Man sometimes I wish Jay-Z was banished to Mars or something. How somebody can be such a annoying, arrogant and corny combination is beyond me. Somehow I really feel sorry that 50 Cent is losing the top dog position in hip-hop and I don't even like him.
btw. the Camel reminds me of Tony Manero's dance partner in Saturday Night Fever, when she keeps rambling on about how much "she's growing". Someone needs to tell Jay-Z to go on a diet.
"Creep through your block
**** a glock
I step Through your neighborhood armed with nothing but a rep
Im giving these ladies something they can feel cause Im real
Ya man get outta line and its kill kill kill"
Jay gets alot of intangible praise too not just the glamor and lights as the "safe" hip hop persona for mainstream to endorse, he has respect from real "pre main stream" hip hop fans. Im talkin about people that would really listen and try to discern a message from a track not just bounce to a beat. Jay survived at a time in hiphop when you had to have lyrical content to be king, i mean look at pac he didnt have the best beats, but his lyrics made him king of the hill, just as biggies made him the fan favorite *bad boy had crazy beats though*.
Im not the biggest Jay fan but im not gonna say he is trash , the man can rhyme no doubt, and when the roc was on fire they were king of the hill. So much so they even squeezed a good song out of Memphis Bleek:lol .
That said with one song Nas crumbled all that shit, even Beans said Nas got Jay in that battle. Obviously after ether the jay haters finally had something to back up their rants about jay being trash. Nas had reason to say what he had to say, and alot of the things on ether people had been thinking for a while about jay. All in all thats one fight with an underdog he should've walked away from.
In the real world Jay was just the right talent at the right place at the right time. Does he get this big if biggie and pac live? Im gonna say no, even though he is good great even, those two just took up too much space in the hip hop world.
Jay gets alot of intangible praise too not just the glamor and lights as the "safe" hip hop persona for mainstream to endorse, he has respect from real "pre main stream" hip hop fans. Im talkin about people that would really listen and try to discern a message from a track not just bounce to a beat. Jay survived at a time in hiphop when you had to have lyrical content to be king, i mean look at pac he didnt have the best beats, but his lyrics made him king of the hill, just as biggies made him the fan favorite *bad boy had crazy beats though*.
.
In the real world Jay was just the right talent at the right place at the right time. Does he get this big if biggie and pac live? Im gonna say no, even though he is good great even, those two just took up too much space in the hip hop world.
The writer of the article failed to fully understand the intent of the line where he alludes to not putting rims on the car.
The man who is now used to money knows you don't put your rims on the big boys. A Chevy, sure, a BMW, go ahead, Mercedes, of course, why not.
But you don't put them shits on an Aston, you don't put them on a Rolls Royce, or on a Bentley or on a Koennig, Maserati, etc.
It wasn't Jay-Z saying "rims destroy a car, I'm too mature kids!" it was Jay-Z saying "I know rims don't belong on a super luxury vehicle, just like I know not to put any old frame on a million dollar painting."
Anyway, he broke his personal record for fastest selling album already with Kingdom Come, so... obviously the other rappers aren't doing their job because the people want this despite the reviews.
I was really disappointed with KC when I first heard it, but after listening through it 3-4 more times, it's really beginning to grow on me. I still like the Black Album the best of Jay's albums, but I think KC is pretty good too.
The one song that I feel like he's writing it for me is Do U Wanna Ride. My interpretation is that he's waiting for his best friend to come up and come through to his level. Feel like that in my life. :lol
The writer of the article failed to fully understand the intent of the line where he alludes to not putting rims on the car.
The man who is now used to money knows you don't put your rims on the big boys. A Chevy, sure, a BMW, go ahead, Mercedes, of course, why not.
But you don't put them shits on an Aston, you don't put them on a Rolls Royce, or on a Bentley or on a Koennig, Maserati, etc.
It wasn't Jay-Z saying "rims destroy a car, I'm too mature kids!" it was Jay-Z saying "I know rims don't belong on a super luxury vehicle, just like I know not to put any old frame on a million dollar painting."
