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[KillLaCam]

I really don't agree with this particular example, for three reasons:

1) The above picture is from the third feature length movie in a trilogy. The bottom pic is from a 26-episode-long series. The difference in budget alone is monumental. Whatever objective edge you can give to the first pic is down to having more time and resources spent on it. You're doing the reverse "anime was better in the 90s look at this old big budget OVA vs. this new weekly show and see for yourself haha" thing .

2) Both incarnations have vastly different visual takes on the same content. Beyond the low budget, 90s Berserk is deliberately going for a rougher, more painterly aesthetic, which is very apparent when looking at the backgrounds. It tries to replicate the style of the manga, which the movies don't. They're going for a cleaner look.

3) Because they have a different look and the 90s show emulates the manga, I actually think it looks immeasurably better. If you're concerned with visual faithfulness to the source material, 90s Berserk is absolutely the better-looking show. Some would argue that a big part of the Berserk experience, moreso than many other manga, is the visuals. YouTuber Caribou Coon actually did a pretty good analysis about the difficulty of adapting Berserk into an anime, and why, in his view, the 90s show is the only one that comes close to replicating the visual feel of the manga despite its low budget. His video explains what I mean better than I could, so give it a watch: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v6CJaChQ7rQ

For the record, I don't mind the movie adaptations too much. They're decent, and they're technically very well made, apart from the 3D. The 3rd movie is clearly the best though. But I still think 90s Berserk looks (and sounds) way better than the movies.

For point 1 I wasn't thinking about budgets or anything. Just that even though I prefer the older style anime there are cases where I think digital can look good.

2) I prefer how the Original Series looks in everything besides this scene. But this scene was the only thing I could think of where digital looks alot better to me in any show/movie that has been in both formats.

3)Same thing as 2. It's only this scene for me. I like the music, sounds and 99% of the visuals better in the Show. But because there aren't many situations where I prefer Digital to Cel animation this is the only thing I could pull up.

I wasn't even thinking about which one is more faithful to the Manga. It wouldnt even be an argument against the Original Series haha.

Just to me this first part of the eclipse was alot creepier to me in the Movie than the original Anime. This was more of a "digital isn't horrible' post Because that scene is literally the only part of the movie that impressed me lol

 

[HStallion]

I see one person being very bitter.

The guy who spent several paragraphs ranting without saying anything of substance? Yeah I don't need all that to say something sucks.

 

[Savitar]

The guy who spent several paragraphs ranting without saying anything of substance? Yeah I don't need all that to say something sucks.

So sayeth the typical poster protecting the fandom.

 

[HStallion]

So sayeth the typical poster protecting the fandom.

Ok bitter person, you have fun yelling at clouds.

 

[LinkSlayer64]

I'm sick of bad harem romantic comedies.
Got some genuinely good manga ones though, which is great.
Also years of having plank of wood MC boys means I usually identify with girl characters more, so thanks anime! (I mean that in a good way.)

 

[DVCY201]

I keep seeing this claim that there's less money in anime now than before, but if I remember correctly there's even more money now, which is why there's so many shows per season and new animation studios. The issue is that the money goes to the production committee and not the studio. I'll see if I can't find a source. It doesn't compare the 80s, but it does show an upward trend

http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2016-09-29/report-anime-industry-up-12-percent-in-2015/.107055

 

[KillLaCam]

I'll never believe in the power of digital animation until someone shows me some beautiful digital hair

 

[Sibersk Esto]

I CHOOSE YOU. Sorry to the others that could have quoted.

Basically, the characters, the animation, the style, the stories, just about everything. It's shit. It doesn't matter if it was made in the late 90's or in the 2000's this is the kind of anime that is frankly crap, it's more of the same generic stuff you see in so many anime these days. The same product distilled to the same audience that anime has been chasing now for the last two decades since the market contracted so badly and shrunk.

I don't fault people for liking it if they do and clearly some people do, look how many times I got quoted. Ironically I remember the first the title was talked about on this forum more people lambasted it than not. To me this title and others of it's ilk is the same uninspired drivel that took me largely out of anime, it's more of the norm now than the minority and that's a shame in my view point. I'm aware that some people speak of emotional moments in the show and certain things that happen and again, if those moments were powerful for you hey great. But it's still more of the same of the same to me personally and doesn't reach the heights spoken of.

