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LTTP: Sonic Adventure 2 - Live and Learn

RK128

Member
Well, this is a big one XD!

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I grew up with Adventure 2 and it was a major game for me growing up. When deciding to revisit the Sonic series, this was the one I was the most interested in re-playing, as my mind set on this changed a lot over the years since 2003 when originally played this.

I loved this game a lot when I was little and was the first video game I played that I wasn't frustrated by. Growing up, I had horrible frustration problems and I couldn't play any video games without getting upset. Didn't know how to jump in Yoshi's Story, snapped the Spyro 1 disk in half after getting frustrated during a level, got lost badly in Pokemon Gold......the list sadly goes on :(. I own many systems during this period of my life too (Dreamcast, GBC, PS1, PS2, ect) and the fact I couldn't enjoy them bothers me when looking back :'(.

But something pushed me into asking for a Nintendo GameCube and my mom had no issue; 100+ bucks latter and she came home with Sonic Mega Collection and the Purple Lunchbox. I loved playing the classic games but I asked for more Sonic games. My mom found Adventure 2 in a store and said 'Why not :)". She brought it home, I put the game in and......my love of gaming was restored and whatever caused my frustration, just...vanished.

It was magical when I played City Escape; everything clicked. Sonic felt great to control, it felt so fast, sliding down the city on that snowboard rocked and it was the most fun I ever had with a game. I enjoyed the rest of the game but that was the most vivid memory of my time with Adventure 2 growing up; City Escape. Such a good first impression.

So, its clear I have strong connection to this game XD! But after playing latter Sonic's (Heroes, Colors, Unleashed HD, Generations, ect) I got a more different view point on Adventure 2. The treasure hunting stages and mech levels were a blur for a reason; I didn't love them but I didn't hate them. The camera was not as good as it should be. The many actions mapped to the action button was dumb considering the Dreamcast and GC controllers had many face buttons.

I still enjoyed SA2 but I started seeing the issues many pointed out over the years.

Playing the game again on PS3 via HD 2012 Version when it launched and starting it up again, its more mixed for me. But I should start talking about the now XD!

Unlike SA1 where we got six characters to play as....well, we still got six with Adventure 2 but unlike SA1, its only three gameplay styles. Sonic, Knuckles and Gama's gameplay styles were expanded and grew more. I think this was a good move, considering those three (and Tails) were fun in SA1.

Sonic/Shadow is the Speed Stages, Knuckles/Rouge is Treasure Hunting, and Tails/Eggman is Shooting.

Sonic/Shadow is great like is should be, with tight level designs that are a very early version of what we saw with Unleashed; consistent focus on going forward with extra paths/short cuts made not to push exploration but to push for faster runs. I loved this in the past and still love this now :). Sonic feels great to control and it feels soo good getting a great run here. Rail Grinding and the multiple actions mapped to the action button are problems but you can work with them.

City_Escape_00.png


Tails/Eggman are fun and while I prefer how Gama controlled (more or less a Robot Sonic with a rapid fire gun with lock on ability), they are still fun. There levels are focused on combat and light platforming. For what it is, honesty could of been much worse. Controls are decent enough, level design is open enough for some fun platforming and the combat is done well.

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Knuckles/Rouge......they can die in a fire X(. I'm sorry but even with my three playthroughs (past, 2012 and now) I hate this gameplay and its because of ONE element; the Emerald Radar.

In SA1, you had a radar that picked up where each Emerald Shard was and it picked up all of them at once. However Sonic Team thought it was smart (no, it was fucking stupid) to have the Radar ONLY pick up one Shard at a time.....what does this mean? Even if a shard is right in front of your face, the game might not read it as its not the one you are SUPPOSED to pick up.

It crates artifical fustration and something I really hate. Its a shame too, as I love how Knuckles/Rouge control, the music for both sound great and the level designs are good (Meteor Herd feels great to explore with how open it is, same with Pumpkin Hill). Not to mention the outstanding Knuckles music but will comment on the OST soon. Overall, weakest part of the game just because of one stupid element that could of easily been fixed.

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Honestly baffled that the GC version nor the 2012 HD re-release didn't fix this major gameplay issue.

The story in SA2 is serious and dark, but unlike latter games (Shadow & 06), its done somewhat well. Everyone is mostly well voiced, some scenes are well done and I like the two new characters a lot. Shadow and Rouge are great additions to the Sonic Crew and its nice they are still around. Eggman had his most powerful time here, as he took stuff seriouslly. He blows up the moon, hold Amy at gunpoint, 'kills' Sonic, and does things finally with his stages; love Eggman here (best role next to Unleashed, Lost World and Colors).

