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Have Kotaku pulled a Digg with their resign? It's so bad

aeolist said:
Wait what is the problem with Javascript? Unless you're browsing on a Pentium 3 using IE5 or something

It's can load a lot slower than a simple HTML and can very easily break the site and stop working. Like I've said, the sidebar didn't load for me at all - there was just loading symbol; another Gaffer here posted a screenshot with an opposite situation - sidebar was visible, but there was no main article.

I have nothing against using javascript to add some spice to your site or to make it more user-friendly. But if you can't even show a single article without it (even though the site is run in a condition where it should work properly), then you know that something sucks.
 
Blue Ninja said:
Kotaku's one of my go-to sites for news, and I enjoy reading it, but I have to agree that the new look isn't all that great. I didn't like it when it was applied to i09 a couple of days ago, and I still don't like it now. It might grow on me, but for now... I just don't like it.

Yeah same, I don't understand all of the negativity coming from this thread in regards to the content on Kotaku and to be honest I think some of the stuff people are saying in this thread is shameful. That said, I really dislike this new design. I think it's unnecessary for Kotaku, I feel like this design is trying to do things differently for the sake of doing things differently; the old design didn't really need to be touched.
 
Roche178 said:
Yeah same, I don't understand all of the negativity coming from this thread in regards to the content on Kotaku and to be honest I think some of the stuff people are saying in this thread is shameful. That said, I really dislike this new design. I think it's unnecessary for Kotaku, I feel like this design is trying to do things differently for the sake of doing things differently; the old design didn't really need to be touched.
What's so shameful. There's numerous and numerous reasons to hate Kotaku but if you like to visit them for news I find that pointless as well because everyone knows it goes GAF > internet > kotaku > gaf in the order of where news appears first.
 
stephentotilo said:
We have different views of the site. Kotaku wasn't a step down from MTV, for me it was a step up. It got my work in front of many more gamers.

As readers of the site have seen, we publish stories we believe are of interest to gamers. For some time now, that has included stories that are not explicitly about video games, though they likely have something to do with the culture around games or the types of things we believe gamers care about. Some of our stories are for the hardcore Xbox user, others for the PC gamer, others for the person who doesn't know gaming but could use an explanation from people with gaming expertise about some gaming-inflected aspect of our culture. I'm a gamer and I find that breadth of content interesting.

I've been at Kotaku for two years and have not seen our team intentionally write misleading headlines. We strive to operate with transparency -- with speed as well, but we take accuracy seriously.

You complained that we hyped the NGP launch. My recollection of the months leading up to the NGP launch was that we broke the news that it wouldn't support a disc format, that we broke the news that it had as much RAM as the 360, and that third-party publishers were sizing it up as a portable PS3. Prior to that, we broke news about the hardware specs of the 3DS. Sometimes I worry that our best work was lost in the never-ending stack of stories we run. Hopefully if you drop into Kotaku in the future you'll see that one of the ways the new layout can serve us and you better is to highlight those big important pieces about which we are most proud.

I appreciate your feedback and am only disappointed that you seem to see so many negatives in a site where I see so many positives.
Can you tell me how the redesign is better in any way? I read the article by Denton but it was really just philosophical mumbo jumbo about how to go "beyond" the blog as if he was starting a new revolution in terrible website design. You push a single feature article above everything else. The previous format, where you had four "Top News" articles was much more accessible, especially for people who haven't checked the site or any gaming news in the past few days. Now if I want to know if there's any new NGP news and I check Kotaku, all I see is some pretentious feature article like "What Demon's Souls tell us about the recession." I guess you guys are trying to not be seen as "G4M3R NEWZ" and want to be "The New Yorker: Gaming Edition," but a redesign to make it seem like you're a newspaper isn't the way to do it.

How about getting rid of such obvious hit-baiting articles like THIS. When you scroll down the main page, the article just has the first picture with the thought-provoking title of "What's the Front of this Samurai Showdown Figure Look Like?" Clearly this is just to entice readers that maybe they can see some anime doll boobs. This type of hit-baiting is really shameless and isn't journalism at all. I know you're going to reply with, "Kotaku discuss all aspects of gaming culture, even some obscure ones." I'm not saying that "New Samurai Showdown figure" isn't news, but the way its presented is awful.

The design is really not user friendly at all. I see so many articles that would have gotten many hits before get completely ignored because they are buried in that tiny sidebar that no one wants to navigate. I don't know who Gawker is trying to appeal to. How about instead of trying to grab new users, you please your fanbase that had their information stolen due to sheer incompetence from Gawker and flame-baiting hackers?
 