But I'm not the target audience for this. That's clear.

At what point in history did anime not target teenagers?

 

[Kilrogg]

For point 1 I wasn't thinking about budgets or anything. Just that even though I prefer the older style anime there are cases where I think digital can look good.

2) I prefer how the Original Series looks in everything besides this scene. But this scene was the only thing I could think of where digital looks alot better to me in any show/movie that has been in both formats.

3)Same thing as 2. It's only this scene for me. I like the music, sounds and 99% of the visuals better in the Show. But because there aren't many situations where I prefer Digital to Cel animation this is the only thing I could pull up.

I wasn't even thinking about which one is more faithful to the Manga. It wouldnt even be an argument against the Original Series haha.

Just to me this first part of the eclipse was alot creepier to me in the Movie than the original Anime. This was more of a "digital isn't horrible' post Because that scene is literally the only part of the movie that impressed me lol

Ah, gotcha. Makes sense, and I definitely see where you're coming from. If there's one part where the movie does a great job, it certainly is the Eclipse. Although it's partly due to the fact that it, you know, actually ended in that adaptation, unlike the 90s show.

 

[Zolo]

I CHOOSE YOU. Sorry to the others that could have quoted.

Basically, the characters, the animation, the style, the stories, just about everything. It's shit. It doesn't matter if it was made in the late 90's or in the 2000's this is the kind of anime that is frankly crap, it's more of the same generic stuff you see in so many anime these days. The same product distilled to the same audience that anime has been chasing now for the last two decades since the market contracted so badly and shrunk.

I don't fault people for liking it if they do and clearly some people do, look how many times I got quoted. Ironically I remember the first the title was talked about on this forum more people lambasted it than not. To me this title and others of it's ilk is the same uninspired drivel that took me largely out of anime, it's more of the norm now than the minority and that's a shame in my view point. I'm aware that some people speak of emotional moments in the show and certain things that happen and again, if those moments were powerful for you hey great. But it's still more of the same of the same to me personally and doesn't reach the heights spoken of.

But I'm not the target audience for this. That's clear.

You specified HxH, so do you mind if I ask what your specific problems with it are using examples from the show, and what makes them wrong?

 

[hosannainexcelsis]

I'll never believe in the power of digital animation until someone shows me some beautiful digital hair

A Silent Voice has some wonderfully animated hair.

 

[KillLaCam]

A Silent Voice has some wonderfully animated hair.

Hmmmmmmmm I may trust in the power of digital now. Good looking hair can add alot to a scene for me. Idk why though haha

 

[faridmon]

I agree the industry had leaned in a direction, but there's also the fact that we only remember the best of those older years. As someone who's been watching anime since the VHS days, there was a whole lot of cruft folks have forgotten.

There was a lot of rubbish no doubt. And I will be the first to admit that, thankfully, a lot of them are forgooten under the great onse that have come at teh same time.

But I do remember the early 2010s when there were at least 4-5 shows I would watch seasonally and these days, I can't even try to like 3 at a time.

Spring 2010 had

Tatami Galaxy
Working
Giant Killing
Rainbow
House of Five Leaves
Durarara
Winter Sonata

Spring 2011 had

Steins Gate
Ano Hana (Which I liked, damn you all)
Iroha
Kaiji
Sket Dance
Nichijou
The World God Only Knows

Spring 2012 had

Kids on The Slope
Hyouka
Tsuritama
Space Brothers
Polar Bear Cafe
Lupin
Ginga Kickoff

Spring 2017? I only watched

Rage of Bahamut
Sakura Quest (only 4 epesode)


Thats a steep decline me thinks

I'm sick of bad harem romantic comedies.
Got some genuinely good manga ones though, which is great.
Also years of having plank of wood MC boys means I usually identify with girl characters more, so thanks anime! (I mean that in a good way.)

If you haven't already, Watch SNAFU!!!!

 

[lunlunqq]

If OP likes the MMO/eSports theme, I'd recommend you give "The King's Avatar" a try. It's a Chinese anime. May take some get used to. But overall it's pretty good. You can watch all episodes on YouTube with English sub.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MSjaP1eV5eQ

 

[Kite]

lol OP, I've been an anime fan for over 20 years and I've seen this exact same thread dozens and dozens of times. It's always the same damn story, a noob comes in and discovers these Japanese cartoons and binges all the popular recommended anime from the past few years. They catch up and are disappointed to learn that good anime isn't produced in the numbers they thought.

