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[FortNinety]

I've enjoyed Macs my whole life, but there are two things which really bug me about them:

OS X - As modern and stable as it is, certain key nuances about the OS really is a slap in the face of the whole philosophy of what the Mac OS is supposed to be. I don't like the terminal, it reeks of the Windows DOS prompts which the Mac was supposed to be moving away from. I really don't the like the whole set up, with administrators and users and stuff like that. It's just an extra layers of hassles set up for people to prevent themselves from shooting their own feet. Though I guess it didn't help that Mac users, who are all using the most simply. easy to use, and elegant interface ever devised, still managed to fuck themselves over my trashing the system folder and the such.

I think this piece does a far better job than I ever could about detailing how much OS X is going further and further away from what it should be...

http://arstechnica.com/reviews/003/panther/macosx-10.3-1.html

But the second thing I hate the most? Without a doubt: it's users. Most Apple users are arrogant pricks that won't listen to reason and constantly contradict themselves.

First off, if you pick up most major PC minded magazines, guess what they're stance is on Macs and OS X? For the most part, they're quite glowing and admire the good things that are in Apple products. What about Mac enthusiast magazines? Constant PC bashing, to the point of childishness. But it really does mirror a good percentile of the mindset of Mac users, with their retarded "no body understands us!" mentality.

It doesn't help that Apple themselves hep to perpetuate the spoiled children image, as it's rather evident with their advertising campaign. Apple caters to trendy, well to do audience, and a good deal of it's users are more than happy to live up to the self fulfilling stereotype.

But what irks me the most is how contradictory diehard Mac users have been. The same folks that were dissing Windows (sorry, "Win-doze" as the truly mindless Mac users like to use, right up there with "Pee-See") for having a command line (they and used to say that to get true functionality from a computer, the masses should not be forced to learn arbitrary commands), now embrace the whole notion since it's now "okay".

I don't get people who use PCs who bash the Mac cuz, really, OS X is pretty much Windows at this point, hence my dissatisfaction.

Also, if you have a Mac and have problems, you're pretty much out of luck. Having one company controlling everything hardware related ensures feet dragging and bullshit tactics when it comes getting any help. And what about the community? Completely useless; most have the attitude that Apple can do no wrong and any problems with the hardware or software is greeted with an "Live with it. But hey, it's still better than a Pee-See!"

But there's many reasons why I prefer Macs. Only 5% of the world uses Macs, and I like it. I like not having to worry about an entire world of hackers and virus trying to fuck my machine up.

 

[shantyman]

I'm lost in LA amongst sea of other koreans. Don't stik out like I use ta in Cincy. *wipes tears*



NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO~ The Namco arcade is gone?!? *wipes more tears*

There is a Namco Wonderpark, but they lifted most of the arcade games out. I can't even remember what is still in there but it is sad.

 

[xsarien]

I've enjoyed Macs my whole life, but there are two things which really bug me about them:

OS X - As modern and stable as it is, certain key nuances about the OS really is a slap in the face of the whole philosophy of what the Mac OS is supposed to be. I don't like the terminal, it reeks of the Windows DOS prompts which the Mac was supposed to be moving away from.

Actually, it reeks of the prompts that pre-date DOS.

But as far as my experience with Macs go, you're certainly not required to use the CLI unless you're either doing something very, very geeky, or just feel like doing things the "hard" way. I think it's great that it's there to use. Whenever I'm at a Mac and just want to remotely check my mail, I can just SSH myself in and use good ol' Pine.

 

[Ecrofirt]

There's idiots on both sides of hte fence.

johnny boy is probably the biggest PC idiot I've seen.

 

[Cioran]

I use a 3-button mouse on a Mac and it works perfectly fine. GASP!

 

[ElyrionX]

I've worked with Macs before and I would rather kill myself than work with another one anywhere in the near future......

 

[Lyte Edge]

I'm actually beginning to see a much greater number of Apple users around my university; lots of Powerbooks everywhere now. The iPod's popularity is also starting to turn people on to Apple products as well.

