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[jett]

http://www.stltoday.com/news/local/...cle_a2893384-0bcf-51a9-b479-9c7e9496c6a1.html

This is insane.

 

[Dreams-Visions]

Everyone seems to love reaching for a weapon when cops point guns at them...

That story is just sickening

To be quite honest, my first reaction if I'm in a tussle and someone reaches for a gun would be to push their hand away from me. This could be interpreted as "reaching for the gun", but no...I'm just trying to keep the gun muzzle from pointing at me. Similar motion, very different intent.

Best solution: don't point a fucking gun at people within arm's reach. People will react to protect themselves.

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

They can start by not shooting innocent people standing in the area, including other cops.

Maybe not fire so indiscriminately that they not only shoot the suspect, but also a fellow cop and kill an innocent woman?

He shouldn't have a gun if he can't aim/handle it properly in a situation. But the act of shooting at a drunk waving a gun seems justified to me. That's a question of competence, not one of right and wrong. We also know nothing of the specific situation.

 

[MikeDown]

anyone got any links to listen to Ferguson police scanner?

 

[Black Republican]

did anyone bring up if Brown was mentally ill when he stole the cigars? he could have been!

 

[ahoyle77]

So what should cops do to subdue an belligerent drunk waving a gun around?

I'd blame the gun laws that allow people to have handguns in the first place, not the cops.

This would be a non story if the cop had just shot the suspect. Hopefully once, since he wasn't being fired back at. The cop only escalated the situation and got innocent people killed and hurt. They are paid, and presumably trained, to protect and serve the innocent. Not to kill bad guys.

 

[Badosh]

did anyone bring up if Brown was mentally ill when he stole the cigars? he could have been!

Only white people can be mentally ill. Come on.

 

[Bam Bam Baklava]

Can't believe we will soon be hitting the 20k post limit.

 

[PHOENIXZERO]

Only white people can be mentally ill. Come on.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/09/13/milton-hall-shooting-officers-charges_n_1880197.html

 

[Spring-Loaded]

He shouldn't have a gun if he can't aim/handle it properly in a situation. But the act of shooting at a drunk waving a gun seems justified to me. That's a question of competence, not one of right and wrong. We also know nothing of the specific situation.

Cops shouldn't shoot innocent bystanders, end of fucking story. No one who places utmost importance on human life gives a fuck how "understandable" the officer's mistakes were.

Tell me how a cop killing an innocent bystander is in any way acceptable.

 

[soundahfekz]

He shouldn't have a gun if he can't aim/handle it properly in a situation. But the act of shooting at a drunk waving a gun seems justified to me. That's a question of competence, not one of right and wrong. We also know nothing of the specific situation.

An innocent bystander was killed and another cop was shot from an officer firing indiscriminately (to which he still did not kill his target), but we don't know anything about the specific situation?

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

An innocent bystander was killed and another cop was shot from an officer firing indiscriminately (to which he still did not kill his target), but we don't know anything about the specific situation?

Like, where everyone was positioned, how many shots fired and how quickly, etc.

 

[Agnostic]

Does anyone know of a livestream of the police raiding the church right now?

 

[commedieu]

Does anyone know of a livestream of the police raiding the church right now?

..are they going for an all time high score...

 

[kirblar]

Vox: How for-profit policing led to racial disparities in Ferguson

 

[Verger]

Does anyone know of a livestream of the police raiding the church right now?

From: http://www.reddit.com/live/tdrph3y49ftn/

Just for your information...there was a report of St. Mark's Church being raided by police...seems like it has been proven to be false from multiple sources

 

[Agnostic]

..are they going for an all time high score...

I don't know if the report is true so i am searching for feeds and journalist reports which is still muddy with facts.



edit: they raided the church because people might be sleeping there? lololololololol I hope this is bullshit. lololololololol
https://twitter.com/jelani9

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

Cops shouldn't shoot innocent bystanders, end of fucking story. No one who places utmost importance on human life gives a fuck how "understandable" the officer's mistakes were.

Tell me how a cop killing an innocent bystander is in any way acceptable.