Anime has always been mostly garbage, for the most part each year has 2 to maybe 3 legit good anime that I wouldn't mind recommend to newbies years later. The rest are quickly forgotten. And as for the whole moe thing, back in the day anime geeks are nutting over 14 year old girls with DD chests, nowadays it's flat-chested 12 year olds. I'm not sure which is worse but both are pretty bad, the rise of moe lol anime has always been creepy shush.

 

[faridmon]

lol OP, I've been an anime fan for over 20 years and I've seen this exact same thread dozens and dozens of times. It's always the same damn story, a noob comes in and discovers these Japanese cartoons and binges all the popular recommended anime from the past few years. They catch up and are disappointed to learn that good anime isn't produced in the numbers they thought.

Anime has always been mostly garbage, for the most part each year has 2 to maybe 3 legit good anime that I wouldn't mind recommend to newbies years later. The rest are quickly forgotten. And as for the whole moe thing, back in the day anime geeks are nutting over 14 year old girls with DD chests, nowadays it's flat-chested 12 year olds. I'm not sure which is worse but both are pretty bad, the rise of moe lol anime has always been creepy shush.

Wtf am I reading?

Are you 13?

 

[Lucumo]

From this season of anime

Stop watching bad anime.

I only partake in anime of the 80s, myself.

Is that supposed to be an example of things that look good or bad? I honestly can't even tell anymore (and for the record, it does look awful).

Also, Versailles no Bara is awesome.

 

[MHWilliams]

There was a lot of rubbish no doubt. And I will be the first to admit that, thankfully, a lot of them are forgooten under the great onse that have come at teh same time.

But I do remember the early 2010s when there were at least 4-5 shows I would watch seasonally and these days, I can't even try to like 3 at a time.

Spring 2010 had

Tatami Galaxy
Working
Giant Killing
Rainbow
House of Five Leaves
Durarara
Winter Sonata

Spring 2011 had

Steins Gate
Ano Hana (Which I liked, damn you all)
Iroha
Kaiji
Sket Dance
Nichijou
The World God Only Knows

Spring 2012 had

Kids on The Slope
Hyouka
Tsuritama
Space Brothers
Polar Bear Cafe
Lupin
Ginga Kickoff

Spring 2017? I only watched

Rage of Bahamut
Sakura Quest (only 4 epesode)


Thats a steep decline me thinks

If you haven't already, Watch SNAFU!!!!

I mean, Spring 2017 had - not counting ongoing or second seasons - Re:Creators, Bahamut: Virgin Soul, Sakurada Reset, Sakura Quest, and Tsuki ga Kirei.

The previous season was the slower Winter season, which had Shouwa Genroku Rakugo Shinjuu, Little Witch Academia, ACCA, and Kobayashi-san Chi no Maid Dragon (depending on your tastes).

 

[CosmicPanda]

What anime is this from?

 

[Haly]

What anime is this from?

Record of Lodoss War, and I think that specific shot might be from the OVA.

 

[Lucumo]

What anime is this from?

Since I posted the .gif, Lodoss-tou Senki (also known as Record of Lodoss War). Make sure not to watch the TV version (it's awful, apart from the OP).

 

[Permanently A]

I CHOOSE YOU. Sorry to the others that could have quoted.

Basically, the characters, the animation, the style, the stories, just about everything. It's shit. It doesn't matter if it was made in the late 90's or in the 2000's this is the kind of anime that is frankly crap, it's more of the same generic stuff you see in so many anime these days. The same product distilled to the same audience that anime has been chasing now for the last two decades since the market contracted so badly and shrunk.

I don't fault people for liking it if they do and clearly some people do, look how many times I got quoted. Ironically I remember the first the title was talked about on this forum more people lambasted it than not. To me this title and others of it's ilk is the same uninspired drivel that took me largely out of anime, it's more of the norm now than the minority and that's a shame in my view point. I'm aware that some people speak of emotional moments in the show and certain things that happen and again, if those moments were powerful for you hey great. But it's still more of the same of the same to me personally and doesn't reach the heights spoken of.

