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[Flayer]

Killzone 4 is a fantastic launch title. It's exactly the kind of thing you want from a launch title - showing off the snazzy new tech and having really fun multiplayer. There's some issues with the pacing of the single player campaign but overall it's a fun experience.

Killzone gets a ton of unwarranted hate I've noticed. I suppose it comes with the territory of a being a flagship Sony franchise.

 

[samwizered]

I've played only two Killzone titles, Killzone 2 and Killzone: Shadow Fall.

I have no idea how Killzone 2 got so much praise. The story and characters were unlikeable, the gameplay was pretty mediocre, and the toughest enemy in the game for me was the controls. The horrible unresponsive controls are what made me never revisit this game. Yeah, Guerilla, we get it, weapons are heavy. Overall, the game was just okay, in my opinion. Classic? Game of the year? HELL no.

Shadow Fall, however, is so much better in every aspect. I bought it with my PS4 on launch day thinking that I might regret it, but I've actually very much enjoyed it. It's not a classic by any means, but it's pretty solid for a launch title.

 

[Papercuts]

All I know is that Rico is legitimately one of the worst videogame characters that has existed. I say that firmly with no hyperbole.

I did not like KZ2 and passed on 3 when I saw a lot of people thinking it was worse. SF still looked interesting to me and I'll give it a shot when I get a PS4, but for now I don't hold the name Guerrilla Games in any high regard.

 

[metalslimer]

KZ2 was a great game overall. I only messed around with KZ3, but it seems sad how Sony mishandled the franchise after 2. I am glad though they are moving on although I wish it had a seemingly better send off. I'll still play it when I get my PS4

 

[8byte]

ITT: People use hyperbole one way or the other, and use buzz words like "innovate", "mediocre" and "generic" because they cannot find appropriate ways to articulate themselves.

 

[pixelbox]

As for neogaf not liking easy games, i say that's bs. Members couldn't even get past chap 8 let alone find their way through a level. Shit people hated jak 2.

 

[maneil99]

If killzone should die what about fable, hell infamous doesn't sell great, good thing resistance is dead too, and ratchet should die since it hasn't been good since 2009? There's room for middle of the road games, as we can see in this thread, alot of people hate killzone, and a lot of people love it. Killzone 2 and 3 sold well enough to make a profit probably. If they didn't they would die, like warhawk and socom. I believe killzone 3 is listed at 2.5 million and KZ2 and 3 million not to mention the trilogy. I'm 99% sure you are using ******** for your OP aswell.

Shadowfall most likely sold in the range of 50,000 at launch and will likely go up from there at hit 2 million in its lifetime.
http://www.********.com/game/1893/resistance-fall-of-man/Global/

Also I'm fairly sure MP stats are bugged, someone mentioned it in the OT

 

[GodofWine]

I love KZ for the gameplay. It isn't spastic like Cod and not even as fast as BF (though I do like BF4 when it works). So I hope they make another, but I have no clue why you do not like the MP it is simple and fun and no grinding to unlock weapons is a welcome change.

People dont like MP for the same reason as SP, its not easy, it doesnt play rock music when you kill 3 guys in a row, you do kinda have to burst fire and your reticule doest mysteriously follow targets that walk through it.

In terms of sheer TDM chaos, COD is king, but for tactical objective play KZSF shines. Warzone is so good and I wish people would just play it for a week and get hooked.

Its sad that a lot of people will just give up on a game they are not immediatley good at (no one quits COD cause its hard to suck at it, my wife who plays no games actually got a few kills the one time I made her play it for laughs), i think thats what KZ does to people (I guarantee the wife would kill no one, ever, in KZ.)

 

[shem935]

So, judging by this thread, I guess I'm a complete freak for actually liking the SP.

*internet knuckle bump*

 

[BadAss2961]

Given that 99% of all games these days are pretty damn "easy", I highly doubt that. Only really difficult game in recent memory for me personally is Dark/Demon Souls. But that's a completely different kettle of fish, and as is par for the course with RPG's, more about grinding, kitting yourself out etc till you can handle the rougher stuff.


