Gears 5 Dev Explains Why They Refused To Compromise On Frame Rate

Justin9mm

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May 9, 2018
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Reading some of these comments, when are people going to learn that not all 30fps looks the same, it is dependent on platform and game. 30fps on PC does not look the same as 30fps on console with some games. I wonder if anyone on here really knows about game development. Optimization is what is important which can make a game look buttery smooth at 30fps.

I'm not saying 30fps can look the same as 60fps but it does not look as bad as playing 30fps on PC compared to the console. PC Masterace always exaggerating this issue. I'd much rather have Dynamic 4K at 30fps then 1080p 60fps and above.

PC gamers can game at 1080p on their 27-30 inch monitor while I sit back and relax on my couch with my beautiful 4K HDR 70 inch TV. You spend all that time tweaking settings, changing texture detail, shadowing and aliasing etc. In some instances ruining the look of the game because well you are not a game developer and have no knowledge of what you are meant to be looking at so you can run your 60fps+ and I will boot up and play almost straight away, the way the game developer intended the game to look.
 

pawel86ck

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Jan 27, 2018
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Are you sure that you didn't get a new tv or something that introduced input latency?
No, I have tv with very low input lag (16ms, while average tv has around 30-40ms), and besides I'm talking about playing these games on the same tv, so you cant blame input lag on TV itself. When it comes to GTA5 on current gen consoles, there's a thread here on neogaf in regards to inputlag problems in that game, so it's not just me who noticed it.

IMO these days people dont see input lag problems simply because they dont remember or have no idea how smooth 30fps should feel. For example one guy have made input lag test in GOW4 on xbox one, and results were very high, almost twice as high compared even to gears of war 1 remaster and that was 30fps game too. Most people dont see input lag problems in GOW4 even when input lag results confirm huge input lag, but I personaly could tell the difference right away.

I suspect inputlag on current gen consoles has something to do with forced vsync, and maybe new graphics effects and multi threaded engines. For example one guy from Turn10 have said forza7 on PC was using single core because it decreased input lag. Anyway whatever the case may be I doubt things will change for better now, and times when I could enjoy 30fps games are over. I can enjoy playing 30fps game on xbox 360 or PS3 and without even thinkg about 60fps, but on xbox one and PS4 things has gotten worse to the point where I need 60fps in order to really enjoy playing these games.
 
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Yu Furealdo

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Dec 22, 2016
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No, I have tv with very low input lag (16ms, while average tv has around 30-40ms), and besides I'm talking about playing these games on the same tv, so you cant blame input lag on TV itself. When it comes to GTA5 on current gen consoles, there's a thread here on neogaf in regards to inputlag problems in that game, so it's not just me who noticed it.

IMO these days people dont see input lag problems simply because they dont remember or have no idea how smooth 30fps should feel. For example one guy have made input lag test in GOW4 on xbox one, and results were very high, almost twice as high compared even to gears of war 1 remaster and that was 30fps game too. Most people dont see input lag problems in GOW4 even when input lag results confirm huge input lag, but I personaly could tell the difference right away.

I suspect inputlag on current gen consoles has something to do with forced vsync, and maybe new graphics effects and multi threaded engines. For example one guy from Turn10 have said forza7 on PC was using single core because it decreased input lag. Anyway whatever the case may be I doubt things will change for better now, and times when I could enjoy 30fps games are over. I can enjoy playing 30fps game on xbox 360 or PS3 and without even thinkg about 60fps, but on xbox one and PS4 things has gotten worse to the point in need 60fps in order to really enjoy playing these games.
That makes sense. I only briefly played some GTA V on ps3 before really diving in on ps4 so there wasn't much of a memory to compare it to.

But yeah very few games feel good at 30 fps this gen. Turning Last of Us: Remastered down to 30 on the ps4 feels gross even on my monitor. The amount of lag is insane... didn't play that on ps3 though so Idk if it was like that then too.
 

Bogroll

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Driveclub was 30fps
Still amazed by how smooth the game feels🤔
I'm not trying to be a arse or cause a argument but Driveclub feels lower than 30fps to me, always from day 1.
Funny how we all see things slightly different.
 

Panajev2001a

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Gamers have always complained and cried “we want 60fps” and now when it’s actually there they say we want 30fps? What kind of a shitshow is this?

