Their biggest show in years and Xbox's biggest franchise ever, and they use an alpha build from January? I'm calling bullshit on that. If true someone needs to be fired (like Phil)
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In defense of Halo Infinite's visuals
- Thread starter Dacon
- Start date
Their biggest show in years and Xbox's biggest franchise ever, and they use an alpha build from January? I'm calling bullshit on that. If true someone needs to be fired (like Phil)
Riven326
Banned
Jesus. That's the end of the thread.Counter-point:
This was Xbox's most important showcase they've ever had. It was hyped to hell, even to the point of arrogance where Spencer said the PS5's showcase made him even more confident in what they had.
There's plenty of reason to worry about that.
Explosive Zombie
Banned
I've seen people defend this on the idea that it's 60 frames and 4K except I've seen it advertised as being up to 4K which is one way of saying it has a dynamic resolution. I suppose it could also mean it has a performance mode or it could mean that they're including how it performs on other consoles but right now I'm not giving them the benefit of the doubt and I don't think that was a very good excuse anyways. and the fact that it was running on a PC is absurd I run games at 60 frames that are open world and look a million times better than that all the time on my PC.
diffusionx
Gold Member
Right and they put out these screenshots because they couldn't get a few caps of this amazing build right?
HellforLeather
Member
Yeah game looks middling even for a current gen offering, let alone a next gen game.
01011001
Banned
Counter-point:
1080p30 Linear vs 4K60 Open
here's the thing, and it seems people don't get this:
If you'd want to play any 1080p30 game that pushes the PS4 to it's limits like TLOU2 at 4K60, you would need 4x the GPU power alone to go to 4K, and you would need 2x the GPU power to go to 60fps.
this mean, simply running a cutting edge PS4 1080p30 game at 4K60 you would need a system that is 8x as powerful, that is a 14,72TF GCN GPU. And this is without a single improvement to the make-up of the graphics (assets, effects, draw distance etc.)
as an example, this is an open game that often pushes the base PS4 to its limits at 1080p30fps, it has a lot of dips that are GPU related.
in order to get this exact game, same as it looks right here, no additional improvments whatsoever, running at 4K60, you would need said 14,72TF GCN GPU
in this game, shadow cascades change resolution literally 2m ahead of you, it has really harsh shimmering due to a low quality AA solution... and it would still need most likely the full power of the PS5 or even the Series X to push it to 4K60
Bragr
Banned
Lighting is more important than textures or polygons, it looks a lot better in the "sun".
Gamernyc78
Banned
Spiderman 1 looks great, Horizon, Ghost of T give any linear game a run for it's money. Not to mention Spiderman 2 will be 4k 60fps and looks better.
Sorry thy had to do better especially when u hear shit about some massive budget, where? Almost everyone on every forum is knocking it for a reason. If you talk tht talk you better walk it.
Caffeine
Member
isnt pushing some kind of envelope usually what halo does? I've been pretty much always surprised by the visuals with each release for their respective time periods outside of odst which was a standalone prequel expansion.
this aint it chief this doesnt look well for a couple month old build of a game that has to go gold in 2.5 months, and is supposed to be some kind of service platform for Halo over the next decade.
this aint it chief this doesnt look well for a couple month old build of a game that has to go gold in 2.5 months, and is supposed to be some kind of service platform for Halo over the next decade.
Eliciel
Member
Then why even make Halo Open World and risking to make these sacrifices if most fans I am hearing are asking out loud: "Why does everything have to be open world these days. I wanted Halo, in regular shape, no experiments, no subscription model, no open world no busllshit, just Halo."1080p30 Linear vs 4K60 Open
here's the thing, and it seems people don't get this:
If you'd want to play any 1080p30 game that pushes the PS4 to it's limits like TLOU2 at 4K60, you would need 4x the GPU power alone to go to 4K, and you would need 2x the GPU power to go to 60fps.
this mean, simply running a cutting edge PS4 1080p30 game at 4K60 you would need a system that is 8x as powerful, that is a 14,72TF GCN GPU. And this is without a single improvement to the make-up of the graphics (assets, effects, draw distance etc.)
as an example, this is an open game that often pushes the base PS4 to its limits at 1080p30fps, it has a lot of dips that are GPU related.
in order to get this exact game, same as it looks right here, no additional improvments whatsoever, running at 4K60, you would need said 14,72TF GCN GPU
in this game, shadow cascades change resolution literally 2m ahead of you, it has really harsh shimmering due to a low quality AA solution... and it would still need most likely the full power of the PS5 or even the Series X to push it to 4K60
Why would you risk that on a system seller? Why not making it Semi-Open-Linear-World-ish, to keep the quality crisp? It's a shooter god damn it, we need effects, particles, textures - it needs to look involving and engaging..., no?
