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First screen of Wii U Zelda HD [Update: Offscreen Footage]

Zinthar said:
It's not bullshit -- the reason tech demos are not trustworthy as examples of what playable games will look like is because they can be optimized to death because it's pre-determined what the camera will be showing the entire time.

Sure, this is a huge leap for Nintendo, but this hardware is not exactly cutting edge.
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funny thing is, i feel like nintendo isn't a company that would go about optimizing a demo like this. I mean, yes they would make it look as good as possible, but it was probably more of a test to see how well they could adapt to HD assets and shaders. I think they would be more concerned with making sure this level of detail could actually be used in real-time gameplay.. almost as if this were a training exercise.

this is the same company that posted realistic polycounts for the gamecube under gameplay conditions when everyone else was sprouting crazy theoretical polycounts for ps2 and xbox.
 
What exactly are you seeing in the lighting that is so amazing? I've rewatched the video a few times and I'm just not seeing it. It's impossible to judge stuff like shadow resolution until we get direct feed video, but nothing I've seen looks beyond Uncharted 1 to me. (No need to invoke PC)
 
Yoshichan said:
Yes. That is exactly why I'm not comparing the art.
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Ok....if we're comparing purely on a technical basis, we'd have to wait for direct-feed 1080P video of the Zelda demo in order to see which has the better performance/effects/textures, etc.

edit: I got you confused with this guy:

TheExodu5 said:
The Witcher 2 looks great, but that's mostly due to the art assets, not the engine.
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lol.
 
Frankenstrat said:
apparently, come out with a clone of the 360 or ps3 with upgraded graphics. seriously.
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i dont think that would matter. gamecube didnt convince anyone and it was more powerful than ps2. but, oh my god, it was PURPLE!

edit: oh wow, i didnt even realize how far off topic i was getting. anyway, for relevance's sake, this video looks incredible. the lighting effects are great. no telling that this will be what the zelda looks like for the new system. heres to hoping for a great wind-waker switcheroo!
 
TheExodu5 said:
No, he's right. To produce visuals that pass these tech demos, you need some serious graphics capability.



The Witcher 2 looks great, but that's mostly due to the art assets, not the engine. Shadows look terrible, and the lighting is simply good. The lighting in the Zelda tech demo has only been matched by Metro 2033 and what we've seen of Battlefield 3, IMO.

http://thejayzone.com/pics/witcher2/max.jpg

That's what The Witcher 2 looks like on Ultra.
Click to expand...

You know, what's fascinating is that Reggie said in his interview with Geoff that the bird/garden demo was created using "early dev equipment, early dev equipment." — emphasis his

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p7jk-O-RETk&feature=player_detailpage#t=367s
 
thecouncil said:
name something they could do to get the 'hardcore' on board.
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Call it something without the Wii name, drop Miis, etc. As I say, it would be stupid financially, but the dudebros are just not going to buy a system named Wii. Dumb but true.
 
Green Scar said:
Haha, people called you a troll? What they did re: showing off the WiiU's power was entirely predictable.

...Although I guessed Metroid would be used for the tech demo.
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Hell, even ShockingAlberto said that was "unlikelly" given how much they spent in the development.
Nintendo focus on innovation, that's why their main theme in the conference was the controller...still it was so confusing I even though it was just a periphal at first.
 
defferoo said:
funny thing is, i feel like nintendo isn't a company that would go about optimizing a demo like this. I mean, yes they would make it look as good as possible, but it was probably more of a test to see how well they could adapt to HD assets and shaders. I think they would be more concerned with making sure this level of detail could actually be used in real-time gameplay.. almost as if this were a training exercise.

this is the same company that posted realistic polycounts for the gamecube under gameplay conditions when everyone else was sprouting crazy theoretical polycounts for ps2 and xbox.
Click to expand...

If you were going to show a tech demo for your new console to the world, wouldn't you spend dozens of man-hours optimizing it in order to get the most optimal reception from fans & press? I most definitely would.
 
Durante said:
What exactly are you seeing in the lighting that is so amazing? I've rewatched the video a few times and I'm just not seeing it. It's impossible to judge stuff like shadow resolution until we get direct feed video, but nothing I've seen looks beyond Uncharted 1 to me. (No need to invoke PC)
Click to expand...

It's hard to explain...but it's definitely got a deferred lighting engine with some very impressive ambient occlusion, and a wonderful volumetric effect to the lighting...Metro 2033 is the only game I've seen produce this level of lighting.
 
TheExodu5 said:
It's hard to explain...but it's definitely got a deferred lighting engine with some very impressive ambient occlusion, and a wonderful volumetric effect to the lighting...Metro 2033 is the only game I've seen produce this level of lighting.
Click to expand...

