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Killzone: Shadow Fall launch trailer & tech trailer
- Thread starter shinobi602
- Start date
Team ICO made the same sacrifices in SotC (resolution being 512x488) and framerate. So if Crytek sucks for it, so does Team ICO
Of couse, that's not the case.
And yes, HDR lighting adds a lot to the games, which is why it's one of the main improvements of the KZSF engine.
Did you just compared it to a ps2 game? lol
My point is Crytek added those and they ended up sacrificing resolution and framerate. Made the game not a looker.
Why can't you get that?
And yes, ICO sucks too. Cant even release TLG.
Metroid-Squadron
Banned
That's weird because the CGI cutscenes in KZ2 were rendered with HDR lighting and looked great. Truth is, KZ2 and 3 would've benefited from HDR lighting just as SF does.
Did you forget Guerrilla sacrificing input precision for eye-candy?
While some people keep denying it for some reason, it is indeed a looker:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YvKLvnYixhQ&t=2m47s
So it seems you don't have a point after all.
Back then there were already progressive scan TVs in which games looked way better at 480p than sub SD interlaced. Of course, pixel counting wasn't so widespread then and marketing didn't tell people to care about resolution so much.
VFX_Veteran
Banned
We'll see.. I doubt it.
JohnnySasaki86
Member
Umm...you can't just come in here and state something as fact without supporting it with evidence. How do you know? Like EatChildren stated we don't know for sure which one is pushing higher quality effects and lighting without the numbers.
and yes were can compare the two engines, thats what were doing. The two engines are obviously very comparable and close or the differences would be more obvious and we wouldn't need the numbers.
VFX_Veteran
Banned
One word: Geomcache. Film effects 10% of the original size now possible with their pipeline. Compare the water in Crysis 3 even on ultra settings, it's not even get close.
Ryse has the best water in any videogame ever made, be it console or pc. This is not me saying this, it comes from an industry expert.
How can you compare an offline simulated mesh with a realtime procedural mesh? Not only that.. just because the behavior is physically simulated doesn't mean the actual "look" of the water is more advanced. I still say that BF4 has the best "looking" water and it interacts with the environment whereas the water in Ryse is "canned".
JohnnySasaki86
Member
I don't think so...If I remember correctly there using 3 different types of lights. area lighting, cube maps, and something else.
Eye candy had nothing to do with dead zone.
2ndly you cant deny that killzone2 & 3 are among the best looking current gen games. crysis 2 & 3 didn't looked as good on 360 and even worse on ps3.
its not always about pushing effects. its about knowing your limitation and building best technical games around them .
Krappadizzle
Member
I dunno, as a person who has spent over half his career crossing the pacific ocean and doing deep sea swim calls, I'd say it's pretty well realized. The problem with water, is that it's.... fluid, and dependent on atmospheric conditions, so you may have seen waves at a beach or a calm lake and think that is how water must act all the time when it isn't. There are so many variables it's hard to have just one metric with which to measure it. The water in that GIF is pretty spot on.
its look like RYSE is using two different meshes. one over the top of other. the bottom one is precomputed that looks good and there is a realtime thin procedural mesh over it which looks jelly like
VFX_Veteran
Banned
Can I ask you what specifically makes KZ superior to the other heavy-hitter graphics games on the PC other than real-time ray-traced reflections? We've all read their tech paper on the graphics engine and everything in there has been implemented on the PC before other than the aforementioned reflections.. While you are at it, can you explain how it's superior and yet lacks displacement mapping and dynamic GI -- yet still remains superior?
Can all those predicting diminishing returns eat some crow now? Please?
The only idiots who were harping about diminishing returns during the PS4 reveal were almost all exclusively Nintendo fanboys. There was even a thread where people were implying the SF gameplay demo from the conference was CG. Lol.
JohnnySasaki86
Member
This. Totally agree. Although once the game comes out I would like to see more of a direct comparison. Comparing the models, textures and levels to Crysis 3 on Ultra. Be surprised if this isn't just as good or better:
valkillmore
Member
Grimløck;89604242 said:
Friend request sent. coolbluehalo
Metroid-Squadron
Banned
But it did have to do with the lag.
Yes, KZ2 and 3 are great. But so are C2 and 3. If you want to keep dismissing them it's up to you, it won't change the achievement they are.