People wanted the ultimate graphic quality from the Masterchief and the main system seller. Now, they received basically a very strange looking game, but hey, it is 60fps/4k/OPEN WORLD. This blows my mind to be honest.
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01011001
Banned
Halo's original vision was to be open world (or at least way bigger in scope for the individual levels), but Bungie had 1 year to finish the game in order to be ready for the Xbox launch, so they made a linear shooter with a lot of reused assets and backtracking.
also, this seem to be big open Hubs like the bigger levels in Crysis (which is not much different when it comes to GPU or CPU strain tho)
also, people love open Halo levels, this is the ultimate version of that...
what a lot of Halo fans (like me) really DIDN'T want to see is Sprint and Clamber... because we care about gameplay not just graphics... and it sadly has both Sprint and Clamber, so fuck THAT aspect of the game.
as for the graphics, people are fucking stupid it they think a cross gen title that runs at 4K60 would be able to look way better than this.
just look at cross gen titles we had this gen, with Assassin's Creed 4 basically looking like a direct 1080p 360 with some added extras like moving bushes n shit. and that was only a jump from 720p30 to 1080p30
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the_master
Member
Well they have not confirmed that it is the whole ring, and it does not because it has the radius of planet earth. So if it was, it'd be thousands of times the rdr2 size
If they did such a thing, they'd have said so in the trailer and it would had been the wow momment
Eliciel
Member
Ok, thanks for the explanation on Halo. I just didn't know these things. I only have 1 friend who is a very big Halo fan and he didn't like the "open world" concept..
itsjustJEFF
Member
Not really a HALO fan personally. Played the splitscreen with buddies back in the day and it was fun AF! I took a look at the 4k version on YouTube and it looks a lot better than it did on the stream, which is a very common thing. Is it ground breaking? Is it a tent pole of visual prowess? Nope. Saying it's looks bad is a bit much. Is it less than what we though it would be? Yes.
I think it looks fine, the real issue is all this pent up energy around the next gen consoles. Yall had to see this coming, right? There has been so much talk about Power this, Power that, SSD here, Velocity Engine there, BC Pack, Audio chips, RDNA2, Wait till the July show... there was A LOT this game had to live up to, a lot for this event to live up to. Almost no way for this game, or event, to have met those expectations.
I think it looks fine, the real issue is all this pent up energy around the next gen consoles. Yall had to see this coming, right? There has been so much talk about Power this, Power that, SSD here, Velocity Engine there, BC Pack, Audio chips, RDNA2, Wait till the July show... there was A LOT this game had to live up to, a lot for this event to live up to. Almost no way for this game, or event, to have met those expectations.
DaleinCalgary
Member
I wouldn't be angry at Microsoft, it's just 343 is not any good.
ZehDon
Gold Member
Lol. If this was an Xbox One game, it would be a poor looking Xbox One game where its clear a trade off was made to achieve the open world scale. If it came it with a rock-solid 60FPS on Xbox One at 900p with these visuals, we might concede that the trade off was worth it, and be actually be impressed with what 343i pulled out of the aging base-Xbox One hardware. For these visuals, we'd be expecting a 4k frame target with dynamic resolution on the Xbox One X, with about the same texture and lighting quality, and go on to wonder about how mindblowing a next-gen Halo could look in comparison.
But... as the headliner for a next-gen console? It is indefensible. Halo Infinite looks bad.
But... as the headliner for a next-gen console? It is indefensible. Halo Infinite looks bad.
Riven326
Banned
Yeah... I mean that looks more in line with what I would expect a next gen Halo character to look like. And that's from Halo 5.
DaGwaphics
Member
The cross-gen thing is definitely going to effect level design and number of enemies/npcs etc. That I can live with for a minute.
My bigger issue is with the fact that there are so many Xbone games that look much better than this. I guess it's the scale they were going for, but it just seems that it was too much for the system to handle.
My bigger issue is with the fact that there are so many Xbone games that look much better than this. I guess it's the scale they were going for, but it just seems that it was too much for the system to handle.
REE Machine
Banned
What about the pilot? he had hair, facial animations etc and they were trash. Hell his VA sucked as well
Men_in_Boxes
Snake Oil Salesman
More discussion about Halo Infinites graphics than Halo Infinites stale, repetitive gameplay loop.
Hmmmm...
Hmmmm...
