I mean, honestly all people saying Souls games makes me wonder why do they even play videogames at all. Games ARE a time waster by nature, so what's even the point then? Do you play games so you can fulfill some arbitrary checklist of games you have to beat? So you want it to be super fast paced so you can get to your "reward" quickly?
I dunno, I always felt games were more about the experience and the challenge than just finishing them. I'm honestly confused by this kind of critiscism
There's a contingent of Souls fans like this who will relentlessly defend them. As if not allowing someone to pause an offline game is beyond criticism.
As unforgiving a system as the Souls game have, not being able to pause offline is dumb. Period.
Yeah, it had been a few gens since I played Pokemon and Sun had so many cutscenes and conversations. There wasn't even anything of intellectual value in them. It was just assholes continuously monologuing about how great Pokemon are and how mysterious they are, etc. Yeah, Lillie, I get it, you don't like dog fighting. Maybe don't live in Alola instead of reminding me every five minutes.
Destiny is incredible with all the loading that goes on in that game, it will actually be a deal breaker if it's similar for the sequel. It really needs fixing so that you're almost never in menus or loading and without having to worry about the PS3/360 that must be possible.
Imagine you are in a tough boss battle for example in Dark Souls 3. Now you have to go to the bathroom otherwise you will literally shit your pants. But you can't pause!
You should probly either see a doctor, stop eating Olestra products, or pay some semblance of attention to the condition of your bowels before entering a fog wall.
You should probly either see a doctor, stop eating Olestra products, or pay some semblance of attention to the condition of your bowels before entering a fog wall.
Any game where you embark on a fetch quest only to discover you need some knick knack that so and so has. So you visit so and so and they won't give you the knick knack because some other dude stole it. Bring the knick knack back to so and so and they'll make it worth your while.
So you set out to kill the other dude to bring the knick knack back to so and so, but you find the bridge is out. Turns out some other guy can fix it but he lost his tools. So this other guy can fix the bridge should you retrieve his tools from what's his face so you can cross a bridge to reach that other dude, to retrieve the knick knack for so and so.
But wait...the tools are spread out across the land. Buried in unmarked spots that each require a map that costs 1,000 ding dongs. Your wallet only carries 200 ding dongs so now you need a bigger wallet....
And as the 8th year of selfish demands for Souls changes dawn, the threat that it will fruitlessly outlive the series itself continues to hang a metatextual level of desperate grandeur in decay that the series so cultivates. Apt, really.
This is my answer. I tried to go back and play MGSV and between loading, timer menus, forced online base stuff, side OP's, flying to objectives, walking the rest of the way (no climbing cracks forcing you to go the long way) and walking back to the helipad the game is just an aggressive waste of my time. And all the amazing gameplay in the world isn't worth all that tedious bullshit.
Second offender: No Man's Sky PS4 - requirement to keep the butoon pressed on a given option and the need to move the cursor freely instead of jumping from one option to another. This literally infuriated me while playing.
Yeah. I like NMS, but pretty much all of the UI is user-hostile, preferring unskippable animations over quick navigation. It takes roughly 6 seconds of slow animations before you can talk to a NPC trader. You can't use the D-pad for inventory navigation, you have to use the ridiculous virtual cursor using the thumbstick. You can't use L1/R1 to navigate between crafting sub-menus, you must tap tap tap on arrows while waiting for the circle of pain to finish animating. (aside: this circle was used in MGSV as well, but it made sense there because it denoted an action that needed time to complete -- in NMS it's merely for the sake of visual appearance) The galaxy map is very pretty, but not very usable. The system map is almost useless, stuffed into a tiny radar screen with a narrow view of only what's ahead of you.
In a game with so much UI interaction for trading and crafting, the UI should be polished and efficient, but it seems the Art Director won all those battles because navigating the UI is a uniformly frustrating experience. They really need a UI designer, because the people at Hello making those decisions don't seem to understand how to make a user-friendly UI.
This for sure. At least for many years. Now you can pretty much warp anywhere instantly but man back in the day just getting anywhere was a huge time-sink let alone doing stuff when you actually got there.
Destiny. It's nowhere near as bad as it was in year 1, but I still feel like I can't get anything done unless I do nothing else with my free time except play the game.
Definitely. That's why I don't play these games. I probably would if you could pause.
