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Fargo - Season 3 - Brothers, Bridge, and Backstabbing in 2010 Minnesota - Wed on FX

ZOONAMI

Junior Member
Nov 4, 2013
9,396
0
0
Saint Paul, MN
DC killing the IRS investigation into Stussy Lots I'd say the odds are pretty high someone would come and tell him sorry for the inconvenience you're free to go.
 

Einchy

semen stains the mountaintops
Jun 21, 2010
23,747
2
790
I'm not sure if I feel like Emmit Stussy deserved to get got, in one way he kinda did for killing his brother and MEW deserved revenge, but everything kinda happened without him wanting it to happen.

I know a lot of you guys are down on this season but I thoroughly enjoyed it.
 

traveler

Not Wario
Oct 22, 2006
14,563
0
0
Emmit being blamed for his brother's death is a stretch. It's clearly an accident, and, if anyone is to blame for it, it's Ray for escalating the situation into a physical accident in the first place when Emmit is doing everything in his power to resolve the situation peacefully. That the glass breaks in such a way to even lethally threaten Ray is a freak occurence. Furthermore, even once it occurs, Emmit tries to get Ray to leave the glass in, which could have saved his life while Emmit went for help, but Ray screws that up too. I'd say total accident or Ray's fault; Emmit gets no blame.
 

Sectorseven

Member
Jun 14, 2013
8,518
2
0
Emmit being blamed for his brother's death is a stretch. It's clearly an accident, and, if anyone is to blame for it, it's Ray for escalating the situation into a physical accident in the first place when Emmit is doing everything in his power to resolve the situation peacefully. That the glass breaks in such a way to even lethally threaten Ray is a freak occurence. Furthermore, even once it occurs, Emmit tries to get Ray to leave the glass in, which could have saved his life while Emmit went for help, but Ray screws that up too. I'd say total accident or Ray's fault; Emmit gets no blame.

I thought that too, but I guess a big theme this season is reality and perception are two different thing.
 

Einchy

semen stains the mountaintops
Jun 21, 2010
23,747
2
790
I thought that too, but I guess a big theme this season is reality and perception are two different thing.

“Thirty years I been killin’ him. That was just when he fell.”

Emmit's perception is that he killed him, I mean, he could logically try and tell himself that it wasn't his fault, but he knows it was. He was ready to die on that road for what he did.
 

Bandit1

Member
Sep 10, 2012
2,537
1
0
So with the theme of "truth" this season, or alternative facts, I think the takeaway from the ending scene is that we're supposed to make our own truth as to whether it plays out Varga's way or Burgle's way. The truth is what we want it to be.
 

UrbanDandy

Member
Jan 14, 2014
4,817
1
0
So with the theme of "truth" this season, or alternative facts, I think the takeaway from the ending scene is that we're supposed to make our own truth as to whether it plays out Varga's way or Burgle's way. The truth is what we want it to be.

Mind blown. (no disrespect)

You're right. This season's been pretty consistent with that theme.
 
May 2, 2010
2,341
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0
What a cheap copout to fade to black. Tell your goddamn story, it's not fun if I have to make up my own ending. Worse than s1 & s2 for me. Had some highs, but just didn't have the same story telling competence of previous seasons.
 

Speevy

Banned
Jun 26, 2004
62,858
1
0
With the way this season has gone, why not just call Mr. Wrench and have him off Varga in front of everyone?
 

hydruxo

Member
Nov 2, 2013
13,039
1
395
Definitely the weakest of the 3 seasons so far, but still pretty good. I'd be cool with Hawley putting the series on ice for a while (or permanently tbh) and doing something new along with Legion.
 

RatskyWatsky

Hunky Nostradamus
Feb 27, 2010
40,307
0
1,010
The last few episodes were good, but they couldn't make up for the rest of the season's mediocrity. I feel like Hawley has done all he can with Fargo - time to move on to other things.
 

