
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They won’t . Not in a million year . Not because it’s apple. But because they don’t have a ground .
They're trying to make the monopoly/antitrust argument. From a certain point of view they do have grounds. Apple not allowing customers a choice of where and how to purchase content for devices they own is a legit argument. Companies have had contracts invalidated by courts before. Companies have been forced to allow competition on their platforms. Apple's App Store has reached economy of scale and the piles of cash they are hoarding from it will work against them in the end. It might not be this case. But it will happen one day.
 

Fated_Crimson

Member
Jun 6, 2018
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I wonder this mess turned out much much bigger than what Epic was planning.

What's happening on the Google side?
I only see news/threads being made about the apple side.
I don't see anything really happening on the Google side since Android allows side loading apps. Google can just say "We won't put it in our store but you can still install it on your own" and be clear of any trouble.
 
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Same ol G

Member
Apr 24, 2017
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Epic is a joke, you should read their latest complain.

They are complaining that their own decision cost them 60% of ios users, you can't make this shit up.

From the article.
But in the new filing, Epic argues that more than its reputation has been harmed: “Daily active users on iOS have declined by over 60% since Fortnite’s removal from the App Store,” Epic claims.
 
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Abriael_GN

Member
Feb 26, 2019
2,071
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twinfinite.net
The gall of these guys. They force the issue in the first place, then go crying to teacher when they inevitably see profits tumble.

“We want the court to give us preferential treatment while you decide if we can force Apple to give us preferential treatment.”



This says it all really, from the Eurogamer article:

In a letter dated 10th July 2020 and included in Epic's filing, Douglas G. Vetter, Vice President & Associate General Counsel for Apple said: "Surely Epic must understand that Apple is entitled to a return on its investment and the use of its property. After all, Epic takes great pains to protect its own investments and intellectual property.

"Yet somehow, you believe Apple has no right to do the same, and want all the benefits Apple and the App Store provide without having to pay a penny. Apple cannot bow to that unreasonable demand."


Imagine actually siding with Apple in a dispute that could result in the actual developers of the games making more money out of their creations instead of having to fatten Apple's coffers as much as they do now. 🙄
 
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PaintTinJr

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Jan 30, 2020
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Imagine if Apple wins this argument and the very next day Microsoft and Google decide to lock Windows and Android in the same way.

In a world of such terrible wealth distribution and wealth unbalance, I wonder if backing those that have less wealth(the US people) than Apple, a $2 trillion dollar company (concentrated wealth, less competition and employment, etc) is a vote winner in the US at the moment.

The US have broken up such giants in the past and forced more competition in lesser situations than this, so will be interesting to see if they've changed their .
 

pasterpl

Member
Feb 8, 2020
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Imagine actually siding with Apple in a dispute that could result in the actual developers of the games making more money out of their creations instead of having to fatten Apple's coffers as much as they do now. 🙄

next Epic will sue sony to have epic games store as an alternative store on PlayStation consoles so that Sony cannot get the cut, because it is unfair that epic have to pay Sony. Imagine siding with Sony in that argument. (Replace Sony with any platform holder name)

/s

Imagine if Apple wins this argument and the very next day Microsoft and Google decide to lock Windows and Android in the same way.

In a world of such terrible wealth distribution and wealth unbalance, I wonder if backing those that have less wealth(the US people) than Apple, a $2 trillion dollar company (concentrated wealth, less competition and employment, etc) is a vote winner in the US at the moment.

The US have broken up such giants in the past and forced more competition in lesser situations than this, so will be interesting to see if they've changed their .

but isn’t google doing exactly the same thing? Unless you side load Apk files you are forced to use google play store where google takes a cut, same as Apple.
 

LeftThumbstick

Gold Member ~ I love GOOOLD!
Jun 21, 2020
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Imagine actually siding with Apple in a dispute that could result in the actual developers of the games making more money out of their creations instead of having to fatten Apple's coffers as much as they do now. 🙄
That’s because most of us function normally valuing logic over your hurt feelings towards corporations.

If you feel so bad about how much developers make, then feel free to create your own store and ecosystem for them instead of being passive aggressive to other forum users.
 
S

SLoWMoTIoN

Unconfirmed Member
I want to cheer for Epic but they lost the moment they just didn't abandon Apple rather then beg.
 
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PaintTinJr

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808
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next Epic will sue sony to have epic games store as an alternative store on PlayStation consoles so that Sony cannot get the cut, because it is unfair that epic have to pay Sony. Imagine siding with Sony in that argument. (Replace Sony with any platform holder name)

/s



but isn’t google doing exactly the same thing? Unless you side load Apk files you are forced to use google play store where google takes a cut, same as Apple.
You'd have to make separate anti-trust arguments for each that match their current power/influence situation against claimed capitalist and societal benefits you would get from acting against that company's current actions.

It is easy to see iOS would be a better option for general computing - in sectors such as government, hospitals, schools, assisted learning and gaming, to name a few.

I would also point out that Android's sideloading isn't good, but making the argument against that is different and harder IMHO
 
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Andodalf

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Oct 20, 2013
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They're trying to make the monopoly/antitrust argument. From a certain point of view they do have grounds. Apple not allowing customers a choice of where and how to purchase content for devices they own is a legit argument. Companies have had contracts invalidated by courts before. Companies have been forced to allow competition on their platforms. Apple's App Store has reached economy of scale and the piles of cash they are hoarding from it will work against them in the end. It might not be this case. But it will happen one day.