I used only Apple machines since 1986 until this year, when I got my first PC (an Alienware Area 51m laptop), mainly because I felt like getting into the gaming side of PCs...if it wasn't for that, I would have gone Apple again. (Although there are small things about Windows that are more covenient...being able to watch AVIs and WMVs without downloading all these Mac conversion programs, emulators, etc...but this stuff really doesn't matter, it's just nice to have. I've also found that synching my Palm devices up with my PC works faster than it did with a Mac, and there's more PC support for Palm devices)

Windows XP is definitely an improvement over the previous versions, but the Mac OSX just kicks its ass. I don't understand why people would be AGAINST an OS that runs better/is more stable and is easier to use. The only thing about Apple products I don't like are the prices. I'm sorry, but those computers need to be priced lower if Apple hopes to really start competing against PCs. There's obviously a large difference between a $500 eMachines desktop and a $1000 Apple iMac G4 desktop, but your average consumer is going to want to save $500....Apple needs to do something about this.

When I was using a Mac as my primary computer, I never had problems when I installed programs. (I still can't get my wireless card working....it's gotten to the point that I finally ordered another brand after reading about all the problems the one I purchased has...this wouldn't happen on a Mac) The only thing that really needs to be changed is the mouse...the whole "one button is enough" really is stupid, but Mac bashers also seem to act as if you can't just buy another mouse and solve the problem.

 

[demon]

The libraries and computer labs on my campus pretty much have an equal number of PCs and Macs, and they're fairly evenly used.

I myself have just never liked Macs. I'm aware of their benefits, but I never found the interface to be as intuitive and practical as later versions of Windows. It seems whenever I use a Mac, something weird happens and there's no practical way to fix/get around it, and it pisses me off, and I get up to look for an available PC.

But that's just my opinion. There are probably Mac users who feel the same way about Windows. As wrong as they are.

 

[bionic77]

I am just too used to using PCs to swich now, but I love the laptops that Apple makes. I wish some PC manufactuers would copy the things that Apples does that work.

 

[jonhuz]

I've worked with Macs before and I would rather kill myself than work with another one anywhere in the near future......

You could be my bastard child, wanna apply? Free mac hating a plenty!

 

[Drinky Crow]

I don't understand why people would be AGAINST an OS that runs better/is more stable and is easier to use.

Because that's purely a subjective observation and in no way rooted in technical fact?

OSX isn't exactly a bastion of stability. As DCharlie so aptly observed, Mac users are much more forgiving when in familiar territory, and have learned to work around the eccentricities and stability issues of their favorite OS, much as PC users have with MS OSes.

 

[demon]

Because that's purely a subjective opinion and in no way rooted in technical fact?

Totally. I've probably dealt with at least as many problems on various Macs I've run into as I have with my own XP machine. And like I said, XP is much more easy to navigate for me as well.

 

[Phoenix]

Mac is a closed source platform. Nuff said.

FALSE!

OSX is so chock full of open source software its unreal. The entire darwin kernel is open sourced as well.

 

[Lyte Edge]

Totally. I've probably dealt with at least as many problems on various Macs I've run into as I have with my own XP machine. And like I said, XP is much more easy to navigate for me as well.

Such as? I'm really curious about this.

Also how is XP any easier to navigate?

 

[Drinky Crow]

I spent three hours Thursday night trying to get my brother's OSX.3 iBook to recognize an external DVD burner without crashing his desktop. I go to the Memorex site only to discover that it's a driver issue with a torturous workaround -- hey, it's just like owning a PC!

I find XP vastly easier to navigate because I'm familiar with Windows OSes. I find OSX an unnavigable mess with too few shortcuts for my tastes. I suspect you feel exactly the opposite.

Ease of use is more often determined by experience than good GUI design.

 

[Phoenix]

When the entire operating system is designed to work just fine with one button, then yes, it's fine. But there are plenty of Mac users who use 3rd party, two-button (and - you may want to sit down for this - three button) nice.

Hell I've got a 5 button tilt wheel Microsoft mouse hooked up to mine at the moment.

