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[El Muerto]

I agree. It's all about the ecosystem now. It's a great time for devs because the PS and Xbox use the same architecture, but for us we get the same game with the same quality on both consoles. It's a shame, i really like the Xbox ecosystem, it's much better than Playstation's, but hoping Xbox doesnt crash and burn like other Microsoft projects when they dont make enough revenue.

 

[Robb]

I personally feel like Sony and Nintendo still have a strong ‘identity’. The only issue I have with Ps5 is the lack of exclusives I’m interested in (and that seem to really push the hardware) and the increase in cross-gen titles making it feel like a “Ps4 Pro Pro” instead of its own thing.

MS has really fallen off a cliff though, there’s zero brand value with Xbox for me.

 

[TGO]

I don't see a radical difference between now and when the SNES and Genesis were battling it out.

Really?
Not only did those Consoles have exclusives but even the Multiplatform games were actually completely different and technically unique to that hardware sometimes.
With how close Consoles are getting to each other when it comes to Multiplatform games the only thing left is exclusives which the platform holders doesn't seem to respect that.
This maybe the only time I say Nintendo knows what the fuck it's doing and is probably laughing right now.
Be funny if Nintendo has sidelined Sony & MS for all this time only to be the last one left because the other two knocked themselves out by loosing sight of the ball.

 

[Hugare]

Nintendo excluded? People are emulating Switch games on their phones (and running better than on the Switch, btw) due to the ARM architecture being very common to cellphone chips

Maybe you are excluding it for being weak, and not x86 like the other consoles, but its not unique at all. Or maybe you are excluding it due to its exclusive games.

Dont fret OP, 'cause consoles will soon abandon x86 for ARM. From the leaks the next Xbox will be ARM, and I bet that Sony will do the same, if not with PS6, they will with PS7.

There's no point anymore on making unique architectures. Spending billions in R&D for marginally better performance. See the PS3, how much it cost Sony when in the end it wasnt a world apart compared to the 360.
Not only that, but now Sony is porting games to PC. Keeping it similar in terms of hardware makes thing easier in terms of porting games.

 

[Darkness_Arises]

You dont know the magic of switch games, i see. I have some friends like You at first, until my friend visit me, and they play Nintendo games together.

And soon after that, almost all of them bought Switch.

I actually have a Switch and have bought games like Mario Tennis and Mario Party, which is why I am able to say that to me they are honestly not worth 60USD. Puyo puyo Tetris is the more popular party game in my social circle. It is cheaper and it plays better on the Deck. I do not hate on all Nintendo switch games. Mario odyssey is the only 3d platformer I have ever found engaging enough to play till end credits. BotW is not my kinda game, heavily inspired as it is by Ubi open world and the survival genre. My son enjoyed it and TotK though. XC1,2 and 3 are the only JRPGs that I have bothered with replaying.

 

[JackMcGunns]

Consoles went from unique but VERY far from PC technology wise, to much closer to PC. That’s a good thing because you’re comparing it to the top end. At launch they’re like pretty decent gaming PCs with incredible form factor, power to performance and to the dollar.

 

[HerjansEagleFeeder]

Xbox falls and all of the sudden the whole universe collapses? Nope, we'll be fine without you microsoft. Hope you find lots of purpose in hell.

 

[TheTony316]

As long as consoles are a thing, i'll use them over PC any day.

 

[Business]

I agree OP. Consoles today are like locked, compact PCs, cheaper to buy on the first day but considering how much more expensive the games are, the mostly shared library with PC, and the yearly subscripton to play online, you end up with a much less compelling offer compared to just getting a PC.

It’s in fact the first generation since the NES I don’t own ‘next gen’ hardware, that is PS5 or Xbox.

 

[Hudo]

FTFY, Mark Cerny was not the one calling the shots. Still love him, tho.
For OP, I really don't get all this bitching about special hardware and some shit, it's been over a decade, let it go already.

Ah, thank you. I was under the impression that Cerny was the guy who made that decision. Good to know!

 

[Fredrik]

Consoles just feel like worse, more locked down PCs at this point - at which point why not just... play on PC?

This is what I realized and I literally built a living room PC to replace both Xbox Series X and PS5. Happened this year. And it’s been awesome, everything looks better and run better and I have access to mods. Probably one of my best gaming related decisions yet.

Today the consoles are only used by my kids for Skylanders and some LEGO titles. I also use PS5 as a Bluray player.

Both Microsoft and Sony will have to show something extremely impressive that I can’t get on PC for me to care about their hardware again.

 

[ByWatterson]

What is the scientific saturation point of number of nostalgia porn threads that GAF can sustain?

