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Evolution address DriveClub micro-transactions concern+ why 1080/30 is right decision
- Thread starter mocoworm
- Start date
LiquidNarwhal
Banned
GAF is on a roll today people are losing their minds over one thing or another in every thread today, 30 FPS is just fine, if you don't like it don't buy it. Seriously some of the hyperbole and shit slinging is unreal get a grip people.
SneakyStephan
Banned
The graphics are really impressive but they should've never put the graphics above the gameplay.
Also big talk about not having microtransactions influence game design but in the end they should've just put in cheatcodes.
Also big talk about not having microtransactions influence game design but in the end they should've just put in cheatcodes.
When you say 30 fps is "good enough", you seem to be implying that developers should make their games run at the minimum acceptable framerate in order to make the graphics as good as possible. If Wave Race's framerate (an ultra-cinematic 20 fps) is "good enough" as well, do you think Drive Club would be even better if it targeted the same 20 fps framerate with better graphics?
I don't think there's a developer in this industry who would truly think they can speak in any terms that would ever relate to everybody. But there certainly seem to be customers that expect that, somehow.
??? The items are free, if you choose to obtain them via the games natural progression system. Well, as free as not having to pay again on top of the price of the game.
I didn't say it's unplayable, I'm just not okay with choosing visual improvements over gameplay improvements and as a result won't be buying this game. I disagree completely with his reasoning.
Ok...? I'm just pointing out how ridiculous their explanation is.
Exactly. That's my point. Visually without motion blur, it won't look as smooth. With quality motion blur, it will look like it's 60. Our brains can adapt to the response time and I doubt most people can truly perceive a .016 second difference.
NFS rivals had other issues that added to latency of controls. It's not a straight "the game would have been perfect in controls if only it was 60fps".
#sixtiiquality
Tongue-in-cheek, of course, but I do wonder how much extra work a toggle would require? I guess part of the issue there is that means ensuring that the framerate is solid in *two* scopes rather than just one.
No it wont, even Forza Horizon which made very good use of motion blur could never reach the fluidity of 60fps, you're kidding yourself thinking otherwise.
Garrett Hawke
Member
I wasn't shitting on the Vita, I own one and it is one of my favourite consoles.
It's about both for me, 60fps games look better in motion than 30fps games even with all the fancy particles and bit bobs.
Muppet of a Man
Member
Was PGR or Motorstorm not a great playing racer?
BRocknRolla
Member
Just about every AAA could be said to be "pushing" next gen consoles. Anyone can build a game that's a huge resource draw. Any dev can jack up some aspect of the game, whether it be textures, lighting, particles, ect to make it nigh unplayable on current gen consoles. You can always build a more and more powerful pc to handle something like that. "Pushing" the consoles is really only a relevant thing when we're talking about a post years-of-optimizations-and-design-work system, when devs have fully figured out the intricacies of the system and can't find places to optimize anymore, and therefore are reaching the edges of what the systems are truly capable of. I don't think anyone believes we're there already. The whole "pushing" thing has come up from a number of devs as this point, but right now it's more PR than anything else.
Beer Monkey
Member
And like Motorstorm I will get your game when the whole fucking thing is free and not a moment sooner.
Man, it was a pain downloading dozens of cars individually to the Vita but whatever.
Man, it was a pain downloading dozens of cars individually to the Vita but whatever.
chrominance
Member
Setting the 30fps stuff aside: so if you're in a club you unlock cars very quickly. What if you're not in a club? Sounds increasingly like this game isn't for me with how integral the social stuff is to the experience. I don't have a bunch of friends with PS4s, let alone ones buying DriveClub, let alone ones who would play it with me on a reliable ongoing basis.
ZackieChan
Member
One person called it a "crime against humanity." It's an insult to actual crimes against humanity, like bad checkpointing.
Face it Tiger..
Banned
Or you know, include a cheatcode to unlock cars.
that is why people believe that you are nickel and diming them.
that is why people believe that you are nickel and diming them.
EatinOlives
Member
...until another racer comes along a couple years from now and looks objectively better than DC, making the tanking of the framerate completely moot in the long run.
Pretty graphics stop being pretty fast. A good framerate is good forever.
Hitokiri03
Member
Every time that I see something about this game I think
I wish they had made another Motorstorm instead of this.
I wish they had made another Motorstorm instead of this.
PGR1 was very good at 60fps
This isn't helping, as PGR1 is easily the worst in the series.
Dr Mayonnaise
Member
This. When did gaming become about resolution and lighting effects instead of how smooth and responsive is it, are the mechanics good, is the story good? I am not saying that you cant have fun with a 30 FPS racing game as I loved Forza Horizon, but when you sacrifice how responsive and smooth your game runs for visual effects that most people wont notice while playing there is a problem. DC could have been 1080/60 and still looked amazing.