Again, we know virtually no details. Where was the bystander? Was this a shot through a wall? Was the drunk apparently about to shoot?

I'm not advocating blind-fire into crowds. And an officer who can't keep his cool and/or aim is indeed at fault. But we don't know that that''s what happened yet, unless there's some source I missed.

If you can't conceive of a reasonable way that this could be a justifiable accident while having the best intentions, then you are biased off the bat.

And I'm not a random "not all cops" guy, I just think it's ridiculous the response with so few details.

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

Revised-- we did know how many times he shot, and we know they tried a taser first.

I guess what we don't know if where people were or how the victim was struck.

 

[Spring-Loaded]

Oh, okay. That makes sense.

 

[ahoyle77]

Like, where everyone was positioned, how many shots fired and how quickly, etc.

According to someone that listened to the 911 call, you can hear 9 shots in approximately 2 seconds. Haven't listened to it myself, so take that with a grain of salt. Nine shots is confirmed though. No excuse for shooting 9 times at someone that wasnt firing back. And you shouldn't shoot into a crowded situation unless you were fired upon first.

 

[Malyse]

My question is how is it that you still have people defending the officers in Ferguson when time and time again they show that they care nothing about the law and only a display of power.

It's not that hard to imagine that Darren killed MB in cold blood when we see exactly how his brothers in blue treat even journalists let alone a black man.

Get out of here with all that logic and making sense.

 

[cackhyena]

So Wilson was hospitalized with an orbital blowout? Someone just told me this. Don't now anything about it.

 

[Zoe]

According to someone that listened to the 911 call, you can hear 9 shots in approximately 2 seconds. Haven't listened to it myself, so take that with a grain of salt. Nine shots is confirmed though. No excuse for shooting 9 times at someone that wasnt firing back. And you shouldn't shoot into a crowded situation unless you were fired upon first.

They're trained to empty the clip.

 

[CassidyIzABeast]

So Wilson was hospitalized with an orbital blowout? Someone just told me this. Don't now anything about it.

sounds like bullshit because Chief Wiggum would have said something about it during the smear campaign portion of his press conference a few days ago.

 

[Veritigo_X]

So Wilson was hospitalized with an orbital blowout? Someone just told me this. Don't now anything about it.

The only thing we know right now is that Wilson was hospitalized. If it was an orbital blowout they would be singing that from the rooftops.

 

[Gaz_RB]

Vox has had really great pieces on this. I never read them before, but they certainly have a new reader now.

 

[victreeb3l]

I really do wonder what goes through the mind of the cops when they see something like that, from kids, directed at them.

Probably mock them, same way they've been mocking adult protestors.

 

[commedieu]

They're trained to empty the clip.

But missed the training to not shoot their partner, shoot taser at loose clothing, and kill a innocent bystander.

New training and cameras are in order.

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

sounds like bullshit because Chief Wiggum would have said something about it during the smear campaign portion of his press conference a few days ago.

The only source I've seen for the orbital blowout was unnamed sources in a story on a right-wing site.

I'll believe it when there's evidence of it.

 

[Veritigo_X]

They're trained to empty the clip.

This isn't true. They're trained to fire until there is no longer a threat. Emptying the clip after one shot is fired no matter what is idiotic and gets people killed.

 

[Ignatz Mouse]

But missed the training to not shoot their partner, shoot taser at loose clothing, and kill a innocent bystander.

New training and cameras are in order.

Like, yesterday.

I understand some arguments against them, but for god's sake the pros outweigh the cons 100:1.

 

[Jacksinthe]

Like, yesterday.

I understand some arguments against them, but for god's sake the pros outweigh the cons 100:1.

Hmmmm... Out of curiosity what are the arguments against them?

 

[soundahfekz]

Revised-- we did know how many times he shot, and we know they tried a taser first.

I guess what we don't know if where people were or how the victim was struck.

I guess we should start actually reading the story that has been linked. You're moving from one thing to the next

 

[CassidyIzABeast]

The only source I've seen for the orbital blowout was unnamed sources in a story on a right-wing site.

I'll believe it when there's evidence of it.