Also, I get where you're coming from about frustrating design, but I honestly do feel that's because gamers these days have become accustomed to hand holding. Constant checkpoints, walk you to the task markers, guides, red dot maps and radars and all the rest. You don't get lost or stuck nearly as often as you used to in shooters of old.

Having said that, I do think the Free fall segment in Shadow Fall was pretty poorly designed, but only pre-patch. I only played it post patch where they fixed it and it was actually great fun.

Only other area I struggled in was this segment where I simply did not hear (to be fair it wasn't very clear) the squad trooper asking me to get on a turret. I blame the loud gunfire and my surround sound speakers, but do agree GG should have made that instruction clearer.

Other than those two points however, I really don't think the game is unfairly frustrating. Just requires a bit of thought and consideration.

Chapter 7 was the last level I played, I thought the freefall part was really cool. Played the chapter twice and only died there once each time, the second death only because the safety mat didn't register for some reason. I see that chapter 8 begins with another one though.

Shadow Fall's been pretty easy to me. You just have to think a little bit and take things slowly. There's an adjustment period where you realize it's not a shooting gallery FPS (I like those shooters too, but SF isn't one of them.) I think a lot of people never made the adjustment.

 

[shem935]

As for neogaf not liking easy games, i say that's bs. Members couldn't even get past chap 8 let alone find their way through a level. Shit people hated jak 2.

The checkpoints in jak 2 were kinda shit if my memory serves correctly.

 

[Zen]

There was really only one section that was too hard with bad checkpointing in Jak II, a lot of people just like to pretend that the game was harder than it was simply because of the Haven city police being very sensitive.

Yeah, declining sales.

Being anywere from the top selling PS4 launch title, to in the top 3-5 spot (second only to CoD/Battlefield)? Sales are really healthy for the franchise. Sorry.

 

[Cow Goes Moo]

ITT: People use hyperbole one way or the other, and use buzz words like "innovate", "mediocre" and "generic" because they cannot find appropriate ways to articulate themselves.

I like you, not because of Killzone, but because I feel this is very unfortunate trend (generalization) among threads.

 

[shem935]

There was really only one section that was too hard with bad checkpointing in Jak II, a lot of people just like to pretend that the game was harder than it was simply because of the Haven city police being very sensitive.



Being anywere from the top selling PS4 launch title, to in the top 3-5 spot (second only to CoD/Battlefield)? Sales are really healthy for the franchise. Sorry.

Oh I'm not trying to say the game was hard. I dunno been a long time. Really liked Jak II though don't get me wrong.

 

[nib95]

Chapter 7 was the last level I played, I thought the freefall part was really cool. Played the chapter twice and only died there once each time, the second death only because the safety mat didn't register for some reason. I see that chapter 8 begins with another one though.

Shadow Fall's been pretty easy to me. You just have to think a little bit and take things slowly. There's an adjustment period where you realize it's not a shooting gallery FPS (I like those shooters too, but SF isn't one of them.) I think a lot of people never made the adjustment.

Absolutely! The beautiful thing about the PS4 Live streaming is that we have have been able to watch some of these reviewers play through the game, and what you said is absolutely the case. Some people just play it like any other shooter, when it simply is not one.

Take Angry Joe, he literally played the game like it was COD or BF. barely any tactical consideration at all, or much use of the tools at his disposal. How about using the OWL more? The shield, the attack mode, the EMP burst (which by the way can also take out ATAT Attack Walkers), the cover system, adrenaline mode, secondary fire, the heat signature view and all the rest. It's only when you truly utilise all these different tools that the game takes on a different, and far more rewarding meaning. There is more tactical freedom in Shadow fall than in most shooters I've played in a LONG time.

But having watched so many people play the game now via stream, most people absolutely do NOT play the game this way. And it's a damn shame. Maybe GG really should have had an entire level just dedicated to tutorials...

 

[Lord Error]

I really enjoyed KZ2 and Shadowfall, so screw you OP. KZ3 was trash, but they've redeemed themselves now.