Anyway, he broke his personal record for fastest selling album already with Kingdom Come, so... obviously the other rappers aren't doing their job because the people want this despite the reviews.
See I got demons in my past, so I got daughters on the way
if the prophecy is correct then the child shall have to pay
for the sins of the father
so I barter my tomorrows
against my yesterdays
in hopes that she'll be okay
The problem with Kingdom Come is he doesn't sound like he gives a **** about what he talks about when he's doing this "mature" thing. I struggle to listen to it and enjoy it knowing what he's capable of, not to mention the fact that the album is all over the place and has a couple of tracks that are just embarassing, it's just hard to listen to as an album. And he's just not delivering on the punch-lines that made him so fun to listen to in the past.
The problem with Kingdom Come is he doesn't sound like he gives a **** about what he talks about when he's doing this "mature" thing. I struggle to listen to it and enjoy it knowing what he's capable of, not to mention the fact that the album is all over the place and has a couple of tracks that are just embarassing, it's just hard to listen to as an album. And he's just not delivering on the punch-lines that made him so fun to listen to in the past.
That's my problem with it. The flow and production are very loose and though there are a couple of really just great songs, the rest is below average album filler, especially for Jay Z.
And yes Minority Report is good, but like I said before, that's the kind of song that is really hard to listen to say everyday on your way to work or whatever.
And yes Minority Report is good, but like I said before, that's the kind of song that is really hard to listen to say everyday on your way to work or whatever.
That part I agree with. This CD to me isn't a CD that I could listen to everyday, because I have to be in a certain mood for it. But then again I have to be in a certain mood to hear a hardcore west coast Game CD too so.....I don't know.
What Jay-Z has become is a dream materialized. Hip Hop has been deeply rooted in the struggle to come up and achieve a dream. But when that dream is achieved does that mean the struggle stops? Obviously so, according to many. See, thereÂ’s a big difference in struggling for food as opposed to struggling to maintain wealth and health. Hip Hop has never really seen a dream materialize, rather many dreams have been halted abruptly. Just when Tupac and Biggie were hitting their collective strides their lives were ended by a hail of bullets
And that, my friends, is the moral of the story. The main reason I loathe hip-hop is because all it's become is bragging to a beat, and talking about how tough they are. Yes, you have lots of money. Yes, "the man" is always trying to keep you down. Yes, you could buy and sell me a thousand times over. Yes, you get all the loose white women you want. Seriously. I don't care.
Whether or not I like hip-hop, I can admit that Jay-Z has a knack for putting out hits. I think he should branch out and do some different stuff, because like that quote I pulled said; the struggle is over.
And IMO, the "new" struggle is neither interesting nor worth listening to.
The one song that I feel like he's writing it for me is Do U Wanna Ride. My interpretation is that he's waiting for his best friend to come up and come through to his level. Feel like that in my life. :lol
Personally I felt the album was extremely lackluster and lazy-like in execution; Jay Z's flow seems tired and slow; it works on slower tracks like Lost Ones, but on most of the other songs the production simply outpaces him. Although some of the beats were great, many don't strike me as AAA beats. The Black Album featured a list of good producers and a bunch of amazing beats, most of which Jay Z flowed over very nicely. But on this album, the verses seem weak and the choruses are terrible, especially on Show Me What You Got; Jay Z came out of retirement to release another generic "club banger", but worse than some of the more offensive ones?
Lyrically he makes many strides, but most of the album still revolves around basic Jay Z: let me tell you how rich I am. Now Hova is so mature he has the means to buy entire yahts and basketball teams, but is this any more relevent than generic rappers bragging about buying cars or grills? Not at all. In fact, it comes off extremely boring.
At the end of the day, Jay seems confused to me; despite his new found stance on "maturity" he still can't help but revert back to the same practices he's critisized recently. On one hand he clearly is intent on showing everyone how mature he is, and how he's "too old" for the more stupid hiphop antics. Yet on the other hand he goes after Dipset and Jim Jones on the album in a suble way (Dig a Hole), and follows that up with a direct diss record aimed at them. Yet just a month ago Jay was saying he was beyond beef, as he signified with Nas. Then he said he wouldn't go after artists as small and insignifigant as Dipset. Now he's attacking them. What's it going to be Hov?