It's not exactly "visual effects that most people won't notice while playing" though. I'd imagine pretty much everyone notices the visual differences between Forza Motorsport 4 and Forza Horizon.. and that's the result of going with 30fps instead of 60fps.
I definitely prefer 60fps racers in general, but it's not like the visual gains made by going with a 30fps game aren't easily noticeable.
Nope that's 3.
Dr Mayonnaise
Member
I highly doubt that most people will notice the clouds (unless you are driving though them), I doubt people will notice the rainbow lighting effect on the head lamps while driving, I bet most people wont notice the view distance and far off vistas while driving, and I doubt people will notice the crowd in any spot than the starting line. Again I am not saying DC will be a bad game but the devs say they are offering a premium experience and it's a flat out lie unless you truly believe graphics are more important than game play.
BumblebeeCody
Member
But people are always looking to support companies....
....for some reason even when it NEVER benefits them. It still surprises me that people will defend the idea of Seasons Pass/Microtransacations/Pre-order bonuses/disk locked content. Have a backbone.
The argument of "If you don't x then don't y it". Wow, so good. So good. 30FPS isn't fine.
Sounds like he's trying to politely say "don't blame us Sony made us put in micro-transactions". I hope that's the case inasmuch as the game really is designed without them in mind and they've just been shoved in to grab money from those who'll immediately stump up to get cars quicker.
Truth should be obvious once game releases anyway.
As for the fps I'll wait and see with the Plus version. I'd prefer 60fps but if it feels okay at 30fps and I like it then I'll get it - I'm not going to skip the game if its good and fun and perfectly playable just on principle about frame rate.
I will gripe later about frame rate if the Plus version makes it clear 60fps would have been better with reduced visuals.
Truth should be obvious once game releases anyway.
As for the fps I'll wait and see with the Plus version. I'd prefer 60fps but if it feels okay at 30fps and I like it then I'll get it - I'm not going to skip the game if its good and fun and perfectly playable just on principle about frame rate.
I will gripe later about frame rate if the Plus version makes it clear 60fps would have been better with reduced visuals.
Not compared to all the big 60 fps racers that came after no.
So, Driveclub looks a heck of a lot better than Project Cars (and is using real next gen assets and rendering to boot)
Project Cars is a little more tame, is dialed into Sim, and has the preformance edge.
Both offer substantially different gameplay.
Sounds like a great fall. Something for everyone!
Project Cars is a little more tame, is dialed into Sim, and has the preformance edge.
Both offer substantially different gameplay.
Sounds like a great fall. Something for everyone!
We better stop here before I get violent.
Technically the worst is MSR actually.
I'd imagine the lighting is a large part of the cause for it being 30fps, which is why I used Horizon as an example. Also, I think it's less about you noticing it being there, it's more that you notice when it isn't.
I don't believe graphics are more important than gameplay. Daytona USA is still my favourite racer ever. However the idea of what makes a premium experience isn't something universally agreed upon, and for a lot of people premium graphics is actually more appealing. Look how consistently people clown Forza 5 here. It's not really a bad looking game considering it refuses to budge from 60fps at all times, but most people don't give a shit, so I can understand why a dev may opt for a lower fps so they can have more bells and whistles to grab people's attention. If the graphical differences really were unnoticeable then we'd have seen more successes for 60fps non-sim racers up to this point.
After? What games are we referring to here?
plutoknight
Member
I'm hoping for this. I thought Forza Horizon played like a dream, even at 30FPS, I don't see the -huge- issue with 30FPS on DriveClub.
The MT stuff on the other hand? Eh. Long as it isn't shoved down my throat.
NullPointer
Member
Yep.
wsoxfan1214
Banned
Didn't have an issue with NFS being 30 fps and I doubt I will here. Don't get all of the people complaining about it, especially if the input lag was reduced well.
Then again, I've always been bad at telling the difference between 60 and 30 unless it's pointed out to me.
Then again, I've always been bad at telling the difference between 60 and 30 unless it's pointed out to me.
drugstore_cowboy
Member
Is there only 50 cars in the game?
My annoyance comes from the active pandering early on in the promotional circuit where they said the game wouldn't contain the sorts of micro-transactions that are now in the game. The distinction between paying money to unlock a car already in the game, and paying money for in-game currency only designed for that same purpose is a spurious one.
That said, I'm buying the hell out of this game, barring some unforeseen issue with its quality.
That said, I'm buying the hell out of this game, barring some unforeseen issue with its quality.
LiquidNarwhal
Banned
How else would you like to change the trend of 30FPS games, hunger strike, picketing, twitter campaign? I find 30FPS acceptable that's how opinions work, we don't have to agree. Also writing off my argument without actually providing counterpoints is a waste of a comment.