Its not perfect though, with English dubbing over-acting at points and talking over peoples lines....just watch this and enjoy the joke :').
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Ixd2q7lzvI

But there are also major plot holes and some characters are badly acted (Tails comes to mind at some points). Overall not bad but not great either. But the fact Sonic did serious decently at all is surprising, considering future games falling on its face when doing this (though Unleashed/Colors had a great balence I think).

Music is something SA2 is infamous for and I have to list a lot of tracks :D.
Live and Learn
Biolizard (Shadow Fight)
City Escape
Metal Harbor
Radical Highway
Green Forest
Pyramid Cave
Final Rush
EGGMAN Theme
Sonic Theme
Knuckles Theme
Wild Canyon
Pumpkin Hill
Death Chamber
Meter Herd

Notice how so many of these tracks come from Sonic and Knuckles stages XD? These tracks are iconic; City Escape is a track we ALL know in some form or another. Pumpkin Hill is sooo good as a track and I love Knuckles tracks as a whole; they are so cheesy its amazing :').

SA2 is also famous for its Chao Garden and I will only briefly talk about this, as barely spent time with this :l.

Its a pet simulator in many respects; you raise specific stats, can generate names for them, buy them toys to play with and play mini games (Kirate and Racing). Its nice relaxing with the Chao's, as they are adorable :).

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But they aren't a major selling point for me, as I don't like Pet Simulators :l. But its a nice extra :).

Overall, I loved my time with SA2 growing up and while I easily see the games issues all over the place now (think Heroes, Colors, and Generations are better), I have a soft spot for the game.

The strong elements here, really are strong and make up for the lesser parts of the game. I recommend giving the game a shot if you have access to a GameCube (Battle Version) or the HD Rerelease that came out in 2012.

Oh! Forgot to talk about the amazing MP X(.

Okay, the MP mode for this is great; whole levels and originals stages are usable for the MP. Can play as all three styles with some new characters for each one (Amy, Metal Sonic, Chaos, Takal, ect) and can unlock costumes after getting enough emblems (things you get for beating stages, extra missions and more). Very fun and had great times playing this with my best friend and my sister (and she doesn't like video games that much XD).
 
Most of this games soundtrack is on my workout list.

Live and learn!

Yo this is knuckles, and we're at pumpkin hill. You ready?

This is by far my favorite Sonic game, having played them all
 
Ah, good times. I remember avidly following previews for the game, and how active the Sonic fanbase was at the time. I believe before Shadow's name was revealed, everyone called him Nezo the Hedgehog.

I agree that the Sonic/Shadow levels were the best, Tails/Eggmen levels were OK, and Knuckles/Rouge levels were the worst, primarily due to the changes to the emerald radar. The final stage was really difficult. For some reason, the Biolizard unnerved me enough that it took a while for me to actually go through with beating it.

At the time, I was quite invested with the story, and thought it was sad how Shadow died. It's still kind of a shame that they never followed up on the mystery of how Sonic was able to use Chaos Control. I remember often being deep in thought about what they'd do for Sonic Adventure 3 during class. EDIT: I previously mentioned the playground, but I remembered that I was thinking of what they'd do with Sonic Adventure 2 then, not 3.

The game had a lot of great music, of course. For character themes, I thought the Sonic Adventure equivalents were all better, except for the GOAT "E.G.G.M.A.N.".
 

SolVanderlyn

Thanos acquires the fully powered Infinity Gauntlet in The Avengers: Infinity War, but loses when all the superheroes team up together to stop him.
The final stage was really difficult. For some reason, the Biolizard unnerved me enough that it took a while for me to actually go through with beating it.
Glad I wasn't the only one. Biolizard creeped me out fiercely as a kid, especially the first battle against it. The space battle wasn't bad.

At the time, I was quite invested with the story, and thought it was sad how Shadow died. It's still kind of a shame that they never followed up on the mystery of how Sonic was able to use Chaos Control. I remember wandering the school playground deep in thought about what they'd do for Sonic Adventure 3.
Same. It doesn't hold up nearly as well today, but I really do appreciate the focus on story the series had back then. There was still an attempt to tie things back to the Genesis games and create an overarching narrative at the time, but the story was simple and lighthearted enough to fit into a Sonic game. Things went a bit too far into serious territory after SA2 with Shadow and 06, but the saturday morning cartoon approach is way too far in the opposite direction. Lost World's story was the worst thing I've seen in a long time. Alas.

P.S. You want to see people take Sonic too seriously (this series has the weirdest fanbase), check this out. Does Knuckles suffer from hallucinations?
 

10k

Banned
I put so many hours into this on my GameCube. Replaying it lots, doing the super sonic missions, raising chaos. The soundtrack is still easily recalled in my head lol.
 

RK128

Member
Glad I wasn't the only one. Biolizard creeped me out fiercely as a kid, especially the first battle against it. The space battle wasn't bad.

