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[Speevy]

Pay me to use Live but blame someone else when it doesn't work right.

- Microsoft

:O

Maybe Live should be free but developers should charge you individual fees based on how well their online play works?

 

[Dr_Cogent]

Its up to MS to set online standards for the devs. MS would be just as at fault for approving the game.

The thing is, some problems won't manifest themselves until they are put under the full load of the real deal. Devs should fix that crap as fast as possible though.

 

[Speevy]

I walked into a room with a guy in full clan outfit calling everyone that entered every racial slur in the book

:lol :lol :lol

I'm sorry, that guy should get his ass kicked, but that's hilarious.

 

[Safe Bet]

So you're saying you completely accept developer incompetence in getting a game up to speed as long as you don't pay a $50 annual fee for it?

I just don't buy another one of their games, ie EA.

I don't really have the choice with Live.

If I cancel the service because of a few crappy games, I lose acces to all my online games even the ones the work properly.

 

[ghibli99]

I barely play on Live, I have a Gold membership, and I think the experience is a really good one. I don't mind paying. I spend more money during my workweek on eating out than I do on an entire year of Live Gold membership. It's nothing, but it's nice knowing that I'm not restricted in any way when I login.

 

[speculawyer]

So, the question is, "Should Live Gold be free to respond to Sony?"

No. There are enough wankers on xbox live . . . having it free would only bring more losers.

 

[Dr_Cogent]

Ahhh well our experiences differ, especially since the camera has launched. I walked into a room with a guy in full clan outfit calling everyone that entered every racial slur in the book. I also walked into a room where a guy had his camera pointed at his computer screen while playing a movie of a woman was ****ing a dog. it doesn't get much mucky than that, coincidentally I'm play alot more UNO now can't wait to see what's next.

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=124868&highlight=Privacy

I just don't buy another one of their games, ie EA.

I don't really have the choice with Live.

If I cancel the service because of a few crappy games, I lose acces to all my online games even the ones the work properly.

So ultimately you need to blame the devs IMO. Not MS. MS can only be held responsible for so much.

 

[rage1973]

I just don't buy another one of their games, ie EA.

I don't really have the choice with Live.

If I cancel the service because of a few crappy games, I lose acces to all my online games even the ones the work properly.

Hey guess what you can do same with games on Live. Just don't buy their games next time. How does it change anything because of Live?

 

[DarienA]

http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=124868&highlight=Privacy

Sony would do well to swipe these privacy settings/ideas

 

[Safe Bet]

So ultimately you need to blame the devs IMO. Not MS. MS can only be held responsible for so much.

So if you buy a crappy car, do you blame the vendors the car company used to build the car or do you blame the carmaker?

"Dude the brand new Ford I bought broke down after just three months."

"Damn those guys at Taylor and Sons Distributing Inc.!"

 

[Piper Az]

Sony would do well to swipe these privacy settings/ideas

If I were Sony, I would just keep on copying Live. Sure, the features would be delayed for a few wks, but they don't have to spend time thinking out them.

 

[Dr_Cogent]

So if you buy a crappy car, do you blame the vendors the car company used to build the car or do you blame the carmaker?

"Dude the brand new Ford I bought broke down after just three months."

"Damn those guys at Taylor and Sons Distributing Inc.!"

What the flippity **** are you talking about?

If I were Sony, I would just keep on copying Live. Sure, the features would be delayed for a few wks, but they don't have to spend time thinking out them.

Weeks? You clearly underestimate the complexity of enterprise level programming.

 

[PhatSaqs]

Sony would do well to swipe these privacy settings/ideas

Dont see why the won't.

 

[Safe Bet]

What the flippity **** are you talking about?

:lol

NVM

Carry on as you were, please.

 

[Dr_Cogent]

:lol

NVM

Carry on as you were, please.

Nevermind is right, your analogy completely sucked ass wind.