Overall yes, I was indeed disappointed by the album. It's truly baffling to me. While Jay Z was making this album he knew Nas was making one too; hell, he's Nas' boss. Yet despite knowing Nas was in the studio working on a great album he didn't feel the urge to take things to another level, enlist the hip hop producer dream team he originally intented for on the Black Album, and drop a true epic. We all know Kingdom Come will outsell Hip Hop is Dead no matter what, and clearly Jay knows that. But as it stands, I've already heard two songs from Hip Hop is Dead that are better than anything on Kingdom Come. And the funny thing is, Jay Z is on one of those tracks.
Yes, I'm back from my own...retirement too, albiet forced.
And that, my friends, is the moral of the story. The main reason I loathe hip-hop is because all it's become is bragging to a beat, and talking about how tough they are. Yes, you have lots of money. Yes, "the man" is always trying to keep you down. Yes, you could buy and sell me a thousand times over. Yes, you get all the loose white women you want. Seriously. I don't care.
Whether or not I like hip-hop, I can admit that Jay-Z has a knack for putting out hits. I think he should branch out and do some different stuff, because like that quote I pulled said; the struggle is over.
And IMO, the "new" struggle is neither interesting nor worth listening to.
For you it isn't, but for more mature/older people it more than likely is. I'm not saying your immature, but keeping Hip-Hop in the "stuggle to survive" box is stupid. Why is it that other genres of music like Rock and Roll (Rolling Stones) to classical R&B (Gladys Knight) can make music forever back rappers can't?
Ol Frank Sinarta was old as hell but the people still loved him. With 700,000 people wanting to hear what Hova has to say in one week, I'm pretty sure we won't stop rapping right know and that other rappers will soon follow his mature rap style. Watch.
For you it isn't, but for more mature/older people it more than likely is. I'm not saying your immature, but keeping Hip-Hop in the "stuggle to survive" box is stupid. Why is it that other genres of music like Rock and Roll (Rolling Stones) to classical R&B (Gladys Knight) can make music forever back rappers can't?
Ol Frank Sinarta was old as hell but the people still loved him. With 700,000 people wanting to hear what Hova has to say in one week, I'm pretty sure we won't stop rapping right know and that other rappers will soon follow his mature rap style. Watch.
Huh? Why do I have to be more mature to understand Jay Z rapping about relaxing on beaches, buying yahts, and being a CEO? It's no different than rapping about cars and grills, as I said earlier.
mckmas8808 said:
Why is it that other genres of music like Rock and Roll (Rolling Stones) to classical R&B (Gladys Knight) can make music forever back rappers can't?
Because they make music that speaks to their audiences; Jay Z didn't do that on this album. There's more to being "mature" than telling everyone how mature you are. Have you heard Mos Def's Black of Both Sides? That's a mature album; it speaks on issues that everyone can understand. If the Rolling Stones had been singing about how rich they were for 40 years they wouldn't be relevent today. Instead, their music continues to speak to common issues everyone can understand and relate to, be it love, politics, etc. Kingdom Come does not achieve that on a large scale.
700,000 bought that album because of the media blitz; the album is everywhere, from Monday Night Football to commercial after commercial. Considering the negative reviews and word of mouth the album is getting, I expect the hype (no matter how manufactured) to die down considerably next week.
700,000 bought that album because of the media blitz; the album is everywhere, from Monday Night Football to commercial after commercial. Considering the negative reviews and word of mouth the album is getting, I expect the hype (no matter how manufactured) to die down considerably next week.
I guess we'll see. If that album loses more than 60% of it's previous weeks sales then you would have been right. But if it maintains more than that, then I consider myself correct.
If he manages to sell 1 million albums in a 2 week span then all I can say is, "DAMN"! And there's plenty of quotes on this album that could and have been posted than notes that he speaks about more stuff than just being rich and a CEO.
Have you heard Minority Report? And do you understand the song Beach Chair? Do you think it's just about chilling on the beach for real? Like actually just sitting on the beach?