TripOpt55

Member
Nov 7, 2008
5,686
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Didn't really like the ambiguous ending. I'm not against them in all cases, but would have preferred something more definitive here personally. The season as a whole was still entertaining, but not as good as the first two. My favorite parts were the bits with Nikki and Wrench together, the best scene being that opening fifteen minutes of the one episode when the transport got flipped and their ensuing escape.
 
Jun 13, 2014
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I'm glad Nikki fucking Swango got got, her character was just all over the place in abilities and the fact she was willing to shoot a cop shows she is hardly an avenging angel, just another scumbag who will kill anyone. That cop's red uniform was crisp and gorgeous. I was sorta ambivalent about Emitt dying, while he definitely deserved it I think Mr. Wrench killing him 5 years later is a bit ... contrary. Did he repent and do good things? I guess thats life, but just felt unsatisfying.

It is sorta interesting that the end is what you make of it, but given that VM Varga has shifted heaven and earth in the past (the text from a mysterious source about the IRS, the fact he got out of the country, has been running around for 5 years, etc) suggests his money will continue to buy his freedom. Its too bad we never really got an understanding of WHY he continues to amass money while trying to stay under the radar, that would have been a very important part of the puzzle of what makes him tick.

Its definitely chrono order for me in terms of season quality, 1 > 2 > 3. 1 & 2 were both really good for different reasons, 3 just had way too many mis steps, bad episodes, bad characters, and bad story arcs for it to stand with the other two.

If they do another season I hope they get rid of that "THIS IS BASED ON A TRUE STORY" stuff, it really got grating by the end.
 

Cornballer

Member
Jul 21, 2006
68,409
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- Sepinwall: ‘Fargo’ Creator Noah Hawley On What Was Real, And What Might Have Been Real, About Season Three
The previous two seasons have ended with a fair amount of closure on what happens to everyone. This one at least leaves ambiguous who will come through the door and what that means for Varga. Why did you decide to go that particular route?

Some of it is in what you just said, which is that there’s a certain way that the first two years have ended that’s consistent, and I think you never want to take it for granted that it has to end the same way. I always joke that Fargo is a tragedy with a happy ending. But that ending in this case is up to you. It could be a happy ending if you’re an optimist, and it could be a darker ending if you’re a pessimist. There’s a degree to which I wanted to engage the audience in that question of does it end well or does it end poorly, and if you think it ends poorly, then maybe you’ll think about why you think it ends poorly. There’s a degree to which I feel like it’s okay to engage the audience actively in the story.

But do you feel that, in making so much of the season be about how the world doesn’t make sense anymore and rules don’t apply, maybe you’ve primed the audience to expect Varga’s version to come through the door?

Well, he’s winning so far on some levels and we see in that moment after Emmit has learned that he is free to go, that it appears that Varga has power over reality itself, so he’s not even willing to say his name out loud. I think there’s a degree to which Varga has proven to be the mastermind that he believes he is, but I also think that we’ve underlined that to some degree with Nikki and this woman from Podunk, No Place who almost got him, that there’s a sense of, “No, he’s mortal. We saw him sweat.” And Gloria is not to be underestimated, and she could win. I think it was very important in sculpting that last scene that after he says “Goodbye,” she looks for a moment like he won and then the smile comes back where she thinks “No, no, I’m going to get him.” You know, that if you’re presenting the audience with a choice, they have to really feel like both things are possible.
You’ve talked recently about whether you might do a fourth season and how hard it is to come up with ideas each year. Having done that third episode in LA, and it being received as well as it was, has that made you consider the idea that if you do another year, it might not have to be set entirely or even predominantly in Minnesota?

I haven’t thought about that too much. I mean, I always joke that I’m going to do Fargo: Tuscany, but I do think there’s some degree to which winter and that isolation of the Midwest in winter is character in it, but there’s no physical way to have snow from the beginning of the season to an end, because it takes five months to shoot and our second year was predominately without snow and we wrapped in June.

