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Just Finished End of Evangelion
- Thread starter ACE 1991
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Jo Shishido's Cheeks
Member
Due to the dumbing down of a lot of information. A lot of the core themes of the show, identity, acceptance, responsibility et al either became unnecessarily obtuse or lost due to the reliance on 'action' to satisfy the demands of the fans who weren't satisfied/didn't fully comprehend the TV ending and just wanted big explosions and the world to end.Blader5489 said:
A prime example is the scene in the film where Shinji strangles Asuka and stomps out the pyramid he's made of sand. This and many scenes like it forego a lot of subtlety and skill the show had to present what's effectively the same thing in a far worse way.
Jo Shishido's Cheeks said:
I fucking love Evangelion to death, but let's be serious, the show was never subtle about its themes or how it presented it them. Especially if we're talking about the tv series ending, where everything grinds to a halt so that the characters can air out their problems as explicitly and directly to the audience as possible.
We need this on Blu-Ray! Man, I bet they're just waiting for 2015 to release the Evangelion 20th Anniversary Digitally-Remastered High Definition Box Set FromKinyou said:
End of Evangelion was a huge mindfuck, though I really enjoyed just letting everything "stream" in.
Okay.Jarmel said:
SneakyStephan
Banned
I was hoping to see some fun memory rekindling of the series here,and all I read is a bunch of douchy hipster 'my version was better' arguing.
Time to bail.
You guys can suck the fun out of anything.
Time to bail.
You guys can suck the fun out of anything.
Jex
Member
Pretty much the text book case of doing it right.Blader5489 said:
You have failed to stipulate why reaching a consensus is somehow a valid measure of objective quality, instead you are holding it up as an unsupported assumption which you use to judge a shows merit.Jarmel said:
That is not a good thing.
iKeepPlaying
Banned
We can agree on something.
Shinji can go to hell. And Asuka should be the pilot of 01.
Shinji can go to hell. And Asuka should be the pilot of 01.
Jexhius said:
There is no such thing as objective quality first off. Quality itself is a variation of personal perspective. My point being is that when your audience doesn't know what just happened then the narrative broke down somewhere. There's a difference between hard to understand and a WTF ending. The ending of the TV series qualified as a 'WTF' ending because of a lack of lead-in or explanation as to what was happening. It just jumped. The movies are much better in this regard.
iKeepPlaying
Banned
In manga? No doubt, he's awesome.Dresden said:
In rebuild? Dunno, let's see how it ends.
In TV series/EoE? No fucking way. He's a selfish prick that sent the whole world to hell, including the painful death of Asuka.
Rei >> Asuka >> Mari >> Pen Pen >> Misato
iKeepPlaying
Banned
Sorry, she was just a teaser. Too much.Brazil said:
InfiniteNine
Rolling Girl
There! Now all is right with the world.iKeepPlaying said:
iKeepPlaying
Banned
He has issues. But somehow he deals with them in a more mature way than in the TV series. Mind you, the manga is still going. Do yourself a favor and read it. I was like: "WOAH!" when I read it.Alucrid said:
Jex
Member
It is certainly clear what your point is, I just completely disagree with it.Jarmel said:
I am still unclear as to why the state of the audiences bafflement or understanding is some how tied into the ending "failing" or "succeeding". I don't see why that has anything to do with anything.
Also, this:
is not the same as -Jarmel said:
considering that the End Of Evangelion clearly has 'lead in'.Jarmel said:
Definitely agreed.InsertNameHere said:
Glad to see that the consensus here seems to be that the endings are complimentary. The TV series uses a lot of non-literal representation, which leads people to mistake it for an embrace of instrumentality, but the choice that Shinji makes is one that goes against everything instrumentality represents. I also think you can find the corresponding point in EoE for that decision too.
I pretty much disagree with everything iKeepPlaying says in this thread. The endings are the same. Mari better than Misato? Better than anyone? What the hell. Total nothing of a fanservice character. Endings are complimentary. And lastly, Shinji is an amazing character. He fucked up big time, to the point where it's hard to justify forgiving him, but he still made the right choice for himself and the people he cared about, and it came from a sincere place. Life and individuality was hell for Shinji, but he allowed himself to continue to feel pain rather than let it end for everyone. I think of him as something of a hero in EoE.
They're both great. The EoE has an incredible, unique atmosphere. That alone justifies its existence. It also wraps up a few narrative and thematic/symbolic threads that were still left dangling (to the detriment of the series) by the end of episode 26.Jo Shishido's Cheeks said:
Sure, but it's also beautiful. Like a Baroque painting.ACE 1991 said:
ThisWreckage
Banned
Jarmel said:
Oh, wow. I disagree with this 100%. Ambiguity is a wonderful thing. I think the fact that people are still debating and discussing the show is a wonderful thing that stems from the ambiguity. Not everything needs to be answered.
firehawk12
Subete no aware
I really find it strange that anyone could come to any other conclusion regarding the TV ending.Krev said:
I can't believe so many people prefer EoE over the TV ending. EoE was basically violence porn with some of the weirdest most random shit tossed in. The TV ending focused on the main theme of the series: Shinji's acceptance of himself and others. While the TV ending is definitely a WTF moment, I thought it was ambitious and satisfying, way more than "zomg Rei turns into a giant naked angel."