The requirements to complete Jiminy's Journal and get the secret ending for proud and normal mode of KH2.5 assume you have no life. It's basically collect everything, synthesize everything, get a nearly perfect score on every minigame and beat all of the secret bosses. On normal you also have to check off a quest based around the not fun to play Gummi Ship missions.
I'm not sure what's worse: the money grind required to advance in the rankings, or the open hub world created solely for the sake of having an open hub world.
Sometimes I just want to jump in and play for like a hour. Without matchmaking that co-op game (cause it was clearly not made to be played alone) it's pure garbage. So I'd need to search players somewhere else first...
I mean... I've litreally spent more than the time played waiting for players to join in when I bought it till I finished the campaign.
And as the 8th year of selfish demands for Souls changes dawn, the threat that it will fruitlessly outlive the series itself continues to hang a metatextual level of desperate grandeur in decay that the series so cultivates. Apt, really.
This is hilariously smug and pretentious, even for a message board comment. Jesus. Is this obscure copy/pasta? Why are you the arbiter of what is selfish? Even for a Souls fan, this is a lot.
I'm not sure what's worse: the money grind required to advance in the rankings, or the open hub world created solely for the sake of having an open hub world.
[edit] Also, JRPGs with slow-ass battle animations that can't be sped up or skipped (unless you disable animations altogether) are the bane of my existence.
Oh God this game is on my list and it's from Let it die dev. Is the grinding for SP stuff? I don't know anything about the game aside from some combat videos I watched years ago.
Funny that so many people are citing Dark Souls / Bloodborne, as I genuinely believe these titles respect my time more than any other video games I have ever played.
And no, I'm not joking.
The games save your progress constantly. Outside of souls / blood echoes (which are easily recoverable or replenished), every item you obtain in the game is retained after dying. Tutorials are minimal and completely optional. And cutscenes are not only few and far between, they're all skippable.
I cannot think of another set of games that respects me, the player, more than Dark Souls and Bloodborne. The fact that they're challenging experiences has absolutely no bearing on how they "respect my time" as a player.
With all that said, if From Software wanted to add a pause function for offline play, I wouldn't be bothered by its inclusion.
I've only played Bloodborne to completion, but it'd be nice if they put some actual thought into their boss encounter design instead of relying on runs back to the boss as their form of "difficulty." Other games have legitimately hard bosses with complicated move sets, new mechanics and scenarios unique to a boss, etc. Bloodborne is "dodge and punish" for almost every boss, but if you die have fun running back!
Soulsborne has been explained already (can't pause)
BF has too much grinding, levelling up and getting new guns and gears take too long. I'm always in for having everything unlocked from the get go.
(-then why would you play? - because the game is fun)
I've only played Bloodborne to completion, but it'd be nice if they put some actual thought into their boss encounter design instead of relying on runs back to the boss as their form of "difficulty." Other games have legitimately hard bosses with complicated move sets, new mechanics and scenarios unique to a boss, etc. Bloodborne is "dodge and punish" for almost every boss, but if you die have fun running back!
I do agree that running back to the bosses was sometimes tedious in BB. There are few routes where they put seriously hard enemies in the way too, like those Church Executioners before
Ludwig or Laurence
. However, I do see why they have done it. If there was a lamp or bonfire right next to a boss, for mosts you could learn the movesets fairly quickly and actually encountering the boss would not be as scary as you have fought it so many times. DS3 has a bonfire right next to the
Nameless King
which is nice as it is a rather difficult boss, but it does take impact away from encountering him as you know you are just a short run away from trying again.
Recently FFXV has seemed it does not respect player time well. The constant imperial dropships and item pickup and interactions that require you to face the exact right direction are annoying. Not being able to collect things in combat is an understandable but annoying feature too as sometimes you would rather just grab an item and run rather than pummel a crowd of the same enemies or deal with some stupid imperial troopers. It doesn't help that jump and pick up item are the same fucking button.
You can't pause in Dark Souls, and the lack of direction makes actual progression take forever unless you follow a guide. Battlefield matches can last like over an hour. Both games are great, but they both require very long spans of time commitment.
This is one of the weakest complaints I've read. I'm sorry, but 90% of games these days hold your hand and tell you where to go in extreme detail. If you consider real exploration (and not follow this marker through vast, empty fields) to be so disrespectful to your time, then why don't you play something else instead?
