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[AltogetherAndrews]

I've been reading some rather disturbing posts as of late, posts that suggest that 720p games do not scale to 1080i for those of us without 720p sets. I don't intend on shelling out for a new TV in addition to paying for a PS3 this year, and my TV does not scale things well, so this talk is obviously more than a little bit troubling. Does anyone here know what's up with this?

 

[bud]

why don't you just go here?

 

[DaCocoBrova]

why don't you just go here?

Because there's nothing there that gives a definitive answer maybe? *shrug*

I have a hard time believing this is the case. That would be so incredibly boneheaded on Sony's part. It would damn sure make me wait until picking up a PS3, which I was already planning on doing.

 

[quaere]

jstevenson posted in the official thread and made it pretty clear there's nothing Insomniac can do about this. It's on Sony. We don't know anything else at this point.

 

[Fatghost]

Yeah we need clarification pretty quick.

 

[pCeSlAyEr]

it sounds to me like it has issues.. why else would content look so horrid at 480p/i also RR7 at 720p..

and WTF I have a 1080i tv... if 90% of the games are going to be 720p they had better fix this quickly...

 

[DaCocoBrova]

jstevenson posted in the official thread and made it pretty clear there's nothing Insomniac can do about this. It's on Sony. We don't know anything else at this point.

Which suggest (to me) that it's hardware related. JS said that we could figure it out if we put some logical thought behind it.

 

[Ceb]

Maybe Threespeech can get someone to clear up this mess?

 

[Klocker]

some discussion on it here

http://www.beyond3d.com/forum/showthread.php?t=35722

 

[Luckyman]

http://ps3.ign.com/articles/745/745259p2.html

Does the PS3 upscale or output all PS3 games to one resolution the user sets in the dashboard? This is a very important question for me also. My TV only displays 480i/480p/1080i. If 720p native games are going to be scaled down to 480p, that would royally suck.

IGN: You're in luck, compadre. The PS3 will display a game at whatever resolution you specify. Good thing, too, since we know it's a question many IGN readers shared.

?

 

[Stench]

http://ps3.ign.com/articles/745/745259p2.html



?

What the f*ck is this shit.

I'm not opening mine until I get a definitive answer on this.

 

[Dahbomb]

Oh man, tomorrow is going to be EPIC... :lol

All the PS3 owners with 1080i only TVs might be in for some heavy onwnage

 

[dynamitejim]

Wow, this is really bad. This means devs have to program for 480/720/1080p all separately. Any game that isn't 1080p native (which will probably be 95% of them) won't be able to display 1080i. This also means users with lower res TVs hoping for some extra AA from downsampling (1080p->720p->480P) are out of luck. This is going to be a huge mess.

 

[quaere]

IGN is wrong, period. I have a retail unit and a retail game and a custom error message by Insomniac comes up on my screen saying 1080i won't work (exact text of which can be found in the Official Launch thread)

 

[Pope Benedict XVI]

I think in the launch thread some people were suggesting this only applies when HDMI is being used, and not when component is used. That doesn't fully make sense to me though because if it has an analogue scaler then why doesn't it upscale ps2 games?

 

[Zaptruder]

Quick GAF, bitch and moan to all the reaches of the internet until this shit gets sorted.

Lack of scaler chip = BUHBUBHBUH.

Maybe they can get it in time for Euro launch. :/

 

[quaere]

I think in the launch thread some people were suggesting this only applies when HDMI is being used, and not when component is used. That doesn't fully make sense to me though because if it has an analogue scaler then why doesn't it upscale ps2 games?

It was speculated HDMI is the reason for the problem, but it effects HDMI and component. I tested it this morning.

 

[Oni Jazar]

I would also like to know what the hell is going on.

And fix the DVD upscalling too... lazy bums.

 

[datamage]

Whoa, hang on a second.

Are you telling me my Sony XBR960 which I bought a year ago, will not display the PS3 properly? This would be F***ing ridiculous. I have my 360 set to 720p, and the tv scales to 1080i, so why would this not work the same?


...

 

[Stench]

IGN is wrong, period. I have a retail unit and a retail game and a custom error message by Insomniac comes up on my screen saying 1080i won't work (exact text of which can be found in the Official Launch thread)

...

*sigh*

I was really excited for this launch, but as of right now, with the ridiculous shortages, the slightly gimped online features, weak launch lineup, and HUGE technical issues like this, I've pretty much lost all faith in Sony at this current moment in time. I almost feel like punting mine off on eBay... you know, give it to someone who actually wants it.