They're both equally valid. EoE is so odd and evocative that it feels wrong to just call it 'violence porn'. To go back to the comparison I made earlier, you could call, say, some Caravaggio paintings 'violence porn', but there's so much skill and personality behind them, and they have so much of an impact on their audience, that it would obviously be hugely reductive. Same thing here.Forkball said:
The TV ending is more focused on communicating the main theme of the series and does a better job at it, but EoE makes you appreciate the strength Shinji showed in his ultimate decision, despite everything that had come before. At least, that's what I took out of it.
The film also ties up a lot of the sub-themes, like the Freudian Oedipal stage 'journey-to-adulthood' stuff.
Trent Strong
Banned
Ultra-depressed, super-apathetic Shinji is one of the best characters of all time.
I'm sure I've read Anno explaining that Evangelion was an allegory for what he went through when experiencing deep depression, this including the main theme of the series (inferiority complex, hedgehog's dilemma, self-acceptance and the like).
It would seem that the TV ending of Evangelion would constitute the ending he originally intended, whereas EoE would be the version made following the overwhelming fan anger and pressure received after the final episodes were broadcasted.
It would seem that the TV ending of Evangelion would constitute the ending he originally intended, whereas EoE would be the version made following the overwhelming fan anger and pressure received after the final episodes were broadcasted.
watatatow
Member
You're hallucinating something I haven't even said. The point was that one should be open to the idea that there is nonsense within a story when an attempt to piece everything together would otherwise only bring on headaches. As for just how much of it is nonsense? That's for the person to figure out, and once that is done, everything will begin to make a whole lot more sense and thus become a lot more enjoyable.Blader5489 said:
"That's a load of bull" is an interpretation too, and one every bit as valid as any other.
mocolostrocolos
Member
I think both EoE and Series Ending complete each other.
I'm looking forward the ending of Rebuild.
I'm looking forward the ending of Rebuild.
HappyBivouac
Member
I must be the only one who thinks the TV ending and EoE are both amazing works. I like things that are introspective, and I also like things that are audiovisually stimulating.
Rebuild is amazing too.
And to fuel the fire, TV and movie both had the same ending, just told differently.
Rebuild is amazing too.
And to fuel the fire, TV and movie both had the same ending, just told differently.
Jo Shishido's Cheeks
Member
One of my favourite parts of the TV ending is where Shinji is shown floating in the air and limitation is explained. Then a line is drawn and he now has to walk on the ground. This was so simple and yet amazing effective.
<3 TV Ending
<3 TV Ending
HappyBivouac
Member
Yeah I definitely dig stuff like that. That part stands out in my mind as well.
But I'm one of those dudes who watches something like Evangelion and thinks "Man, how could someone watch this and not be tremendously affected by how well it touches on one's own human psychology?" I think perhaps it's that people are predisposed to see a character like Shinji and think "well, I'm not a little emo bitch like him! I'm a well adjusted person!" But it's not about whether you're an emo bitch. These things that Evangelion touches on, particularly in eps 25 and 26, are absolutely tied with the human mind and the human condition. Really though, it's probably just that I'm one of those dudes that is moved by this sort of thing, and other people aren't.
But I'm one of those dudes who watches something like Evangelion and thinks "Man, how could someone watch this and not be tremendously affected by how well it touches on one's own human psychology?" I think perhaps it's that people are predisposed to see a character like Shinji and think "well, I'm not a little emo bitch like him! I'm a well adjusted person!" But it's not about whether you're an emo bitch. These things that Evangelion touches on, particularly in eps 25 and 26, are absolutely tied with the human mind and the human condition. Really though, it's probably just that I'm one of those dudes that is moved by this sort of thing, and other people aren't.
One of my favorite endings to any story. Why write an ending just like every other? I just love how this sticks out to me and communicates exactly the feeling that needs to be communicated.2th said:
Neon Genesis Evangelion - Final Scene in 14 Languages2th said:
(if you think it's boring; skip to 9:02; mexican penguin is hilarious)
You're not alone. I agree with everything you say, except for Rebuild being amazing. I'd say it's a fun ride and nicely directed, but it falls apart a bit if you think much about it. On the other hand, the flaws in the original series mostly add to its greatness.HappyBivouac said:
drunkendonuts
Member
2th said:
i actually prefer the TV ending to EoE. the fact that they pulled that out of their asses when their animation budget got cut was great.
DrForester
Kills Photobucket
Just going to post my explanation from the last thread.
Evangelion's Ending (movie and TV show)
Gendo's plan succeeds and he and the rest of the world are chilling The Great Link. However, all is not well in Orange Juice town, there's one loose end. Shinji is still around, and no one likes Shinji. Everyone teams up to trick Shinji into rejecting instrumentality to get him out of there.
They succeed and decide and decide for good trolling measure to send him Asuka.
Asuka realizing she's been had and that she has to spend the rest of her life with Shinji, says what anyone would say faced with living with Shinji. "I Feel Sick".
Shinji, realizing he's been had and has to spend the rest of his life with Asuka does what anyone would do faced with living with Asuka. Choke her to death.
The End
HappyBivouac
Member
God. That gif. What a fucking movie that is.
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