 

[evanft]

What is "unique" about an Android tablet from 2016?

 

[Feel Like I'm On 42]

I disagree, the move to make games more streaming based, (not just faster loading), is an innovation brought about by consoles.

Remember that lag in PC games not experienced in consoles? That’s because consoles changed how things work that PC will learn from.

You should realize streaming is still inferior to non streaming and suffers from input lag...so that totally negates your point unless it's for the gamer who doesn't care about lag and inferior image quality. Maybe someday it won't be an issue but it is now.

 

[acm2000]

Bespoke = expensive

Nintendo basically used off the shelf Nvidia chips because "cheap"

 

[sigmaZ]

I agree. Consoles are held together by exclusives now and they don't offer much other than being a media PC (Which I think still holds value to some). I regret nearly every PS5 purchase I've made, especially knowing most titles will come to PC anyway.

 

[Three]

At the end of the day all these machines play games that are possible on all of them.

The internet:

Nintendo blocks native PC ports but you can play switch games better than native on a PC/Deck via emulators. "switch is unique, bless nintendo"

Playstation makes PS5 exclusives. "why is this exclusive. we know they're coming. Why are you not doing day 1"

Switch does quirky controller shit. "Wow motion controls are amazing, ring fit is great"

Playstation does quirky shit. "Portal sucks, why did they do PSVR2, and all your controller features are not needed including motion controls"

I really don't get how nintendo gets a pass all the time for the stuff it does.

 

[Loomy]

But that wasn't a reaction by Sony to what Xbox were doing. That was a reaction of Mark Cerny trying to prevent another PS3 situation, so he chose to be conservative with the architecture of PS4.

They chose to be pragmatic. And it was the right call.

 

[Skifi28]

What is the scientific saturation point of number of nostalgia porn threads that GAF can sustain?

Yes.

 

[THE DUCK]

There is still value in the overall package price wise. But more than that, it's the plug and play expeience. Sony tried to add something different that PC with adaptive triggers, both tried to add something with faster loading.
I think the bigger problem was really lack of a huge jump overall from the previous generation in terms of raw power so the wow factor is not there.

Blaming xbox doesn't make sense. Sony had all the options in the world when designing in the PS5 and chose the one that would make it easier to develop for, which actually makes sense.

As far as Nintendo being given a pass, I can't agree with that. It's what, 8 years old at this point and your giving at a pass why, becuase it happens to be a portable that hooks to a TV? It's full plug and play with physical media? So are PS5 and Series X.
The architechture was so-so when it launched, there was almost no invation other than the dual purpose, and was succesful due to some great games and no competition in the mobile space. The only point that is valid is true exclusives.

 

[Hudo]

They chose to be pragmatic. And it was the right call.

Yeah, the pragmatism was that they went conservative and used stock parts of a well-understood architecture. And yes, it was the right call, which is why they and Xbox made it back then.

 

[Cyberpunkd]

The only console that feels like consoles used to (and are supposed to) is the Switch. it's full plug and play, physical media on the Switch tends to mean more than on other systems, it has unique hardware and unique controls, it has first party games that are never going to PC, let alone PlayStation or Xbox, it even has third party exclusives (though fewer than older Nintendo systems may have had, and they do tend to get ported eventually). If the Switch 2 continues the same style and success that the current Switch has, I will probably forego PlayStation entirely starting next gen (haven't owned an Xbox in years so that's no longer a concern) and just go with PC plus Nintendo consoles from now.

It’s important you added “with PC” because game performance on Switch has been abysmal. Ever since getting a Steam Deck I made it a point that unless Nintendo stop releasing outdated hardware that makes games chug into low 20s (just check newest Lego Skywalker Saga) no amount of Nintendo nostalgia will make it an enjoyable experience.

Overall I find your argument flawed. It’s once again “games are coming for PC, I can just play them there”. Yes, but that costs 1500-3000€. Compare that with a price of the console. You make it sound like everyone has unlimited budget.

 

[yamaci17]

such special much unique




yeah devs pls bring the iconic 15-20 fps stuttery experiences back due to "special" hardware being hard to code for unless you go out of your way for coding specially for that hardware.

 

[Mr.Phoenix]

Nostalgia is a deceitful mistress....

 

[Team Andromeda]

I laugh at silly threads like this. Switch is just an Nvidia shield there is nothing unique about its hardware at all, nothing at all
To say consoles and PCs are just the same is for the birds and even in the 360 and PS3 era with different hardware specs many 3rd party games were the same simply down to development costs. Still, that's not exactly a new thing many Atari ST and Amiga ports were basically the same game, same for Xbox and Game Cube ports and to moan about Digital when everyone spends their life online and can't live without their smartphone, is also for the birds.