Loads of games use that type of lighting. SSAO, point and direct lights are all stock now.
 
thecouncil said:
i dont think there is anything nintendo can do to woo 'the hardcore'... i think today's reaction to wiiU on this board alone is evidence of that. unless your concept of 'hardcore' is somebody other than the people on these boards.
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I think that's a key issue. Nintendo is not going after the type of person who posts on gaming forums, they never have been. They're going after the people who play COD, most of which are hardcore gamers, in that they're mainly 12-30 (15-25 maybe more directly) aged males, MORE than they did with Wii. Their main audience is still a broader one, they just want to also have more appeal to the hardcore (not the forum posting hardcore).

So, the reactions from this forum are not really indicative of what the mass hardcore segment will think.

The other thing is, as has already been stated, going forward power is not going to matter much. One, because most people, even avid gamers can't tell much difference, two, (many) developers aren't that suicidal.
 
linko9 said:
Call it something without the Wii name, drop Miis, etc. As I say, it would be stupid financially, but the dudebros are just not going to buy a system named Wii. Dumb but true.
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dudebros lol

I feel awful for anyone who considers themself a gamer & didn't play games like Super Mario Galaxy all because they were too embarrassed to ask the clerk for a Wii game.
 
Warm Machine said:
Loads of games use that type of lighting. SSAO, point and direct lights are all stock now.
Click to expand...

Yeah, I realize that, but no game still has the volumetric quality to light that Metro 2033 and Battlefield 3 have shown. What that means in technical terms, I'm not sure.

Oh, and SSAO in console games is pretty laughable, for the most part. It's always so low resolution that it distracts and looks unnatural.
 
defferoo said:
funny thing is, i feel like nintendo isn't a company that would go about optimizing a demo like this. I mean, yes they would make it look as good as possible, but it was probably more of a test to see how well they could adapt to HD assets and shaders. I think they would be more concerned with making sure this level of detail could actually be used in real-time gameplay.. almost as if this were a training exercise.

this is the same company that posted realistic polycounts for the gamecube under gameplay conditions when everyone else was sprouting crazy theoretical polycounts for ps2 and xbox.
Click to expand...
Probably the same reason the textures on Brawl are surprisingly good for a Wii game.
 
Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if that Zelda demo was running off UE3.5/UE4. I can't really think of any other engine that has shown that kind of lighting quality and DOF, aside from Metro 2033's engine.
 
TekkenMaster said:
The Witcher 2 has horrible art. It looks like the various characters are barely-teaked generic Poser models with dead eyes.
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The Witcher 2 has excellent art direction and that's part of what makes it look so excellent. A good engine with shit art is useless - see Two Worlds 2.
 
AceBandage said:
3.5, maybe.
4? No no no no no no no.
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Why not? UE4 is just a branch off UE3.5. There's nothing stopping it from being used on lesser hardware.

The bird demo had some nice bokeh dof...not too sure about the Zelda demo...need a direct feed to see it better.
 
Iwatas Magic Sports Coat said:
dudebros lol

I feel awful for anyone who considers themself a gamer & didn't play games like Super Mario Galaxy all because they were too embarrassed to ask the clerk for a Wii game.
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This probably never happened ever. These people don't even exist anymore, they certainly don't in the quantity they did in the GCN days (LOLZ PURPLE).
 
Here are some better Witcher 2 screenshot examples that I took through steam (pressing F12) -- they're compressed a bit, but still pretty good.

1) http://www.imgplace.com/viewimg89/928/202011060400017.jpg
2) http://www.imgplace.com/viewimg101/1607/402011060400015.jpg
3) http://www.imgplace.com/viewimg16/7936/712011060400011.jpg
4) http://www.imgplace.com/viewimg718/7929/152011060400010.jpg
5) http://www.imgplace.com/viewimg121/4610/202011060400005.jpg
6) http://www.imgplace.com/viewimg219/8201/742011060400008.jpg

Anyway, I don't think Witcher 2 or any other modern PC game need be analyzed -- I have to agree with the other poster saying there are some 360/PS3 games that already can compete with that lighting. Uncharted series is one, but the best out right now IMO in that category is Assassin's Creed Brotherhood (particularly in motion with the effect of the clouds passing overhead).

Edited to remove screen thumbnails.
 
markot said:
Has Nintendo ever, ever, used an outside engine?
Click to expand...

I don't know.

I mean, it might be in-house...but it seems too advanced for that...unless it's been in development for a very long time.
 