-Pyromaniac- said:
What's so shameful. There's numerous and numerous reasons to hate Kotaku but if you like to visit them for news I find that pointless as well because everyone knows it goes GAF > internet > kotaku > gaf in the order of where news appears first.

I find the blind hatred and comments claiming that all Kotaku staffers should resign pretty shameful, they haven't done anything to deserve that as far as I can see. I personally read Kotaku for the articles, I find them well written, interesting and I occasionally come across news I wouldn't have otherwise noticed on Gaf.

I realize I'm fighting a loosing battle here but I would hope at least people can keep it civil.
 
Nothing loads if you disable javascript or it fails for some reason :lol

I've worked on all sorts of sites with usability issues but this takes the cake. A site that is dependent on javascript to load and delivers no fall back content. bra-vo.

keep your "apps" off the web. Thanks.
 
I can't claim to know anything about web design, but my god, every single one of the Gawker sites looks absolutely awful with this new skin. What a trainwreck.

It's not just ugly, it's unintuitive. Everything is reduced to a vague, ugly thumbnail, and it seriously took me almost 30 seconds to figure out how i was supposed to even scroll through the damn stories.
 
I enjoy reading Kotaku, I guess I'm not GAF enough to hate them.

That being said, the re-design is frigging awful, and it'll depend on how lazy I am to change my bookmark to the "classic" design site. May just use gameinformer or joystiq.
 
stephentotilo said:
You complained that we hyped the NGP launch. My recollection of the months leading up to the NGP launch was that we broke the news that it wouldn't support a disc format
So after the UMD format didn't take off as Sony wanted and they released a handheld that didn't use UMD or any discs at all you managed to predict that the next handheld they released wouldn't use a disc format? Congrats.

I predict that the next Xbox will be released by Microsoft!

Roche178 said:
I find the blind hatred and comments claiming that all Kotaku staffers should resign pretty shameful, they haven't done anything to deserve that as far as I can see.
I don't want them to resign. I'd prefer they all stay at Kotaku so I can just ignore one site and not have to see their writing.
 
I hate it. Sifting through all the news stories in that small little column is a pain in the ass and it's kind of hard to get a feel of what the story is going to be about unless you click on it.
 
Brian Crecente said:
WelcomeÂ… DonÂ’t Panic!!

If you've got a pulse and have visited Kotaku before, you probably noticed that the front page looks just a *tad* different today. Don't worry, we can explain.

With the launch of the redesigned Kotaku you'll noticed that one story takes up most of the page, and a list of today's headlines in a column down the right side of the page. The page is a lot simpler and lighter, which means it will load quickly. And at last we have a way to display big, gorgeous images and videos on the front page of our site. That's the point.

We realize that things have changed a lot, and we want to help you become master navigators of the new layout. That's why we've put together this helpful guide on how to make the most of our new design.

How to scan through stories

When you come to Kotaku, usually you want to scan through a lot of stories at once. Now you have two ways to do that: Flipping through pages and scrolling through headlines.

If you like the experience of flipping through stories and glancing over the full text, video, and pictures for each one, you'll want to use our "next post" button. It's on the left side of the navigation bar at the bottom of the page. Clicking it takes you through the day's stories one at a time. You can even flip through the pages right from your keyboard: Just use the right and left arrow key to page through the day's stories. Go on, give it a try.

If you'd rather just scroll through headlines, you can use your scroll button or up/down arrow keys to move through the stories in the right-hand column, which are displayed in reverse-chronological order. There is also a "next headlines" button at the bottom of that column, for even quicker scanning.

At the top of the right-hand column, you'll see three icons: A house, a flame, and a magnifying glass. Click the house if you want to see today's stories. Click the flame for today's most popular stories. Click the glass for search.
If you have to spend a few paragraphs telling people how a website works, odds are it's not real well designed.
 
What's this redesign stuff all about? Just sub the RSS feed, it hasn't (and can't) change.

Anyway, Adblock Element Hiding Helper to make the cluttered up right sidebar vanish. Problem solved.
 
notworksafe said:
So after the UMD format didn't take off as Sony wanted and they released a handheld that didn't use UMD or any discs at all you managed to predict that the next handheld they released wouldn't use a disc format? Congrats.

I predict that the next Xbox will be released by Microsoft!

They had a report that seemed genuinely sourced with some non-obvious info. After TGS. For example about the screen being an inch larger, which turned out to be more literally true than most expected I think.