 

[Drinky Crow]

Why you wouldn't replace the stock Mac mouse is beyond me -- the pucks were terrible, and the new clear candy bar atrocities are purely for looks alone.

 

[EviLore]

There's obviously a large difference between a $500 eMachines desktop and a $1000 Apple iMac G4 desktop, but your average consumer is going to want to save $500....Apple needs to do something about this.

$999 eMac
1.25GHz PowerPC G4
256MB DDR333 SDRAM
80GB Ultra ATA drive
SuperDrive


$599.99 emachines
Athlon XP 3200+ (512KB L2 cache & 400MHz FSB)
512 MB DDR 333
160 GB HDD (7200 RPM)
8x DVD +/- RW Drive
8-in-1 Digital Media Manager
nVIDIA® GeForce4™ MX graphics

 

[xsarien]

Why you wouldn't replace the stock Mac mouse is beyond me -- the pucks were terrible, and the new clear candy bar atrocities are purely for looks alone.

At my old job, the guy who ran it - best boss in the world - tried to foist an extra puck on me when we got a whole bunch of gumdrop iMacs. It took a whole lot of convincing that as the in-house graphic guy, that little monster would cripple me. Literally.

I got to keep my "normal" Mac laser mouse, one button and all. Besides, the pucks didn't match my G4 Cube. (Man, did that thing get a bad rap. I loved it.)

 

[xsarien]

$599.99 emachines
Athlon XP 3200+ (512KB L2 cache & 400MHz FSB)
512 MB DDR 333
160 GB HDD (7200 RPM)
8x DVD +/- RW Drive
8-in-1 Digital Media Manager
nVIDIA® GeForce4™ MX graphics

Fair, but you also have to factor in that it's, well, an eMachines.

 

[Phoenix]

Windows XP is definitely an improvement over the previous versions, but the Mac OSX just kicks its ass. I don't understand why people would be AGAINST an OS that runs better/is more stable and is easier to use.

Depends on what you're doing. Some things are much easier on XP and some things are much easier on OSX. Just depends on what you're trying to do.

The only thing about Apple products I don't like are the prices. I'm sorry, but those computers need to be priced lower if Apple hopes to really start competing against PCs. There's obviously a large difference between a $500 eMachines desktop and a $1000 Apple iMac G4 desktop, but your average consumer is going to want to save $500....Apple needs to do something about this.

But they aren't. Apple bills itself as the 'luxury' brand and as such they charge a surcharge for that luxury. Same thing if you look at Lexus and Hyundai. Both products can do the same thing - but the Lexus level of luxury and service dwarfs by an order of magnitude what you'll get from your Hyundai or their dealerships.

When I was using a Mac as my primary computer, I never had problems when I installed programs. (I still can't get my wireless card working....it's gotten to the point that I finally ordered another brand after reading about all the problems the one I purchased has...this wouldn't happen on a Mac) The only thing that really needs to be changed is the mouse...the whole "one button is enough" really is stupid, but Mac bashers also seem to act as if you can't just buy another mouse and solve the problem.

If I had to pick exactly one feature about OSX which I love that Windows doesn't have, it would be the application bundles. Not having to fart around with the registry, no add/remove programs, no little stupid ass installshield temporary files all over my hard drive. I select the Word application - I drop it in the trash. If I want to move it to another machine, I select the word application - I drag it to my machine. And it works. If I want to do a quick backup of my machine I can drag my applications folder and my user directory to my iPod and reformat. After the reformat I can drag those directories back and it will work - without question, without reinstalling, without the .dll hell of the Win32 architecture.

 

[Shogmaster]

I got to keep my "normal" Mac laser mouse, one button and all. Besides, the pucks didn't match my G4 Cube. (Man, did that thing get a bad rap. I loved it.)

Wow, Logitech made laser mice for Apple before the MX1000?

 

[xsarien]

Wow, Logitech made laser mice for Apple before the MX1000?

Huh? It was a standard-issue, non-puck translucent Apple mouse, complete with one button.

