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Graphical Fidelity I Expect This Gen

Nanite would have been hugely beneficial here, at least to reduce the pop-in. I would take baked lighting over lumen in this case. Either way, just not acceptable for a 1st party game in 2026 imo. Why are people so soft on criticising this game? It's a ps4 tech game with a nice particle system.
Same reason as BF6 and Arc Raiders. Its not that kind of game. You need a higher resolution and 60 fps to be able to actually play it. especially on base consoles where fsr2 is the only option and it completely breaks down IQ below 1080p.

Just look at High on Life 2 and how terrible it looks on consoles because they put in everything from nanite to lumen and vsms and it ran at 720p 60 fps with no 30 fps mode while looking like utter dog shit.

P.S BF6 has so much detail, destruction and smoke effects that anything below 1440p would make it very hard to make out other players. As these next gen games start pushing more detail and more effects, readability starts becoming an issue at lower resolutions. especially on big tvs. That said, i think lumen or nanite couldve been added in the PS5 Pro version since its running at an internal resolution of 1440p, but we dont know if cpu is the bottleneck here. this is just a very different kind of game.
 
What did you think of shadows again? Like where would you rank it? To me, its the best looking game of the generation but at the same time, its clear that UE5 games are just able to get that photorealistic/cg look much better than Anvil which is going for more detail and a slightly more gamey look which doesnt quite land in youtube videos but stuns when you are actually playing it on your screen.

This looks to be an improvement over shadows. Even on consoles, they were able to get ray traced GI working in the 60 fps version. Shadows' 60 fps mode didnt have RTGI.

The faces are also a massive improvement over shadows. I am pretty sure they will announce they have upgraded to a metahuman like tech for their faces because they look a generation ahead of the trashy faces we've had since AC origins. Watch some of the youtuber footage to see more cutscenes where you get to see the characters for more than just a second. The face shaders are a huge upgrade over even Unity, the last time ubisoft did great character faces. I will try to find some footage of the faces and make some gifs. I think they are very close to matching HFW.

There are two trailers. One short 1 minute story trailer and another 8 minute gameplay overview. Then a bunch of youtubers like ElAnaldebits have their own B roll. Some of the comparisons ive seen especially on water are absolutely stunning. They had this great morning fog, and light scattering through it, on top of the ocean as you sail through it. Its as close to CG as ive seen Anvil look.

I love this shot. The pirates beware sign is so detailed with almost nanite quality texture work, and the main shot of havana (or is it something else?) is detailed as fuck. This kind of detail pushing is where Anvil really stands out even if it cant do UE5 quality photorealistic lighting.

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Black Flag goes back to a time when Ubisoft actually bothered with decent quality facial mocap so even if all they did was retexture everything and everyone with more modern tech it'll still look 10x better than Shadows.

 
What did you think of shadows again? Like where would you rank it? To me, its the best looking game of the generation but at the same time, its clear that UE5 games are just able to get that photorealistic/cg look much better than Anvil which is going for more detail and a slightly more gamey look which doesnt quite land in youtube videos but stuns when you are actually playing it on your screen.

This looks to be an improvement over shadows. Even on consoles, they were able to get ray traced GI working in the 60 fps version. Shadows' 60 fps mode didnt have RTGI.

The faces are also a massive improvement over shadows. I am pretty sure they will announce they have upgraded to a metahuman like tech for their faces because they look a generation ahead of the trashy faces we've had since AC origins. Watch some of the youtuber footage to see more cutscenes where you get to see the characters for more than just a second. The face shaders are a huge upgrade over even Unity, the last time ubisoft did great character faces. I will try to find some footage of the faces and make some gifs. I think they are very close to matching HFW.

There are two trailers. One short 1 minute story trailer and another 8 minute gameplay overview. Then a bunch of youtubers like ElAnaldebits have their own B roll. Some of the comparisons ive seen especially on water are absolutely stunning. They had this great morning fog, and light scattering through it, on top of the ocean as you sail through it. Its as close to CG as ive seen Anvil look.

I love this shot. The pirates beware sign is so detailed with almost nanite quality texture work, and the main shot of havana (or is it something else?) is detailed as fuck. This kind of detail pushing is where Anvil really stands out even if it cant do UE5 quality photorealistic lighting.

