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Is DOOM the most technically impressive game out today?
- Thread starter MrOogieBoogie
- Start date
You will feel ashamed of your words and deeds.
Tricky I Shadow
Banned
perineumlick
Member
Easily? Wow, I'm surprised that people are that high on Doom's graphics. Several times during UC4 I was floored by the graphics; Doom never gave me that feeling. It looks fine, and runs well, but it's nothing crazy looking to me. To each his own.
Lys Skygge
Member
Based on the demo, I thought it was incredibly boring. I don't understand the praise at all.
Transistor
Banned
It's the perfect blend of old school FPS with new generation graphics. It's the best FPS I've played in a long time
jim2point0
Banned
Me neither. Doom has mostly tight indoor environments. Games like Uncharted 4 have a ton of outdoor environments with a lot of different things to render that Doom doesn't have to worry about. Both are extremely technically impressive in their own way and I really don't see how you can put one over the other.
And Watch Dogs does all of that better than GTA5, and it even does large buildings with visible interiors from the outside....despite the quality of the game. Except for the AI simulation ofcourse.
Yet the gameplay would have been vastly inferior due to 30fps being massively inadequate for a fast paced action first person shooter. Therefore, 60fps was always going to be the target and they did so, whilst maintaining a very high level of visual fidelity - how can that not be considered a technical achievement?
Yea, DOOM is really great, but it falls way short in the texture resolution department and most of the lighting is static.
Witcher 3 is the most technical power-pusher these days. It's got a lot more individual textures on a per-frame basis and dynamic environment lighting (even those the local light sources are all flat).
DOOM is arguably doing a lot of neat things though (i.e. SSR, Directional Occlusion, etc..). It's texture resolution holds it back from being the #1 top dog.
Witcher 3 is the most technical power-pusher these days. It's got a lot more individual textures on a per-frame basis and dynamic environment lighting (even those the local light sources are all flat).
DOOM is arguably doing a lot of neat things though (i.e. SSR, Directional Occlusion, etc..). It's texture resolution holds it back from being the #1 top dog.
LiveFromKyoto
Member
I don't think it's fair to say no unless you're willing to put out there what you think is better.
Stop with the hyperbole please...
JasoNsider
Member
As far as technical stuff, I'd say Uncharted 4 and GTAV are the champs here. Doom's tech is great, though.
GTAV remastered in particular I am still just in awe at how much is going on and how many systems are being juggled in that game. Coupled with attention to detail in rendering tech and art and it's simply amazing. Hell I didn't even really enjoy the story mode that much but it's hard to deny how impressive it is from a technical standpoint.
GTAV remastered in particular I am still just in awe at how much is going on and how many systems are being juggled in that game. Coupled with attention to detail in rendering tech and art and it's simply amazing. Hell I didn't even really enjoy the story mode that much but it's hard to deny how impressive it is from a technical standpoint.
JasoNsider
Member
I agree about the live action, but it did occasionally trick me into thinking I was watching a pre-rendered cutscene. I think that's only happened to me one time prior to this, and that was when PS3 and 360 launched and HD visuals made a huge jump. Uncharted 4 definitely had some wizardry.
It means that each and every level is tailored to "look" a certain way. Those same lighting/shading techniques aren't portable (i.e. you can't just plop in a character that has skin shaded for one shot and expect it to look the same for another shot with different lighting -- although it should if it didn't have baked light maps).
DOOM probably has more portability in that aspect.
Well, they are doing (like every gaming company) some good tricks. Problem is, we'll never push the tech envelope doing tricks. We need stuff to be more dynamic, procedural and physically plausible so that we can create consistent visuals across any particular art direction. ID seems to be moving in the right direction (as well as CDProject).
blastprocessor
The Amiga Brotherhood
I played the demo on PC and would say no after playing that mars level. Looked barren. The texture streaming is sluggish as well.
Why are people bringing up Uncharted 4? Have you not watched the videos of people playing Doom maxed on PC? It's not even in the same realm technologically. A better comparison would be Battlefront, which still doesn't run nearly as well as Doom on a variety of platforms and looks bad on consoles.
And yeah, Doom is special. The best SP FPS since Half-Life 2: Episode Two.
And yeah, Doom is special. The best SP FPS since Half-Life 2: Episode Two.
sleazefrenzy
Member
Tech aside though..
Odin Sphere: Leifthrasir beats all.
Odin Sphere: Leifthrasir beats all.