I think it was because of how sickly it looked; the metal tubes connected to his back, the very fleshy appearance.....it really hits home the image of an unfinished experiment or something badly incomplete.
 
I think it was because of how sickly it looked; the metal tubes connected to his back, the very fleshy appearance.....it really hits home the image of an unfinished experiment or something badly incomplete.

For me, it was the contrast of the color of the mouth and the rest of the body, the fact that if you went too fast, you'd run into its tail, and most of all, the music. EDIT: Oh, and watching a video of it now, the loud sound effects.
 
The lack of hub world was disappointing as someone who loved the original. But I did really enjoy this game on the GameCube (no idea why I never picked it up on Dreamcast). The opening to City Escape music was one of the most memorable.
 
The music for the Biolizard was very haunting. I despise a lot of the scenario and gameplay direction of SA2, but the moment The Gerald Robotnik recording began playing in the final episode, the game took a disturbingly dark turn I didn't expect as a kid.
 

JoBo4

Neo Member
game is great. remember getting it on dreamcast. probably have like 100 hours in it.


a few points:

-had no idea about the AIDS references in the Maria storyline.
-This game felt oddly dark to me as a kid. Even now, looking back at it. Shadow's life, the biolizard, the fucking moon being blown up. Really creepy
-Rouge/KNuckle's stage music is the best in the game. hands down
-This is Sonic in 3D at his finest.I dont like the Sonic Generations 3D movement where you're just running straight and boost. This game had it right. The movements for sonic and shadow were tight, and had a great sense of speed. The bounce attack was one of my favorite moves
-King Boom Boo was a shitty boss
-Chao breeding was fun
 

SolVanderlyn

Thanos acquires the fully powered Infinity Gauntlet in The Avengers: Infinity War, but loses when all the superheroes team up together to stop him.
Both Sonic Adventures had really uncharacteristically creepy final bosses, actually. Biolizard wins out for how unnatural it seemed, both in the story and how it looked, but Perfect Chaos was very menacing, too.


How this stuff ended up in a Sonic game is beyond me.
 

rardk64

Member
This is pretty much where I landed with this game on a recent play through. As a kid, I loved this game. The story felt really serious to me, I loved the light vs. dark storyline and
how they came together in the end
.

On my most recent playthrough, I noticed how I'd always found the Tails/Eggman levels tedious, but never had I really thought about it before. Their slow, heavy gameplay while attempting platforming just didn't feel great at all. As for Knuckles/Rouge, I'd always found their levels tedious. It's often like you have to just depend on the hints to get you to the treasure (even though you lost points for doing so).

In a Sonic Adventure 3, I'd like to see them keep going in a good direction with Sonic levels, take Tails out of his machine, and maybe make Knuckles' levels play more like a beat-em-up. Think Sonic Unleashed's werehog levels, but with Knuckles (except improved too).

Overall, I still like SA2, but I think they have a lot of room to improve it, so I wish they would.
 

HardRojo

Member
Yep, this is my favorite Sonic game. I spent a whole summer playing it with a friend on Dreamcast trying to get all the emblems. Eventually I got the PS3 version, and while I have fond memories of the game, its controls haven't aged well. It'd be nice to see a remake or both SA games.
 

RK128

Member
Glad to see people enjoying thread :D! I grew up with SA2, so I have a bias on the game sadly but despite its issues, I enjoy this game quite a bit :).

Some Eggman tracks I forgot to include in the OP are really good to, so here are a few links :D.

Lost Colony
Cosmic Wall
Iron Gate
 

RK128

Member
Both Sonic Adventures had really uncharacteristically creepy final bosses, actually. Biolizard wins out for how unnatural it seemed, both in the story and how it looked, but Perfect Chaos was very menacing, too.



How this stuff ended up in a Sonic game is beyond me.

Well, Sonic Team wanted there final bosses to be 'scary' and while SA1's Perfect Chaos didn't do that for me, Bilolizard did that for sure. Such a creepy design and story elements linking up to it really paint a picture of a experiment gone horribly wrong.
 

Sami+

Member
Tails and Knuckles legitimately kill the experience for me. Not a fan of the story either, and I genuinely think the controls and level design for Sonic's stages were superior in SA1.

I'll give SA2 Chao gardens tho, I loved that shit and still want it back.
 
I still enjoy SA2, but alot of it falls on Nostalgia. The Knuckles/Rouge levels are just so badly designed and the Tails/Eggman stages are so boring and hurt my ears. The Sonic/Shadow levels are great, but have their own flaws. I am glad there is no BIg the Cat or Amy bs shit though.
 
A classic. Despite the tedious nature of the Treasure Hunting stages and some occasional buggyness, it's definitely worth playing.
 