Download the games and enjoy gaming because it's brilliant at the mo with so many good games

 

[Mr.Phoenix]

such special much unique




yeah devs pls bring the iconic 15-20 fps stuttery experiences back due to "special" hardware being hard to code for unless you go out of your way for coding specially for that hardware.

I laugh at silly threads like this. Switch is just an Nvidia shield there is nothing unique about its hardware at all, nothing at all
To say consoles and PCs are just the same is for the birds and even in the 360 and PS3 era with different hardware specs many 3rd party games were the same simply down to development costs. Still, that's not exactly a new thing many Atari ST and Amiga ports were basically the same game, same for Xbox and Game Cube ports and to moan about Digital when everyone spends their life online and can't live without their smartphone, is also for the birds.

Download the games and enjoy gaming because it's brilliant at the mo with so many good games

Both of these.

Only reason I am not saying any more than I have said... is because "its the OP's opinion".

And I can't give my opinion on OP's opinion without coming off as insulting.

That anyone can with a straight face praise the proprietary architectures (gaslighted as unique) of the PS1/PS2/PS360 generations while somehow glossing over all the issues those came with and the piss poor performance of games during those times while putting down the more standardized easier to develop for architectures of the more recent consoles.... is beyond me.

Apparently, 80-second load times and games generally even struggling to hit 30fps were so cool. Who would have guessed?

I have decided that this is all a by-product of the demise of Xbox. Been seeing a number of these kinda threads pop up of late. Can't be a coincidence.

 

[bitbydeath]

You should realize streaming is still inferior to non streaming and suffers from input lag...so that totally negates your point unless it's for the gamer who doesn't care about lag and inferior image quality. Maybe someday it won't be an issue but it is now.

Local content streaming, not online cloud streaming.

 

[spons]

I don't particularly care about them being 'unique machines', I just want good first-party output and both Xbox and PlayStation are disaster zones in that regard this gen.

 

[Fabieter]

More and more people will drop consoles in the future tho.

 

[Zheph]

The weird nostalgia threads are out in force

 

[winjer]

Not sure I am the only one feeling this way. But while I have always preferred playing on PC, I used to love consoles and respect and appreciate them. They used to have unique bespoke hardware that was different from the rest of the industry and usually marked a generational leap in the technology used for games that bled over into the PC side of things too. The hardware was unique that had games developed exclusively for and around it (optimizing games for a fixed spec meant that developers extracted a lot more performance from the silicon than they could elsewhere where they relied on abstraction layers and other similar overhead). Console controllers were different and controls were different. Their capabilities were different. Their games were distinct and unique to them, and each console felt different from one another, and from PC gaming, and from arcades.

Today that is no longer the case. PlayStation and Xbox are basically the same hardware. They no longer rely on fixed specs and hardware profiles, with mid gen refreshes and budget models like Pro/Series S. 99.99% of the games are shared between the two platforms, as well as with PC gaming. The controls and controllers are identical. Third party exclusives are dead. Even first party games are no longer exclusive, and often come to at least PC (and if Microsoft has something to say about it, on other consoles too). The generational leaps are smaller and smaller every time, and they no longer are cutting edge even at release (especially compared to PC). Consoles don't even get price drops anymore, which was another thing in their favour. When PCs went all digital, physical media was in consoles' favour, but that's no longer the case as they move increasingly digital. Plug and play used to be a big thing on consoles, but now we have to install games and wait on updates on consoles too. Consoles just feel like worse, more locked down PCs at this point - at which point why not just... play on PC?

It's impossible to have hardware as complex as we have today, without abstraction layers. No one is going to code to the metal, for hardware with thousands instructions, registers and micro ops.
And the cost of developing unique hardware, just to be used on one console is not financially viable. Going for off the shelf hardware, with some custom functions is the only way to go.

Besides, modern compilers and APIs are much more advanced and effective than what we had 20 or 30 years ago. So the penalty of abstraction layers is not that huge.

The only console that feels like consoles used to (and are supposed to) is the Switch. it's full plug and play, physical media on the Switch tends to mean more than on other systems, it has unique hardware and unique controls, it has first party games that are never going to PC, let alone PlayStation or Xbox, it even has third party exclusives (though fewer than older Nintendo systems may have had, and they do tend to get ported eventually). If the Switch 2 continues the same style and success that the current Switch has, I will probably forego PlayStation entirely starting next gen (haven't owned an Xbox in years so that's no longer a concern) and just go with PC plus Nintendo consoles from now.