Finding my way through a new area in a souls game is -in my opinion- one of the best experiences in gaming nowadays, and so few games give you such a good sense of exploration. Keep your signposts, HUD markers and minimaps out of my souls games, please.
P.S. I'm proud to say that I've beaten all these games before looking online to see which hard to find optional areas I missed, so I have to disagree with your comment about using a guide.
I do agree that running back to the bosses was sometimes tedious in BB. There are few routes where they put seriously hard enemies in the way too, like those Church Executioners before
Ludwig or Laurence
. However, I do see why they have done it. If there was a lamp or bonfire right next to a boss, for mosts you could learn the movesets fairly quickly and actually encountering the boss would not be as scary as you have fought it so many times. DS3 has a bonfire right next to the
Nameless King
which is nice as it is a rather difficult boss, but it does take impact away from encountering him as you know you are just a short run away from trying again.
I agree with you that it's done intentionally, but my point was why not make the bosses more interesting themselves? Why not make each boss's moveset a puzzle to figure out instead of just rewarding the player for using the same tactic over and over again?
I just feel there are better ways to generate tension than forcing runbacks to the boss. The Witch boss was a bit too easy, but also one of the more enjoyable fights because she seemed to have unique mechanics that you had to figure out. I swear if I ran into another beast boss that felt like a copy/paste "dodge this swipe" I was gonna turn the cane on myself.
I read a chunk of the thread, a couple of things.
If you stop going after lame ass achievements most complaints become no longer valid.
Pause button could be implemented in Souls disabling the ability of inventory management I guess but who cares.
Open world games are time wasters by definition though, all this useless back and forth shit through same locations, roads, hubs.
Twilight Princess and Skyward Sword were really annoying about this. Basically any game that makes you do stupid shit in between the real stuff just to make the game longer for no reason.
*5 sec intro scene*
*cries*
*charizard attack is cut bco intimidate*
*tranitar attack is cut bco intimidate*
...
Battle
...
*tyranitar takes potion damage*
*tyranitar heals a little with leftovers*
Does every action have to take 5 sec seperately? Just add all boosts together or let us just click through it. Don't even get me started on double battles..
This is my biggest pet peeve with Pokemon. The worst is when you're waiting for a multi-hit attack like double slap, and each slap takes 2.5 seconds, and they stop in the middle to tell you that one of the slaps was a critical hit. I've always felt like they could streamline the fighting process by just showing quick graphic icons and effects instead of making you slog though text boxes. Why not allow the player to choose this sort of option in the settings if they're scared it will not be newbie friendly?
One other huge waste of time in Sun and Moon is Festival Plaza. It baffles me that Game Freak thought we would get enjoyment out of a bunch of completely fake social interactions. Why should I want to travel around the plaza directing fake people (or real people who will never respond or know of my actions) to the plaza's attractions? The minigame "missions" are not fun and come of as a chore. But you pretty much have to grind through it in order to have access to some important items.
I agree with you that it's done intentionally, but my point was why not make the bosses more interesting themselves? Why not make each boss's moveset a puzzle to figure out instead of just rewarding the player for using the same tactic over and over again?
I just feel there are better ways to generate tension than forcing runbacks to the boss. The Witch boss was a bit too easy, but also one of the more enjoyable fights because she seemed to have unique mechanics that you had to figure out. I swear if I ran into another beast boss that felt like a copy/paste "dodge this swipe" I was gonna turn the cane on myself.
I think plenty would find the bosses super interesting already though, and not just the "gimmick" bosses like the Witch that you're referring to. "Dodge this swipe" strikes me as a bit reductive when most bosses have their own movesets to learn and master how to fight against.
Some of the MGSV R&D was so dumb. I had played the game for 90 hours, S ranked every mission (not that it was hard but it took some time obviously), and was still many, many hours away from naturally unlocking Raiden or finishing construction of every strut for example. Yeah there are online guides on how to farm materials fast, but at that point its better to just stop playing which is just what I did.
And its not just the materials cost. The game applied a real life timer to unlocks before you can actually use them because fuck your time.
This is my answer. I tried to go back and play MGSV and between loading, timer menus, forced online base stuff, side OP's, flying to objectives, walking the rest of the way (no climbing cracks forcing you to go the long way) and walking back to the helipad the game is just an aggressive waste of my time. And all the amazing gameplay in the world isn't worth all that tedious bullshit.