But I'm not the target audience for this. That's clear.

I can definitely see your issue with derivative anime - The Hunter Exams, the Chuunin Exams, the Entrance Exam etc. A bit of Seinfeld Is Unfunny in Hunter x Hunter's case but that's understandable. What I am curious about is your comment "it's still more of the same of the same to me personally" are you talking about the character of Meruem? Because I cannot think of another villain like Meruem in shonen. I think his character arc, especially juxtaposed with the character arc of the main character... is something really unique to shonen anime as far as I know.

 

[Visceir]

Weird to see this thread turn into bickering over animation styles.

Hajime No Ippo was absolutely incredible but that wasn't a modern show.

Actually just recently went through that show and felt like there was a huge change in quality from Season 1 (2000 - 2003?) to season 2 (2009?), which was a bit harder to get through, started watching season 3 too (2013?), but been just losing interest.

While season1 still felt like it was all about boxing and somewhat grounded then season2 was just over the top flashy and didn't seem to have much to do with boxing anymore (last fight where all boxing rules and principles were tossed out of the window)

Not to mention feeling the need to add a comedic relief dog which for some reason gets featured prominently in ending credits (this feels like some higher up decided to just come in and told them to add that) and just weird scenes of girls fighting over the MC.

Also noticed how the episodes were built up differently -- the first season seemed to respect your time, make things move along quick and did not have cliffhanger endings, while in seasons after that it felt like that shit was just dragging on.

tldr: season1 seemed to respect your time and felt more grounded with less bs going on in comparison to newer seasons which also felt somewhat focus tested.

 

[Kite]

Wtf am I reading?

Are you 13?

Been watching anime for 20+ years, yeah I'm 13 lol. I started in the mid 90s, fans were complaining how 80s anime and their super robots and badass manly pilots were better than the angsty 90s teenager eva pilots and clones. Miyazaki was bitching about how terrible anime was back then as well. I did the same to the 00's anime, and the same cycles continues.

 

[KillLaCam]

Been watching anime for 20+ years, yeah I'm 13 lol. I started in the mid 90s, fans were complaining how 80s anime and their super robots and badass manly pilots were better than the angsty 90s teenager eva pilots and clones. Miyazaki was bitching about how terrible anime was back then as well. I did the same to the 00's anime, and the same cycles continues.

Miyazaki knows the truth though .

 

[HStallion]

Miyazaki knows the truth though .

I heard he is physically hunting down the team responsible for the Berserk anime one by one

 

[KillLaCam]

I heard he is physically hunting down the team responsible for the Berserk anime one by one

I had SO much hope for that Miyazaki needs to avenge Anime for us all!

 

[Mossybrew]

Most anime is juvenile crap and as you get older your tastes mature, you become exposed to media that raises your standards, the foreigness of it is no longer a novelty, etc.

Yeah. My daughter is a huge anime fan, and we like to watch shows together, but man we have to sometimes wallow through some absolute crap before we find a show worth watching, there is a LOT out there to sift through. And then her standards are different from mine, she'll dig a show that I think is garbage and then get mad at me for making fun of it, etc. etc.

 

[Astral]

So is Redline actually good or just really fucking pretty?

 

[LotusHD]

So is Redline actually goodnie just really fucking pretty?

Yes.

 

[HStallion]

So is Redline actually goodnie just really fucking pretty?

Its basically F Zero Whacky Races with incredible animation.

 

[petran79]

Nichijou, Steins;gate, and Usagi Drop all came out in that same year. I hear about each of those way more than Madoka. Not that Madoka was even bad. This was 2011. Past that there are plenty of shows that push the boundary both artistically (Ping Pong, One Punch Man, Drifters, Monogatori) and dramatically (Shouwa Genroku Rakugo, Shinsekai Yori, Kids on the Slope). Plus way more than the examples I gave.

This whole thread is powered by the same generator that makes people say, "Nothing like the classics" to every single other medium under the sun. Finding new things to like is hard, especially as you get older. It's a lot easier to just say it all sucks.

Steins Gate is decent but it was evidence of the decline of scifi anime. When a series based on a video game is regarded as the best scifi series of the last years, then we have a problem. Compared to Texhnolyze or Ergo Proxy it lacks.Both were original productions btw.ProjectD instilled some hope for good scifi,though I am not very certain.