5mal2hz.gif
Like i said, i have a lot of shit in my mind during these days so i'm not perfectly lucid, i guess i need to rewatch the trailer when my brain is less scrambled.
 
Looks like PS First party developers were briefed on the Playstation handheld and its only a PS5 handheld. It will play PS6 games using remote play like the PS Portal does while PS5 games will run natively on the hardware.

At least thats what twitter says.
 
Looks like PS First party developers were briefed on the Playstation handheld and its only a PS5 handheld. It will play PS6 games using remote play like the PS Portal does while PS5 games will run natively on the hardware.

At least thats what twitter says.

That doesn't make much sense to me as I have to imagine virtually all PS6 games are going to be crossplatform with PS5
 
I would argue that none of those games are pushing the envelope in terms of particles on screen like Saros(what game does?). And while Silent Hill 2 and Wukong look amazing on PC, the console versions have considerable graphical downgrades and/or performance issues

Maybe it is partially on Housemarque, but I still think UE5 is an unoptimized mess that puts undue stress on developers. If Phantom Blade Zero and Gears of War look as good as advertised on consoles than I will agree with you, at least in terms of UE5 being utilized in linear games
I know those games looks far better on pc, I am talking about utilizing tech, they do what housemarque didn't do on even ps5 pro, on other hand also optmize UE5 not epic games alone developer's themselves have responsibilities, from my small game development experience you can utilize lumen and nanite on games but not on everything like I said before you can use other cheap techs alongside them like spom and ssgi which will lead to far better performance, that said the narrative that gpu particles cost that much on ps5 gpu is wrong, their are many ways to render particles at very cheap cost, I really hate the developers who only consider achieve better resolution , scale up their existing last gen techs as their biggest achievement this generation and didn't try any other thing
 
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1440p is ~80% more than 1080p, they could save a shit ton of render time with very small degradation of image quality. And boom, lumen might be possible!

Even base PS5 version is ~1200p with FSR3, very small difference between them (and cost of FSR3 is not that much lower than PSSR2).
 
1440p is ~80% more than 1080p, they could save a shit ton of render time with very small degradation of image quality. And boom, lumen might be possible!

Even base PS5 version is ~1200p with FSR3, very small difference between them (and cost of FSR3 is not that much lower than PSSR2).
Saros just seems like it's technically underwhelming, it damn near doesn't use any of the demanding UE5 features and still somehow struggles to lock down 60fps on the pro....why is it even so demanding seems unoptimized? Exactly what demanding next-gen tech is it even using to drag performance down in a baked world, which even took out the destruction from their last title? They could have just used UE4 at this point and targeted 120fps and have a PS4 port at this point, ala Days Gone as I don't see a large leap in fidelity; it seems they went with UE5 and don't know how to handle the tech well at all.
 
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Looks like PS First party developers were briefed on the Playstation handheld and its only a PS5 handheld. It will play PS6 games using remote play like the PS Portal does while PS5 games will run natively on the hardware.

At least thats what twitter says.
Thats best case scenario, and avoids being the series S that will keep the actual PS6 from ever really flexing it's muscle.
 
That doesn't make much sense to me as I have to imagine virtually all PS6 games are going to be crossplatform with PS5
PS6 versions of those games will either have hardware lumen or path tracing and other next gen features. The 5 tflops handheld will get the performance mode versions of base PS5 games running at 30 fps.
 
Here 8 minutes B roll direct feed gameplay from Black flag remake instead of YouTube bullshit (note video size =4.2 gb)
Enjoy everyone
Edit
Direct feed 1mintue trailer
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this looks so good wow. The ship sections especially look amazing.
 
Exactly what demanding next-gen tech is it even using to drag performance down in a baked world,
This.

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Only the environment textures have baked lighting. The character model, and all those insane particles are all dynamically lit. thats when the game drops framerates.

They are also bringing back volumetric effects. You can see the godrays/volumetric effects fill the level. those cant be baked in either. This is easily the best looking level in the game, and you can see the metallic environments are very highly detailed and have proper light bounce despite being baked.

I still think that they couldve implemented at least software lumen on the Pro because of its high resolution. Like Boji said, drop 1440p to 1080p which PSSR2.0 can handle just fine, and that gives you a good 75% of the GPU power back. Software lumen is expensive but that shouldve covered it.