Zinthar said:
If you were going to show a tech demo for your new console to the world, wouldn't you spend dozens of man-hours optimizing it in order to get the most optimal reception from fans & press? I most definitely would.
Click to expand...
i recall miyamoto saying something like... they threw together the spaceworld gamecube zelda demo a week before e3 or something.. i mean, i'm sure it wasn't like that this time, but nintendo is not one to show bullshots or visuals that their system cannot do during gameplay. so for now i'm giving them the benefit of the doubt.

but honestly, whenever somebody praises the graphics of any kind, GAF seems to have a list of excuses as to why it could possibly look that good without ACTUALLY looking that good ("pre-rendered" when it isn't, optimized camera angles, "empty rooms", not "in-game" despite being in-engine, etc, etc, etc). seriously, why is everyone so cynical? then again, it's GAF... meh
 
Zinthar said:
Here are some better Witcher 2 screenshot examples that I took through steam (pressing F12) -- they're compressed a bit, but still pretty good. .
Click to expand...
Yep, artifacts and resolution to the side, it looks amazing and should never be underestimated.

ZaX3O.jpg

xMhxC.jpg


http://i.imgur.com/BWYoj.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/OjuFb.jpg
 
TheExodu5 said:
The Witcher 2 looks great, but that's mostly due to the art assets, not the engine. Shadows look terrible, and the lighting is simply good. The lighting in the Zelda tech demo has only been matched by Metro 2033 and what we've seen of Battlefield 3, IMO.

http://thejayzone.com/pics/witcher2/max.jpg

That's what The Witcher 2 looks like on Ultra.
Click to expand...

TekkenMaster said:
The Witcher 2 has horrible art. It looks like the various characters are barely-teaked generic Poser models with dead eyes.
Click to expand...

You guys are insane.

The Witcher 2 looks incredible both because of the engine and the art, not to mention the unmatched texture work. Its only flaw in my opinion is the animation which I consider just "adequate".

I would say that Zelda demo sits in the same ballpark as Uncharted 2, which itself looks nearly as good as TW2 in terms of overall visual fidelity (resolution, framerate, and general tech notwithstanding).
 
The Witcher 2 really doesn't have impressive lighting at all though. Crysis 1 murders The Witcher 2 in the lighting department. Metro 2033 then murders Crysis.
 
TheExodu5 said:
Honestly, I wouldn't be surprised if that Zelda demo was running off UE3.5/UE4.
Click to expand...

Doubt it, Nintendo always uses their own engine for Zelda and I doubt they would switch that up right now.

Whatever this engine is though, its fucking insane.
 
TheExodu5 said:
Clearly there weren't enough sparks. I'm very disappointed at the lack of amazement from this tech demo. I feel like people really need big explosions and sparks to show them that something looks good. These are the same people that want massive amounts of disgusting bloom in their games, because they can't appreciate subtlety.
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Part of the problem is the first thing people see of the 'demo' is a couple seconds of lower res footage during a montage (zelda) marred even further by a lot of them watching it on low res internet streams. (The Nintendo stream online was painfully low res and filled with artifacts). The only other things we got from it were the same Mii crap we got on the Wii and then ports of existing content. The Tech Demo was nice, but the subtle effects were lost due to the footage resolution. If they spent some time actually putting more footage together to actually show off the Wii'U capabilities instead of leaving it for behind closed doors, I think people would be more inclined to believe it was a step up. Nintendo is to blame for shoddy, and poorly managed reveal of the console. They revealed it too early and without much preparation.

Having said that I have taken a step back from my initial review of the conference for the Wii'U. The shaders for the tech demo and the zelda demo were amazing even if subtle. Lighting was also a fairly decent step up from our current gen, I think what pushed people to think its from our current gen is the fact the stuff they were seeing clearly looked computer generated, even blocky or lacked the definition you might expect from a serious step up (the Bird felt very synthetic). But everything else outside of the geometry was a clear step up from our current gen, they should have just focused more on that part if they really wanted to get hardcore people to enjoy the possibilities of the console. The way they added all those current gen games in at the end made it seem like they wanted us to believe it was based on the same gen hardware, and that we were supposed to like that, which came off more as in insult. Again its not the hardware, it was the extremely poor reveal, they have only themselves to blame for not understanding what a lot of the 'core' audience really wanted in a reveal.
 
The Witcher's character art is terrible. I mean, holy shit at the sex scenes. The woman he was fucking looked like roadkill.

The art for some of the environments do look good, but overall, Witcher 2 is a mixed bag in the art department.
 
Cow Mengde said:
The Witcher's character art is terrible. I mean, holy shit at the sex scenes. The woman he was fucking looked like roadkill.

The art for some of the environments do look good, but overall, Witcher 2 is a mixed bag in the art department.
Click to expand...
Not to derail this thread, but the character art in witcher 2 was excellent.
The armor and outfit design is brilliant and the characters look great. The only thing that bothered me was the facial animation, but that is because I bought LA Noire at the same day.
Otherwise the game has the best artdirection any western rpg ever had in the history of rpgs.