Other titles were manga and novel based .Shinsekai Yori is only worth for the thematology. Animation was not that good. Yuusa’s Ping Pong was fine,just like the manga,but compared to Kaiba and Kemonozune it feels less original.

50 episode kids series with quality like Planet Survival,Porphy's Journey or even Erin feel like a distant dream. Series that werent legendary classics by any means

Subjectivity also matters but even when I put blinders on, some things feel underwhelming.

 

[Theonik]

Record of Lodoss War, and I think that specific shot might be from the OVA.

Record of Lodoss War (1990 OVA) Episode 01.

 

[petran79]

Record of Lodoss War (1990 OVA) Episode 01.

Best "Excuse me?!" ever in anime

 

[Violet_0]

Anime was so good in the 90s.

which show/movie is this from?

 

[hosannainexcelsis]

Steins Gate is decent but it was evidence of the decline of scifi anime. When a series based on a video game is regarded as the best scifi series of the last years, then we have a problem.

The best science fiction anime of the past couple years is Fafner Exodus.

which show/movie is this from?

Made in Abyss, the first episode of which just came out.

 

[jackal27]

When it comes to modern anime, I seem to having the opposite problem. There are too many shows to watch! I think the main issue is that we done really have a service like Toonami was for us in the 2000s curating what we watch. Even then, Toonami premiered some shit shows at times and was itself pulling from 20+ years of anime for its lineup.

The 80s and (especially) the 90s had plenty of terrible anime. These days we just have so much I think it's difficult to sort through it all and find something we want to dive in an watch.

One is the first Gundam. The other GIF is a fanservice show literally about toys.

Here's the latest real Gundam.

Iron Blood

Thunderbolt

Gundam didn't leave anyone behind.

I agree the industry had leaned in a direction, but there's also the fact that we only remember the best of those older years. As someone who's been watching anime since the VHS days, there was a whole lot of cruft folks have forgotten.

Thunderbolt looks so damn good even if I'm not the hugest fan of how dark the tone is. Let's not forget The Origin OVA as well!

Sure, its Mobile Suit action was sparse (makes sense within the narrative), but it's a perfect example of how dynamic 3D animation can actually be when done well. I would kill for a remake of the OG Mobile Suit Gundam that looked like this.

 

[Lucumo]

Actually just recently went through that show and felt like there was a huge change in quality from Season 1 (2000 - 2003?) to season 2 (2009?), which was a bit harder to get through, started watching season 3 too (2013?), but been just losing interest.

Glad I'm not the only one to think so. I really liked Hajime no Ippo but New Challenger felt off for several reasons (some of which you mentioned). But unlike you, I haven't even bothered with Rising so far.

When it comes to modern anime, I seem to having the opposite problem. There are too many shows to watch! I think the main issue is that we done really have a service like Toonami was for us in the 2000s curating what we watch. Even then, Toonami premiered some shit shows at times and was itself pulling from 20+ years of anime for its lineup.

Thunderbolt looks so damn good even if I'm not the hugest fan of how dark the tone is. Let's not forget The Origin OVA as well!

Sure, if you can stand the crappy CGI, I guess it works for you.

 

[jackal27]

Sure, if you can stand the crappy CGI, I guess it works for you.

I have never liked CGI, but tbh it's so dynamic here that I barely even notice it. I have no idea how you can call the gifs above "crappy CGI" personally. It's used to great effect and scene composition is fantastic at conveying scale and motion.

I do think that CGI has trouble conveying the weight of Mobile Suits though. Maybe it's the fact that it's missing those minor details of movement in the joints and impact against the environment at times.

 

[Lucumo]

I have never liked CGI, but tbh it's so dynamic here that I barely even notice it. I have no idea how you can call the gifs above "crappy CGI" personally. It's used to great effect and scene composition is fantastic at converting scale and motion.

I do think that CGI has trouble conveying the weight of Mobile Suits though. Maybe it's the fact that it's missing those minor details of movement in the joints and impact against the environment at times.

It looks completely artificial and inorganic. From best to worst it's like 3, 2, 1, 4. It's also not about the composition at all.

Especially in sci-fi anime it can look really bad.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZp_NE3Tq48

And it's not like it can't be done right. You would need competent people and money for that though which Japan or outsourced studios don't have.

