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Harvard boots 10 admitted high schoolers due to their god-awful memes

"Seems Harvard has a no asshole admittance policy."

I dunno about that. But you've got to not be a big enough asshole to post images about child abuse, rape, racism, etc. with your name attached to it.
 

jaekeem

Member
I don't have any sympathy for these young adults. I don't have any sympathy because I can only imagine how they interacted with students of color in HS and how they'd interact with students of color on campus. Students of color deserve better than a potential of someone magically becoming not racist.

If these adults (not children, adults) deserve a chance for education and perhaps becoming a better person how would you ensure that students of color aren't harmed detrimentally by their behavior? Racism creates a hostile environment with its effects and steals away opportunities from those who are victims are racialized abuse. With that in mind, these kids aren't going to prison they can go to any other school, they aren't really harmed in the long run. While their presence could harm students of color and other ethnoreligious groups.

It's not student's job to tolerate racism on the off chance someone becomes not racist. If they learned something from this maybe at the next school they go to, they'll take African American studies or Jewish studies or something. They'll be fine.

It's also not the school's job.

Why should one of the most prestigious colleges in the world bear the burden of rectifying the fucked up tastes of select individuals? They have no responsibility to do so. Harvard is a privilege, not a right.
 
College admissions is already an essentially dehumanizing process. The admissions office doesn't care about you as a person, your individual future, or your education. It wants to select the people who already, independent of where they go, have the highest chance of being successful, and of enhancing or maintaining the prestige and overall reputation of the university. There are some easy metrics for this. Grades. Standardized test scores. Can you put sentences and paragraphs together in a coherent manner. If you don't have those things already, they don't want you. Whether that's fair to you personally, whether you might have some excuse for the lack of those things, doesn't really enter into it.

Here's another easy metric. Are you dumb enough to get yourself caught doing dumb stuff. Yes? Then hey, that's a red flag that maybe you aren't going to help the prestige and reputation of the school. Bye.

Is this fair? Not really. It's dehumanizing, it doesn't take individual circumstances into account, it isn't nearly as meritocratic as we like to imagine. It's also hard to see a different system taking root given the incentives in play. This is what we've got.

Of course Harvard dropped these kids. It's easier to reject an applicant than rescind an admit, and it's far far easier to rescind an admit than expel someone. Of course they dropped them now before it became exponentially more difficult to do anything.

And really, given that their behavior was exposed like this, this was the best outcome these kids could expect. Their names weren't publicly released, so no one is going to chase after them on social media, nobody is going to blacklist them, they can still go to their second choice of prestigious ivy league private university.

I don't hope these kids fail. I hope they go on to learn to be decent human beings, and then have good lives in which they are kind and decent and try to help those who are less fortunate than themselves. But it's hard to see Harvard as having done anything wrong here.

Good post which also captures my feelings on the matter. Yes, those kids posted some awful memes and they were really stupid to let them leak but they deserve a second chance. So good on Harvard for dropping them but not releasing their names. Hope they learned some lessons from this.
 

Riposte

Member
They could have sidestepped this problem entirely by just asking people on their initial application if they use 4chan and rejecting everyone who answers yes.

There wouldn't be a problem to sidestep if they had just used 4chan to begin with.
 

Mister Wolf

Member
"Seems Harvard has a no asshole admittance policy."

I dunno about that. But you've got to not be a big enough asshole to post images about child abuse, rape, racism, etc. with your name attached to it.

Its a no asshole policy they just have to catch you haha. What they did was equivalent to going on TV with a shirt that reads "I'm An Asshole".
 

danm999

Member
Why rescind their admission, though? Perhaps a proper education can mold their minds better.

Harvard just gave them the best lesson in what can happen if you're a vile person.

Even better, others can see and learn from the lesson too.

They were accepted for a reason, and a lot of teenagers are idiots. Stupid memes aren't the end of the world.

Neither is not going to Harvard. Seems the punishment fits the infraction.

Do you know what Harvard material is?

I know what it isn't.

I believe Harvard's job is to educate... lol

And they did! And for free! Harvard really did these students an amazing favour.
 

E92 M3

Member
Harvard just gave them the best lesson in what can happen if you're a vile person.

Even better, others can see and learn from the lesson too.



Neither is not going to Harvard. Seems the punishment fits the infraction.



I know what it isn't.



And they did! And for free! Harvard really did these students an amazing favour.

All they learned is that stupid meme shouldn't be linked with a public profile. At the end of the day, they will still get an excellent education somewhere else, but I strongly believe Harvard did this to avoid the possible bad press and not due to their own moral and ethical standards.

Playing devil's advocate to this whole situation.
 
All they learned is that stupid meme shouldn't be linked with a public profile. At the end of the day, they will still get an excellent education somewhere else, but I strongly believe Harvard did this to avoid the possible bad press and not due to their own moral and ethical standards.

Playing devil's advocate to this whole situation.