 

[FireSol]

It's hard. Bare that in mind. Harder perhaps than nearly all other console shooters I've played in recent years (at least on first play through, second play through much less so). Most shooters hand hold you to such a degree that is non existent in Shadow Fall. The latter has no proper tutorial, no proper explanation of the OWL and it's tactical abilities (beyond throwing you in the thick of it), no auto aim, a very limited objective marker solution, vague task outlines and so on. It is extremely hardcore centric.

this!! i can predict that one of the next cod sp compaings evolve to something like House of the Dead, because there is no point t ocontrol your char, it impossible to lost there, you always run forward. also soty, its much better than most ppl think, you need just listen what is going on around you like what Helgast civilians think about this situation, soldiers communications, new pappers, audiologs, etc.

 

[fuzzyreactor]

I really enjoyed KZ2 and Shadowfall, so screw you OP. KZ3 was trash, but they've redeemed themselves now.

Hopefully GG don't take all this criticism to heart and pull another KZ3 on us.

 

[NullPointer]

Absolutely! The beautiful thing about the PS4 Live streaming is that we have have been able to watch some of these reviewers play through the game, and what you said is absolutely the case. Some people just play it like any other shooter, when it simply is not one.

Take Angry Joe, he literally played the game like it was COD or BF. barely any tactical consideration at all, or much use of the tools at his disposal. How about using the OWL more? The shield, the attack mode, the EMP burst (which by the way can also take out ATAT Attack Walkers), the cover system, adrenaline mode, secondary fire, the heat signature view and all the rest. It's only when you truly utilise all these different tools that the game takes on a different, and far more rewarding meaning.

But having watched so many people play the game now via stream, most people absolutely do NOT play the game this way. And it's a damn shame. Maybe GG really should have had an entire level just dedicated to tutorials...

So true.

ShadowFall may be a lot of things but its NOT a focus-test driven game. Its hard edges are there to see and cut yourself on.

Hell just the tactical use of adrenaline alone changes things dramatically and I'd bet thats the least used tactical option that players use (except accidentally). But 20 seconds of ADS slow-mo for those particularly hairy situations? Its a night and day difference to first playthroughs.

 

[nib95]

So true.

ShadowFall may be a lot of things but its NOT a focus-test driven game. Its hard edges are there to see and cut yourself on.

Hell just the tactical use of adrenaline alone changes things dramatically and I'd bet thats the least used tactical option that players use (except accidentally). But 20 seconds of ADS slow-mo for those particularly hairy situations? Its a night and day difference to first playthroughs.

I used adrenaline quite a bit on my first play through for kicks (shotgun hilarity). But on my second run on Hard, I'm using the Heat Vision view a lot more, coupled with Attack drone to keep them occupied, or shield, coupled with Heat Vision to just pick their heads off when they pop out of cover. Pretty effective.

Hell I've done so many funny and weird things. Using my OWL shield in weird and wonderful locations etc. One section late game (on Hard) I climbed up some random beam I wasn't supposed to go up. Planted myself up there with my OWL shield out, and covering my entire field of view, and had a quick exit on to a platform below for when the shield gave out. It was hilarious because up there in my personally made birds nest, I felt invincible as they came through the door and I shotgunned an entire spawns worth without them standing a chance lol.

Another funny moment was when I OWL EMP'd an ATAT Walker, mowed him down in one sitting using the chain gun, blew up one of those canisters that cause that blue super jump stream, used it to jump completely over this building and the map, straight on to one of those devices where I immediately popped up my OWL shield, and then put in the cylinder to then blow it up along with the Scanner Sentry, all in one go. Felt like a boss.

 

[BadAss2961]

Absolutely! The beautiful thing about the PS4 Live streaming is that we have have been able to watch some of these reviewers play through the game, and what you said is absolutely the case. Some people just play it like any other shooter, when it simply is not one.

Take Angry Joe, he literally played the game like it was COD or BF. barely any tactical consideration at all, or much use of the tools at his disposal. How about using the OWL more? The shield, the attack mode, the EMP burst (which by the way can also take out ATAT Attack Walkers), the cover system, adrenaline mode, secondary fire, the heat signature view and all the rest. It's only when you truly utilise all these different tools that the game takes on a different, and far more rewarding meaning.

But having watched so many people play the game now via stream, most people absolutely do NOT play the game this way. And it's a damn shame. Maybe GG really should have had an entire level just dedicated to tutorials...