Now, we dont know if those rare framedrops Oliver talked about were due to CPU or GPU. The game seems to handle most scenarios just fine at a locked 60 fps as you can see above, so maybe those rare drops are CPU related and adding nanite and lumen wouldve hit the CPU on top of whatever GPU cost Lumen might have had. It could just be Sony devs being lazy, but i think the CPU in the Pro might have held it back here.
 
If Phantom Blade Zero and Gears of War look as good as advertised on consoles than I will agree with you, at least in terms of UE5 being utilized in linear games
Phanthom blade zero? Zero chance then, the name told you already. Tell u what these Chinese studios are notorious for their "pc first" strategy (u know Chinese market loves pc) and for pc platform there are always Nvidia and epic to back them up , if Sony doesn't step in better prepare for a shitshow on consoles.
 
Saros just seems like it's technically underwhelming, it damn near doesn't use any of the demanding UE5 features and still somehow struggles to lock down 60fps on the pro....why is it even so demanding seems unoptimized? Exactly what demanding next-gen tech is it even using to drag performance down in a baked world, which even took out the destruction from their last title? They could have just used UE4 at this point and targeted 120fps and have a PS4 port at this point, ala Days Gone as I don't see a large leap in fidelity; it seems they went with UE5 and don't know how to handle the tech well at all.

I hear you man, you're making legit points. With Returnal being my favorite game of all time, I wanted so much from Saros in terms of graphics. I thought SOME form of hardware RT was a shoo-in for the Pro but nope. Then I hear that some cinematics are video recordings, no 120hz mode, notable downgrade in environmental destruction and I'm left disappointed in key areas. Then I hear reviewers who loved Returnal saying the art direction and graphics are step above in Saros and see shit like this and im back to being super hype:


I struggle to find a game to compare to fairly judge Saros. It's basically in a class of it's own.
 
all those insane particles are all dynamically lit
What exactly do you mean?

They look to be just an emmisive glow. I doubt they light the enviroment outside of some screen space color blend (aka cheap ass lighting).

I also dont get people being jmpressed by what seems at best to be 1k of particles tops on screen at once like whoopti dooda. It looks visually goregous from an aesthetic stand point but hardly technicly impressive. Like why exactly are these gifs being posted supposed to impress?
 
What exactly do you mean?

They look to be just an emmisive glow. I doubt they light the enviroment outside of some screen space color blend (aka cheap ass lighting).

I also dont get people being jmpressed by what seems at best to be 1k of particles tops on screen at once like whoopti dooda. It looks visually goregous from an aesthetic stand point but hardly technicly impressive. Like why exactly are these gifs being posted supposed to impress?
I am pretty sure whatever glow they have has a cost on the gpu. Particles typically do.

That said, i pointed out exactly why i find it so impressive, but If you dont find the gif impressive, i dont think i can convince you otherwise.
 
Decima is way behind times right now (and no new games on Horizon), for open world games we now have Anvil, Snowdrop and (probably) Rage with GTA6.

Other open world games are not really comparable.
Gg had a chance to blow away the competition last year with ds2. But they set back as the insane kojipro tech director dismissed the ps5 specs as inadequate for a generational leap.

Then they were shown up by a mobile gacha studio from Korea who showed them that mmorpgs don't need to look like garbage Fortnite clones. They are literally making a mobile game right now. Its insane.

This is why i have zero faith in ssm and nd to deliver next gen visuals. If gg has lost their way then what hope is there?
 
Decima is way behind times right now (and no new games on Horizon), for open world games we now have Anvil, Snowdrop and (probably) Rage with GTA6.

Other open world games are not really comparable.
I guess if we are only talking about open worlds, sure i can see it (although i want to see something more clear than a yt video), i would put blackspace engine up there even if i personally think it's too broken and inconsistent and you have to mod and reshade its ass to make it look constantly good.

Even if we stay within ubisoft ubisoft, i think the highs of avatar and outlaws are still bettere than anything i saw from BF.

And of course BF is not touching stuff like wukong or crazy bitch 2 anytime soon...
 
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We live in times when remake of a PS3 game sets new graphical standards.
You people have quick amnesia, when this launches it will be completely downgraded. Mark my words.
It will look nothing like this.