 

[Shogmaster]

Huh? It was a standard-issue, non-puck translucent Apple mouse, complete with one button.

Sorry, I guess I was too subtle.

At least now people can say they have a "laser mouse" and have some chance that they'd be right.

 

[Cerebral Palsy]

I like my Powerbook. I like my PC. I want a G5. Most of you people are idiots. Bye.

 

[FortNinety]

At my old job, the guy who ran it - best boss in the world - tried to foist an extra puck on me when we got a whole bunch of gumdrop iMacs. It took a whole lot of convincing that as the in-house graphic guy, that little monster would cripple me. Literally.

I got to keep my "normal" Mac laser mouse, one button and all. Besides, the pucks didn't match my G4 Cube. (Man, did that thing get a bad rap. I loved it.)

You have a Cube? Wow.

As much bitching and hate that thing got, it's still awesome in my book (despite some rather crippling flaws).

 

[Shogmaster]

I like my Powerbook. I like my PC. I want a G5. Most of you people are idiots. Bye.

Says the man going by Cerebral Palsy.

 

[xsarien]

You have a Cube? Wow.

It was an office computer, it wasn't mine.

 

[Pochacco]

Can't we just agree that all Computers suck?

 

[FortNinety]

I am just too used to using PCs to swich now, but I love the laptops that Apple makes. I wish some PC manufactuers would copy the things that Apples does that work.

Since I don't use PC laptops, I wouldn't know what they are. Mind listing a few?

 

[Gek54]

I hate seeing this add at the top of GAF and all I can think is butt plug.

 

[Drinky Crow]

God, the MX1000 is awesome.

 

[Lyte Edge]

We used to have a G4 Cube at my house. Only computer we've ever owned that died. My dad was disappointed, but didn't seem to mind going out and getting a new G5 Tower to replace it.

Can't we just agree that all Computers suck?

TYPEWRITERS FOR LIFE YO

 

[Stuggernaut]

I used G5's in school, brand new ones as of last spring 2gb ram etc etc

Anyway, aside from the "cool" factor of playing around with OSX I had a few complaints.

- One button mouse (easily fixed when I brought in a 2 button one)
- Photoshop....it ran slower than I thought it would, and really seemed to chug when loading large high res images. (which is all we ever did)
- CD Burning...it would never let me rewrite a CD, it would make me format it every time.
- Buggy USB Flash drive interface (a lot of corrupt files)

That's it...

Overall they were fun to use and mostly crash/bug free but I was kind of let down because I was expecting a "graphics powerhouse".

Still...was fun to use something different and I'm sure the majority of my issues were software and not just a "mac" thing in general.

 

[thom]

I hate Macs. Sure they do some things better then a PC, but I can't help feeling like I'm using a fisher price computer when I'm on one. Everything seems dumbed down....but in a bad way.

Some say the same thing about the Gamecube.

 

[miyuru]

I don't use macs very often, only at school in one computer lab when I'm checking my email. I'm just not a fan of Apple's flashy design for their hardware. I'm sure it up's the price considerably, and their keyboard/mouse just don't feel as functional as the normal stuff I have at home for my PCs. Everything seems more tedious, like the mouse feels really sluggish or too fast, it's just not "right". Of course more time with a Mac and I'd be really used to it, but I just don't like them...nothing against them, well nothing valid I suppose (all my reasons are subjective), I just prefer PC's a million times more. And yeah, why would I need anything easier to use than my PC, when I work just fine in Windows?

Is it really easier to use? Seems like a matter of perception to me.

 

[nitewulf]

i find XP to be very stable and easy to navigate. i've had my current laptop more around one and a hal years now, running almost 24 hours every day, and it rarely crashed. of course my familiarity w/ MS OSs is the main reason why i find XO more navigable.
and i HATE the one button mouse for macs, a one button mouse, who came up with that??

 

[Baconäger]

How can you hate that?

 

[miyuru]

Looks like a beluga.

 

[way more]

Macs drive me crazy. They're completely useless to me.