Did you hear the ode to his mother? Or what about the song for that guy in jail? Hell he even had a whole sublimial song directed towards Dipset too.
I guess we'll see. If that album loses more than 60% of it's previous weeks sales then you would have been right. But if it maintains more than that, then I consider myself correct.
If he manages to sell 1 million albums in a 2 week span then all I can say is, "DAMN"! And there's plenty of quotes on this album that could and have been posted than notes that he speaks about more stuff than just being rich and a CEO.
Have you heard Minority Report? And do you understand the song Beach Chair? Do you think it's just about chilling on the beach for real? Like actually just sitting on the beach?
Did you hear the ode to his mother? Or what about the song for that guy in jail? Hell he even had a whole sublimial song directed towards Dipset too.
At the end of the day record sales don't mean an album is good, as has been proved many times this year.
I've heard the album. Yes I've heard Minority Report. It's not a great song, but lyrically it's very good. Same with Beach Chair. But at the end of the day, the majority of the album still revolves around how much money he has.
The Dipset diss really turned me off. Not only is it an extremely weak diss track compared to the likes of Takeover, it also contradicts his current "mature" persona. And besides, why is freaking Jay Z responding to Jim Jones?
Jay-Z is overall wack to me, only song I liked from him was "Big Pimpin" He is a sell out, driving around in Europe think he the shiz. Lyrically I know way better rappers than him. It's a huge hype, people talking about the king is back, when Cassidy come out the hospital hungry, I hope he slices up some of these rappers. Jim Jones and the Dipset camp they got the club on lock, but I dunno how long people going to say BALLING. Jay-Z only addressed the diss towards them because he didn't want people to think he was getting soft and a minor beef before a album release = huge sales. 50 cent formula for success, if he still has any...
He lost my respect, on the streets he not respected anymore. He is a snitch, he played Dame out and switch up sides. He is money hungry, this aint for hip-hop, just a buisness man talking. " Men lie,Women lie, Numbers Don't" he is talking about how he love hip-hop he is eating and chilling. Of curse he loves it because he is set for life. Back in the day when he wanted that paper his whole tone was different...
You the same dude that said Jay minus the dope beats = Fat Joe right? No offense, but how is anyone supposed to take your opinion seriously after a statement like that?
For one, you are wrong with the assumption that no rap song is forever. Their are plenty of songs that one would deem classics. That is all dependent on who listens to them. I could throw out something from say...Public enemy and I am willing to bet that a lot of people that listened to them when they came out or atleast know something about hip hop, would tell me that "Don't Believe the Hype" would fit the bill as a classic.
For one, you are wrong with the assumption that no rap song is forever. Their are plenty of songs that one would deem classics. That is all dependent on who listens to them. I could throw out something from say...Public enemy and I am willing to bet that a lot of people that listened to them when they came out or atleast know something about hip hop, would tell me that "Don't Believe the Hype" would fit the bill as a classic.
Although I'm not into Public Enemy I agree with your point. Many rap artists have made quality, classic songs that do stand the test of time. You could listen to Black on Both Sides or some Blackstar at any point and it would still be relevent to society as well as your life.
That can't be said of certain rappers who spend 50 minutes an album telling me how rich they are, or who their girlfriend is. In essense that's the problem with Kingdom Come. It tries to come off in a mature manner but fails due to immature lyrics and lackluster delivery. If a person has to tell you how smart they are, chances are they aren't very smart. Likewise I can't help but feel that Jay Z's attempts at telling me how mature he is prove to the contrary. Mos Def didn't have to tell me that: I felt it in the music. I don't feel anything here.
He tries taking the same cocky hustler persona he previously had and instead of rapping about drugs and violence raps about "good credit and such". It doesn't fit.
Although I'm not into Public Enemy I agree with your point. Many rap artists have made quality, classic songs that do stand the test of time. You could listen to Black on Both Sides or some Blackstar at any point and it would still be relevent to society as well as your life.