 

[Izayoi]

MORE GIFS

 

[RangerBAD]

It looks completely artificial and inorganic. From best to worst it's like 3, 2, 1, 4. It's also not about the composition at all.

Especially in sci-fi anime it can look really bad.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DZp_NE3Tq48

And it's not like it can't be done right. You would need competent people and money for that though which Japan or outsourced studios don't have.

1998 CGI, huh? That's the example of bad CGI in anime? Not Berserk?

 

[Lucumo]

1998 CGI, huh? That's the example of bad CGI in anime? Not Berserk?

Didn't realize Berserk was a sci-fi anime.

 

[RangerBAD]

Didn't realize Berserk was a sci-fi anime.

Oh, I see my mistake. Still that's a pretty old example.

 

[wmlk]

Last night I finished Your Lie in April, which is modern, and it became quite possibly my favorite anime of all time. The story cut me deeper than a goddamn cartoon had any right to. The visuals were absolutely beautiful, as was the music, and the character development was really wonderful to behold. There were so many chances for this anime to be cliché and mediocre, but it ended up being incredibly compelling, emotional, heartbreaking, inspiring, and by the end, unforgettable.

I now understand what all those weebs call "Post Anime Depression Syndrome." I've been completely out of it all day today, and every time I hear the music from the OST I get a lump in my throat.

I cannot recommend this show highly enough. You can watch it for free on Crunchyroll and it's also on Netflix if you have that.

Literally every episode is the same song and dance. Dealing with trauma, but oh there's this girl I really like so I'm going to do this for her. The repeating internal monologue is terrible the third time around. I can't believe I withstood even 12 episodes of this.

At least I was able to hate watch SAO.

 

[Lucumo]

Oh, I see. Still that's a pretty old example.

Mostly because it's one of the stains on Legend of the Galactic Heroes (OVAs). And I had already modern examples posted above by jackal27. It was just another example of why sci-fi anime can be especially bad (because ships, mecha etc are more visible in front of the vast nothingness that is space - Detective Conan, on the other side, has/had terrible CGI cars which aren't as bad as there is the street and houses and such nearby - there is nothing in space however).
As for Berserk, I obviously hope as well that Miyazaki is successful in hunting them down.

Literally every episode is the same song and dance. Dealing with trauma, but oh there's this girl I really like so I'm going to do this for her. The repeating internal monologue is terrible the third time around. I can't believe I withstood even 12 episodes of this.

Is it so bad? I watched some good AMV about this anime a year or so ago.

 

[wmlk]

Is it so bad? I watched some good AMV about this anime a year or so ago.

People in general love it, but it's apparent two/three episodes in that every episode will boil down to an internal monologue about the same thing.

 

[Necrovex]

People in general love it, but it's apparent two/three episodes in that every episode will boil down to an internal monologue about the same thing.

I liked the show, but you're not wrong about the internal monologue. I was mostly there for that OST and animation. The story is very YMMV. I was fine with it, but I understand why some may loathe it.

 

[The Dink]

Since I posted the .gif, Lodoss-tou Senki (also known as Record of Lodoss War). Make sure not to watch the TV version (it's awful, apart from the OP).

Oh good, so it wasn't just me. I remember buying the whole TV series after watching the OVA and could not get into it. Ended up trading it in to some used place for like...2 bucks credit? Worth it.

There's still good anime out there these days. It's just a lot of the popular stuff these days seems designed to be watched and enjoyed without much critical thought. "Just turn your brain off" and what not. I see this mindset in titles like SA:O and DBS and it drives me nuts. There's also you know...fanservice. Which got to be too much in anime a decade ago and is now just laughable. And then there's the new Berserk...

...Yeah...


So is this a stealth anime recommendation thread? Because I've liked these titles that are pretty recent:
-91 Days
-One Punch Man
-Attack on Titan
-Konosuba
-Mob Psycho 100
-Parasyte: The Maxim

Although some on my list aren't without their own flaws, I enjoyed them enough to give a shout out.

 

[Mister Wolf]

Ah, gotcha. Makes sense, and I definitely see where you're coming from. If there's one part where the movie does a great job, it certainly is the Eclipse. Although it's partly due to the fact that it, you know, actually ended in that adaptation, unlike the 90s show.

Bingo.