The Switch also uses PC hardware. The GPU is just an Nvidia Maxwell, from a few years ago.
Just like modern Playstation and Xbox, it has internal storage where we can install games and downloadable content.
It uses an ARM CPU. But it's just a bunch Cortex A57 cores. Not some unique bespoke hardware.

 

[Team Andromeda]

Both of these.

Only reason I am not saying any more than I have said... is because "its the OP's opinion".

And I can't give my opinion on OP's opinion without coming off as insulting.

That anyone can with a straight face praise the proprietary architectures (gaslighted as unique) of the PS1/PS2/PS360 generations while somehow glossing over all the issues those came with and the piss poor performance of games during those times while putting down the more standardized easier to develop for architectures of the more recent consoles.... is beyond me.

Apparently, 80-second load time and games generally even struggling to hit 30fps were so cool. Who would have guessed?

I have decided that this is all a by-product of the demise of Xbox. Been saying a number of these kinda threads pop up of late. Can't be a coincidence.

I bet so many of these people who claim to love uniqueness and custom silicon never bought a Saturn that's for sure and were the ones making fun of poor 3rd party ports on Saturn.
People also seem to forget the terrible frame rates in the 360.

Everything seems better looking back and it's hard to think of anything in life that's better in your late 30's to early 40's to that of your young teenage year or early 20's.
Feck me, even going to the pub is hard work in your 40's LOL and I love the Pub

 

[Drew1440]

Consoles were better when they had Risc processors (Mips\PowerPC) and had their own custom designs, which was reflected in their exclusive titles. Multiprocessor designs are where devlopers start to complain, as with the PS2/Saturn/Atari Jaguar were difficult to make the most of. Most of the time thrid party games were ported over and didnt take advantage of the extra processing.
I think the sixth generation was the last when each console had their own unique design, it wasnt just the processors but even their memory design was unique with the PS2/Gamecube using embedded RAM, giving a massive amount of bandwidth for the era. You were able to pull off graphics effects that just weren't possible on the PC or Xbox, even if they were overall more powerfull.

On the PC side you do have unique graphics cards like the HBM Radeon's from AMD and Apple's Mx series, but the software just does not take advantage of them.

 

[MAX PAYMENT]

Consoles just suck now

 

[BlackTron]

I actually have a Switch and have bought games like Mario Tennis and Mario Party, which is why I am able to say that to me they are honestly not worth 60USD. Puyo puyo Tetris is the more popular party game in my social circle. It is cheaper and it plays better on the Deck. I do not hate on all Nintendo switch games. Mario odyssey is the only 3d platformer I have ever found engaging enough to play till end credits. BotW is not my kinda game, heavily inspired as it is by Ubi open world and the survival genre. My son enjoyed it and TotK though. XC1,2 and 3 are the only JRPGs that I have bothered with replaying.

If Mario Tennis and Golf had been as good as prior entries, they would have been worth sixty bucks. As it is, yes Nintendo's first party lineup is full of games of questionable value. I put these games above 1-2 Switch but below Smash and Kart. But I always laugh when people knock Switch as a multiplayer console by bringing up Mario Tennis while ignoring all of the extremely good first party titles which to some, are indispensable. You can run out of money buying outstanding Switch titles before paying any attention to those lame games.

Edit: Super Mario Party was lame, but Superstars was worth the 60

 

[mdkirby]

Dualsense is not the same controller as an Xbox controller at all….. and tbh PlayStation games are very different because of that controller vs the Xbox counterpart.

Def agree with that, I’ve bought games on ps5 that are otherwise “free” on gamespass just to use the dualsense

 

[lughnasadh123]

Really?
Not only did those Consoles have exclusives but even the Multiplatform games were actually completely different and technically unique to that hardware sometimes.
With how close Consoles are getting to each other when it comes to Multiplatform games the only thing left is exclusives which the platform holders doesn't seem to respect that.
This maybe the only time I say Nintendo knows what the fuck it's doing and is probably laughing right now.
Be funny if Nintendo has sidelined Sony & MS for all this time only to be the last one left because the other two knocked themselves out by loosing sight of the ball.

Radically different? Yeah, really. Similar controllers used in a similar home experience running similar cartridge. I just don't understand lamenting the days of arguing which system had better chiptune music and sprites over which system today has better ray-tracing and FPS.