Yup. Also, there's rarely an enemy that pops up that I didn't spot beforehand. The game tells you early on to scan often, but doesn't hold your hand by constantly repeating it or making you have to do it.

I scan and use the owl in just about every encounter. I've taken my time so much that only recently I realized what you can do with adrenaline... Scan room, use adrenaline, enter room, aim and efficiently take out everyone before they even know what hit them.

 

[IVIEDICATED]

I think the Killzone games are pretty good and they're just different enough to sell.

 

[Nyx]

Shadow Fall has one of the best singleplayer campaigns in years, as a shooter that is.

No more corridor -> enemies spawning -> checkpoint/cutscene -> corridor -> repeat bullshit like in every CoD or BF game but bigger maps, tracking, awesome gunplay, amazing graphics and sound...

The only thing I don't like as much is the story.

 

[Zen]

Absolutely! The beautiful thing about the PS4 Live streaming is that we have have been able to watch some of these reviewers play through the game, and what you said is absolutely the case. Some people just play it like any other shooter, when it simply is not one.

Take Angry Joe, he literally played the game like it was COD or BF. barely any tactical consideration at all, or much use of the tools at his disposal. How about using the OWL more? The shield, the attack mode, the EMP burst (which by the way can also take out ATAT Attack Walkers), the cover system, adrenaline mode, secondary fire, the heat signature view and all the rest. It's only when you truly utilise all these different tools that the game takes on a different, and far more rewarding meaning. There is more tactical freedom in Shadow fall than in most shooters I've played in a LONG time.

But having watched so many people play the game now via stream, most people absolutely do NOT play the game this way. And it's a damn shame. Maybe GG really should have had an entire level just dedicated to tutorials...

They absolutely should have. The game is terrible at organically directing the player and shaping their expectations over what type of game it is. Combine that with the first level being completely open, and people get a huge culture shock that they are more often than not unable or unwilling to overcome.

 

[PsihoPerihelion]

Say what you want about the franchise, but don't even dare to talk crap about Killzone 2. That game was great as hell.

 

[PBY]

They absolutely should have. The game is terrible at organically directing the player and shaping their expectations over what type of game it is. Combine that with the first level being completely open, and people get a huge culture shock that they are more often than not unable or unwilling to overcome.

I hate this type of critique- don't blame the player for bad design.

 

[DigitalDevilSummoner]

killzone 2 & 3 (minus the length) were awesome.

for me the best console FPS games I've ever played

Shadow Fall has one of the best singleplayer campaigns in years, as a shooter that is.

Good to hear.

 

[Bluth54]

I played a decent amount of the single player of the first Killzone but I found it so average and uninteresting I couldn't be bothered to finish.

I tried the demo of Killzone 2, hated the controls and found the demo section pretty boring. Haven't touched the Killzone franchise since and never plan to again.

 

[RedRedSuit]

The OP is way too aggro. KZ has survived, apparently, because it has been selling reasonably well. Otherwise it would be gone like Wipeout and any number of things.

Anyway, Killzone 2 was an excellent war campaign. One of the most intense I've ever played. Some of the best combination of linearity and vertical level design I've seen... in an FPS... at least by that point in time, in single-player. It definitely occupied a nice middle ground between the openness of Halo and the shooting gallery of CoD. Not without its problems but just a really good intense campaign.

It also had everything arrayed against it -- the CG render controversy, the grim look, the me-too accusations, PS3 being at a low point... critics and people were ready to fucking rip it apart. Yet it delivered 90+ scores and good sales.

I also enjoyed its multiplayer, though I'm not expert in that area. I liked it though.

After that one moment of brilliance, I have to admit I am not sure if GG have what it takes to take KZ somewhere meaningful. KZ3 was fun enough and looked great but just seemed phoned in and uninspired. Shadow Fall sounds painful.

So I'm not sure what is going to happen from this point on. I assume it will have sold well due to the launch drought, a-la Resistance, but that's not good enough to necessarily keep pumping them out. They had a chance to really do something different and good with SF and apparently have not succeeded in "good," even if it is different.