It’s possible. I think that if I saw any real negativity about this season early on, it was that it’s a little familiar now, like the accents and some of the archetypes, and I guess part of the challenge for me in trying to conceive of 10 more hours of this, is to say, “Well, we don’t want to repeat ourselves and we don’t it to be so familiar and we don’t people to go, ‘Oh yeah, it’s the shtick and it’s funny and then it’s not and then it is again.'” You don’t want to be predictable and you don’t want it to become a thing. I’m always interested in exploring the boundaries of this Fargo story and what it can do and what it can be, and maybe setting it someplace else is one of the ways to do it, but I just don’t know.
- Deadline: ‘Fargo’ EP Noah Hawley On Open-Ended Finale, Potential Season 4 & ‘Cat’s Cradle’
- Variety: ‘Fargo’ Finale: Creator Noah Hawley Talks Season 3 and Possible Future
- NY Times: Actor David Thewlis on the ‘Fargo’ Season Finale, V.M. Varga and Greed
- THR: ‘Fargo’ Creator Goes Inside Season 3 Finale and Offers Hope for Franchise’s Future
I’m interested in this as a season of interrogation rooms, starting with the East German scene and ending in the DHS facilities. Was the bookending structure always on your mind?

Yeah, I knew very early on that the season was gonna end in that room and it was gonna end with us looking at a clock and the door and it was gonna end with the audience having to make a choice as to whether they believed this was gonna end well or badly. Then, as it came time to design that final room, we did design that final interview room to have the exact same dimensions as the opening room. Obviously it's a very different room, but there was a sense, an echo, that we were looking for.
 

Maengun1

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Dec 13, 2014
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I agree this was the weakest season, but I think things kicked up sufficiently in the last 3 eps to where I wouldn't say weakest by far at the end. And I happen to be a fan of ambiguous endings for the most part, lol.

I hope this isn't the end though it's looking that way. This is certainly a show that could take an extended hiatus and then come back whenever though
 

Fury451

Banned
May 1, 2012
11,857
4
0
Cleveland, OH
If they do another season I hope they get rid of that "THIS IS BASED ON A TRUE STORY" stuff, it really got grating by the end.

No way, that's practically a main character at this point.

If I remember correctly, the Coens also used it as a framing device to encourage the audience to suspend disbelief. That works for the show too, in a different way
 

UrbanDandy

Member
Jan 14, 2014
4,817
1
0
Man did they absolutely waste Carrie Coon this season.

Yep. Never have I seen a character so shafted. couldn't even let her have the last moment.

Also, as I've posted before, I related more to Ray than to Emmit, and after all that's happened, I really felt bad for Emmit. I thought the end of his arc should have ended with him and his family. Swango had the opportunity to turn her life around, but her zealousness got the better of her, and I felt as a viewer that I could not sympathize for her.

Technically it was superb from a scenic, cinematographic level. The story however, just couldn't get over itself.
 

Speevy

Banned
Jun 26, 2004
62,858
1
0
If I remember correctly, the Coens also used it as a framing device to encourage the audience to suspend disbelief. That works for the show too, in a different way

At no point in the movie Fargo did anything happen that approaches the jaw-dropping ridiculousness of this show.

The events in Fargo are unbelievable because they're funny in a very dark way, but you totally buy into them.

Now that the show is mercifully over, I have to just say that Noah Hawley missed a great many deceptively simple points the film makes pretty well. He tried to create a kind of Coen-verse and there are references to everything from Blood Simple and The Big Lebowski to No Country for Old Men and A Serious Man in this series, but the Coens do not work like this. Their films stand alone very well within themselves. They do not often repeat their own beats so often that they become stale, nor do they devolve into self-parody.

I don't fault the show for wanting to be its own thing, nor do I fault it for wanting to borrow from the Coens. What I fault it for is hardly ever being very funny, which the Coens often are even in their more serious movies. I fault it for rarely being very suspenseful, which the Coens often are even in their funny movies. There are more suspenseful and funny scenes in Burn After Reading than there are in this season.

Fargo isn't a movie about a female police officer who can't solve the case of the stupid greedy murderer, nor is it about aw-shucks Minnesota nice people reacting in quirky ways to grisly homicides.