Do you play Gears competitively? Do you know how much the 60fps made the gameplay smoother? To hell with the graphics, I’d take 60fps over 4k/30fps and over everything else

Every year, all the games people asks for 60fps and now suddenly 30fps is what they want? What a joke
Some gamers always cry about wanting 60 FPS in everything or they threaten to throw a temper tantrum... so? Making wise generalisations as aggressively as you can for what reason again?

People bitch and scream for tons of reasons, not everyone plays Gears competitively (some play single player and some play multiplayer non competitively/esports tournaments) and some played it competitively on a 30 Hz budget. People butch about having at least 30 hours games and never complete them, people bitch about 60 FPS and then bitch about graphical cutbacks... so?

I am glad to know what “you” would accept or take or deem good, but you are absurdly generalising it... there are valid reasons for a 30 Hz third person shooter, especially one that has a strong single player component and where multiplayer could be played well with a locked 30 FPS target and you can still have a 60 FPS mode for multiplayer if you want.
 

Lort

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Yeah, I do not know where he gets "choppy" from. The game never dips frames, if at all ever, even with the insane weather effects.

Some voodoo magic 30fps going on. Possibly a very well done motion blur solution and sense of speed with a locked framerate.

While I do prefer 60fps over 30fps if I have the option, DC is no slouch.
We have entered a new level of fanboyism where 30 fps on a playstation game is no longer 30 fps.

Lets all hold hands as we enter this new era of rediculularity.
 
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Panajev2001a

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We have entered a new level of fanboyism where 30 fps on a playstation game is no longer 30 fps.

Lets all hold hands as we enter this new era of rediculularity.
Sure, it is because it is running on PlayStation not because motion blur is more than a buzzword, that there are a myriad ways of implementing it, and having a smooth framerate without tons of duplicated or torn frames can give the game a very fluid look... (which DriveClub has) :rolleyes:. Setting your target at 30 FPS is a starting point not the end of the journey for your game.

All in all, especially given the timelines for the game, DriveClub at 60 FPS would have played very similarly but looked a lot worse and presentation in that game did make a difference with dynamic environment lighting and time of day as well as weather effects which also affected gameplay.

We only need the usual victim card of “in a Sony thread people would not do that SonyGAF” to complement the level of defensive aggressiveness here already.
 
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DeepEnigma

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We have entered a new level of fanboyism where 30 fps on a playstation game is no longer 30 fps.

Lets all hold hands as we enter this new era of rediculularity.
That is how you are interpreting it. Stop projecting.

The game is not "choppy", at all.
 
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Panajev2001a

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Actually I'd say it's very likely. The CPU is gonna be a lot better, and the console makers have spoken about how their systems' specs this gen should help with framerate. God willing... 60 fps will be the norm.
I am not sure, there is always something you can do with more than 2x of processing power ;).
 

DeepEnigma

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I am not sure, there is always something you can do with more than 2x of processing power ;).
RT will kiss that 60FPS for all games dream goodbye real fast. Unless they are planning on 1080p for those modes to retain framerate.
 

DeepEnigma

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Even with dedicated RT hardware, though?
I mean, there's some hope.
Possibly. But even looking at RTX cards on the PC, the resolution and framerate takes a decent hit with one vs. off, and that is just current gen games and assets. Maybe the the bandwidth setup will help some in the consoles too.
 

Lort

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Sure, it is because it is running on PlayStation not because motion blur is more than a buzzword, that there are a myriad ways of implementing it, and having a smooth framerate without tons of duplicated or torn frames can give the game a very fluid look... (which DriveClub has) :rolleyes:. Setting your target at 30 FPS is a starting point not the end of the journey for your game.

All in all, especially given the timelines for the game, DriveClub at 60 FPS would have played very similarly but looked a lot worse and presentation in that game did make a difference with dynamic environment lighting and time of day as well as weather effects which also affected gameplay.

We only need the usual victim card of “in a Sony thread people would not do that SonyGAF” to complement the level of defensive aggressiveness here already.
Um many many other games have modern morion blur and 30 fps no drop. U need to get out more and get over your off topic fanboy posting.
 
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Panajev2001a

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Um many many other games have modern morion blur and 30 fps no drop. U need to get out more and get over your off topic fanboy posting.
So? Nobody said DriveClub is the only game that could deliver smooth 30 FPS with the right implementation of motion blur and all. Not that you can only do it on PlayStation consoles... saying the opposite really, but in the rush to call people names you missed that maybe?!

What is your point beside a hastily constructed straw man?
 
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GustavoLT

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Apr 24, 2019
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campaing should have been 30fps with greater visuals (on Xbox X) game feels ugly running at 60fps.