But now back to zelda.

Zelda in HD looks fucking amazing.
 
Of course it's not going to have the iq of a PC game. It was delusional to think that would happen. That said, it looks fantastic.
 
Cow Mengde said:
The Witcher's character art is terrible. I mean, holy shit at the sex scenes. The woman he was fucking looked like roadkill.

The art for some of the environments do look good, but overall, Witcher 2 is a mixed bag in the art department.
Click to expand...

I disagree, and this may be due to lowered expectations, but I think it looked pretty good.

Stylistically, it looks waaaaaaaay better than oblivion did or the ugly mess that's dragon age.
 
Cow Mengde said:
The Witcher's character art is terrible. I mean, holy shit at the sex scenes. The woman he was fucking looked like roadkill.

The art for some of the environments do look good, but overall, Witcher 2 is a mixed bag in the art department.
Click to expand...
Seriously, have you even played the game at all or are you just trolling? Wtf is it with juniors at E3 time.
 
The Witcher 2 has some amazing lighting and cool effects, but it is plenty rough around the edges. Geralt's hair is fucking horrendous, awful pop in, visible colour filter changes when you walk through Flotsom etc etc.
 
freddy said:
Funny how this thread went from initial comparing of a screen to Vita and now to Witcher 2.
Click to expand...

Well people went from looking at a screenshot of what it actually looks like to low quality offscreen footage and declaring it the best graphics ever produced by man.
 
What makes it look really nice also is the lack of a HUD.

Please, make the HUD extremely noninvasive. Heck, make it part of the experience itself if necessary a la Dead Space, no HUD at all!
 
ThoseDeafMutes said:
The Witcher 2 has some amazing lighting and cool effects, but it is plenty rough around the edges. Geralt's hair is fucking horrendous, awful pop in, visible colour filter changes when you walk through Flotsom etc etc.
Click to expand...

The color changes are on purpose, btw.

And they're awesome.
 
Buckethead said:
The Witcher 2 isn't even in the same ballpark as Zelda.

Muchhh bigger game.

Newer tech on WiiU.

So much silliness.
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Okay, you're being silly. The Witcher 2's (max) tech is probably farrr beyond Wii U.

Probably, anyway.
 
All I know is that Zelda picture looks great as my wallpaper.

Also, is there any way to prevent the pictures of getting bigger if my mouse hovers over them, its driving me nuts (I'm using Chrome btw).
 
Earl Cazone said:
maybe they offer multiple control schemes
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That's my understanding. It looks as though the idea behind this controller is that it makes your home console slightly portable. TV in use? No matter, play with the controllers screen. The console is designed to use all of the control options used by the
Wii, and Nintendo showed this very clearly in their presentation.

I also think, however that motion controls are now being de-emphasized by Nintendo, and here's why: Nintendo made the right move with the Wii, they opened up a whole new market of casual gamers, however that same market has proven to not be very profitable. They would rather play 3.99 for an iPhone game. So this time around a return of supporting the hardcore gamer makes sense.

The world of gaming had really hit a plateau. On the technical side of things, it really can't keep moving at the pace it has. PC gaming is nearly dead as a result, it's simply too expensive to make games of ever increasing graphical fidelity. I think that's why the most successful games on the PC, like World of Warcraft have completely de-emhasized this anyway.

Forget me, I'm rambling, the point is, gaming has reached the point where it doesn't *need* to get any better technically, and we are definitely at the point of diminishing returns. Nintendo sucessfully competed this gen by offering unique experiences the new gamers and experienced gamers alike, and I think they will do it again next gen, but with a renewed focus on hardcore gamers.

I think third parties will be on board this time in droves too. What can MS and Sony possibly offer next gen? More of the same but slightly better looking? And at what cost? With each new generation we have seen development costs skyrocket, which has resulted in gun shy developers scared to take a risk in case it's a flop. There just too much money on the table.

This gen has been terrible for that, and it's resulted in some very dull gaming, to be honest.
 
chubigans said:
untitled-1h886r8gc.jpg

No other info so far.

edit: better pic, thanks jett.

1080p version: http://h5.abload.de/img/untitled-1h886.jpg

edit2: note that this was not any kind of announced game for the Wii U, but part of the promo reel for the Wii U. Nor was it mentioned as a game of any kind during the conference. So who knows what this will turn out to be. :p

edit3: Reggie just said on GTTV that this Zelda demo is "an experience that is meant to show what the Wii U can do...the Zelda team is always working on new things. It's what Zelda could look like."

edit 4: Kotaku has a hands on: http://kotaku.com/5808706/weve-played-nintendos-new-wii-u-the-next+generation-of-motion-control
Click to expand...
Looks amazing, cannot wait, 1080p Zelda finally a reality and not just through emulation anymore
 
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