Exactly. People in this thread are idiots. Epic knew exactly what would happened, and what has happened exactly proves their antitrust arguments. You idiots are laughing at Epic for proving their point. Epic isn’t complaining about losing players, it’s showing how Apple is anti competitive, now with hard data.
 

FStubbs

Member
Aug 29, 2010
4,720
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I wonder this mess turned out much much bigger than what Epic was planning.

What's happening on the Google side?
I only see news/threads being made about the apple side.

You'd have to make separate anti-trust arguments for each that match their current power/influence situation against claimed capitalist and societal benefits you would get from acting against that company's current actions.

It is easy to see iOS would be a better option for general computing - in sectors such as government, hospitals, schools, assisted learning and gaming, to name a few.

I would also point out that Android's sideloading isn't good, but making the argument against that is different and harder IMHO

I can't see where they'd have a case on the Google side. Tencent is free to put Epic Game Store on Android and sell from there. Sideloading is perfectly legitimate - an Android user could bypass Google entirely and buy their MTX directly from Tencent through EGS. No court would argue against this IMO.
 
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Mistershine.

Member
Jan 20, 2018
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I wonder this mess turned out much much bigger than what Epic was planning.

What's happening on the Google side?
I only see news/threads being made about the apple side.
You can't get it from the Google store, you have to get it from epic.
 

//DEVIL//

Member
May 28, 2014
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They're trying to make the monopoly/antitrust argument. From a certain point of view they do have grounds. Apple not allowing customers a choice of where and how to purchase content for devices they own is a legit argument. Companies have had contracts invalidated by courts before. Companies have been forced to allow competition on their platforms. Apple's App Store has reached economy of scale and the piles of cash they are hoarding from it will work against them in the end. It might not be this case. But it will happen one day.
I would like to be stand corrected. which company before was forced to allow competition on thier platform ?
 

gamerguywashere

Neophyte
Aug 3, 2020
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I'm not picking sides. I can't think of many giant companies I care less about.


...but why pick a fight you can't win?...unless you're just trying to garner sympathy.


I do kinda love seeing greed come back to bite epic in the ass.


Now we get to watch these two assholes nickel and dime each other in court like they've both been doing to consumers. Fuck them both lol.
 

BlackTron

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Jun 30, 2016
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But in the new filing, Epic argues that more than its reputation has been harmed: “Daily active users on iOS have declined by over 60% since Fortnite’s removal from the App Store,” Epic claims.

I was in a bad mood from the lame Mario collection.

But now my Sunday is going great.
 
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Three

Member
Oct 26, 2014
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Why don't epic just make a browser based version, or add a 30‰ apple tax to their MTX prices?
The apple tax is there. They were removed from the app store for providing a way for the consumer to save 20% by not paying the Apple tax.
 

DaGwaphics

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Dec 29, 2019
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It is easy to see iOS would be a better option for general computing - in sectors such as government, hospitals, schools, assisted learning and gaming, to name a few.

Apple has a compelling argument regarding security and subsequent loss of value to all of these sectors.

People are kidding themselves if they don't think Epic would spin this around toward other platforms in a heartbeat following a win. IOS isn't even the dominant mobile OS by a large margin, if Apple is so bad to its consumers (and they are so unhappy with these practices) they can get an Android. Same for devs, don't like the rules? Then, don't participate in the game.
 

Sakura

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Feb 13, 2012
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I can't see them getting an injunction, because Epic is the one preventing the app from going back on the store. Apple has already said they'd put it back if they removed the Apple-bypassing payment option.
 

Cert.in.Death

Member
Jun 28, 2013
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Injunctive relief is rarely if ever granted and this doesn’t strike me as an instance that a judge would be willing to extend protection. What’s the problem with Epic being asked to comply in the interim while the issue is litigated, particularly in light of the fact that they instigated this response? A judge may go so far as to grant and deny in part, allowing the app be reinstated but without alternative avenues that bypass the App Store.

The real play for requesting an injunction is to force Apple to publicly defend their policies. It’s all about publicity, not substance, at least at this stage.
 

NinjaBoiX

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Aug 2, 2009
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Apple didn’t hoodwink them into signing an agreement, they didn’t change the rules after the fact, they didn’t purposely mislead with confusing language. They played the game absolutely fairly, even if their rules aren't as agreeable as people would like.

But you know what? Don’t play the game if you don’t like the rules. Or better yet, ask that they look at and change said rules BEFORE you pull on a shirt if you’re so concerned with the greater good.
People are kidding themselves if they don't think Epic would spin this around toward other platforms in a heartbeat following a win. IOS isn't even the dominant mobile OS by a large margin, if Apple is so bad to its consumers (and they are so unhappy with these practices) they can get an Android. Same for devs, don't like the rules? Then, don't participate in the game.
EXACTLY!
 

dorkimoe

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Aug 19, 2007
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They brought it on themselves. All they had to do was follow the rules and then create a lawsuit while the app still followed the rules making money while they waited. But no they tried to prove some point and lol