Come back to us when you get your shit together, Sony.

 

[Vrolokus]

What?

Am I hearing this right?: The PS3 outputs video at 480i, 480p, 720p, and 1080p - not 1080i? And it won't upscale, so if I have a TV that displays 480i, 480p and 1080i, it runs in 480p?

This can't possibly be right. Are we sure it's not just unique to Resistance? How the **** could Sony allow a problem like this when the vast majority (all?) HD CRTs don't display 720p?

 

[plagiarize]

Whoa, hang on a second.

Are you telling me my Sony XBR960 which I bought a year ago, will not display the PS3 properly? This would be F***ing ridiculous. I have my 360 set to 720p, and the tv scales to 1080i, so why would this not work the same?


...

it will work the same. but not all 1080i tv sets can do that. you don't need to worry as a result.

 

[Luckyman]

Whoa, hang on a second.

Are you telling me my Sony XBR960 which I bought a year ago, will not display the PS3 properly? This would be F***ing ridiculous. I have my 360 set to 720p, and the tv scales to 1080i, so why would this not work the same?


...

Should work the same.

How did IGN test this, but seems kinda weird..

 

[Lord Error]

also RR7 at 720p...

Wait a sec, who said RR7 looks bad in 720p? I read the exact opposite.

Most 1080i native TVs accept 720p signal and scale it, some older ones don't though.

 

[Stench]

Most 1080i native TVs accept 720p signal and scale it, some older ones don't though.

Yeah, mine doesn't.

I always had the impression that most CRTs weren't able to perform this, anyway.

 

[datamage]

Most 1080i native TVs accept 720p signal and scale it, some older ones don't though.

This is what would make sense. Since my 360 is feeding a 720p signal to my tv, and the tv itself scales it. I don't see why it would be any different with the ps3, the ps3 thinks it's sending a 720p signal, and my tv would take care of the rest.

 

[gollumsluvslave]

Lack of scaler chip = BUHBUBHBUH.

According to ERP on Beyond3D

There is an internal scaler chip, just

Not one you're allowed to use.

This could be a seriously large botch-up by Sony - I mean after all the touting of 1080p!

What percentage of HDTV's in the US don't support 720p and only do 1080i?

 

[plagiarize]

This is what would make sense. Since my 360 is feeding a 720p signal to my tv, and the tv itself scales it. I don't see why it would be any different with the ps3, the ps3 thinks it's sending a 720p signal, and my tv would take care of the rest.

one question, why aren't you feeding your 1080i set a 1080i signal from the 360?

 

[dynamitejim]

Whoa, hang on a second.

Are you telling me my Sony XBR960 which I bought a year ago, will not display the PS3 properly? This would be F***ing ridiculous. I have my 360 set to 720p, and the tv scales to 1080i, so why would this not work the same?


...

The problem is that there are a number of older HD CRT sets that don't accept a 720p signal period, forcing those owners to play their games in 480p. If your TV is 1080i and can upscale 720p, then just set your PS3 to 720p and your TV will take care of the upscaling.

 

[Geoff9920]

According to ERP on Beyond3D
What percentage of HDTV's in the US don't support 720p and only do 1080i?

It's mostly just older CRT's.

 

[datamage]

one question, why aren't you feeding your 1080i set a 1080i signal from the 360?

It's my understanding that all games are rendered @ 720p anyway, so if I tell the xbox to send a 1080i signal, the the 360 is doing the scaling instead of my tv. I prefer my tv to do the scaling. That, and I could have sworn I've noticed a performance loss on a few games @ 1080i (well NFS: MW mainly..)

If anyone knows otherwise, please PM me or something, I don't want to derail this thread.

 

[mrklaw]

isn't this what the xbox did?

You set the resolutions your TV can handle, and each game picked the highest one that it supported

 

[Stench]

How "old" are we talking here, though?

I mean, my CRT really isn't that old, and when I was doing research, it didn't seem like a whole lot of models out there were able to perform this.

F*ck, this is such garbage...

 

[Luckyman]

isn't this what the xbox did?

You set the resolutions your TV can handle, and each game picked the highest one that it supported

Yeah, but why does it fall back to 480p.

 

[Smokey]

one question, why aren't you feeding your 1080i set a 1080i signal from the 360?

Was going to ask the same thing. I have a Sony XS CRT and I have my 360 set at 1080i. Is there a reason you have yours at 720p?