That can't be said of certain rappers who spend 50 minutes an album telling me how rich they are, or who their girlfriend is. In essense that's the problem with Kingdom Come. It tries to come off in a mature manner but fails due to immature lyrics and lackluster delivery. If a person has to tell you how smart they are, chances are they aren't very smart. Likewise I can't help but feel that Jay Z's attempts at telling me how mature he is prove to the contrary. Mos Def didn't have to tell me that: I felt it in the music. I don't feel anything here.
He tries taking the same cocky hustler persona he previously had and instead of rapping about drugs and violence raps about "good credit and such". It doesn't fit.
For one, you are wrong with the assumption that no rap song is forever. Their are plenty of songs that one would deem classics. That is all dependent on who listens to them. I could throw out something from say...Public enemy and I am willing to bet that a lot of people that listened to them when they came out or atleast know something about hip hop, would tell me that "Don't Believe the Hype" would fit the bill as a classic.
I guess you didn't understand what I was trying to say. I know lots of rap songs can be classics forever. Everybody knows that.
What I'm saying is that when rappers get older it's okay for them to rap about their current situation. You guys always talk about keep it real, but the second a guy does keeps it real some people complain.
The one song that I feel like he's writing it for me is Do U Wanna Ride. My interpretation is that he's waiting for his best friend to come up and come through to his level. Feel like that in my life. :lol
I listened to the album. Let's see, how many songs deal with drugs/I was a hustla/I'm so mature/look how rich I am/my girlfriend/haha Dipset diss/"club" song/etc:
Prelude
Kingdom Come
Show Me What you Got
Oh My God
30 Something
Trouble
Dig a Hole
Anything
Spin that:lol
As I said, most of the album is standard Jay Z; am I supposed to be impressed he has a couple songs which show lyrical growth? And if the album was actually good this probably wouldn't be too much of a problem. But please don't act like this is some revolutionary piece of work. This is just Jay Z trying to jump on another bandwagon. He tries to pull off an almost Kanye West-type album but fails.
I'm not a hater on Jay Z, but let's be real. The man knows exactly how to market himself and project an image, no matter how fake/manufactured it is. He knows that if you say something enough people will believe it, whether it's true or not. Whether he's saying buy product X, my first album was a classic, I'm the GOAT, etc.
Like I said before, it's not about understanding the album. His lyrical work, cadence, flow, what have you is just not as good as he has been before. Then on top of that, the production (which has covered his ass when he's been lacking) wasn't good either. We all get the underlyng "mature" theme of the album, but look, a theme doesn't make an album good. Neither does one song that you think is amazing in Minority Report. It's hard to listen to a lot of those songs, so what if there are 2-4 good ones.
I'm not a hater on Jay Z, but let's be real. The man knows exactly how to market himself and project an image, no matter how fake/manufactured it is. He knows that if you say something enough people will believe it, whether it's true or not. Whether he's saying buy product X, my first album was a classic, I'm the GOAT, etc.
So you are saying that his emotions of KC is fake? And that this is just a marketing ploy? How would you know? I think he really feels this way. Until you have proof that this is all a lie, you shouldn't say it's manufactured/fact.
BUT, at the end of the day I also understand what Wellingtion is saying. Jay's word play has fallin off some. And his razor sharp lyrics aren't what they use to be. God I hate to pull a Jay-Z but here it goes.
Remember when Jordan came back the and didn't have the lift off the floor that he use to have? Well what did he do? He resorted more to the fade away (something that lots of guards are doing now) shot, than dunking on people.
I look at what Jay-Z is doing and sorta feel that if his word play/flow isn't going to be what it used to be then at least he is rapping about something different (not saying he planned it that way).
Atleast people that are 30+ that listen to this album don't have to feel like they are 20 years old to understand the lyrics. I've seen and heard plenty of older people love "So me what you got." They always tell me that they love the beat and the feel of the song.
I've always preferred hip-hop with some thought. I'll listen to some club hits, but when its all about BS, thats when I'm done. My most hated song is "That just my Baby Daddy".
I think its sad when other artist can't see Jay'Z transition and respect it. Jay Z just has moved to another level in hip-hop, hopefully he'll spark a new trend in hip-hop.