 

[MilkBeard]

OP, this is your second topic in very recent memory where you shit on a game. Have you played the game in question, this time, or are you just making assumptions?

I have played Killzone Shadowfall. It is not anything groundbreaking, but it is a decent game to play. A game doesn't have to be phenomenal to exist. Sony funds Geurilla because enough people keep buying their games. I guess they are doing something right.

Why don't you post about something you like next time?

 

[msdstc]

The single player was definitely a step back from 3 which was a step back from 2, but it had solid moments. Either way I think the franchise would be better off as a mid level shooter, not sold as the AAA title it's touted as, because it's just not that.... that being said the online is a ton of fun.

 

[Showaddy]

The single player was definitely a step back from 3 which was a step back from 2, but it had solid moments. Either way I think the franchise would be better off as a mid level shooter, not sold as the AAA title it's touted as, because it's just not that.... that being said the online is a ton of fun.

K3 was downright unbearable at times, even if the gameplay was tighter due to it being completely linear. Those characters...constant on rails sections...Press Square to fucking blow up Helghan...

Makes Shadow Fall look like fucking Half-Life by comparison.

 

[NullPointer]

K3 was downright unbearable at times, even if the gameplay was tighter due to it being completely linear. Those characters...constant on rails sections...Press Square to fucking blow up Helghan...

Makes Shadow Fall look like fucking Half-Life by comparison.

Agreed 100%

KZ3 started off promising but went downhill fast, and on rails no less. The stealth there was barely an afterthought too.

An funny enough I got half life vibes a few times playing through the ShadowFall campaign.

 

[msdstc]

Agreed 100%

KZ3 started off promising but went downhill fast, and on rails no less. The stealth there was barely an afterthought too.

An funny enough I got half life vibes a few times playing through the ShadowFall campaign.

I got those vibes too, but like the scifi channel straight to DVD version... so tacky. They had such nice looking environments, but barely used them. 3 was better just by virtue of leaving out those god awful floating in space levels and the freefalling garbage.

 

[Sean]

Just turn GG into an engine/tech studio for other Sony first parties.

Let's be honest, graphics are the only reason people ever bother with the Killzone franchise. All of KZ1's hype revolved around "omg NURBS", all of KZ2's hype was on seeing if it could match the fake CG trailer, and the reason people are buying KZSF is cause it's a pretty launch game.

They've had ten years to make the Killzone franchise meaningful and relevant and they're just not up to the task.

 

[boredandlazy]

I'd just like to add, the soundtrack (especially during the Helghast sections) is absolutely amazing.

 

[Danj]

I got the PS4 Shadow Fall bundle, I've played a bit of it so far. I like the outdoor environments but after that bit it switched to corridors on a spaceship and I was like meh.

 

[RedRedSuit]

I have no idea how Killzone 2 got so much praise. The story and characters were unlikeable

The story was fine. Good intro. Reasonably well exposed plot that made sense. A surprisingly good ending cutscene (I know that's a controversial one, but IMO). Some of the thickest and most immersive atmosphere of any campaign like this.

That said, yes, the characters were obnoxious. Really, though, they were no obnoxious than, say, those in Gears -- people can easily overlook those for some reason. Really the only killer was Rico. I can understand (though I don't agree personally) he can kill this game for someone.

That said... it's just the story. It is not very important, as long as it's competent, which it was.

the gameplay was pretty mediocre

The gameplay was great. Very tactical and challenging. Nice vertical levels instead of just corridors or big arenas. Weapons were very satisfying.

and the toughest enemy in the game for me was the controls. The horrible unresponsive controls are what made me never revisit this game.

While I personally never understood this -- I fucking loved the feel of this game -- this complaint is so widespread there must be something to it. Well, they patched in "fixed" controls later. So there's that.

Yeah, Guerilla, we get it, weapons are heavy. Overall, the game was just okay, in my opinion. Classic? Game of the year? HELL no.

Very few people, even fans of the game like I, would claim it was GotY. That was the year Mass Effect 2 and Uncharted 2 came out. So no, not GotY... but it was definitely an excellent campaign.

 

[RedRedSuit]

Let's be honest, graphics are the only reason people ever bother with the Killzone franchise.