People will say, but its 2 months away... I guaranfukingtee you it will be downgraded.

I already see it now. all those volumetric, the lighting. kiss that good bye, you're not seeing that period.
 
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You people have quick amnesia, when this launches it will be completely downgraded. Mark my words.
It will look nothing like this.

People will say, but its 2 months away... I guaranfukingtee you it will be downgraded.

I care about end results, AC Shadows is the best looking open world game right now and this runs on the same engine.

And SlimySnake SlimySnake is 100% about judging games (both positively and negatively) based on YT videos, I also thought "this looks like shit" looking at YT trailes of some games - when on my tv in 4k those games looked amazing (YT is killing all the small details).

Ubisoft is known for their lies but AC Shadows ended up looking better than first screenshots, we will see...
 
Man, imagine Anvil engine in central Europe. Would that be Austria? Czech republic? Amazing architecture in those cities in the 1600s. Ubisoft Montreal did the original Black Flag, AC Origins and Valhalla. Shame all their directors are leaving, maybe they shouldnt have fired the director behind those 3 games just because he had an extra marital affair. And now 3 of his replacements cannot deliver a game in 6 years.

 
Man, imagine Anvil engine in central Europe. Would that be Austria? Czech republic? Amazing architecture in those cities in the 1600s. Ubisoft Montreal did the original Black Flag, AC Origins and Valhalla. Shame all their directors are leaving, maybe they shouldnt have fired the director behind those 3 games just because he had an extra marital affair. And now 3 of his replacements cannot deliver a game in 6 years.



Sounds fucking amazing.

I love that we went from yearly AC games to "maybe every 2-4 years". And both Red (shadows) and hexe started their development around the same time.
 
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You people have quick amnesia, when this launches it will be completely downgraded. Mark my words.
It will look nothing like this.

People will say, but its 2 months away... I guaranfukingtee you it will be downgraded.

I already see it now. all those volumetric, the lighting. kiss that good bye, you're not seeing that period.
But AC Shadows has those same volumetric effects already. I have played that game for like 70 hours and its insane how those volumetric fog effects show up in dozens of different day/night, weather, and season combinations. It's all dynamic and somehow fits in their rendering budget without completely destroying the framerate. I dont think we need to worry about a downgrade here.

James Bond was dropping frames like crazy on PS5 during the reveal so it was always going to get downgraded during the optimization period. But even there, they are adding path tracing on PC, so essentially it will look better than the reveal in most aspects.
 
Man, imagine Anvil engine in central Europe. Would that be Austria? Czech republic? Amazing architecture in those cities in the 1600s. Ubisoft Montreal did the original Black Flag, AC Origins and Valhalla. Shame all their directors are leaving, maybe they shouldnt have fired the director behind those 3 games just because he had an extra marital affair. And now 3 of his replacements cannot deliver a game in 6 years.


They've been struggling ever since those news about misogynistic execs came out.
You can play as Alexios or Kassandra but Kassandra is the cannon choice, female Eivor is the cannon choice, what is even the point of having these choices in the first place?
They haven't written a single decent protagonist ever since they began doing this bullshit and it was worsened by the ever more non-linear structure of these games.

I imagine since Odyssey the design and writing meetings for AC must have been complete shitshows.

I'm hoping Hexe will finally break this curse since they're ditching the magic garbage and finally got the balls to pursue a female protagonist without tacking on some bullshit male option because they were forced to.
 
Sounds fucking amazing.

I love that we went from yearly AC games to "maybe every 2-4 years". And both Red (shadows) and hexe started their development around the same time.
Starting with Valhalla they changes strategy: alternating big open worlds (AC: Valhalla, AC Shadows) with more compacted games (Mirage, Black Flag). Next probably will be Hexe (open world) and then AC1 remake.
 
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I care about end results, AC Shadows is the best looking open world game right now and this runs on the same engine.

And SlimySnake SlimySnake is 100% about judging games (both positively and negatively) based on YT videos, I also thought "this looks like shit" looking at YT trailes of some games - when on my tv in 4k those games looked amazing (YT is killing all the small details).

Ubisoft is known for their lies but AC Shadows ended up looking better than first screenshots, we will see...

Ubisoft literally holds the crown for the biggest downgrade this gen (Avatar) and it's not even close. Star Wars outlaw is a distant second.