So you are saying that his emotions of KC is fake? And that this is just a marketing ploy? How would you know? I think he really feels this way. Until you have proof that this is all a lie, you shouldn't say it's manufactured/fact.
BUT, at the end of the day I also understand what Wellingtion is saying. Jay's word play has fallin off some. And his razor sharp lyrics aren't what they use to be. God I hate to pull a Jay-Z but here it goes.
Remember when Jordan came back the and didn't have the lift off the floor that he use to have? Well what did he do? He resorted more to the fade away (something that lots of guards are doing now) shot, than dunking on people.
I look at what Jay-Z is doing and sorta feel that if his word play/flow isn't going to be what it used to be then at least he is rapping about something different (not saying he planned it that way).
Atleast people that are 30+ that listen to this album don't have to feel like they are 20 years old to understand the lyrics. I've seen and heard plenty of older people love "So me what you got." They always tell me that they love the beat and the feel of the song.
That's what gets most older people to listen to hip-hop, my mom listens to hip-hop, its always the beat. You won't believe how many older women liked Kanye's Gold Digger with the Ray Charles hook.
So you are saying that his emotions of KC is fake? And that this is just a marketing ploy? How would you know? I think he really feels this way. Until you have proof that this is all a lie, you shouldn't say it's manufactured/fact.
BUT, at the end of the day I also understand what Wellingtion is saying. Jay's word play has fallin off some. And his razor sharp lyrics aren't what they use to be. God I hate to pull a Jay-Z but here it goes.
Remember when Jordan came back the and didn't have the lift off the floor that he use to have? Well what did he do? He resorted more to the fade away (something that lots of guards are doing now) shot, than dunking on people.
I look at what Jay-Z is doing and sorta feel that if his word play/flow isn't going to be what it used to be then at least he is rapping about something different (not saying he planned it that way).
Atleast people that are 30+ that listen to this album don't have to feel like they are 20 years old to understand the lyrics. I've seen and heard plenty of older people love "So me what you got." They always tell me that they love the beat and the feel of the song.
I said Jay Z is manufactured, not the album. The emotions on KC are not fake, they're contrived. He's acting like he's the first rapper to do this, but in reality many others have done this far better than him. Hell, Kanye did the whole "introspective" angle far better on both his albums.
Your Jordan analogy doesn't work. Jordan began shooting fade aways because he had to; age forced him to change his game up. Jay doesn't have any sort of physical excuse for his new flow: it's his decision. If Jordan could still dunk/dominate at 40, don't you think he would have done it?
I said Jay Z is manufactured, not the album. The emotions on KC are not fake, they're contrived. He's acting like he's the first rapper to do this, but in reality many others have done this far better than him. Hell, Kanye did the whole "introspective" angle far better on both his albums.
Your Jordan analogy doesn't work. Jordan began shooting fade aways because he had to; age forced him to change his game up. Jay doesn't have any sort of physical excuse for his new flow: it's his decision. If Jordan could still dunk/dominate at 40, don't you think he would have done it?
Naw I think Jordan would want to dunk on people till he was 50. :lol
But seriously Jay is most def not acting like he is the first to do the mature/grown up rap. That's the critics, media, DJs, VJs, and listeners that are saying that. I know Kanye has been doing it for a while and that's why I've always liked his music and will buy every single Kanye album till I die if he keeps it like that.
And I didn't mean for the Jordan to Jay-Z analogy to be taken at straight on like that. On the internet it's hard to get a point across just like I would like to.
My point was with the analogy was this. Just like I loved Jordan's game when he switched it up (even though I loved that high flying Jordan more), I can and have come to love Jay-Z's new rap theme with this album too.
But Phoniex I do agree with you when you said why even go at Jim Jones. I mean hell we all know that it's a waste of time, so why even go there? With that said the Brooklyn High song is kinda hot.
Did you see the concert he did in New York (last week) when he performed that song and everybody in the crowd was going crazy?
You the same dude that said Jay minus the dope beats = Fat Joe right? No offense, but how is anyone supposed to take your opinion seriously after a statement like that?