Great Hair
Banned
Explosive Zombie
Banned
Is this literally the first Halo ever where people are coming up with excuses for the visuals. Like as a fan of games like crysis in killzone if a new one came out and looks like this I'd be too embarrassed to try and defend it. When a franchise is known for setting visual benchmarks there's really no excuse for something like this.
Abear21
Banned
Exactly, came in to post that the core gameplay still looks fun to me. You say stale, but I’ve skipped the last few Halo’s so it looks as I remember and a good time—Grenades and melee mixed in with fast paced action and shield recovery management.
If they show an impressive Multiplayer suite and it has a good amount of content for Single Players at launch I could still see this being very well received.
You never get a second chance to make a first impression though!
BattleScar
Member
Really shouldn't need any defense.
The fact that you feel the need to, speaks for itself.
The fact that you feel the need to, speaks for itself.
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Imagine trying this hard to defend Halo
LarknThe4th
Member
Their is no way its gonna change much visually between now and release
If you liked what ya saw then get Gamepass, if ya didn't move on
It's kinda the reality of it
Because of the anger for it in some corners I'm starting to wonder if they will bite the bullet and delay it to put all the shine on that the majority want or will they release it and patch it as they go?
If you liked what ya saw then get Gamepass, if ya didn't move on
It's kinda the reality of it
Because of the anger for it in some corners I'm starting to wonder if they will bite the bullet and delay it to put all the shine on that the majority want or will they release it and patch it as they go?
Dacon
Banned
Infamous Second Son also runs at sub 30fps a lot of the time when all those effects are on screen. Unlocked it keeps like 40fps on a regular ps4. Never played it on a Pro though.
The game is getting a ray tracing patch post launch. We'll see how much that changes. I think, compared to a lot of people on this forum my expectations of next gen were severely tempered by past generations, so I wasn't expecting some insane leap in visuals here. I never bought into the marketing bullshit so I wasn't too surprised by what we saw here.
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01011001
Banned
I hope you're not a hypocrite and if you ever get sued or prosecuted for a crime you stand by that logic.
AeonGaidenRaiden
Member
People need to stop defending this 4k/60fps argument. First of all HALOs art-style and geometry are so basic, it doesnt have huge lived in cities with ton of NPC just randomly walking around, there sure as hell isnt even close the amount of buildings that there are in Witcher 3 for example. The buildings themselves as already mentioned are much simpler I guess to give it that smooth futuristic vibe and thats fine, it was the same since Halo 1. But dont tell me how that shit requires so much power to drive through green fields and a few umpa lumpas along the way when you have Gears of War 5 in 4k/60fps with 20 times more detail on a 4 times less powerful console (X1X) and with a HDD.
If the argument is, well this is cross gen and thast why...sure but then show off the bells and whistles version. Even SONY show gameplay from PS4 PRO, not the base model. Something is very wrong at 343, and with rumors that it might not arrive with multiplayer....imagine Call of Duty but no MP at launch? This game needs another year or two in the cooker, yet they had 5 years to underwhelm people. HALO is Xbox! Thats the big deal, this is the flagship that people think of as a brand so yes, people have the right to bitch because who then cares for a new console if even with all that power jsut to get 60fps, it will look worse than a 5 year old game before it.
If the argument is, well this is cross gen and thast why...sure but then show off the bells and whistles version. Even SONY show gameplay from PS4 PRO, not the base model. Something is very wrong at 343, and with rumors that it might not arrive with multiplayer....imagine Call of Duty but no MP at launch? This game needs another year or two in the cooker, yet they had 5 years to underwhelm people. HALO is Xbox! Thats the big deal, this is the flagship that people think of as a brand so yes, people have the right to bitch because who then cares for a new console if even with all that power jsut to get 60fps, it will look worse than a 5 year old game before it.
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We also saw some pop-in in the GT7 premiere. I wonder if we're mistaken in assuming that it's a thing of the past next-gen.
People are overstating how bad it was, sometimes to the point of hysteria. I think a little pushback against those extreme views is warranted.
Reindeer
Member
Digital Foundry said pop-in can also be caused by GPU or CPU being a bottleneck, so the idea that it's gonna go away with faster SSD seems to be wishful thinking
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30yearsofhurt
Member
It looks like a 360 game.
30yearsofhurt
Member
This reminds me of Wall guy.Right and they put out these screenshots because they couldn't get a few caps of this amazing build right?
RCU005
Member
Microsoft got in this mess by themselves. They were taunting the Xbox Series X as the most powerful console since E3 last year. They even mocked the PS5 with the SSD and variable frequency.
If they knew that Halo Infinite was subpar, at least they should've kept quiet. If there were backlash, then they could've said that it is a game made on Xbox One but will be enhanced for Xbox Series X. That's it, no one would've made anything out of it.
