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[xaosslug]

You trolled him with an ad hominem straw man, pure and simple. He hasn't even remotely stated or implied anything like what you "fixed" his comments to be.

:lol

Excuse you? When did I personally attack Dr_Cogent? Sure, I made an assumption based on his subjective opinion on this topic in this thread (and Dr_Cogent's circular arguments that I thought in no way was discussing the topic in any kind of progressive, civil manner) but, I never personally attacked him. That's what you did to me, actualy.

Oh, he entered the thread with:

I can't see myself buying any such game.

It was flamebait, plain and simple. I took it, I guess.

 

[WrathOfOtaibah]

Assuming this isn't a joke thread, the original poster is just trying to get some circle jerk points with the gay members. Nothing more.

 

[Eggo]

Previously mentioned, but I don't think people picked up on it. Chou Aniki has been around for a long time in Japan. Definitely the gayest game I've come across (whoops). I was exposed to it in back in the Saturn days. Bosses who go erect... lots of bare-chested men flying around... umm, yeah... I thought this game was legendary.

IGN review of Chou Aniki: Legend of Holy Protein

Some history behind the series

 

[Senretsu]

Not sure if its been mentioned but Xenosaga was the only one I've played (Shion and KOSMOS, even though she was a robot, she was a very sexually attractive one)

 

[xaosslug]

Previously mentioned, but I don't think people picked up on it. Chou Aniki has been around for a long time in Japan. Definitely the gayest game I've come across (whoops). I was exposed to it in back in the Saturn days. Bosses who go erect... lots of bare-chested men flying around... umm, yeah... I thought this game was legendary.

IGN review of Chou Aniki: Legend of Holy Protein

Some history behind the series

I know you're not being serious, but I don't think that's what Mihyaeru meant when he typed "Gay game?"

Seriously though, that's prob. what what people think when they hear "gay game."

 

[duckroll]

I know you're not being serious, but I don't think that's what Mihyaeru meant when he typed "Gay game?"

Seriously though, that's prob. what what people think when they hear "gay game."

Well with all due respect.... he wanted a GAY GAME and a GAY GAME was presented! There should be no complains! :lol

 

[ivysaur12]

In Earthbound, Jeff's friend at his school was gay.

But yah, it's a bit odd that no party based RPGs (mainly JRPGs, I guess) have had a gay character. It could definately add some character depth.

 

[xaosslug]

Well with all due respect.... he wanted a GAY GAME and a GAY GAME was presented! There should be no complains! :lol

lolzerzing!

 

[Dr_Cogent]

It was flamebait, plain and simple. I took it, I guess.

Flamebait? How so? Just because I didn't express a personal interest in it? Please, spare me. We all have differing opinions. I don't expect everyone to be interested in what I am, or believe what I believe - but the flamebait argument is bogus.

 

[Campster]

Anyways, Mihyaeru, I think this thread is enough of an example as to why you'll not see a game that deals with the issue of homosexuality responsibly. As previously stated, these sorts are the kind that make up the majority of not just game players, but game designers. And it demonstrates their mentality when someone asks for a game that might not appeal to them and all they can do is mock the concept. Just as toys/paidea/non-games might appeal to an audience that isn't the traditional hardcore gamer get maligned and battered about.

I laud diversity in games, thematically or design-wise.

 

[duckroll]

In all honestly, I think this is what our friend is really looking for. May he find it in the next-generation, for he won't find it in this one!

 

[xaosslug]

Flamebait? How so? Just because I didn't express a personal interest in it? Please, spare me. We all have differing opinions. I don't expect everyone to be interested in what I am, or believe what I believe - but the flamebait argument is bogus.

Um... you posted a reply in a thread that you, in your own words, have no "personal interest in" except to express your personal opinion, which was never enquired. Why even bother otherwise?

 

[xaosslug]

In all honestly, I think this is what our friend is really looking for. May he find it in the next-generation, for he won't find it in this one!

What? Seriously, why are you guys purposefully trying to start shit with Mihyaeru? Did he PM you gay porn or something? Damn.

 

[RevenantKioku]

I know you're not being serious, but I don't think that's what Mihyaeru meant when he typed "Gay game?"

Seriously though, that's prob. what what people think when they hear "gay game."

What did he "mean" then? I read it over and I don't get it. Gay people can be just as goofy and ridiculous as straight people, right? Why does it matter to anyone? There have been gay characters, opportunities to have your character choose their sexual mates and so on.
Do people really feel better seeing a character that has a trait similar to themselves?

 

[Dr_Cogent]

Um... you posted a reply in a thread that you, in your own words, have no "personal interest in" except to express your personal opinion, which was never enquired. Why even bother otherwise?