 

[pr0cs]

WTF would live go free if we still haven't seen how well (or poorly) Sony's online experience is. Ask this question again in Feb/March when there are a number of PS3 games that are online enabled and there are more than a handful of customers using the service.

 

[DarienA]

WTF would live go free if we still haven't seen how well (or poorly) Sony's online experience is. Ask this question again in Feb/March when there are a number of PS3 games that are online enabled and there are more than a handful of customers using the service.

Are you the same one who predict a PN crash in a thread a bit back?

 

[Safe Bet]

Nevermind is right, your analogy completely sucked ass wind.

You would do well not to anger me young jedddiiiiii....

I kindly stepped out of the thread because I don't want this to turn into a bash on live get flamed in return mess.

Please don't throw rocks at me as I walk away.

 

[MoxManiac]

I get the feeling you dont do much online gaming.

No, I really don't. I'm not that huge on onlne gaming. But i've played on both free and pay servers, and i've yet to see a difference in the quality of the client base.

I'm not arguing that Live isn't worth the money - but I don't buy the arguement that it would be worse for gamers if it was free. Blizzard's been doing free online play (except for WoW) for years, and those games have had HUGE player bases.

 

[Dante]

Yes! It's been time to make this free for awhile now.

 

[Dr_Cogent]

You would do well not to anger me young jedddiiiiii....

I kindly stepped out of the thread because I don't want this to turn into a bash on live get flamed in return mess.

Please don't throw rocks at me as I walk away.

:lol Young Jedi? That's Muad'Dib to you.

But seriously, I could not possibly agree with your analogy.

 

[PhatSaqs]

WTF would live go free if we still haven't seen how well (or poorly) Sony's online experience is. Ask this question again in Feb/March when there are a number of PS3 games that are online enabled and there are more than a handful of customers using the service.

Even still there's no reason for them to go free just because Sony is. XBL offers unique content and experiences not available on the PS network. It's like arguing Showtime on DirectTV should cost the same as Starz does on Comcast.

 

[Mirimar]

Well, lets see. They have to host messages, video, audio and text for example. They manage the VoIP I believe as well. The simple fact of the matter is - it's not just matchmaking that is behind Live. There is obviously much more to it than that.

Before you all start hammering on Live, why not wait and actually see what Sony is truly offering you for free. Then you can start making comparisons on why or why not Live should be free.

Since when are server farms free? If MS can manage to make it free in competition, I am somewhat for it. The problem I have is any Tom, Dick or Harry can get online with the PS3 so even more assholes will be on there. And there hasn't been any mention of a reputation system either. And if someone is an asshole and you filter them from playing with them somehow, all they have to do is create a new free account.

The current SlimLine comes with a mac address, doesn't it? I'm pretty sure they could just ban the mac-address and prevent you from even using the online part if they wanted, right?

 

[DarienA]

Even still there's no reason for them to go free just because Sony is. XBL offers unique content and experiences not available on the PS network. It's like arguing Showtime on DirectTV should cost the same as Starz does on Comcast.

Not only that but everything I've seen still indicates XBL's community features are stronger than the initial PN offering.

 

[Dr_Cogent]

The current SlimLine comes with a mac address, doesn't it? I'm pretty sure they could just ban the mac-address and prevent you from even using the online part if they wanted, right?

Possible, but will they? We will just have to find out.

 

[Mirimar]

Possible, but will they? We will just have to find out.

It would be a little extreme, but it could keep cheaters out and on a lower level, assholes. I doubt they'd ban an account in this way for jerks in general, there'd be some rediculous abuse going on.

 

[Pimpwerx]

Free is always better and LIVE at one point was free but due to costs we had to get charged a measely $4 a month.

Sony will realize that offering this service free is not cost effective... especially with the expected user base, and will either just give superficial features or they will start charging.

I see MS jumpstarting LIVE with extra content and maybe features.... which has already started IMO, we are really getting new Demos at least once a week.