Harvard does have moral and ethical standards. They also have nearly 10x as many equally qualified applicants with perfect grades, test scores, varsity sports letters and 100 merit badges that they can't admit simply due to space, they won't miss this small pool of applicants. You are wrong.

Here's the student handbook for 2016/2017.

Section on student conduct:

Conduct Within the Community
A fundamental goal of the College is to foster an environment in which its members may live and work productively together, making use of the rich resources of the University, in
individual and collective pursuit of academic excellence, extracurricular accomplishment, and personal challenge. In the words of the Resolution on Rights and Responsibilities adopted by the Faculty of Arts and Sciences on April 14, 1970, “By accepting membership in the
University, an individual joins a community ideally characterized by free expression, free
inquiry, intellectual honesty, respect for the dignity of others, and openness to constructive change.”
For this goal to be achieved, the community must be a tolerant and supportive one,
characterized by civility and consideration for others. Therefore the standards and
expectations of this community are high, as much so in the quality of interpersonal
relationships as they are in academic performance. 

Discrimination
Discrimination based on race, color, sex, gender identity, sexual orientation, religion, creed,
national origin, age, ancestry, veteran status, disability, military service, or any other legally
protected basis is contrary to the principles and policies of Harvard University.  
 
I think if Harvard needs to educate you that the Holocaust was bad or that raping children is bad, you are not good enough to get into Harvard.

I don't think they needed to be educated that those things were bad , only that as an adult, you are responsible for your actions and doing bad things has consequences. And on that point, Harvard just gave them the best education money can't buy
 

HStallion

Now what's the next step in your master plan?
All they learned is that stupid meme shouldn't be linked with a public profile. At the end of the day, they will still get an excellent education somewhere else, but I strongly believe Harvard did this to avoid the possible bad press and not due to their own moral and ethical standards.

Playing devil's advocate to this whole situation.

Just like many big corporations and business pull ad time from groups or people they don't want to be associated with because of the terrible things they say and espouse. I'm fine with this.
 

Demoskinos

Member
At first I was like why the hell would someone be kicked out because of memes? And then well.. I read some of the article. Oh boy.
 

Armaros

Member
Devils advocate posters complanjng about hyperbole from posters talking about the booted teens and then at the same time using arguments like 'just put them in jail?' 'or just kill them then?'

Yeah are are definitely arguing in good faith there.
 

Klocker

Member
It's also not the school's job.

Why should one of the most prestigious colleges in the world bear the burden of rectifying the fucked up tastes of select individuals? They have no responsibility to do so. Harvard is a privilege, not a right.

Who else?

Who else to set the tone for what is considered acceptable behavior, to be a good citizen, a good fellow human being and set those boundaries for what it means to be in a civilized society than a bastion of higher education.
 
All they learned is that stupid meme shouldn't be linked with a public profile. At the end of the day, they will still get an excellent education somewhere else, but I strongly believe Harvard did this to avoid the possible bad press and not due to their own moral and ethical standards.

Playing devil's advocate to this whole situation.

The devil already has the best lawyers money can buy... he doesn't advocacy from those without a license to practice.

Who else?

Who else to set the tone for what is considered acceptable behavior, to be a good citizen, a good fellow human being and set those boundaries for what it means to be in a civilized society than a bastion of higher education.

They did though.

By revoking their admission
 

The Lamp

Member
?

Their names were withheld. They aren't going to have their lives ruined.

Have you seen the contents of the memes they were posting?

vivid rape jokes. images suggesting the death of ethnic babies.

It was fucked up. Letting them in would have been a stain on Harvard's reputation.

It is fucked up. This is the correct consequence. They don't deserve to go to Harvard.

I forgot their names were witheld. Thats good then. The people looking for more punishment than what happened or vengeance by releasing their names and ruining their lives are overboard, though.
 

danm999

Member
All they learned is that stupid meme shouldn't be linked with a public profile.

How do you know that? Maybe some of them will feel remorse, reflect on why this happened and become better people.

At the end of the day, they will still get an excellent education somewhere else,

Maybe. Maybe not. And maybe they'll only get that decent education is because Harvard fired a warning shot across their bow about how you shouldn't be a vile person if you want to get ahead.

but I strongly believe Harvard did this to avoid the possible bad press and not due to their own moral and ethical standards.

Playing devil's advocate to this whole situation.

You realise having strong beliefs about something and playing devil's advocate to something are like, contrary?

I don't think you're being remotely genuine.
 
Who else?

Who else to set the tone for what is considered acceptable behavior, to be a good citizen, a good fellow human being and set those boundaries for what it means to be in a civilized society than a bastion of higher education.
Parents? Also your argument suggests that only Harvard can do that. These kids can get all of the aforementioned at almost any higher education institution.
 

Lois_Lane

Member
I don't think they needed to be educated that those things were bad , only that as an adult, you are responsible for your actions and doing bad things has consequences. And on that point, Harvard just gave them the best education money can't buy
I can't believe I'm agreeing with you. Better Harvard does this now than they become the next White lady who makes an aids joke. They should be grateful to walk away from this at all.
 
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