Such a minor thing to get hung up about, but I absolutely trust that Kotaku can and does bring good information and interesting articles and previews. I have in particular enjoyed many of Stephen's articles.

That said, I DON'T like the new design. But, tbh, I mostly come to Kotaku articles directly via Google News - that's my frontpage for Kotaku and everything else, if you like - so I expect visit frequency won't change much in the future due to the design change.
 
stephentotilo said:
We have different views of the site. Kotaku wasn't a step down from MTV, for me it was a step up. It got my work in front of many more gamers.

If that's genuinely how you feel about that, then I respect your opinion on the matter.

As readers of the site have seen, we publish stories we believe are of interest to gamers. For some time now, that has included stories that are not explicitly about video games, though they likely have something to do with the culture around games or the types of things we believe gamers care about. Some of our stories are for the hardcore Xbox user, others for the PC gamer, others for the person who doesn't know gaming but could use an explanation from people with gaming expertise about some gaming-inflected aspect of our culture. I'm a gamer and I find that breadth of content interesting.

It's not so much that I disagree with the notion that a "gaming site" can have information or articles on it that don't have a direct correlation to gaming. It's more a matter of my own personal opinion that I just don't find 95% of those articles on Kotaku interesting. I absolutely understand that there are some readers that genuinely do like those kinds of articles. What I don't understand is why that has to be on the same page mixed in (well, now crammed in on that right sidebar) with "hardcore gamer news". Especially on the redesign, it makes finding information relevant to me much more difficult in the respect that I'm not interested in those types of articles (or a more casual gamer might not be interested in the types of articles I'd want to read), and without a direct search, there's no filter between them. It's a giant hodge-podge of content that seems a bit aimless as to who its target audience is. It seems like a better solution would be to have Kotaku for serious gamers and Kotaku Culture for off-shoot articles, or at the very least a filter between them.

I've been at Kotaku for two years and have not seen our team intentionally write misleading headlines. We strive to operate with transparency -- with speed as well, but we take accuracy seriously.

I'm genuinely not trying to suck up to you when I say this, but I don't think you're the "problem" here. It's guys like Crecente and Ashcraft that genuinely don't seem to care if what they post is accurate or not so long as it gets hits. Here's a slightly older, but no less ridiculous example of what I'm talking about. There was no fact-checking and he blamed CAG for his own inability to do any remote semblance of fact-checking. More recently, the fake GT5 footage where Ashcraft (I believe) ran an article talking about how slow the GT5 load times were. While the game isn't great with load time speed, it's really not good when the video in question is running in slow motion.

You're not the issue here as far as I can tell. These aren't things that I or others have imagined.

You complained that we hyped the NGP launch. My recollection of the months leading up to the NGP launch was that we broke the news that it wouldn't support a disc format, that we broke the news that it had as much RAM as the 360, and that third-party publishers were sizing it up as a portable PS3. Prior to that, we broke news about the hardware specs of the 3DS. Sometimes I worry that our best work was lost in the never-ending stack of stories we run. Hopefully if you drop into Kotaku in the future you'll see that one of the ways the new layout can serve us and you better is to highlight those big important pieces about which we are most proud.

It's not so much the launch hyping or the information prior to PlayStation Meeting 2011 that I was referring to. I was reading the Kotaku liveblog prior to the meeting start, and there was so much rampant speculation going on just minutes prior to an event, and in my opinion, it detracted from waiting for actual information. Specifically, when they started getting into details that obviously were not going to be announced that early at the conference or any time soon. Maybe some people enjoyed that, but it seemed more like they enjoyed listening to each other talk rather than actually gleaming any information from it.

I appreciate your feedback and am only disappointed that you seem to see so many negatives in a site where I see so many positives.

I wish that I felt differently about it, but I've been burned by Kotaku too many times.
 
It really just feels like the horrific revenge of frames. You thought they died with GeoCities? You're wrong!
 
gofreak said:
They had a report that seemed genuinely sourced with some non-obvious info. After TGS. For example about the screen being an inch larger, which turned out to be more literally true than most expected I think.

Such a minor thing to get hung up about, but I absolutely trust that Kotaku can and does bring good information and interesting articles and previews. I have in particular enjoyed many of Stephen's articles.
I dunno. When I read the article that implied Sony should dump Polyphony because GT5 was taking too long to make while ignoring the money brought in by GT5:P, I decided that they really had nothing worthwhile to say anymore. It's not the worst thing they've posted, but just the last one I felt like reading.

I suppose if I feel the need to read another post with someone's bad fanart combing two games, one about a cake that looks like a video game level, or one about video game tits I'll go back to the site.
 