Incorrect: Killzone 2 was an excellent game.

Overall, you may have a point.

 

[Zen]

I actually love the world, setting, and technology design of the franchise. Also the gameplay is above average aside from Killzone 1.

I hate this type of critique- don't blame the player for bad design.

I will absolutely blame players when it is due. They are after all people, capable of missing the most obvious directions or being stubborn and narrow minded. There is bad design in ShadowFall, but when some people go through the game barely using any owl powers ever, even after dying multiple times, and then complain that the game is too hard, the fault doesn't rest with the designers, certainly not completely.

Some people are just idiots.

 

[SmoothRunningGun]

You not liking it doesn't mean that everyone else feels the same op.

 

[xJavonta]

Killzone 1 sucked, but so did all PS2 FPSes (except TimeSplitters)

Killzone 2 was fucking fantastic.

Killzone 3 was mediocre

Killzone Mercenary is fan fucking-tastic. One of my top Vita games so far.

I haven't played Killzone Shadow Fall yet (too cheap to spend $60 on it lol)

But all these games were/are technical marvels and push the hardware pretty well.

 

[chadskin]

Take Angry Joe, he literally played the game like it was COD or BF. barely any tactical consideration at all, or much use of the tools at his disposal. How about using the OWL more? The shield, the attack mode, the EMP burst (which by the way can also take out ATAT Attack Walkers), the cover system, adrenaline mode, secondary fire, the heat signature view and all the rest. It's only when you truly utilise all these different tools that the game takes on a different, and far more rewarding meaning. There is more tactical freedom in Shadow fall than in most shooters I've played in a LONG time.

This! KZSF offers so much more gameplay depth than your average CoD, maybe too much for most people?

 

[MilkBeard]

I would say that Shadowfall is a little bit disappointing in the fact that the possibilities that the game brings to the table aren't fully explored-- for example, the owl is such an awesome idea, and makes those particular levels quite fun, but it goes a bit underutilized. The more open levels are great, but they are few and far between.

Even at it's worst, though, it's still a passable game. Shadowfall is a beautiful game that is passable at worst, and shows flashes of design that could be really awesome if it had more time in the oven. Eh, what can I say? It's a decent video game. I don't think it deserves such hate. Definitely works for a launch title, to fill the gap until the bigger titles come along.

 

[Breakfast at Noon]

played them all and never really liked any, there the definition of meh.

they still need there halo. shadow, just about competes with halo 4, and that is no feat.

 

[NullPointer]

Let's be honest, graphics are the only reason people ever bother with the Killzone franchise.

Nope.

 

[kitch9]

sales are sales.. as long as they recoup and then some.

Opinions are like arseholes, everyone has one and the guys who is loudest tends to be a bit shitty.

 

[npa189]

2, 3, and Shadow Fall are all solid games, I've played better, and much worse. Guerrilla has rock solid tech, their games always look fantastic.

 

[Big_Al]

Overall I really enjoyed this, moreso than Killzone 2 and 3. I especially liked the premise, two sides who hate each other living very close side by side on the same planet and the problems that come from that. It's much more interesting to me than the incredibly dull stories of Killzone 2 and 3 and the trench warfare of those games.

Unfortunately the story isn't that well told, just like Killzone 2 and 3 and I didn't really care about anyone at all but I do like that it's very much 'man on a mission' and the various environments they occur in. For example I really enjoyed the

Spoiler

Horror inspired level were you are trying to find Massar

Much better than 2 and 3. The game is one of the harder ones I've played in recent years as well. I love how they make you rely on your owl and use your tactical visor. They are core features in the game which you HAVE to use or you'll get punished for it. Along with enemies were certain weapons work better than others I found it very satisfying to play. It also helps that they've finally got it heavy without the lag from Killzone 2 (and even 3 to an extent). For me it feels really good to play, moreso than many other FPS. It reminds me of the very underrated Syndicate in some ways, the weapons are fucking monsters and feel really good to use.

 

[maverick40]

Every killzone game except for shadow fall has reviewed brilliantly and sold great for sony so you are talking out your arse.

The killzone multiplayer is incredible and hasn't been replicated since