"You want us to obey and yet give us free will? why?"
Its my understanding as a muslim that this life is a trial or test if you will. He gave us free will i.e the ability to choose our beliefs and actions, and that he will eventually judge us based on those decisions we made.
The Quran contains a very interesting verse/ayat which I think relates to this discussion:
33:72 (We offered the trust to the heavens and the earth and the mountains, but they refused to carry it and were afraid of doing so; but man carried it. Surely he is wrong-doing, ignorant.)
A Prominent scholar gave the following commentary in his famous commentary/exegesis of the Quran:
"In the end, Allah wants man to realize his real position in the world; if in that position he regarded the life of the world as mere fun and sport and adopted a wrong attitude carelessly, he would only be working for his own doom. Here, the word 'amanat" (trust) implies khilafat (caliphate) which, according to the Qur'an, man has been granted in the earth. The inevitable result of the freedom given to man to choose between obedience and disobedience, and the powers and authority granted him over countless creations for using that freedom, is that he himself be held responsible for his voluntary acts and should deserve rewards for his righteous conduct and suffer punishment for his evil conduct. Since man has not attained these powers by his own efforts but has been granted these by Allah, and he is answerable before Allah for their right or wrong use, these have been described by the word khilafat at other places in the Qur'an, and by amanat here. In order to give an idea of how important and heavy this "trust" (amanat) is, Allah says that the heavens and the earth, in spite of their glory and greatness, and the mountains, in spite of their size and firmness, could not have the power and courage to bear it. But man, the weak and frail man, has borne this heavy burden on his tiny self. The presentation of the trust before the eanh and the heavens and their refusal to bear it and their being afraid of it may be taste literally, or it may have been said so metaphorically. We can neither know nor can comprehend Allah's relationship with His creations. The earth and the sun and the moon and the mountains are dumb, deaf and lifeless for us but they may not be so also for Allah. Allah can speak to each of His creations and it can respond to Him, though its nature is incomprehensible for us. Therefore, it is just possible that Allah, in fact, might have presented this heavy trust before them, and they might have shuddered to see it, and they might have made this submission before their Master and Creator. "Lord, we find our good and our convenience only in remaining as Your powerless servants: we do not find courage to ask for the freedom to disobey and do justice to it, and then suffer Your punishment in case we cannot do justice to it." Likewise, it is also quite possible that before this present life Allah might have given another kind of existence to mankind and summoned it before Himself, and it migln have willingly undertaken to accept the delegated powers and authority. We have no rational argument to regard this as impossible. Only such a person, who might have made a wrong estimate of his mental and intellectual powers and capabilities, can think of regarding it as impossible. However, this also is equally possible that Allah may have said so allegorically. In order to give an idea of the extraordinary importance of the matter, He may have depicted the scene as if the earth and the heavens and the mountains like the Himalayas were present before Him on one side and a 5 to Gfoot man, on the other. Then Allah might have asked: "I want to invest someone of My creation with the power that being a subject of My Kingdom, it may acknowledge My Supremacy and obey My Commands of its own free will; otherwise it will also have the power to deny Me, even rebel against Me. After giving him this freedom I shall so conceal Myself from him as if I did not exist at aII. And to exercise this freedom I shall invest him with vast powers, great capabilities, and shall give him dominion over countless of My creations so that he may raise any storm that he may in the universe. Then I shall call him to account at an appointed time. The one who will have misused the freedom granted by Me, will be made to suffer a most terrible punishment; and the one who will have adopted My obedience in spite of aII chances and opportunities for disobedience, will be raised to such high ranks as no creation of Mine has ever been able to attain. Now tell, which of you is ready to undergo this test?" Hearing this discourse a hush might have prevailed for a while all through the universe. Then one huge creation after the other might have bowed down and submitted that it should be excused from the severe test. Then, at last, this frail creation might have risen and submitted: "O my Lord, I am ready to undergo this test. I shall brave aII the dangers inherent in the freedom and independence only in the hope that I shall be blessed with the highest office in Your Kingdom if I pass the test. " By imagining this scene through his mind's eye only can man judge exactly what delicate position he holds in the universe. Allah in this verse has called the person °unjust and ignorant", who lives a carefree life in the place of test, and has no feeling at all of how great a responsibility he is shouldering, and what consequences he will encounter of the right or wrong decisions that he makes in choosing and adopting an attitude for himself in the life of the world. He is ignorant because the fool holds himself as responsible to no one; he is unjust because he is himself preparing for his doom and is also preparing the doom of many others along with him."
"I dunno... probably not. Bring on eternal damnation, I guess."
This is similar to what the people who opposed the Prophet Mohammed PBUH said to him during his time, basically saying If you are a true messenger and we are really denying the Truth, then you should not delay the torment with which you threaten us. (reffering to Allah/Gods punishment an chastisement)
Allah responded to them in the Quran saying
(29:53) "They ask you to hasten in bringing chastisement upon them. Had there not been an appointed term for it, the chastisement would have already visited them; in fact it will come down upon them all of a sudden (at its appointed time) while they will not be aware of it."
