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Is the PS3 (!) actually scaling new games now? Potential Evidence Inside

JB1981

Member
From Gamespot Forums. (Yes! Gamespot lozlzllzz)

So Sonic apparently only supports 720p (at least that's what the box says), but this guy from Gamespot got it to run at 1080i.

http://www.gamespot.com/pages/forums/show_msgs.php?topic_id=25361111



Pics:

document-1.jpg


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Did the latest firmware update that 'strengthened' PS2 and PS3 games allow for this?

- can anyone else here who has this game confirm or deny?
 

Bad_Boy

time to take my meds
Agent Icebeezy said:
I recall reading that it was
Got a link or something? I mean the OP says the box said 720p. I dunno who to believe, and I'm sure enough not buying sonic to find out.

Bildi said:
Sonic in 1p would be unbearable.
As cool as it to make fun of sonic (because it is crap), theres a bigger reason behind this thread. But something tells me most people will ignore it.
 
All my PS3 games run in 1080i, whether they say they do or not. My TV doesn't do 720p. As long as I don't check 480p, it scales to 1080i instead. If I check 480p, it runs in that.
 

Bad_Boy

time to take my meds
Leondexter said:
All my PS3 games run in 1080i, whether they say they do or not. My TV doesn't do 720p. As long as I don't check 480p, it scales to 1080i instead. If I check 480p, it runs in that.
hmm...just wondering. How long have you had your ps3?
 

Panajev2001a

GAF's Pleasant Genius
llTll said:
eh sonic looks good in that pic O_O

It seems so, notice how even that nearby street lamp does not have a shadow ? Well, walk a few more cm towards it and WHAM! it will appear or check out the trees and their progressively drawn shadow (a sight to behold).
 

Miburou

Member
On my PS3, 480p is checked and grayed-out, so I can't uncheck it. I'm using HDMI with a Sony CRT HDTV, BTW.
 

dark10x

Digital Foundry pixel pusher
Panajev2001a said:
It seems so, notice how even that nearby street lamp does not have a shadow ? Well, walk a few more cm towards it and WHAM! it will appear or check out the trees and their progressively drawn shadow (a sight to behold).
The game has issues, but the visuals are generally quite good.
 

drohne

hyperbolically metafictive
vf5 is apparently upscaling to 1080i and 1080p -- i haven't got a 1080p tv to test it, but it does default to 720p even if you have 1080i checked, which isn't how 1080p-native ps3 games behave.
 

SleazyC

Member
Bad_Boy said:
hmm...just wondering. How long have you had your ps3?
This is my initial train of though. The TV could be taking the 720p signal and upscaling it itself. Need to find someone who has a TV which doesn't upscale the signal. I know someone but the problem would be getting them to even rent Sonic :lol
 

Lord Error

Insane For Sony
SleazyC said:
This is my initial train of though. The TV could be taking the 720p signal and upscaling it itself.
That couldn't be happening because the guy has 720p disabled in the system options.

Also, the VF5 situation is curious if what Drohne says is true.

Who knows, the new devkit resolution scaling might have be a part of TRC now, and future games will have no problems being 480p on 1080i-only TVs. Someone with such TV should grab resistance to test it, but the game probably needs patching to have that problem resolved.
 

Lord Error

Insane For Sony
cartoon_soldier said:
Isn't it that the developers have to code it to do that?
It's in part that developers have to allow for the horizontal scaling, but the hardware is supposed to scale automatically from there on. Point being, there's no increased frame buffer memory footprint as if the game would support 1080p natively, vs. the 720p natively.
 
Marconelly said:
It's in part that developers have to allow for the horizontal scaling, but the hardware is supposed to scale automatically from there on. Point being, there's no increased frame buffer memory footprint as if the game would support 1080p natively, vs. the 720p natively.

But if the hardware was doing the upscaling, it would do the same for older games too.

So either the developers weren't informed of what to do or they never had time to do it or they choose to ignore to do it.

In any case if the best PS3 game out there can't upscale, it just sucks :(
 
until we get someone testing this at 1080p i wouldn't be too sure of anything.

the number of times i've seen games mislabelled with regards to what resolutions they do and don't run at on the box is pretty shocking.
 