Each company has to play to it's strength and change accordingly. Nintendo wasn't going to win the power war so it smartly consolidated it's home and portable console business together. MS is moving in the direction of software to stay alive after hardware losses. Playstation is opening up to PC along with offering other hardware like VR and it's streaming device. All unique strategies specific for that platform holder. That's not even including expanding further into media outside of gaming.

 

[bobone]

The answer is yes.
You cant even argue otherwise.
Consoles used to have massive numbers of exclusives, and so did PC.
They looked, and felt significantly different. Today it's a given that a major game will be on multiple platforms. Most likely all of them.
This is probably because they need to sell and insane amount of copies to be profitable.
But it certainly makes things less interesting.

 

[thuGG_pl]

I agree, I don't feel the need of owning a PS5, because many games are being ported to PC. There are maybe 2-3 exclusives right now that I would want to play, but it's way to little to justify buying PS5. And there is a chance that some of them will be ported to PC anyway (GoW, Stellar Blade).

 

[DaGwaphics]

The Dreamcast was basically a PC

Yeah, we all remember all those PC units built with a SuperH CPU.

OG Xbox was the first PC in console clothing I'd say. With the GC being a bit of a Mac in console clothing, from a hardware perspective.

 

[Duchess]

In an interview with VGC, [Atsushi Inaba, head of Platinum Games] was quick to qualify that he isn’t trying to rain on anyone’s parade. “I don’t want to sound like, ‘hey, I know everything about the new consoles and they’re boring’. But with the information that I have now, I haven’t seen any extremely big surprises,” he said. “When you’re simply seeing graphical improvements or just ‘faster, bigger’… Obviously it’s nice, but it doesn’t have that same inventive quality that really surprised me with past consoles.”

Platinum Games boss isn’t that impressed with the next generation of hardware

Ok, so what do you think, you’re Elvis or something?

www.videogamer.com

 

[Labadal]

It's a double edged sword. More standardized arcitecture means easier porting, but it becomes more of the same.

Exclusives give incentive to own a certain console, but not as many people will play the game.

I have my PC, so my PS5 doesn't feel like a must have, but it is nice to have when I just want to sit on the couch and boot up a game.

The Switch is still different enough with a decent amount of exclusives, and portability.

With that said, I might get new consoles in the future, but I won't be in a hurry to do so, and I am not willing to spend more that $400.

 

[Buggy Loop]

If Valve hurry up and make a Deck 2 it would make the Series X and PS5 completely redundant until the end of their cycles.

Valve is in its own realm where time doesn’t matter.

When they drop something it’s unexpected. But don’t expect them to do it..

 

[Mobilemofo]

I'll buy consoles for as long a I can. I just don't want to get back into pc gaming at all. It has no appeal to me whatsoever.

 

[Flyingpanther]

I also have the feeling . And now also with the mid gen refresh of the consoles, the lesser exclusive (and the ridiculous prices of those exclusive games, 80 euro in the Netherlands). I bought a gaming pc with the 4090, 5 month ago and haven't touch my ps5 at all since then.

 

[ShadyAcshuns]

The weird nostalgia threads are out in force

They're a refreshing breath of air compared to all the armchair Sony business analysis threads.

 

[ReBurn]

Really?
Not only did those Consoles have exclusives but even the Multiplatform games were actually completely different and technically unique to that hardware sometimes.
With how close Consoles are getting to each other when it comes to Multiplatform games the only thing left is exclusives which the platform holders doesn't seem to respect that.
This maybe the only time I say Nintendo knows what the fuck it's doing and is probably laughing right now.
Be funny if Nintendo has sidelined Sony & MS for all this time only to be the last one left because the other two knocked themselves out by loosing sight of the ball.

Hardware differences played a role in why multiplat games were different between consoles, but that wasn't the only reason. A lot of the time completely different studios handled ports for the different systems and they made different design choices about how to implement.

 

[bender]

Sometimes I feel like I don't have a console
Sometimes I feel like my only friend
Is the hardware I live in, the city of Zeldas
Lonely as I am, together we cry
I game on her streets 'cause she's my companion
I walk through her eShop 'cause she knows who I am
She sees my good deeds and she kisses me windy
Well, I never worry, now that is a lie

 

[FalsettoVibe]

Based on several recent threads....I think some ppl are feeling some type of way about something.

Cant quite put my finger on it.....

100% this...lol

 

[Skifi28]

Sometimes I feel like I don't have a console
Sometimes I feel like my only friend
Is the hardware I live in, the city of Zeldas
Lonely as I am, together we cry
I game on her streets 'cause she's my companion
I walk through her eShop 'cause she knows who I am
She sees my good deeds and she kisses me windy
Well, I never worry, now that is a lie

This sounds waaay too human.