How much does MySpace charge you to do all this stuff on their site? I mean, they see way more traffic than MS and Sony will probably see combined this gen. Oh wait, that's free right? Slap a gaming portal on MySpace, and you have Live/PSN-redux. Stop trying to justify paying money for a service that should be free. It costs as much as a game or a controller. This forum likes to complain about hardware prices, but then get suckered into repeat payments that eventually add up to more than a system. Say what you will, but over the life of the system, you could buy a Wii at launch instead of going on Live.

It's everyone's perogative to pay for whatever they like. But I don't see a justification for paying for online. Different strokes, I guess. PEACE.

 

[DarienA]

How much does MySpace charge you to do all this stuff on their site? I mean, they see way more traffic than MS and Sony will probably see combined this gen. Oh wait, that's free right? Slap a gaming portal on MySpace, and you have Live/PSN-redux. Stop trying to justify paying money for a service that should be free. It costs as much as a game or a controller. This forum likes to complain about hardware prices, but then get suckered into repeat payments that eventually add up to more than a system. Say what you will, but over the life of the system, you could buy a Wii at launch instead of going on Live.

It's everyone's perogative to pay for whatever they like. But I don't see a justification for paying for online. Different strokes, I guess. PEACE.

I get connection errors or error accessing this page whatever their generic error message is all the time when I log in and try to access features on myspace... I certainly don't want my online gaming network reliable like that(as in not reliable).

 

[Safe Bet]

That's Muad'Dib to you.

Somethings should not be joked about. :|

On-topic:

That's why I stepped out. This is a subject people feel one way or another about and usally no amount of debate will change that.

*shrug*

 

[Gek54]

Comparing online gaming to Myspace? Wow

 

[itslikethatyall]

it all depends on how well sony's network will run. who cares about getting something for free if it sucks. i just want reliable online gaming!

 

[Safe Bet]

The current SlimLine comes with a mac address, doesn't it? I'm pretty sure they could just ban the mac-address and prevent you from even using the online part if they wanted, right?

You run into alot of problems when you go down that road.

What about buying "used" machines?

Imagine the backlash Sony would face if consumers began to discover the used PS3's they bought from EB can't be played online because they've been banned...

 

[Dr_Cogent]

You run into alot of problems when you go down that road.

What about buying "used" machines?

Imagine the backlash Sony would face if consumers began to discover the PS3's they bought used from EB can't be played online because they've been banned...

That's a good point.

 

[demi]

I certainly wouldn't mind.

 

[Mirimar]

You run into alot of problems when you go down that road.

What about buying "used" machines?

Imagine the backlash Sony would face if consumers began to discover the PS3's they bought used from EB can't be played online because they've been banned...

That'd make for a nice GAF thread, wouldn't it? :lol I was more thinking of its use in moderation. Like temporary suspensions of usage for mal-usage or disruptive behavior, kind of like what Forum mods do you users. Banning would be the last resort. If the person sells the banned PS3, it could be a hassle to get it unbanned..but doesn't have to be so. If they did go this route, customer service would have to look up the information of the previous owner (have no idea what personal info will be entered in to use online...credit card?). New owner would have to give information over the phone or whatnot..and get unbanned. That is a possible work around.

 

[Safe Bet]

That's a good point.

I can't take credit for it...

Someone explained it to me after I began bitching about the cheaters/lamers on Live using multiple alt accounts to get around bannings.

 

[----]

The problem with making Live free is that they would lose complete control over their ability to silence accounts or outright ban an account with regards to foul language or cheating.

I have been saying that they should make Silver accounts able to access Quick Match only and Gold accounts able to do Optimatch and Create a Match. Problem is that you can create an infinite number of Silver accounts and if you just want to cheat and be an asshole there would be nothing MS could do to stop them. Allowing Silver accounts to play online could ruin the service for everyone.

In theory people are saying that a free online service is better, but lets wait and see how PS3 online is in practice. If they can't do anything to curb cheaters and assholes on the Playstation network then there's a good chance gamers will not be happy with the state of PS3 online.