In the same boat. It kills me because I wanted to like MGSV so badly. They NAILED the core game mechanics, it plays fantastically. But it's designed like shit. For every minute of fun there's 2 minutes of bullshit.
Let it Die is the recent one, though I have to say this is my first f2p game and I don't know if most f2p are like that or not.
Oh God this game is on my list and it's from Let it die dev. Is the grinding for SP stuff? I don't know anything about the game aside from some combat videos I watched years ago.
It costs money to proceed to each stage, which is earned by doing short boring missions over and over again. This, along with the big empty hub world, is blatant padding for what is probably a 3-5 hour game otherwise.
It's a shame that No More Heroes 2 doesn't feel nearly as stylish as the first, because it's far less irritating overall.
But the gunplay and moment-to-moment gameplay is so exciting! I think if you take it one district a day, relaxed, change guns and playstyles, you'll find its beautiful sandbox so compelling. One of the best 50 hours I spent this year.
I have IBS and have never once shit myself because of a Dark Souls boss. That's ridiculous, you can just not go to the boss and stay at a bonfire and be safe. Runs to a boss are usually 30 seconds to a minute, so it's not like you'll spend 30 minutes getting there then need to use the bathroom. And even if that did happen...you've likely killed all the enemies so just chill in from of the fog gate while going to the bathroom. Sure, they could allow you to pause if you are playing offline, don't have a problem with it. But don't act like Dark Souls is causing people to shit their pants.
Hate that shit as hell, but there is literally 2-3 easy ways to get the bitch.
1. Don't take Alfred with you, he's shit and will give BSB an HP buff
2. Be ultra patient (this is LITERALLY all important)
3. Now you've 3 ways to do this
- Stay unlocked and near her, when she attacks, dodge right, always right, the i-frame will take you through and a fast weapon can get 2-3 hits in. Saw Cleaver + Fire paper is your friend
- Get good at parrying, which I rarely did with her, but there are people who are literally owning her by just parrying
- Pungent Blood Cocktail - doesn't always work for me, cuz of shit aiming and BSB being too fast to get to it, but works for 3 back-viscerals and is a great way to get her down to half health
Having said all that, this boss is all about not getting greedy, and staying Anti-doted and away in Stage 3 when she does the Poison shower
I finished Far Cry 2 yesterday, and this thread kept popping into my mind over the course of the entire game. So much so that I'm stunned to see the game not mentioned in here, as it was absolutely infuriating to see a game with such little content artificially stretched to 40 or so hours because of design choices that are best described as "bullshit."
I would estimate that over half of my time playing the game was spent on traveling from one objective to the next, and at no point was any of that compelling or fun. The missions themselves, side or main, just are not good or varied enough to justify how long it takes to even get one started.
We're talking about simple side missions that are nothing more than "go to this location and assassinate [target x]" taking an hour to do, where maybe 50-55 of those minutes are spent on just getting to that simple objective, and not on the objective itself. I'm sorry, my time is more valuable than the in-game rewards I get for doing those missions.
There are several design choices that make Far Cry 2 a pain, but even if they only changed one of them, it would have been a much better game.
- Respawning guard posts.
- Very limited fast travel.
- Not being able to take more than one quest at a time.
- Mission designs that require lots of travel.
- The problem of traveling around the game world (by car or on foot) just not being fun to do.
I could probably have lived with 4 out of those 5 design choices. Ubisoft set out to make a hardcore, realistic experience and I'm all for that, but what's the age-old question? "But is it fun?" That aspect of the game (which is a large part of the game) is not.
I get what Far Cry 2 was going for, and it's largely what I would want out of a Far Cry game. It made a strong first impression and after the first hour or two, I was loving it. But once I actually saw what Far Cry 2 is, how repetitive and tedious it is, it became a real grind.
The most laughably maddening part of the game was how
Safe house upgrades fucking reset at level 6. Like, that was the only reason I was doing those buddy missions was that maybe something awesome would happen at later levels, like maybe getting a jet pack to fly around, or being able to fast-travel between safe houses. You know, something that would reward me for wasting extra time doing the main missions that would allow me to waste less time going forward? NOPE. There was nothing I could do but laugh when I did buddy mission #7 and I got the awesome reward of health packs showing up at safe houses -- again.