Your logic is self defeating xaosslug.

The entire point to these forums, and all forums in general on the net are to discuss each persons personal opinions. The original poster expressed his opinion, and I expressed mine. I suppose the thread was only meant for people who agree with the poster right? So why even post the thread in the first place, just to get a bunch of yes men saying they agree? Or is this forum not meant to express each others opinions and debate issues? Nice try, but you aren't going to outwit me I am afraid.

 

[byproduct]

I thought it was awesome when I read that in Fable you can hit on men as well as women. Mind you, I didn't buy the game so I don't know how well it was done.

I like seeing games that use gay characters without making them joke characters, although I don't need them to necessarily be the main character of the game as I can see this would limit the game's audience somewhat. I'd rather the game appeal to a wider audience with a heterosexual or ambiguous main character and then show gay characters as a normal part of the world in that game so that all gamers can potentially be exposed to the idea (of gay people being regular people, not just stereotypes). If the game is all about being gay then people who don't like the idea just wont be exposed to it, because they wont buy it.

 

[Campster]

What did he "mean" then? I read it over and I don't get it. Gay people can be just as goofy and ridiculous as straight people, right? Why does it matter to anyone? There have been gay characters, opportunities to have your character choose their sexual mates and so on.
Do people really feel better seeing a character that has a trait similar to themselves?

Because when the only representation you get in a medium is HUR HUR GAY PEOPLE then it paints you in a negative light. Maybe you people don't realize this, but not every single person on this planet is a young, comfortably middle class white male. And the fact that that's the only sort of person that gets extensive coverage in this industry is a shame.

I'll be happy when there are games for 6 year old poor Pakistani girls, 20 year old hardcore gamers, 70 year old black grandmas, and gay 40 year old executive businesswomen.

 

[Dr_Cogent]

I'll be happy when there are games for 6 year old poor Pakistani girls, 20 year old hardcore gamers, 70 year old black grandmas, and gay 40 year old executive businesswomen.

:lol

There are plenty of games out there that can be enjoyed by anyone, in any social status and in any situation. They don't have to be tailored to those particular people.

I love Tetrisphere. I see it as a game that can be enjoyed by anyone. There are plenty of games that can be enjoyed by all, that don't have to be tailored to them in particular.

 

[duckroll]

I'll be happy when there are games for 6 year old poor Pakistani girls, 20 year old hardcore gamers, 70 year old black grandmas, and gay 40 year old executive businesswomen.

You're right! Nintendo agrees with you! Welcome to the......

 

[Campster]

:lol

There are plenty of games out there that can be enjoyed by anyone, in any social status and in any situation. They don't have to be tailored to those particular people.

I love Tetrisphere. I see it as a game that can be enjoyed by anyone. There are plenty of games that can be enjoyed by all, that don't have to be tailored to them in particular.

Right, because it should either be your perspective or a totally neutral perspective. It's very easy to say X doesn't matter when you're not X and your own desires ARE being met.

If these games are so appealing to everyone, why aren't more women playing games? Or more elderly people? Why can't we have a black protagonist that isn't a rapper/gangster/sports star?

Why can't we have a game that legitimately deals with homosexuality? It's a valid question. And if games are ever taken seriously as art, there will inevitably be one.

 

[RevenantKioku]

Because when the only representation you get in a medium is HUR HUR GAY PEOPLE then it paints you in a negative light.

First, that's not the only representation and second, I think everyone has bigger problems than their "group's" image in video games. Not to mention half the problem is this group mentality.

Maybe you people don't realize this, but not every single person on this planet is a young, comfortably middle class white male.

No, we do realize it.

And the fact that that's the only sort of person that gets extensive coverage in this industry is a shame.

Change is slow, but it is happening. But I tell you what, when I see a gay character in a show, video game, book, I don't care. But when I see "THIS IS A GAY BOOK/GAME/MOVIE!" I can only roll my eyes. Mind you that this usually it's not the fault of the particular artist.

I'll be happy when there are games for 6 year old poor Pakistani girls, 20 year old hardcore gamers, 70 year old black grandmas, and gay 40 year old executive businesswomen.

I think there has to be less segregation and more generalization. Part of the problem is that most of the games are targeted towards middle-white men, yes. But I don't think we need companies that just make games for those specific segments.
The problem I see is that you end up with games that have the black person, the gay person, the other ethnic or gender person and it become even worse.
The best thing I think that'll happen is when we get a game like Metroid, where the ending reveals the main character is something we didn't think they were, and we realize it didn't fucking matter if the character was gay or not.