JasoNsider
Member
You are patently, demonstrably wrong here. These "tricks" you refer to are portable to other teams and games. They are discovered techniques that can be solved by one and used again by another in the future. A lot of this stuff are razor's edge techniques that are then shared at conferences with attendees, published in white papers, and given to other teams. And very often there are techniques being discovered under the hood you can't see or hear because they have to do with data management, algorithmic discoveries and more (even in something like Uncharted 4).
Saying things need to be "Dynamic, procedural, and physically plausible" is a) only one aspect and b) grossly misguided in that Naughty Dog developed some procedural techniques in order to create Uncharted 4.
sloppyjoe_gamer
Member
Great game but the load times after you die before you get back into the game are way too long.
banefirelord
Banned
Seeing as it couldn't run faster than 7 frames per second at lowest settings and lowest resolution on my computer that more than met minimum requirements and then did some weird crash that somehow fucked up my video card drivers to the extent that I had to completely reinstall my card from the ground up...I'm gonna say "no."
Eh, UC4 isn't as pretty as folks hyped it up to be.
I mean, architecturally it's sound and full of details, but it isn't anything that we haven't seen before, and some areas (jungle) are actually pretty mediocre looking at times, with some flat lighting and ugly foliage.
That game looks it's best in cutscenes and some of the high paced action segments
gitgud
ikr? it's atrocious. the game starts up in campaign mode so it takes a while to play snapmap too
Definitely had more fun looking at Doom than Uncharted 4 as I played both pretty much at the same time. The flawless imagine quality and ultrasmooth framerate alongside the high-end effects made a difference to the comparatively pretty choppy and blurry Uncharted 4. Though I was playing it maxed out on a 1440p Gsync monitor at 120+fps, I just hadn't ever seen anything that smooth/clean outputting those kinds of visuals before.
TheAdmiester
Member
It's the best looking non-PBR game I've ever seen. It has amazing water shaders, car paint shaders, decent-ish 3D grass and fur.
It has some amazing volumetric lighting and almost every single light in the game casts dynamic shadows and can be shot out, which is something I rarely ever see even in linear games. And overall it has the most natural lighting I've seen in a game, especially when modded. Every time I see a new weather/time pattern in the game it blows me away, and it's one of the only games that makes a boring midday with short-ish shadows look real:
Oh, and it has the best DOF/bokeh I've ever seen in a game. Have yet to see that beaten anywhere, nevermind in an open world game.
It has a staggeringly good streaming and LOD system that gives minimal pop-in despite the sheer detail of the world regardless of how fast you're going. The fact that I can teleport from one end of the map to the other to force pop-in, and even then I still only see about 1-1.5 seconds of low detail, is crazy.
Basically, whenever you're playing a linear game and you see a level with amazing pre-baked lighting and whatever amazing effects and think "wow, that looks awesome", GTA is that, with entirely dynamic lighting, with no linearity whatsoever.
There are certainly parts where it's (barely) beaten by other games, but as a whole, with all of these ridiculous systems running in a massive open world, with tons and tons of AI/traffic/foliage running at 60+FPS, that's what makes it the most technically impressive game ever. The fact that it does so much and runs so well despite being entirely non-linear is what makes it the best.
As someone who mainly games on PC, I can't really appreciate this effort on a personal level. I can play on the framerate I want the game to be anyway (if it is supported) and since you can't really turn up the visuals for the game to look really awesome, you just have dozens of potential frames that you can't tap into if you don't have a >60Hz monitor.
I can say that in theory delivering a game that runs really well on multiple platforms with decent graphics to boot is a technical marvel, but that just doesn't affect me personally at all. I play a game on one platform each, not several. So all I got was really nice interior visuals paired with not so great looking exteriors that constantly reminded me that they were on a really tight frametime budget.
Jonneh3003
Banned
blue_phazon
Member
PC doom vs. UC4 yeah
Lys Skygge
Member
Is there more to it than what the demo had shown? Because unless the demo section (I believe it's the beginning of the game) is the worst part of the game, I thought it was incredibly boring. I thought it was worse than the worst parts of Black Ops 3.Maybe you should play more than the demo
That's not hyperbole. I've definitely felt some gameplay sections looked live-action.
Really? It's like 3 secs long on my PC. Can't imagine the consoles being much longer.
Read the first few posts... Watched the 4K video.
That passes for great graphics? Ok. They aren't bad, but hardly great either. Granted the OP did say TECHNICALLY. Hell, maybe it's doing something amazing under the hood that makes it technically amazing, but just visually it's boring and certainly nothing I would call excellent.