 

[Lord Error]

I always had the impression that most CRTs weren't able to perform this, anyway.

Mostly the older ones had that problem. My 30HS420 direct view CRT TV for example does an excellent job of displaying the 720p signal. In fact, 720p outputted from my computer looks even better on that TV than 1080i signal.

Panasonic's direct view CRT TVs were never able to accept 720p either, be it old models or new. That's why I never took them into consideration when buying a TV.

 

[Beatbox]

I have a 3.5 year old Toshiba 57H83 RPHDTV - obviously 1080i native. I just switched my cable box to 720p from 1080i and it works fine - however the TV defaulted the resolution down to 540p and I simply had to switch the TV back to 1080i to get it to scale that way.

 

[quaere]

What?

Am I hearing this right?: The PS3 outputs video at 480i, 480p, 720p, and 1080p - not 1080i? And it won't upscale, so if I have a TV that displays 480i, 480p and 1080i, it runs in 480p?

This can't possibly be right. Are we sure it's not just unique to Resistance? How the **** could Sony allow a problem like this when the vast majority (all?) HD CRTs don't display 720p?

The PS3 outputs 1080i - for example Ridge Racer 7, a 1080p game, runs fine in 1080i. It just doesn't upscale 720p games like Resistance to 1080i, so you either have to have your TV do it or play in 480p.

 

[MobiusPigeon]

this reminds me of the xbox version of soul calibur 2 not being able to display properly. maybe its an nvidia thing?

 

[Manp]

so if a game doesn't support a certain resolution it can't be upscaled/downscaled to it?

in other worlds a game needs to support resolutions natively? to output in 1080i/p it must render to a 1920x1080 framebuffer and so on?

 

[Luckyman]

so if a game doesn't support a resolution it can't be upscaled/downscaled?

Dead Rising SD ****up not possible on PS3. :lol

 

[VanMardigan]

This is unbelievable. And just my luck, I just happen to have one of those tv's affected. No Ps3 for me now.

 

[Manp]

Dead Rising SD ****up not possible on PS3. :lol

wait, what?

edit: .... what?

 

[quaere]

so if a game doesn't support a certain resolution it can't be upscaled/downscaled to it?

in other worlds a game needs to support resolutions natively? to output in 1080i/p it must render to a 1920x1080 framebuffer and so on?

The PS3 has downscaling technology - for example 1080p videos from the Playstation Store play fine at 720p/480i/p

 

[urk]

The PS3 outputs 1080i - for example Ridge Racer 7, a 1080p game, runs fine in 1080i. It just doesn't upscale 720p games like Resistance to 1080i, so you either have to have your TV do it or play in 480p.

Which in turn means some older sets that can't do 720p, but can do 1080i, will have to play such titles in 480p, right?

In your case, you just have to make the manual switch, which is a mild annoyance at best.

 

[3rdman]

The PS3 outputs 1080i - for example Ridge Racer 7, a 1080p game, runs fine in 1080i. It just doesn't upscale 720p games like Resistance to 1080i, so you either have to have your TV do it or play in 480p.

OMG, what a flustercuck! I asked this very question MONTHS ago and was assured by others that it would work the same as the 360...My HD is 480/1080i ONLY what the hell are they thinking???

This has to be a mistake...Is this IGN just looking for hits? In any case, I'm glad I decided to wait a couple of years before taking the plunge...Firmware updates FTW (hopefully).

 

[Manp]

The PS3 has downscaling technology - for example 1080p videos from the Playstation Store play fine at 720p/480i/p

i'm talking about games, not videos

 

[Beatbox]

this reminds me of the xbox version of soul calibur 2 not being able to display properly. maybe its an nvidia thing?

I thought the SC2 issue was only that it was 4:3 and you couldn't stretch it.

 

[Diablohead]

It's my understanding that all games are rendered @ 720p anyway, so if I tell the xbox to send a 1080i signal, the the 360 is doing the scaling instead of my tv. I prefer my tv to do the scaling. That, and I could have sworn I've noticed a performance loss on a few games @ 1080i (well NFS: MW mainly..)

If anyone knows otherwise, please PM me or something, I don't want to derail this thread.

Some games, via checking the back of the box, will do true 1080i, doa4 for an example (only one I own that does so cant check other games)

The 360 will upscale if the game is 720 yes, but some will look a ton better in native.

 

[Luckyman]

wait, what?

edit: .... what?

If every game has to natively render at 480i/p.