Unless I missed a game this gen. Ubisoft did the most downgrade and it wasn't close. Every gen they have done the most downgrade, last gen and the gen before that.

Now about shadows I don't recall there being a gameplay reveal trailer or a reveal trailer at all outside of cinematic.

I'm not saying they were the only game that were downgraded, there were hellblade 2, etc but those were very minor downgrades here and there.
 
Ubisoft literally holds the crown for the biggest downgrade this gen (Avatar) and it's not even close. Star Wars outlaw is a distant second.

Unless I missed a game this gen. Ubisoft did the most downgrade and it wasn't close. Every gen they have done the most downgrade, last gen and the gen before that.

Now about shadows I don't recall there being a gameplay reveal trailer or a reveal trailer at all outside of cinematic.

I'm not saying they were the only game that were downgraded, there were hellblade 2, etc but those were very minor downgrades here and there.
I would say they hold the crown, but with Outlaws, not avatar. They were pretty clear that the first trailer was an inengine render. Now with Outlaws, they tried to pass off gameplay which was clearly souped up.

Both outlaws and avatar got gameplay reveals at the same conference, and Avatar was shown running on PS5. You can watch that trailer. Aside from them using fancy cutscene shots that were not in the game which is largely first person, the final game is pretty much identical to that trailer. And even better on PC.
 
I would say they hold the crown, but with Outlaws, not avatar. They were pretty clear that the first trailer was an inengine render. Now with Outlaws, they tried to pass off gameplay which was clearly souped up.

Both outlaws and avatar got gameplay reveals at the same conference, and Avatar was shown running on PS5. You can watch that trailer. Aside from them using fancy cutscene shots that were not in the game which is largely first person, the final game is pretty much identical to that trailer. And even better on PC.
Come on, you can't let them get away with this.
It literally says "Game Footage Powered by Snowdrop"



Its avatar and its not close.

Keyword: "Game footage"

Imagine if Remedy or any other studio released their game with that label. Say for example alan wake 2.
And it comes out not looking even close. No one would give them the latitude of not crucifying them. It seems like there is ubisoft fatigue in the sense that they do this so much that no one is even interested in discussing/acknowledging their downgrades anymore.

But AC Shadows has those same volumetric effects already. I have played that game for like 70 hours and its insane how those volumetric fog effects show up in dozens of different day/night, weather, and season combinations. It's all dynamic and somehow fits in their rendering budget without completely destroying the framerate. I dont think we need to worry about a downgrade here.

James Bond was dropping frames like crazy on PS5 during the reveal so it was always going to get downgraded during the optimization period. But even there, they are adding path tracing on PC, so essentially it will look better than the reveal in most aspects.

Path tracing is just one of the many effects 15+ that contributes to a game looking nextgen.
A game doesn't just look next gen because it has path tracing. if you added path tracing to the current avatar it will still look no where near that trailer. not even close.

Why? there are dozens of other effects that made up that initial trailer that is either completely gone or complexity has been gutted.
For example while the object density is still there, the object fidelity (higher polygon / roundness) were gutted. Thats why one aspect.
Then you have cloud rendering, volumetrics, shadows, translucency, complex material shaders, water shaders, subsurface scattering, landscape quality, whether, reflections, pom/tessalation, completely different asset models, vfx with contributing lights and self shadowing, things that were complex materials are now baked down to simple textures, etc

Take for example the grass in the avatar demo is completely different from the one in the release. It looked like it was running some complex fur shader. path tracing is not gonna bring that back.

The same thing applies to 007 first light. sure you can slap pathtracing on top. but did you cut effects and shaders from the rest of the game? That's what matters. notice in the comparison you posted the difference of suit (cloth shading) of both bond and the other guy. Or the wooden staircase arm that isn't wooden in the latest trailer.

Mark my words it will be downgraded.

Skull and bones literally looks last gen compared to the blackflag reveal
 
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Come on, you can't let them get away with this.
It literally says "Game Footage Powered by Snowdrop"



Its avatar and its not close.

Keyword: "Game footage"

Looks near 1:1 with the final game to me, just with higher draw distance and different tonemapping / higher contrast. Ngl, the trailer feels kind of dated graphically nowadays.
 
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