It's a perfectly pitched dark comedy about a murder in a small town. It works because of its small cast and a pair of Oscar-caliber performances from William H. Macy and Frances McDormand. It works because the Coens' bleak and moody lensing create a feeling of desperation and suspense for the characters even as you're laughing at it.

One thing Fargo doesn't have is a single character who drones on endlessly about his philosophy on life. Dialogue is always related directly to the plot, even as it is delving into weightier themes.
 

Grizzlyjin

Supersonic, idiotic, disconnecting, not respecting, who would really ever wanna go and top that
Jun 23, 2004
24,048
40
0
Loved how Gloria saw through his bullshit Russian phrase. They really didnt do enough with Carrie Coon this season

They really didn't. Her character Nora in The Leftovers is pretty good at calling out bullshit too, would've been nice to see more of that in the Gloria character.

Oddly enough, Emmit's murder is the one that doesn't really sit right with me. Ray's death was a pure accident. Otherwise he was a victim of Varga. They never wanted to go along with the borrowing scheme. Emmit had an incredibly brief lapse when he didn't trust Cy. But that's it. I don't know, Emmit's murder just didn't feel "earned." As much as I loved Nikki Swango, she most definitely earned her death in the first episode with the A/C kill.

Good season overall. They got things back on track near the end, but I still feel like the finale was a bit of a stumble. I'd be okay with the show being put on ice for awhile until the right idea comes along.
 

LotusHD

Banned
Aug 27, 2016
21,135
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0
Like others have said, the weakest season easily. And that's putting aside the fact that I really dislike ambiguous endings...
 

Ross61

Member
May 17, 2015
5,300
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360
Don't know about y'all, but I really enjoyed this season. If they decide to end the series in that, I would also be okay. Noah Hawley has blessed us with a classic.
 

Kadayi

Banned
Oct 10, 2012
11,977
15,134
1,225
Discord : Kadayi#0650
I thought within itself the episode was decent but at the same time I think the season was pretty uneven and as a result, I can get people's frustrations with it.

I'd like to see more Fargo. Though I think a hiatus wouldn't be a bad idea at this juncture.
 

Martinski43

Member
Apr 26, 2016
2,577
733
590
At first the whole dealings with Stussys company and that whole thing was wholly uninteresing. I dont watch Fargo for finance drama. Was uninteresting until that whole house of cards started to falling.

Also the over the top violence that was so entertaining in the first 2 seasons was so toned down here. Instead we got a disgusting brit with bad teeth that likes to run his mouth.
 

Grinchy

Banned
Aug 3, 2010
27,705
19,113
1,305
a cave outside of Whoville.
Well, that finale was as mediocre as I should have expected. What a letdown of a season.

At least we'll always have the first 2 seasons. It's a good thing the Coen brothers don't watch this show. It would be a real shame if they started with this season.
 

Bladenic

Member
Sep 13, 2011
23,698
12
750
Oh this is already done? Need to watch.

How was Mary Elizabeth Winstead? Comparable to Kirsten Dunst (in acting, not necessarily her character)?
 
Aug 3, 2013
4,124
0
520
Canada
The performances in this season were so damn good. Great season overall - just a few weird plot moments.

Emmett's car breaks down and then later he gets in and drives away?
 

Kadayi

Banned
Oct 10, 2012
11,977
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Emmett's car breaks down and then later he gets in and drives away?

Yeah, that somewhat irksome. The assumption is Nikki rigged his car in some fashion so it would breakdown. Also, he smashed his phone up, but it wasn't clear if he picked it up.


Why did it take that hitman 5 years to kill Emmit?

“And the Yak, they can afford to move so fucking slow, man, they’ll wait years and years. Give you a whole life, just so you’ll have more to lose when they come and take it away. Patient like a spider. Zen spiders.”
― William Gibson, Neuromancer
 
Jun 1, 2016
5,531
0
0
I did not like the ending. I think Hawley wanted to end with Varga "winning" but was too afraid to pull the trigger so he copped out and said "it's up to the audience's world view". Make a statement, damn it. I don't think this is interesting ambiguity from a narrative perspective.


edit: thinking about it more it does tie in thematically with the subjective nature of reality, I don't hate it. I guess I'm okay with it. But it was definitely not cathartic, which is fine I guess.
 