This is what really makes me question gamers, PC gamers in particular. You shouldn't have to check what the resolution, framerate, AA solution etc are before deciding if you think the graphics are good or not. Doom to me is lacking detail and strong art direction. Also the lighting is functional rather than beautiful. Run whatever resolution and effects you like, that doesn't makes games look good. Artists make games look good and it seems like Doom had better coders than artists working on it.
So yeah it could well be the most technically impressive game out there, who knows. But it's not the best looking, not by a mile.
That passes for great graphics? Ok. They aren't bad, but hardly great either. Granted the OP did say TECHNICALLY. Hell, maybe it's doing something amazing under the hood that makes it technically amazing, but just visually it's boring and certainly nothing I would call excellent.
This is what really makes me question gamers, PC gamers in particular. You shouldn't have to check what the resolution, framerate, AA solution etc are before deciding if you think the graphics are good or not. Doom to me is lacking detail and strong art direction. Also the lighting is functional rather than beautiful. Run whatever resolution and effects you like, that doesn't makes games look good. Artists make games look good and it seems like Doom had better coders than artists working on it.
So yeah it could well be the most technically impressive game out there, who knows. But it's not the best looking, not by a mile.
On console, it's like loading into a Lost Odyssey battle before they let you install the disc to the HDD. It's like reloading a checkpoint in Invisible War. In case those examples are obscure... It's horrible. It was like playing a PS2 game.
I think you need to see it in action before you decide this, and not base it on a YouTube video that has terrible compression. Great IQ that you can obtain on a PC makes last-gen games look incredible, and you just can't compare to console games.
The fact that it can look like that and run so well makes it the most technically impressive game.
It really is a lesson to PC game devs on how it's possible to achieve top notch graphics and performance on such a wide range of cards.
I used to question whether performance issues were really due to "lazy developers", but Doom shows that it may just be that...are low budgets, or lack of talent. In any event, it makes the performance in games like Quantum Break and Hitman inexcusable.
No reason a 1080p game shouldn't be able to run at a locked 60FPS on at least high settings on a 390/970.
It really is a lesson to PC game devs on how it's possible to achieve top notch graphics and performance on such a wide range of cards.
I used to question whether performance issues were really due to "lazy developers", but Doom shows that it may just be that...are low budgets, or lack of talent. In any event, it makes the performance in games like Quantum Break and Hitman inexcusable.
No reason a 1080p game shouldn't be able to run at a locked 60FPS on at least high settings on a 390/970.
ArkhamFantasy
Member
To be fair, the OP didnt say it was the best looking game, he said it was the most technically impressive, graphics arent the only measure. The game runs super smooth on every platform with almost no tech problems to speak of. I think Uncharted 4 is the better looking game, but its 30 FPS.
This is about being the most technically impressive game, Uncharted 4 looks great for being a console game and naughty dogs has some incredible artists but I would never say that Uncharted 4 is the most technically impressive game out there.
The demo is definitely the worst part of the game. It takes ~2h for the game to finally hand out enough weapons to make the arena fights worthwhile. They should have picked a level in the middle of the game to show it off, not the very first one..
I thought Dooms art direction was pretty great myself., especially the hell themed levels.
Lys Skygge
Member
Well that's good. The demo did absolutely nothing for me, but I might at least rent it from Redbox.
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
The Madagascar city chase sequence is a technical and artistic tour-de-force that is simply unmatched by anything else around at the moment. Take some time and analyse what's actually going on during that sequence in terms of individual effects and techniques - its pretty staggering.
ThanksVision
Member
Can you elaborate why you think it is so bad and boring?
Chronospherics
Member
It's impressive that it looks as good as it does while retaining the framerate it does on consoles. It's hard to say if it's more technically impressive than Uncharted 4 because the overall visual presentation of UC4 is far superior, especially with consideration to the sheer quantity of minute environmental details and aspects like like foliage that feature in UC4s environments. However, of course Uncharted 4 does run at half the framerate.
I still think that Driveclub is the most technically impressive game on consoles, however.
I still think that Driveclub is the most technically impressive game on consoles, however.
Leatherface
Member
Yeah on a technical level DOOM really is in a class all its own. What a badass game too!
The motion blur there looks almost as awful as it does on UC4.
No, compression shouldn't matter that much. Is a clearer video going to make all the models different shapes, higher ploy count? Going to change the lighting? Going to reimagine all the textures/visual style? No. IF I was talking about the technical side of things then sure, you need the best video quality possible. But I can tell the mona lisa is a painting of one of the world's ugliest woman just fine compressed, even if I can't make out the brush strokes.