Crisis said:
Let me be perfectly honest with you in regards to Kotaku if you're actually reading posts here. I genuinely cannot fathom why you left MTV for Kotaku. I get that MTV isn't necessarily game-oriented and maybe that was a deciding factor for you. If it's all the same to you, and a paycheck is a paycheck, then say no more, I'm in a similar situation. I've enjoyed a lot of the pieces that you've written over the years and the care with which some of them were written, but I haven't become a dedicated follower of yours or anything like that, if that makes sense.

Kotaku deserves every single bit of negative reaction that it gets. They have unabashedly published intentionally-misleading headlines, published headlines/articles with very key details absolutely wrong, only to edit and change them later without so much as a notice mentioning that they were wrong. They routinely make fools out of themselves with pre-event speculation (with the NGP press conference being a very good and recent example). They've been known to run rumors as fact. Despite your presence, they have been slowly drifting over to posting articles/content that have nothing to do with gaming at all. All it does is serve to waste screen real estate. Even you're doing it. That's just stuff I thought of off the top of my head - they got a rap sheet a mile long. I don't mind telling you that to me, Kotaku is the preeminent example of what is wrong with the state of video game journalism. I don't visit it anymore, and it's a real shame, because I enjoy reading your work.



As far as I know, the intention of any redesign for a website is to make things better, not worse. I've tried two different web browsers with some of the Gawker Media sites, and my mouse has literally no idea what section of the page I'm trying to scroll down. Not optimizing it for some computer screen sizes is really just not acceptable. That should have been taken care of prior to the launch of this stuff as it just makes people not want to go back. Condensing all of the content save for one giant headline/article into the sidebar over there brings up a number of potential issues, not the least of which is the potential for Kotaku's Bullshit Headline Syndrome to work overtime to get people to click on them. You have to scroll down quite a bit just to find anything that isn't the giant headline. I don't know what all has been posted on that site and if I had just logged onto it without knowing what Kotaku was, I'd wonder if I had actually stumbled onto a game site at all. And honestly, the whole "click to get to any details of the next article" thing really reminds me of what sites like 1Up were doing a few years back with their stupid Top 10 lists where they had one thing on a page, and you'd have to click through 9 through 11 of them just to see all of them. The whole thing smells like a way to generate more ad revenue without actually having a lot more ads on the page.



With any luck, I'll be able to go back to not caring about Kotaku at all.
Wow. Brb, printing and framing this.

I agree 100% with you and I always try to give Kotaku a chance but the fake-Japanese culture spewing in the website makes me sick to my stomach. Some of the non-gaming stories are fine and well, but changing the website design so they can be in the frontpage more than actual news is just pathetic. The comment section is not user-friendly at all, and only 'star commentors' i.e. users voted by others regardless of the post for that certain article get visible (99% are fanboys who get votes by other fanboys) while other constructive comments get hidden.

And then there are insanely biased posters like Bashcraft who, as his name states, bashes everything PS3, and other biased posters who do the same for other consoles.
 
Horrible. I like the fact that when I go to a blog site, they all function more or less the same. This just doesn't work at all for me. 1 article w/ navigation on the bottom-right? Are you kidding me?

As for the content of the site, I don't mind it. I just avoid the comments, which honestly, aren't much worse than a lot of the stupid throwaway/troll/hate posts here on GAF.
 
The reason I don't like the redesign is that I can't EFFECTIVELY sift and scan through stories without clicking on them.

I have 2 options you say?

1) Use the right sidebar.
2) Click next post.

The 1st one is bad because it's just a one sentence quip about the story. I don't obtain a good feel for what the post is going to be about just by reading one sentence.

The 2nd one is bad because I have to click and WAIT for the stories to load.

In the old design, all I had to do was essentially scroll through the page and read half-paragraph descriptions about the post. If I was interested, I would click on it.

I'm saying all of this because I like Kotaku - it's my go to website for gaming news and it's my home page.
 
Good news: Bar on the right now loads.
Bad news: New design is still pretty bad IMHO.
Good news: Never used Blog view before, tried it and like it!

Net positive for me today :)
 
well i'll be using joystiq, and the gamcenter app more often now. Bad design Koatku, BAD!!!!

And as for the Engadgtr design I agree. I love the sites design and love Joystiqs as well.
 
DigiMish said:
The reason I don't like the redesign is that I can't EFFECTIVELY sift and scan through stories without clicking on them.

I have 2 options you say?

1) Use the right sidebar.
2) Click next post.