Right, because it should either be your perspective or a totally neutral perspective. It's very easy to say X doesn't matter when you're not X and your own desires ARE being met.

I think this attitude is part of the problem. My desires of heterosexuality are not met by video games.

If these games are so appealing to everyone, why aren't more women playing games? Or more elderly people? Why can't we have a black protagonist that isn't a rapper/gangster/sports star?

It has less to do with the content and more to do with people enjoying GAMING.

 

[Mihyaeru]

I know you're not being serious, but I don't think that's what Mihyaeru meant when he typed "Gay game?"

Seriously though, that's prob. what what people think when they hear "gay game."

I know, you would think from this thread the title I made was flamingly homoeritic gay only games, made only by and for gay gamers. Come and post pics that make you gag. from the thread posts. j/p

In Earthbound, Jeff's friend at his school was gay.

But yah, it's a bit odd that no party based RPGs (mainly JRPGs, I guess) have had a gay character. It could definately add some character depth.

Agreed.

 

[byproduct]

Do people really feel better seeing a character that has a trait similar to themselves?

If you grow up gay, going through high school thinking you are the only gay person in the world and hearing "fag" and "poof" etc shouted as insults about 1000 times a day, with the only opinions of gay people you hear being that they are sissys, transvestites or predators, and then seeing nothing but straight people on TV, in books, etc, when you spot a gay person in any form (in real life, on TV, in a book, in a magazine), they are FASCINATING.

Maybe because they don't keep their sexuality secret and you do, or maybe because they are shown dealing with the process of accepting themselves and you haven't done that yet, or maybe because they deal with it destructively and it shows you how things might happen if you deal with it destructively, or maybe because they are shown to act normally when you have always heard that to be gay is to be effeminate or ultra-butch.

When you get older and have been exposed to gay people/isues a lot you just like to see gay representation in media because you know from experience that when anti-gay straight people meet you and get to know you they may change their minds about gay people being evil and see them as normal, which makes it easier to get on in the world.

The same thing doesn't really apply to straight, white men because they have plenty of healthy role models all around from age 0, so I guess you wouldn't think about it much when you see a straight, white main character.

 

[Mihyaeru]

In all honestly, I think this is what our friend is really looking for. May he find it in the next-generation, for he won't find it in this one!

It could be done well,

Or not lol.

 

[RevenantKioku]

The same thing doesn't really apply to straight, white men because they have plenty of healthy role models all around from age 0, so I guess you wouldn't think about it much when you see a straight, white main character.

Sorry man, I don't go to video games for fucking role models. I think there are much deeper issues here.

 

[Mihyaeru]

If you grow up gay, going through high school thinking you are the only gay person in the world and hearing "fag" and "poof" etc shouted as insults about 1000 times a day, with the only opinions of gay people you hear being that they are sissys, transvestites or predators, and then seeing nothing but straight people on TV, in books, etc, when you spot a gay person in any form (in real life, on TV, in a book, in a magazine), they are FASCINATING.

Maybe because they don't keep their sexuality secret and you do, or maybe because they are shown dealing with the process of accepting themselves and you haven't done that yet, or maybe because they deal with it destructively and it shows you how things might happen if you deal with it destructively, or maybe because they are shown to act normally when you have always heard that to be gay is to be effeminate or ultra-butch.

When you get older and have been exposed to gay people/isues a lot you just like to see gay representation in media because you know from experience that when anti-gay straight people meet you and get to know you they may change their minds about gay people being evil and see them as normal, which makes it easier to get on in the world.

The same thing doesn't really apply to straight, white men because they have plenty of healthy role models all around from age 0, so I guess you wouldn't think about it much when you see a straight, white main character.

Good post, thanks.

Sorry man, I don't go to video games for fucking role models. I think there are much deeper issues here.

Well of course not, unless you are gay you missunderstood him.

 

[duckroll]

Sorry man, I don't go to video games for fucking role models. I think there are much deeper issues here.

What are you talking about?! Kiryu Kazuma from Ryu ga Gotoku is the OFFICIAL role model of 2005! He's the fucking MAN!

 

[Dr_Cogent]

Right, because it should either be your perspective or a totally neutral perspective. It's very easy to say X doesn't matter when you're not X and your own desires ARE being met.

If these games are so appealing to everyone, why aren't more women playing games? Or more elderly people? Why can't we have a black protagonist that isn't a rapper/gangster/sports star?

*looks over at wife playing WoW*

You were saying?

:lol

Anyway, gaming has been tailored in general towards the same type of people who started the gaming industry. That doesn't necessarily mean that there aren't games out there that anyone can enjoy in any walk of life.