FTFY.
VFX_Veteran
Banned
I just loaded up Crysis 3 on my computer and replayed the opening level.. I can't believe on that level there isn't a single shadow-casting light.. wtf?? They hid that very very well with the SSAO.. but it's apparent it's already appearing dated compared to games like Metro.. hmmm.
Lord Error
Insane For Sony
Like that intro scene with Visari speech etc? Well that was some high end CG, so of course it's going to look great, for a number of reasons other than just simple HDR. Personally though I didn't really like the aesthetics of the overbright look of that CG. I don't know, I just think the HDR lighting really wasn't needed for the bleak and desolate atmosphere of KZ2 to look great. Everything there was overcast or otherwise gloomy, so HDR would practically look out of place, but it is definitely part of the reasons why KZ3 doesn't look so hot.
No, on one of their pages in that doc it said "time to say goodbye to point light" or something along those lines, followed by explanation that every light in the engine is now area light. Cube maps and screen space raytracing were for reflections.
It's interesting how in that Adam Sessler thread you were defending him and rapping that "Game Design > Graphics" shtick yet almost your entire recent post history is you downplaying every single PS4 related graphics thread and talking about how amazing Crytek games look while ignoring the fact that Crytek is the premier example of a Graphics > Game design company. C2 and 3 and Ryse all look like shitty tech demos designed by 1 guy in 20 minutes tops.
Metroid-Squadron
Banned
HDR helps with precision in lighting calculations. You don't need to add bloom or shiny surfaces to see its advantages. It would have helped a lot with the overblown whites for example.
Yeah, I'm not going to address more trolls.
VFX_Veteran
Banned
Area light in games isn't very impressive nowadays. Since their using a deferred renderer, they can make point light arrays that make shapes to simulate area lights. What they haven't told you is if these area lights cast dynamic shadows.. that's the real expense in lights which is why almost every game doesn't have it.
wheels within wheels
No, area lights aren't particularly impressive, but making ALL of them area lights is a step up. Not a paradigm shift, but it's notable.
JohnnySasaki86
Member
oh yea your right. I mixed them up.
Dark Octave
Banned
Man I'm excited for KZ. The wife and I just kept going over that video. Just a few more days.
G-Bus
Banned
Looks great. Not sure I can handle any more shooters though.
After 360/ps3 i'm kind of sick of the genre.
As entertaining as I have found the console warrior bullshit it's starting to get old. Sick of it fucking up threads I would generally just like to read without having to sift through.
After 360/ps3 i'm kind of sick of the genre.
As entertaining as I have found the console warrior bullshit it's starting to get old. Sick of it fucking up threads I would generally just like to read without having to sift through.
That is one hell of a LED!
Triggerhappytel
Member
In the tech trailer at 2:06 it shows crates floating in an indoor environment - hopefully this means we'll be going back to a low gravity or zero gravity areas, like near the end of KZ3. That was one of my favourite parts of the game.
I think the most impressive individual part the is the lighting, but the Material Expression at about the 4:00 is amazing too - they've rendered it so well you can tell what material it is just from the look and the textures.
I think the most impressive individual part the is the lighting, but the Material Expression at about the 4:00 is amazing too - they've rendered it so well you can tell what material it is just from the look and the textures.
viveks86
Member
Agreed. I was also extremely impressed by the rain. There is a very brief glimpse of it in the launch trailer where the rain hits the wet ground. It blew me away. Especially after all the complaints the past month, it made it all the more satisfying to see the improvement!
jimbobsmells
Member
The rain was the one disappointment for me when I tried the demo station at Eurogamer Expo, if they've improved that I'll be very happy! It looked like you were being attacked by minecraft-esque worms falling from the sky.
I really miss the old guns
I think it's because the water has lod, i saw the transition in a recent trailer. Look what happens when it gets even closer than the first gif i posted.
Edit: Sorry for going ot guys. I just wanted to respond to the other dude.
It's a cut-scene. At real gameplay there is no water physics at all ( a month ago )
This level in KZ3 is not bad too :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DrH9PwzlzbE
This post made me laugh for some reason. You're going to play through the next few levels inspecting every little bit aren't you?
The_Hitcher89
Member
I really miss the old guns
Wait, is the ISA Rifle not in it at all?