I was going to ask if Wilson was still out of town or if he had come back. So I take it this hospitalization confirms he's back.

 

[cackhyena]

The only thing we know right now is that Wilson was hospitalized. If it was an orbital blowout they would be singing that from the rooftops.

That's what I was thinking.

 

[mbmonk]

My question is how is it that you still have people defending the officers in Ferguson when time and time again they show that they care nothing about the law and only a display of power.

It's not that hard to imagine that Darren killed MB in cold blood when we see exactly how his brothers in blue treat even journalists let alone a black man.

I am interpreting what you are saying as: The officers in Ferguson have shown they care about displaying power over enforcing the law. Since Dareen's brothers in blue act that way, Darren probably did the same.

Fallacy of division

A fallacy of division occurs when one reasons logically that something true for the whole must also be true of all or some of its parts.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fallacy_of_division

I have heard the citizens in Ferguson say that even they didn't think all the cops were bad. So clearly there are some cops that are turds and others that aren't.

Get out of here with all that logic and making sense.

Yea. Fallacious logic.

To be clear, I am not siding with Darren. I am just saying the logic used in this specific argument is flawed in my eyes.

 

[El Odio]

So will the new thread keep the same title or will it be updated to reflect the decision for a Grand Jury and police militarization?

 

[Spring-Loaded]

Oh, okay. That makes sense.

This was intense sarcasm btw

 

[Gaz_RB]

Hmmmm... Out of curiosity what are the arguments against them?

I posted this a couple days ago in the thread:

Primarily, it brings up the question of when these cameras are allowed to be turned off, or the variability of cops saying they "malfunctioned". For instance, when an officer is talking to a confidential informant or another sensitive source, are they allowed to turn it off? What about when they are talking to a vulnerable victim of something like sexual assault? Should that entire conversation be video taped? If you allow discretion for the cops so that they can turn it on and off when they feel the need, what's to say that they won't only have it on when it is at their advantage to do so?

Who gets to watch the tapes? Who gets to access them? If the police often can't even be trusted to do basic things, do we trust these same people to safely store possibly sensitive footage?

That's what I mean when I say murky. It just seems like it is something that needs to be eased into, and isn't just a catch-all remedy for preventing police abuse.

I do think we at least need to get cameras on our weaponized riot police at all times. The people in these situations where they could easily kill or injure another person. And I think that in certain tense and problematic areas of social or racial tension such as Ferguson, that it would be a possible option to pave the way to improved police-citizen relations. But in my opinion, to say that ALL cops at all times EVERYWHERE should have to wear a camera seems a bit naive and sort of misses the other things that cops actually do.

Just my opinion though.

 

[CrankyJay]

Can't believe we will soon be hitting the 20k post limit.

Because stats are fun....

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/misc.php?do=whoposted&t=871547

 

[xnipx]

If this really drags out until October before he's indicted ferguson is going to crumble.

 

[BronsonLee]

Because stats are fun....

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/misc.php?do=whoposted&t=871547

Oh god, how am I number two?!

I hereby retire!

 

[Black Republican]

any asian americans agree with this?

http://www.racefiles.com/2014/08/20/why-ferguson-matters-to-asian-americans/

 

[everyday math]

Oh god, how am I number two?!

I hereby retire!

Same >_>

 

[CountBlack]

Damn saw this on twitter.. apparently the Cop thinks that Mike Brown was:

 

[Gonzalez]

Damn saw this on twitter.. apparently the Cop thinks that Mike Brown was:

Mike should have known Wilson had projectile attacks.

 

[BronsonLee]

Mike should have known Wilson had projectile attacks.

Balrog vs Cable confirmed

 

[Indicate]

The only source I've seen for the orbital blowout was unnamed sources in a story on a right-wing site.

I'll believe it when there's evidence of it.

Same here. Given Wilson's reactions after the shooting from the witnesses video, it appears he's fine. Wouldn't he be treated from injuries right away at the scene?

 

[CrankyJay]

Same >_>

The weird thing is I hardly remember you posting in this thread, but you're the clear winner...lol. Your posts must have been completely inoffensive to me to not recognize.