They talked too much, but they couldn't walk the walk.
If they knew that Halo Infinite was subpar, at least they should've kept quiet. If there were backlash, then they could've said that it is a game made on Xbox One but will be enhanced for Xbox Series X. That's it, no one would've made anything out of it.
They talked too much, but they couldn't walk the walk.
kikii
Member
Nickolaidas
Member
If a 1.8 TF machine can do this in 1440p/30 fps ...
I see no reason why a 12TF machine (8 times more powerful) can't do it in 4K/60fps.
The Series X is a monster. It can do it, easily.
The problem with Halo Infinite's visuals is that they lack life, besides the models looking like something out of an X-Box One S. The environment looked static, with only the enemies and four birds moving. Everything else looks like an X360 game. Colorful, but lifeless.
There are three possible explanations I see.
A) 343 is being pressured as fuck to rush this game out of the gate on launch day and will be patched/improved down the road. - DELAY IT
B) 343 lacks talent - BUY TALENT
C) 343 is understaffed - BUY STAFF
The reason this is getting the hate it gets is because of MS (Phil/Greenberg)'s humongous hubris, about the visuals blowing our minds (they didn't), about feeling at ease with what the competition has shown as if you have games ten times prettier to show (you hadn't).
I expected to see weather effects and storms and the wrath of God as Master Chief would pew pew his enemies (with a large badass boss fight in the end), and all I saw was a modded level of Halo 1 MC when he first steps into the ring (see what I did there?). I felt betrayed, and I'm not even an MS fan.
I see no reason why a 12TF machine (8 times more powerful) can't do it in 4K/60fps.
The Series X is a monster. It can do it, easily.
The problem with Halo Infinite's visuals is that they lack life, besides the models looking like something out of an X-Box One S. The environment looked static, with only the enemies and four birds moving. Everything else looks like an X360 game. Colorful, but lifeless.
There are three possible explanations I see.
A) 343 is being pressured as fuck to rush this game out of the gate on launch day and will be patched/improved down the road. - DELAY IT
B) 343 lacks talent - BUY TALENT
C) 343 is understaffed - BUY STAFF
The reason this is getting the hate it gets is because of MS (Phil/Greenberg)'s humongous hubris, about the visuals blowing our minds (they didn't), about feeling at ease with what the competition has shown as if you have games ten times prettier to show (you hadn't).
I expected to see weather effects and storms and the wrath of God as Master Chief would pew pew his enemies (with a large badass boss fight in the end), and all I saw was a modded level of Halo 1 MC when he first steps into the ring (see what I did there?). I felt betrayed, and I'm not even an MS fan.
hangdang69
Member
Massive cope. As someone else said, it's not even really open world. Just faux open world like Metro Exodus or that Uncharted expansion. Where was that sense of scale that supposedly forgives the bad graphics? I sure didn't see it. I'm still gonna buy and probably enjoy the game, but what a dud to start the conference.
I wonder what Hellblade will ACTUALLY look like when we see some in-game footage instead of the prerendered trailer they showed.
I wonder what Hellblade will ACTUALLY look like when we see some in-game footage instead of the prerendered trailer they showed.
anothertech
Member
PS3 games looked better.
Cutty Flam
Banned
I’ll still probably buy it, but the Big Team Battle maps better be on point otherwise I’m 100% buying a PS5 and not looking back
343i have been making fools of themselves ever since Halo 4 days, those boys are a joke. I sort of wonder if they’ll have as catastrophic of a failure with this as the Halo: Master Chief Collection release day? That game was fucked, took like two years of updates to get it decent lmao
This coming from a dude who could tell stories all night about the Halo 2 and Halo 3 days (love those games)
343i is a joke, this is nothing new to me. If the maps are incredible, I’m investing my time into Halo: Infinite. But tbh, I have a bad feeling about all this lol. Hopefully I am wrong
343i have been making fools of themselves ever since Halo 4 days, those boys are a joke. I sort of wonder if they’ll have as catastrophic of a failure with this as the Halo: Master Chief Collection release day? That game was fucked, took like two years of updates to get it decent lmao
This coming from a dude who could tell stories all night about the Halo 2 and Halo 3 days (love those games)
343i is a joke, this is nothing new to me. If the maps are incredible, I’m investing my time into Halo: Infinite. But tbh, I have a bad feeling about all this lol. Hopefully I am wrong
Bragr
Banned
I'm more disappointed in the visuals than you, but that comparison is dumb and disingenuous. There are too many Playstation fanboys going after anything and everything Halo right now.