(29:54) "They ask you to hasten the chastisement upon them although Hell encompasses the unbelievers."
I know you were probably joking but to me it's interesting because of the similarity, please dont be offended either
"I'd worship him, while of course secretly thinking he's an asshole for it (I couldn't just magically choose to love him all of a sudden, regardless of my outward actions)"
I'm sure if you took some time to think of all the favors and bounties he bestowed on you such as life, seeing, hearing, thinking, comprehension, form, food, air, your family and the innumerable other blessings he gave you would come around. I find it facisinating that the word Allah uses in the Quran to describe a denier of the truth, in other words a disbeliever, is Kafir which is also used in the Quran to describe one who is ungrateful (implying ungrateful to God).
Also its hard to love someone you don't know, interestingly enough the first ayat that was revealed to the Prophet Mohammed PBUH was;
(96:1) "Recite in the name of your Lord Who created,"
commentary on this ayat states;
"The first verses of Surah Alaq (96) are of great importance, and on reflection there is great significance of this first revelation. ‘Read in the name of your Lord…..’, this is the first command for the whole of mankind. The Glorious Qur’an came as wisdom and a teaching for each and every person, living in every nation through every generation, right until ‘Qayamat’ - The Day of Judgement.
The first verses did not order us to pray, or fast or to pay Zakat, which are among the pillars of Islam but in fact the first commandment was to ‘Read’. The first duty in Islam to be revealed was to ‘Read‘, thus to acquire Knowledge."
In Islam we believe that the avenues to know the Creator are through revelation (Quran), what the Prophet PBUH told us about him and also through examining the creation, as The Prophet PBUH advised us "Do not contemplate about Allah but contemplate about Allah's creation."
as another more knowledgeable brother explained; "Our minds are very limited when it comes to thinking about Allaah Himself, once we look at what he has created and "taffakur" upon all of the creation, we will come to realize his greatness holds no bounds. The word "Taffakur" means to consider something carefully, to ponder deeply over it and to reason
It means do not think of "how" Allah is, what He looks like, etc. Instead think about His creation, how perfect He is and how detailed His creation is. How all the powers of the universe check one another and none can act without His permission etc."
"Being a God, he could then read my mind, and would probably throw me in hell anyway."
Allah says in the Quran: (67:13) "Whether you speak in secrecy or aloud, (it is all the same to Allah). He even knows the secrets that lie hidden in the breasts of people."
the commentary on this says: "The address is to all human beings, whether they are believers or unbelievers. For the believer it contains the admonition that while living his life in the world he should always remember that not only his open and hidden deeds but even his secret intentions and innermost thoughts are not hidden from Allah; and for the unbeliever the warning that he may do whatever he may please fearless of God, but nothing that he does can remain un-noticed and unseen by Him. "
Allah then says in the next verse (67:14) "Would He not know, He Who has created, when He is All-Subtle, All-Aware"
the scholarly commentary for that is also interesting: " Another translation can be: "Would He not know His own creatures?" In the original man khalaqa has been used, which may mean: "Who has created" as well as "whom He has created, " In both cases the meaning remains the same. This is the argument for what has been said in the preceding sentence. That is, how is it possible that the Creator should be unaware of His creation? The creation may remain unaware of itself, but the Creator cannot be unaware of it. He has made every vein of your body, every fibre of your heart and brain. You breathe because He enables you to breathe, your limbs function because He enables them to function, How then can anything of yours remain hidden from Him?
*22 The word Latif as used in the original means the One Who works in imperceptible ways as well as the One Who knows the hidden truths and realities. "
Also Allah says in the Quran “It was We Who created man, and We know what dark suggestions his soul makes to him: for We are nearer to him than his jugular vein.” (Surah Qaf, 50:16)
scholarly commentary: That is, "Our power and Our knowledge has so encompassed man from within and without that Our power and knowledge is closer to him than his own neck-vein. We do not have to travel from a distance to hear what he says, but We directly know every thought that arises in his heart. Likewise, when We shall want to seize him, We will not have to seize him after covering a distance, for wherever he is, he is in Our grasp; and whenever We will, We will seize him."
Allah is merciful though as The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said, “Allaah will forgive my ummah (followers) for any insinuating whispers that may cross their minds, so long as they do not act upon it or speak of it.” (Agreed upon).
of course in Islam good and proper intentions are a must, as intention is different than passing thoughts and God knows best.
"I'd want him to fix all the shit in the world before I'd worship him. Worshiping an asshole isn't in my wheelhouse."
http://www.suhaibwebb.com/personaldvlpt/purification-heart/the-dream-of-life/
http://www.suhaibwebb.com/personaldvlpt/reflections/this-life-a-prison-or-paradise/
http://www.suhaibwebb.com/personald...hment-reinterpreting-prosperity-and-hardship/