Don't tell me what I think either. I don't think it should be either my perspective or totally neutral. All I said in the beginning of this thread is that I would have no personal interest in such a game, that is all.

Also, the fact is, games are made to make money. If companies don't feel there is a large enough market to tap into - they aren't going to bother. I have no idea how many people are gay in this world or not, but apparently these companies don't feel there is a large enough market to create said content. Once they do, I am sure they will make said games.

 

[xaosslug]

What did he "mean" then? I read it over and I don't get it. Gay people can be just as goofy and ridiculous as straight people, right? Why does it matter to anyone? There have been gay characters, opportunities to have your character choose their sexual mates and so on.

I think he means two guys as main characters in a game that clearly like each other, no vague subtextual shit, that are OK looking and (not an amalgamation of characteristics of every gay stereotype known to man) done in a smart compelling way that doesn't beat the player over the head with "issues" and treat the characters like they are wrong for this world.

Not a joke, to be laughed at basically, which is what that game seems to be.

Do people really feel better seeing a character that has a trait similar to themselves?

Not necessarily. But, some people would love to see that, clearly.

 

[byproduct]

Sorry man, I don't go to video games for fucking role models. I think there are much deeper issues here.

Sorry, did you read my post? You aren't looking for role models in a videogames store because you have already been exposed to role models and don't need to see any more. This is not always the case for gay people who spend most of their teenage years pretending not to be gay and not having access to gay role models. THAT is the deeper issue.

 

[Tarazet]

Four pages and none of this yet?

Metal Saga looks seriously cracked.

 

[RevenantKioku]

Sorry, did you read my post? You aren't looking for role models in a videogames store because you have already been exposed to role models and don't need to see any more. This is not always the case for gay people who spend most of their teenage years pretending not to be gay and not having access to gay role models. THAT is the deeper issue.

Yeah I read your post. Guess what? I got shit in high-school too despite being a white heterosexual male. When you stick out, shit'll happen despite whatever makes you different. Stop acting like heterosexual white males are incapable of understanding.
It's life. Get on with it.

 

[Mihyaeru]

I think he means two guys as main characters in a game that clearly like each other, no vague subtextual shit, that are OK looking and (not an amalgamation of characteristics of every gay stereotype known to man) done in a smart compelling way that doesn't beat the player over the head with "issues" and treat the characters like they are wrong for this world.

Not a joke, to be laughed at basically, which is what that game seems to be.

Being misunderstood by 50 people in this thread was worth it, if I am understood by one so thanks lmao.

Not necessarily. But, some people would love to see that, clearly.

Especially considering they have never seen it done in a game before.

 

[Campster]

Sorry man, I don't go to video games for fucking role models. I think there are much deeper issues here.

Like the plague that is passive consumption of art.

 

[byproduct]

Yeah I read your post. Guess what? I got shit in high-school too despite being a white heterosexual male.

I'm beginning to see why.

 

[RevenantKioku]

I'm beginning to see why.

OH BOY SNAPPY REMARKS.

 

[TheTurtleTitan]

Before this thread goes down the crapper, I just want to mention that Banjo-Tooie (a game filled with innuendo) had...

- A blatantly gay frog named Jolly Roger (who even sounds feminine)
- A crossdressing toad who is a friend of Jolly Roger
- An item menu in Jolly's restaurant called "Seamen Surprise"

While it certainly wasn't a "gay game," I'm surprised they managed to put them in an E-rated game.

 

[duckroll]

Before this thread goes down the crapper

Too late, didn't you see the thread title? :lol

 

[Azelover]

I won't bother reading the ntire thread but I've already noticed some people getting caught up in the notion of "looking" gay. I can tell you for sure that MOST(as in 80%) gay men don't look or act gay, at all, and they don't even have to fake either. Wereas a lot of drag queens are in fact straight, you'd be surprised at the number of married men with children who, with their families consent, just go drag. I know of a lot of straight men who just like dressing up like girls and being buttfucked by their girlfriends, would it be easier if they just sought another man? Yes, but they aren't gay and have no lust for men. So in the end "looking" gay can be a misleading thing to go by.

 

[byproduct]

I know of a lot of straight men who just like dressing up like girls and being buttfucked by their girlfriends

:lol :lol :lol :lol :lol :lol

Trying to imagine the BBQ conversation that this came up in!!

 

[madara]

I think a "gay james bond" like game would go over well,even though the wave of Queer Eye, Queer as Folk and metrosexual seems to be over with the window has not totally closed. Gameplay would have to be solid though and not totally rely on guys witty remarks alone, flashs night club scenes and more "popular" aspects of gay culture. "Nice ass though".