The 1st one is bad because it's just a one sentence quip about the story. I don't obtain a good feel for what the post is going to be about just by reading one sentence.

The 2nd one is bad because I have to click and WAIT for the stories to load.

In the old design, all I had to do was essentially scroll through the page and read half-paragraph descriptions about the post. If I was interested, I would click on it.

I'm saying all of this because I like Kotaku - it's my go to website for gaming news and it's my home page.
3) Use the arrow keys.

Up/down (or letters j/k) scrolls the currently selected article up or down
Left/right scrolls to the next/previous article in the article bar on the right side of the page

The new design is definitely lacking, but the arrow key functionality is great imo.
 
While I don't visit Kotaku regularly, i do like Lifehacker and it is shame that it is also on this redesign. Looks like the need to just use the RSS feed has now become more of an necessity.
 
notworksafe said:
I dunno. When I read the article that implied Sony should dump Polyphony because GT5 was taking too long to make while ignoring the money brought in by GT5:P, I decided that they really had nothing worthwhile to say anymore. It's not the worst thing they've posted, but just the last one I felt like reading.

Undoubtedly they publish things I don't find myself nodding my head to, and yes, they've had some occasional blinders in this respect, but pretty much every site does the same. Maybe it is click-baiting, and that's something I don't like, but that's not to say they don't also publish some stuff of interest from time to time. Anyway, I don't mean to white-knight Kotaku, but I thought the comment about guesswork on NGP was a little unfair. Unless people are talking about their chit-chat immediately prior to the NGP conference - in the liveblog - in which case I thought it was incredibly obvious some of the stuff they were throwing out was done in jest.
 
mattp said:
every gawker site switched over to this layout

This. They made a terrible business decision to release this without first testing it out within the community.

And in answer to the OP's question...it's so bad!

powerglove-o.gif
 
stephentotilo said:
You should be able to swiftly and smoothly navigate through the headline stack. It's also a known issue that the current design isn't optimized for all screen sizes, and that's being worked on.

With any luck, you will soon be able to go back to complaining about us only for our content.

You guys should've done an A/B tests before launching anything. C'mon, the intentions of the design are nice, but it ain't working.

I don't know why you guys picking the direction of emulating an app interface for a site that makes scanning for content quite a chore?

edit: Having this in guiding your users/readers doesn't help much.

Read on for tips, tricks and how to access the more familiar Blogroll view Kotaku
 
I checked Kotaku after this thread. Yes, it's bad, but why the heck do I end up in io9 if I keep clicking Next Post? Is that intentional? Also, the back button doesn't work, wut?

How is the Gawker audience responding?

edit:
http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/kotaku.com

It seems they are doing just fine. Even the whole hacked DB worked in their favor as evidenced by the spike in traffic during that time.
 
godhandiscen said:
I checked Kotaku after this thread. Yes, it's bad, but why the heck do I end up in io9 if I keep clicking Next Post? Is that intentional? Also, the back button doesn't work, wut?

How is the Gawker audience responding?

edit:
http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/kotaku.com

It seems they are doing just fine. Even the whole hacked DB worked in their favor as evidenced by the spike in traffic during that time.

Alexa figures are about a week behind, so hard to gauge from that. Also they will likely see a brief surge in traffic from everyone checking out the new design.
 
godhandiscen said:
I checked Kotaku after this thread. Yes, it's bad, but why the heck do I end up in io9 if I keep clicking Next Post? Is that intentional? Also, the back button doesn't work, wut?

How is the Gawker audience responding?

edit:
http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/kotaku.com

It seems they are doing just fine. Even the whole hacked DB worked in their favor as evidenced by the spike in traffic during that time.

regarding their traffic, they're getting a lot of eyeballs/page views because there's so much discussion about their new design. if i were a betting man i'd wager they'll see a drop off, i'm pretty patient when it comes to shit like that but i gave up in a hurry.
 
Mr_Zombie said:
It's can load a lot slower than a simple HTML and can very easily break the site and stop working. Like I've said, the sidebar didn't load for me at all - there was just loading symbol; another Gaffer here posted a screenshot with an opposite situation - sidebar was visible, but there was no main article.

I have nothing against using javascript to add some spice to your site or to make it more user-friendly. But if you can't even show a single article without it (even though the site is run in a condition where it should work properly), then you know that something sucks.

For the people who are having problems with loading website redesigns such as the one discussed, what you can do is to empty your cache, then relaunch your browser for the changes to take place. Those glitches are unfortunate but they are not always in the hands of the website developers. If all else fails then continue with the bashing.

With that said, I have no comment on the new design.
 
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