Azurro
Banned
As far as I know, that 7 month old build info doesn't come from any reputable sources, just some random twitter account. Seriously, this was the most perfect conditions for an event showcase: no live gameplay, no one is on the show floor to play it, just need to capture video footage and edit it if needed in case anything gets screwed up....and they still went ahead and showed that.
That's all they have buddy.
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Amaranty
Member
As I understand the demo was running on PC and Digital Foundry said it best, that we have these amazing looking current gen games like Modern Warfare and Doom and they use game engines that probably scale well into next gen.
Now we take a look at Halo Infinite, which was running probably on 12 TF machine and it doesn't look any better than current gen games. The game was built for Xbox One, maybe down the line we'll see improved visuals besides ray-tracing, which is supposed be patched in.
Now we take a look at Halo Infinite, which was running probably on 12 TF machine and it doesn't look any better than current gen games. The game was built for Xbox One, maybe down the line we'll see improved visuals besides ray-tracing, which is supposed be patched in.
SirTerry-T
Member
I don't think the lighting helped, everything looked very flat, could be a shader/material thing too. These things are often being tweaked by the A.D, character and environment artists right up till the eleventh hour (if they can get away with it), so it's not all doom and gloom.
Those first impressions were not great though, from a visual standpoint. There is not one good reason for why a Halo game being made today should not look as good, or at least on par, with the last two main Halo titles. Open world or not, it's as much an art direction issue as it is a technical one.
Those first impressions were not great though, from a visual standpoint. There is not one good reason for why a Halo game being made today should not look as good, or at least on par, with the last two main Halo titles. Open world or not, it's as much an art direction issue as it is a technical one.
RoadHazard
Gold Member
If a 1.8 TF machine can do this in 1440p/30 fps ...
I see no reason why a 12TF machine (8 times more powerful) can't do it in 4K/60fps.
The Series X is a monster. It can do it, easily.
The problem with Halo Infinite's visuals is that they lack life, besides the models looking like something out of an X-Box One S. The environment looked static, with only the enemies and four birds moving. Everything else looks like an X360 game. Colorful, but lifeless.
There are three possible explanations I see.
A) 343 is being pressured as fuck to rush this game out of the gate on launch day and will be patched/improved down the road. - DELAY IT
B) 343 lacks talent - BUY TALENT
C) 343 is understaffed - BUY STAFF
The reason this is getting the hate it gets is because of MS (Phil/Greenberg)'s humongous hubris, about the visuals blowing our minds (they didn't), about feeling at ease with what the competition has shown as if you have games ten times prettier to show (you hadn't).
I expected to see weather effects and storms and the wrath of God as Master Chief would pew pew his enemies (with a large badass boss fight in the end), and all I saw was a modded level of Halo 1 MC when he first steps into the ring (see what I did there?). I felt betrayed, and I'm not even an MS fan.
Well, GoT on base PS4 (1.8TF) isn't 1440p. The Pro version (4.2TF) is. But yeah, GoT does look faaaaar better than Halo Infinity, not counting resolution and framerate. 12TF should be looking better than this.
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Aion002
Member
Yeah.... But you are comparing a bad screenshot nitpicked by an user to bash a game.... With a fucking promotion screenshot made by Microsoft to hype their game.... If you can't see the difference... Well... Have fun!1080p30 Linear vs 4K60 Open
here's the thing, and it seems people don't get this:
If you'd want to play any 1080p30 game that pushes the PS4 to it's limits like TLOU2 at 4K60, you would need 4x the GPU power alone to go to 4K, and you would need 2x the GPU power to go to 60fps.
this mean, simply running a cutting edge PS4 1080p30 game at 4K60 you would need a system that is 8x as powerful, that is a 14,72TF GCN GPU. And this is without a single improvement to the make-up of the graphics (assets, effects, draw distance etc.)
as an example, this is an open game that often pushes the base PS4 to its limits at 1080p30fps, it has a lot of dips that are GPU related.
in order to get this exact game, same as it looks right here, no additional improvments whatsoever, running at 4K60, you would need said 14,72TF GCN GPU
in this game, shadow cascades change resolution literally 2m ahead of you, it has really harsh shimmering due to a low quality AA solution... and it would still need most likely the full power of the PS5 or even the Series X to push it to 4K60
CAB_Life
Member
I’m not a Halo fan, so I’m unsure if that garishness is a series’ standard. Still, was way too cartoony and colourful for my tastes. Lots of XSX games I’m excited for but this ain’t one of them. Gunplay looked terribly average as well. You know you fucked up when you showcase Destiny 2 later in the presser and it looks better than your “next gen” game.
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