Lord Error

Insane For Sony
cartoon_soldier said:
But if the hardware was doing the upscaling, it would do the same for older games too.
No, because the developer has to enable the software to support the scaling, which was allegedly introduced only recently in the new devkit. Developer basically has to support resolution that's something like 960x1080.
 

bill0527

Member
I just tested Resistance on my TV and it is still downscaling to 480p.

I'm not about to drop a dime on Sonic, so I have no way to test it.

There are a couple of scenarios here..

The system could in fact be upscaling. Or the box had a misprint and its actually a 1080p game. Every game that does 1080p on the PS3 will do 1080i also.

I really hope this gets implemented soon. I'm not spending any money on PS3 games unless they support 1080i, I don't care how great the game is. Resistance looks like dogshit in 480p on my TV, especially compared to other games in 1080i on my 360. I don't like to look at dogshit. It takes away from my enjoyment of the experience.
 

JB1981

Member
bill0527 said:
I just tested Resistance on my TV and it is still downscaling to 480p.

I'm not about to drop a dime on Sonic, so I have no way to test it.

There are a couple of scenarios here..

The system could in fact be upscaling. Or the box had a misprint and its actually a 1080p game. Every game that does 1080p on the PS3 will do 1080i also.

I really hope this gets implemented soon. I'm not spending any money on PS3 games unless they support 1080i, I don't care how great the game is.

why did you go out and buy a monitor that supports 720p/1080p for your PS3, then? :lol
 

Panajev2001a

GAF's Pleasant Genius
dark10x said:
The game has issues, but the visuals are generally quite good.

You need to play it more and pay attention to the details.

Put the game back in and wander around the town. Look at the NPC's, how their shadows are just not rendered until you get quite awfully close to them. Look at those two giant trees in the hallway that passes in the middle of the town and pay attention the the nice shadow they progressively generate (it really is a nice shadow once it is fully rendered, I am not kidding).

Or let's talk about Tails' A.I. (ok, we were supposed to bitch about graphical issues :p), but the way you can get him to commit suicide and the ways he comes back to life or comes from the sea just to die in front of you and come back to life after 30 seconds or so... etc... ok ok... graphics... graphics...

My issue is not the lack of skill of the individual programmers (the way the trees' shadow in the city [not the action stages, which is actually weird!] are rendered and then faded out progressively as you get closer to the trees and then move farther away from them is not something that trivial to realize, btw), but lack of polish of the title and the sense that something somewhere fell apart really badly and people tried to patch things together to keep the game engine running along well or simply the City stage/area does not use anywhere near the performance the engine is capable
Or maybe the City somehow was designed/created in a way that bring the engine down on its knees (maybe wasting lots of cycles rendering unseen objects/areas) and forcing the developers to cut corners.

The game has plenty of issues with the visuals too, but it is in places where you would last expect to see issues and probably the part of the game the developers spent less time working on or polishing it up.

The issues with loading times is another alarm sign IMHO that indicates that something along the project was completed went really bad and in a really ugly way.
 

bill0527

Member
JB1981 said:
why did you go out and buy a monitor that supports 720p/1080p for your PS3, then? :lol

I found out quickly that gaming in my computer chair holed up in my computer room in front of a small monitor sucks compared to gaming while kicked back on my couch in front of a 48" screen. The monitor's nice, but after a few weeks I just couldn't see myself playing for any extended period of time in front of it. Plus the fact my wife was bitching because we've got all these blu-ray movies that she now can't watch. I also missed my 5.1 setup. Gaming on a monitor is a temporary fix, but it just doesn't work for me because I've been gaming on a big screen for so long. I've still got my cables all hooked up to the monitor and I can easily bring the PS3 upstairs if I wanted to, but I just don't see myself doing that very often.
 

theBishop

Banned
bill0527 said:
I found out quickly that gaming in my computer chair holed up in my computer room in front of a small monitor sucks compared to gaming while kicked back on my couch in front of a 48" screen. The monitor's nice, but after a few weeks I just couldn't see myself playing for any extended period of time in front of it. Plus the fact my wife was bitching because we've got all these blu-ray movies that she now can't watch. I also missed my 5.1 setup. Gaming on a monitor is a temporary fix, but it just doesn't work for me because I've been gaming on a big screen for so long. I've still got my cables all hooked up to the monitor and I can easily bring the PS3 upstairs if I wanted to, but I just don't see myself doing that very often.