Nope! It's a graphics discussion, just like all the other Killzone threads through out the last couple of years! Never 'bout the Game or the Story, just the graphics.
Can we at talk about the Killzone series as a whole, particular scenes, memories and not mention any boring Crytek game? (Crysis 1 was good though, not sure about Ryse)
What fight in Killzone 2 do you remember the most? Did anyone feel like Visahri Palace was like a WW2 Berlin? I never forget that fight the first time I entered it. The atmosphere was bloody, cruel, dark, intense, the air full of smoke, fire and particles. The screams of burning ISA soldiers you couldn't save, masses of Helghan fanatics. It was hell.
GG always used to be particularly good with sound design. Will you play with 5.1/7.1? Good headphones?
Will you play KZ2 and 3 again before SF?
What fight in Killzone 2 do you remember the most? Did anyone feel like Visahri Palace was like a WW2 Berlin? I never forget that fight the first time I entered it. The atmosphere was bloody, cruel, dark, intense, the air full of smoke, fire and particles. The screams of burning ISA soldiers you couldn't save, masses of Helghan fanatics. It was hell.
GG always used to be particularly good with sound design. Will you play with 5.1/7.1? Good headphones?
Will you play KZ2 and 3 again before SF?
As someone who really loves Crysis 1, I understand EXACTLY how that feels.
SPACECADET
Member
Hey let's see what's going on in the Killzone thread... bet everyone is excited about the game coming out in two days!
*Walks in and sees people bitching about Ryse, Crysis 1/2, BF*
me too man, me too
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2gmiSPMHrWQ
OriginalThinking
Member
FFS people instead of dick waving about who is better at "teh graphics" can't we all just agree that Killzone SF is a seriously impressive looking launch title for the PS4?
For those who feel the need to bring up Crysis/Crytek (whatever side of the fence you happen to be on) can we just agree that they also make seriously good looking games and leave it at that?
Neither Crysis 3 or Ryse are available on the PS4. The moment they are then we can start with the comparisons between platforms.
If we need to start a discussion about the best looking console game/game of all time why don't we start a thread about that?
Sorry if I sound a little annoyed it just seems that every KZ thread recently ends up with either Battlefield/Ryse/Crysis shots fired and defense forces on both sides crapping up the entire thread.
For those who feel the need to bring up Crysis/Crytek (whatever side of the fence you happen to be on) can we just agree that they also make seriously good looking games and leave it at that?
Neither Crysis 3 or Ryse are available on the PS4. The moment they are then we can start with the comparisons between platforms.
If we need to start a discussion about the best looking console game/game of all time why don't we start a thread about that?
Sorry if I sound a little annoyed it just seems that every KZ thread recently ends up with either Battlefield/Ryse/Crysis shots fired and defense forces on both sides crapping up the entire thread.
Dictator93
Member
No offense... but there are tons of shadow casting lights in Crysis 3 levels. According to their own documentation something like 60-75% of all the lights in the game are shadow casters (which is huge for a deferred engine). If anything and you look at Metro Last Light, it reduced the amount of shadow casters and volumetric lights in comparison to the first game for performance reasons (guns no longer cast shadows when fired, some objects in the environment have artist tagged flags for shadow casting which are noticable when you turn on the flashlight, many volumetric lights are in fact geometry beams, etc...)
Area lighting is very impressive. Confusing point light arrays to simulate area lights is partially disingenuous, due to the fact that those have really horrible specular problems and do not cast shadows in an area light manner. Games like Killzone and Crysis 3 both do this (with Killzone probably doing it for many more lights than C3), having played lots of Metro... I amnot sure where anf if they are even using area lights to be honest. WHen the thread comes... you will have to find direct evidence with specular shape.
Thats a lie. Most lights are casting shadows.
Like for example every light on this shot through the whole hall is casting shadows
http://i3.minus.com/ibvuTgRf9TPCEN.png
---
Also Metro does not have Area Lights.
cheezcake
Member
KZ SF Demo Postmortem
Silde 32, "all our lights are area lights"
Only volumetric lighting though, no volumetric smoke effects
Can all those predicting diminishing returns eat some crow now? Please?
Why? It looks great yes. But you can make some amazing looking gifs of previous Killzone games too.