 

[The Faceless Master]

You run into alot of problems when you go down that road.

What about buying "used" machines?

Imagine the backlash Sony would face if consumers began to discover the used PS3's they bought from EB can't be played online because they've been banned...

people had the same problems with the xbox... and from what i recall, MS reps just said that those are the risks with buying used...

 

[Safe Bet]

people had the same problems with the xbox... and from what i recall, MS reps just said that those are the risks with buying used...

Microsoft bans accounts, not machines...

You sir are a victim of viral marketing.

Sucks doesn't it?

 

[demi]

They ban your machine if its modded.

 

[BenjaminBirdie]

The current SlimLine comes with a mac address, doesn't it? I'm pretty sure they could just ban the mac-address and prevent you from even using the online part if they wanted, right?

The problem is, really, why do we not have an answer to that? The thing is out in LESS THAN A MONTH. Sorry, but we knew the answers to every single one of these questions for the 360 Upgrade To Live by this point.

"They could do this, hey, you know maybe they could even do this, oh, I wonder if I can stream music from my iPod that wording is kind of vague, hm..."

Drop a bias tag on me all you want, but Gamer's Day is over as is every middling excuse that's been doled out for months. There are way too many unanswered questions about this system for anyone to have any kind of faith on its ability to do a very large number of things.

 

[bishoptl]

The problem I have is any Tom, Dick or Harry can get online with the PS3 so even more assholes will be on there.

Funny, that doesn't seem to have *any* difference with the number of racist turd burglars I've had to deal with on Live. Glorified P2P should be free. Period. And if Live continues to be a paid service, I'll switch my online gaming over to Sony as soon as my Live Gold expires.

 

[qirex]

Comparing online gaming to Myspace? Wow

I know, MySpace probably has a thousand times the requirements of Live.

 

[DarienA]

The problem with making Live free is that they would lose complete control over their ability to silence accounts or outright ban an account with regards to foul language or cheating.

How would they lose control? Those items are part of the TOS for using XBL. Making XBL free doesn't mean the TOS has to change.

Funny, that doesn't seem to have *any* difference with the number of racist turd burglars I've had to deal with on Live. Glorified P2P should be free. Period. And if Live continues to be a paid service, I'll switch my online gaming over to Sony as soon as my Live Gold expires.

I've already told that live is much more than glorified P2P so hush.

 

[bill0527]

How would they lose control? Those items are part of the TOS for using XBL. Making XBL free doesn't mean the TOS has to change.

The $50 fee is the control portion. People are much less likely to spend $50 and create a new account. Some will, but most won't. They certainly won't do it multiple times. Whereas if it was free, then they could just continually make new account after new account after each banning.

 

[Beer Monkey]

And if Live continues to be a paid service, I'll switch my online gaming over to Sony as soon as my Live Gold expires.

Are all your friends switching? I can't imagine dropping Live when most of my friends will be sticking with 360 for the time being. Playing with my friends is way more important than what platform we are on and what it costs.

 

[aerofx]

Microsoft bans accounts, not machines...

You sir are a victim of viral marketing.

Sucks doesn't it?

And you don't know what the hell you're talking about. My account was banned on my Xbox but works on other peoples.

 

[Safe Bet]

They ban your machine if its modded.

That's kinda a play on words isn't it?

Live will not allow mod'ed machines to access the network but the machine itself is not "banned" per say.

Hence the reason mod'ers only need to "mask" the fact their machine has been mod'ed to get on Live.

If Live rejects you because it detects a mod does it ban that machine permantley or can you turn around and get right back with the same machine as long as the mod is undetected?

I'm a straight player so I'm not quite sure about how it deals with mod'ers.

Please correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[Odrion]

As soon as I heard there wasn't a unified friends list I knew Sony's Online service won't pose too much threat to X-Box Live.

 

[Safe Bet]

*deleted*