IronRinn

Member
Mar 8, 2007
8,688
0
1,305
I think that three might be the weakest but it might also be the one in most need of a re-watch now that we have a cap on it's themes. As jon_i634 pointed out the show was pretty explicit in its intention to examine what makes something true and how your concepts of how the world does or should function affect reality. I don't know if this season was as...satisfying as the two the preceded it (certainly not in the traditional Fargo sense, surely) but I enjoyed it a lot regardless.

I thought it was interesting, as someone pointed out in the comments of the AV Club review, that Nikki is unstoppable, even divinely protected, until her perception of reality causes her to seek vengeance on the wrong person. Paul Marrane gives her a speech which she will remember at the right time but she doesn't, because it's not the right time and it's not the right person. No doubt that speech was meant for Varga and her divine protection was withdrawn when she went after an "innocent" man.

I usually hate ambiguous endings but I thought that one worked really well. And, as previously noted, I loved the character of VM Varga and Thewlis's performance (everyone did a good job, as usual for this show).

It's definitely something that gets better to me the more I think about it. If this is the last season, it would be an appropriate one. In this day and age Fargo's sense of justice perhaps no longer applies.
 

schadenfood

Member
Sep 20, 2012
301
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Did I misread the last scene with Emmitt? Did he go on to marry Sy's wife and have children with her, while Sy came out of his coma a shell of a man? That seemed like the darkest turn on an already dark finale.

EDIT: Or, he got back together with his wife with whom he already had children. Right? Says a lot about the characters this season that I had sort of forgotten that he had a wife since they all shuffled off earlier in the season...
 

tauroxd

Member
Oct 1, 2011
2,062
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675
Venezuela
“And the Yak, they can afford to move so fucking slow, man, they’ll wait years and years. Give you a whole life, just so you’ll have more to lose when they come and take it away. Patient like a spider. Zen spiders.”
― William Gibson, Neuromancer

Awesome.
 

iddqd

Member
Mar 17, 2007
3,001
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Glad this is over, S03 for me was nothing but a shadow of the greatness of the last season.

Hoping they take a long break or just stop.
 
Aug 2, 2007
15,210
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So what do people think were the meanings behind the following:

Varga's loathing of waste but at the same time his bulimia, garrulousness and his desire to accumulate wealth (wasted in that it's unused) were his defining character traits.

Gloria not being picked up by motion sensors before the bar conversation.

Ray Wise's whole thing.
 

IggyChooChoo

Member
Apr 26, 2016
1,520
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0
So what do people think were the meanings behind the following:

Varga's loathing of waste but at the same time his bulimia, garrulousness and his desire to accumulate wealth (wasted in that it's unused) were his defining character traits.

Gloria not being picked up by motion sensors before the bar conversation.

Ray Wise's whole thing.
I definitely thought the Ray Wise thing was going to pay off at the end with some sort of Minnesota Jewish vengeance on Varga.
 

Intheflorsh

Banned
Oct 31, 2012
11,645
0
0
I think the ending is fine in theory, but extremely unsatisfying as the payoff to an unfocused and meandering season. If season one had an ending like this (instead of the far too tidy one we got) I would have appreciated it a lot more.

So what do people think were the meanings behind the following:

Varga's loathing of waste but at the same time his bulimia, garrulousness and his desire to accumulate wealth (wasted in that it's unused) were his defining character traits.

Gloria not being picked up by motion sensors before the bar conversation.

Ray Wise's whole thing.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯
 

Ruruja

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Feb 27, 2014
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360
Although I didn't think the season was that great, the final episode was a 10/10. I'm not a massive cinematography buff but that was amazingly directed from start to finish, some fantastic shots.