 

[Mr_Furious]

Socially?

Jinx's points related to quality and relevance..

It's no more bad an idea than books featuring gay characters, or movies featuring gay characters or whatever. Ultimately all that should matter to us is quality.

That's bullshit and you know it. Quality does not guarantee success and it's stupid that I have to point out the obvious.

Yeah I'm close minded because I have hope of seeing my and 10% of my races sexuality represented in the games that I play... Your replies are the worst in this thread, you are trying to hard.

My replies are the worst? Why? Is it because I see no actual relevance to what your lame ass thread is proposing other than for you to (personally) feel happy that your sexual preference is being injected into your hobby. Please explain to me how I'm "trying to hard". I'd really like to hear it. I've simply stated that what your asking does in fact exist and that it sounds like you have a personal agenda which is never really the right way to start off any game design. You really are having a close minded perspective on this topic and have ignored many responses (except mine) blatantly shedding a light on your ignorance regarding homosexuality in video games.

 

[RevenantKioku]

Well of course not, unless you are gay you missunderstood him.

Why would I have to be gay to understand that people have problems, people feel ostracized and people feel that they don't have a role model?

 

[xaosslug]

Your logic is self defeating xaosslug.

The entire point to these forums, and all forums in general on the net are to discuss each persons personal opinions. The original poster expressed his opinion, and I expressed mine. I suppose the thread was only meant for people who agree with the poster right? So why even post the thread in the first place, just to get a bunch of yes men saying they agree? Or is this forum not meant to express each others opinions and debate issues? Nice try, but you aren't going to outwit me I am afraid.

Go ahead, duck behind that old "freedom of messg. boards" chestnut. I don't recall, anywhere in Mihyaeru's first post, him asking whether or not anyone would play or had any interest in playing his ideal game.

Anyway, gaming has been tailored in general towards the same type of people who started the gaming industry. That doesn't necessarily mean that there aren't games out there that anyone can enjoy in any walk of life.

Don't tell me what I think either. I don't think it should be either my perspective or totally neutral. All I said in the beginning of this thread is that I would have no personal interest in such a game, that is all.

:lol

Nobody said their wasn't games out their to suit most people's tastes. Mihyaeru only stated how what with the mainstream acceptance Brokeback Mountain has received and huge leaps and bounds in progress that has been made in the movie industry in reagard to such content, he hopes it could translate into the gaming industry as well.

Also, the fact is, games are made to make money. If companies don't feel there is a large enough market to tap into - they aren't going to bother. I have no idea how many people are gay in this world or not, but apparently these companies don't feel there is a large enough market to create said content. Once they do, I am sure they will make said games.

That should have been your first post.

 

[terrene]

Why would I have to be gay to understand that people have problems, people feel ostracized and people feel that they don't have a role model?

Shut up, fag.

 

[terrene]

lol sorry.

 

[Ollie Pooch]

Shut up, fag.

:lol :lol :lol

 

[RevenantKioku]

Shut up, fag.

*highfive*

 

[jlh]

:lol

There are plenty of games out there that can be enjoyed by anyone, in any social status and in any situation. They don't have to be tailored to those particular people.

I love Tetrisphere. I see it as a game that can be enjoyed by anyone. There are plenty of games that can be enjoyed by all, that don't have to be tailored to them in particular.

I don't think the problem is that gay people are not able to enjoy games that aren't tailored to them but that it really is special being able to enjoy something that represents a segment of your life. I assume that you are a young white hetero guy, how would you feel if the only young white hetero guys you saw in games, movies, television, etc. were joke characters derided or victimized to the point where their mere presence is an embarrasment. I remember how great it was to play KOTOR and stumble onto the "romance" with Juhani (a romance which was butchered supposedly because of pressure from Lucasarts). It was a really cool experience, that doesn't mean I didn't enjoy the game before I discovered that aspect of the character only that it was something which was cool and was a departure from the whole hetero-centric experience of most other games on the market. My ex-gf started playing games (which before she thought were completely stupid wastes of time) with KOTOR, then she went on to Jade Empire and became completely rpg crazy after that to the point where she just started playing every rpg she could get her hands on. So with a little effort on Bioware's part they have turned someone who would have never given games a chance into a gamer, that's something that all developers should be interested in accomplishing. I think game companies should try to increase their fanbase as much as possible and gay dollars spend just the same as straight.

 

[terrene]

*highfive*

Haha, thanks. Good post, btw - it reminded me of that scene in The Office where the girl goes "...well, why can only black people be offended by racism?"