heh, i want to get a monitor with DVI support so i can do Cell programming on my desk. The stuff i do now is over SSH, which is a little wonky.
 

dark10x

Digital Foundry pixel pusher
You need to play it more and pay attention to the details.
I aware of those issues, but I feel that the are only severe within the town (which looks ugly). The actual action stages are often very nice looking. The shadows may fade in on certain objects, but the game has a fully unified lighting model AND runs at 60 fps with high poly models throughout.

There is some decent work in there, but the game was clearly unfinished when released. I agree that it seems as if they ran into serious troubles during development.
 
Bad_Boy said:
hmm...just wondering. How long have you had your ps3?

Picked it up 2 weeks after launch, it's done this since day 1. I spent a little while mad that the 720p games were running in 480p (I assumed they'd upscale like the 360) until I unchecked it and they bumped up to 1080i properly. After that, I assumed all the talk about it not scaling was just from people who checked all the boxes. I guess that's not the case. (???)

For the record, Resistance works in 1080i for me, too, and it's definitely not my TV scaling--my TV doesn't do 720p or any scaling at all (it's an early Sony WEGA CRT). And I can certainly tell the difference between 480p and 1080i.
 

Bad_Boy

time to take my meds
Leondexter said:
Picked it up 2 weeks after launch, it's done this since day 1. I spent a little while mad that the 720p games were running in 480p (I assumed they'd upscale like the 360) until I unchecked it and they bumped up to 1080i properly. After that, I assumed all the talk about it not scaling was just from people who checked all the boxes. I guess that's not the case. (???)

For the record, Resistance works in 1080i for me, too, and it's definitely not my TV scaling--my TV doesn't do 720p or any scaling at all (it's an early Sony WEGA CRT). And I can certainly tell the difference between 480p and 1080i.
Whats the model number on that TV? Pretty interesting how you can get them running @ 1080i.
 
Leondexter said:
For the record, Resistance works in 1080i for me, too, and it's definitely not my TV scaling--my TV doesn't do 720p or any scaling at all (it's an early Sony WEGA CRT). And I can certainly tell the difference between 480p and 1080i.

That's amazing since even the Resistance devs admit that it doesn't output 1080i. :)
 

JB1981

Member
Leondexter said:
Picked it up 2 weeks after launch, it's done this since day 1. I spent a little while mad that the 720p games were running in 480p (I assumed they'd upscale like the 360) until I unchecked it and they bumped up to 1080i properly. After that, I assumed all the talk about it not scaling was just from people who checked all the boxes. I guess that's not the case. (???)

For the record, Resistance works in 1080i for me, too, and it's definitely not my TV scaling--my TV doesn't do 720p or any scaling at all (it's an early Sony WEGA CRT). And I can certainly tell the difference between 480p and 1080i.

No it doesn't. I just disabled 720p output for that game and it refused to play in anything but 480p.
 
beermonkey@tehbias said:
That's amazing since even the Resistance devs admit that it doesn't output 1080i. :)

Yes, I know--it's on the back of the box. I don't know what to tell you, but my TV is getting a 1080i signal, and it looks a hell of a lot nicer than 480p. 720p on my television looks like a scrambled cable porn channel, it's not supported.

If I get some time, I'll be happy to record switching between the resolutions. Not till the weekend, though.
 
JB1981 said:
You can't over hdmi. And I just tried Resistance at 1080i over component and it just defaults to 480i.

Hmm...I don't know. If I uncheck everything, I get 480i, the game displays in 4:3 (I have to manually change it to widescreen on the TV). If I check only 1080i, the HD signal forces my TV to widescreen and the game looks excellent. As I said, I can probably post video on the weekend if anyone's interested.


Whats the model number on that TV? Pretty interesting how you can get them running @ 1080i.

I'm not sure (I'm at work)...HSsomethingsomethingXBR...this is it, though:

http://www.gameswelike.com/web/images/Leonsetup.jpg
 
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