That hurts. This entire thread hurts, on my birthday too.

 

[Fresh Prince]

The only problem I have with Apple are it's store staff (just the way they seem to treat customers) and the zealot 'Apple=Godly' fans (which I encountered only once). Their products are fine to me if albeit overpriced (if you're not a student ).

 

[somnific]

a one button mouse, who came up with that??

that would have been Dr. Doug Englebart, the guy who invented the mouse. of course, he also went on to later design a three button mouse as well.

having used macs (and pc's) for a long time, i think it's pretty much mandatory now a days to ditch the single button mouse - there isn't one mac user i know in person (and i know many) that still uses a single button mouse. apple needs to get on the ball and design a two button mouse already. the one button mice look wonderful and all, but i'll take the functionality of a $20 kensington optical mouse over the appledesign mouse anyday. and let's not even get into the abortion that is the puck mouse.

macs are great. pc's are great. choose whatever the fuck you want to use and get on with your day.

 

[Manabanana]

I'd like to see a Windows machine run Photoshop CS, Painter 9, Dreamweaver MX (all with projects open), an FTP app, a chat client, bit torrent, soulseek(both with downloads), an internet browser(10-ish tabs), and iTunes and still move as fast as my G5 does. In fact, I'd like to see one do that and not crash. I used Windows until a couple months ago, and it just cannot hold a candle to kind of performance I get out of my G5. And I only have 256 megs of RAM. Shit.

Oh, and I have a 5 button mouse :O. I bought a new mouse with my Windows machine and my G5. One button isn't enough, two buttons isn't enough, so shut up.

 

[StrikerObi]

The only reason I use a one button interface with my Apple is because it's a Powerbook. I also only use the trackpad. If I ever get a mouse it will probably be a two button mouse, unless I end up going for the Apple Bluetooth mouse.

The appeal of the new iMac G5, to me at least, is the abality to run the entire fucking thing with ONE cable going into it, for power. With a bluetooth module you can get a wireless keyboard and mouse, and you're set. Plus it can be mounted on a wall.

Honestly though, the "Lamp" G4 model is better due to the abality to rotate the screen around 180 degrees. That feature is severly lacking on the G5 model.

 

[Phoenix]

Yeah, I miss the lamp myself. I thought it was a far superior design to this new one.

 

[somnific]

Oh, and I have a 5 button mouse :O. I bought a new mouse with my Windows machine and my G5. One button isn't enough, two buttons isn't enough, so shut up.

what kind of mouse?

and what are the specs of your g5? you using a dual? if so, i am jealous!

Yeah, I miss the lamp myself. I thought it was a far superior design to this new one.

yeah, i agree. this new design looks great, but the lamp was mind blowing when i first saw it.

 

[Scrow]

:lol

 

[Mejilan]

I hate the one button mouse...is that irrational?

No. That is NOT irrational.

 

[EviLore]

I'd like to see a Windows machine run Photoshop CS, Painter 9, Dreamweaver MX (all with projects open), an FTP app, a chat client, bit torrent, soulseek(both with downloads), an internet browser(10-ish tabs), and iTunes and still move as fast as my G5 does. In fact, I'd like to see one do that and not crash. I used Windows until a couple months ago, and it just cannot hold a candle to kind of performance I get out of my G5. And I only have 256 megs of RAM

From a google search, OSX looks to take up 100mb-125mb ram by itself, and the first three apps you listed are going to consume a lot of ram regardless of the platform, especially with projects open. Add in another half dozen programs and I'm going to have to say that you're long out of physical memory.

 

[Phoenix]

Because that's purely a subjective observation and in no way rooted in technical fact?

OSX isn't exactly a bastion of stability. As DCharlie so aptly observed, Mac users are much more forgiving when in familiar territory, and have learned to work around the eccentricities and stability issues of their favorite OS, much as PC users have with MS OSes.

I call BS on that one. OSX has its problems, but they are more with eccentric behavior - not kernel panics (OSX blue screens) or having to reformat the drive and reinstall the OS to keep it 'performing well'.