I don't particularly love doing the hunt for the Chaos Emeralds either, but I actually LOVED the Knuckles/Rouge levels just for how expansive they were and I liked how they controlled a lot.

The GameCube version had alternate objectives to do in those levels (probably in the Dreamcast version) and the "Hard" version of the treasure hunt didn't randomize the locations, so one you found them you could find them again instantly.

I rare member there being a Mario Galaxy type level where you rocket between planetoids with their own gravity. I remember that level being GIGANTIC.
 

RK128

Member
I don't particularly love doing the hunt for the Chaos Emeralds either, but I actually LOVED the Knuckles/Rouge levels just for how expansive they were and I liked how they controlled a lot.

The GameCube version had alternate objectives to do in those levels (probably in the Dreamcast version) and the "Hard" version of the treasure hunt didn't randomize the locations, so one you found them you could find them again instantly.

I rare member there being a Mario Galaxy type level where you rocket between planetoids with their own gravity. I remember that level being GIGANTIC.

Mad Space sure was something X(.........

But if the radar was fixed, I would of enjoyed those stages more then I do now. But as it, I agree with everything you are saying; the stages are mostly well designed, the controls for Knuckles/Rouge feel great and the music for there levels (Knuckles in particular) sounds awesome.
 
SA1 and SA2 get a lot of hate now days,but I still feel that they have the best 3d sonic gameplay out of all of the 3d games and nothing even comes close.
The controles are great and the level design rewards exploration and it never feels like it's on rails too much even if it's not perfect.

I would love to see them go back to this sonic/shadow gameplay with levels that had more multiple pathways.
 

Laputa_94

Member
I loved this game when I was younger. I have yet to revisit it however. Hopefully whenever I do it will still be enjoyable.
 

ChaosXVI

Member
I know this game is honestly pretty crummy...but I can't help but love it for everything that it means to me. This game was my LIFE when I was 11. And when they finally re-released it in 2012 I still had just as much fun with it as I did back then. Sonic and Shadow's levels were fantastic, Tails and Robotnik's were OK overall...and honestly Knuckles and Rouge's levels are just a pain that you have to suffer through but OK.

City Escape is legitimately awesome though, just a perfect representation of what I think of when I think of "modern" Sonic, despite it being nearly 15 years old (Holy Christ). And once that cheesy ass song is in your head you can't get it out. ever.
 

Luigi87

Member
Missed this one.

I adored Sonic Adventure 2 Battle as a kid. Played the hell out of it, yet never got all the emblems... (Only for Knuckles).

Being said my friend and I used to always play the multiplayer levels. We eventually made a ruling of No Amy though.

Amy was freaking OP man. Unlike Sonic/Shadow's Chaos Control (or "Time Stop" =P), Amy's "Just Wait a Minute!" would freeze the other player, but only their controls and not their momentum, so if they were about to do a loop you could kill them every time, lol
 
Loved this game when I was kid, but take off the rose colored glasses and man is it pretty horrible. The soundtrack however goes down as one of the best in history. Crush40 4 lyfe
 

mikestrife

Member
I couldn't get into this one, I loved the first Sonic Adventure for it's hub exploration, chao raising and 6 different characters (except for maybe trying to complete all the fishing challenges, lol.) Then 2 came along and no more open world and it just felt like a step back to me.
 
This game has the GOAT soundtrack and the Chao Garden is super fun. Worth wading through the nonsense for those two alone.

"This is Knuckles, and we at Pumpkin Hill. You ready?"
 
Beside that Pyramid level, all Sonic and Shadow levels are dope. Eggman/Tails level are inoffensive.

Knuckles/Rouge levels are garbage.

Music is great.

Overall, I really like Sonic Adventure 2 and it's 60fps goodness
 
E.G.G.M.A.N. is the best.

It should totally be used more as Eggman's theme song.


I love this game, even if it's kind of mediocre. It was my first GameCube game and I used to play it for hours, running through levels, and raising chao.

But wow, the HD re-release came out in 2012!? For some reason I thought it came out in 2014.

That port still feels so new to me lol
 
Playing through this on the PS3 currently.

Yep, Mad Space can kiss my fucking ass. Same for you Meteor Herd. Probably the most unpleasant 3D experiences I've ever had.

On the other hand, I'm actually investing time into the Chao sub-game this go around, something I never did in the Dreamcast days due to having a bootleg VMU with no screen. It's greatly increased the enjoyment level for me. It needs to return in some form in the series.
 

Zipzo

Banned
What Sonic Adventure 2 gave up in not having the open world exploration (which I was a huge fan of) was a systematic litany of stage challenges. Getting A ranks in every single mission in every single stage was disgustingly masochistic, and I took the actual time and did the practice to do it.

The leeway they give you on a lot of those challenges in terms of the ratio of your time, rings, and how that plays in to your score, you were simply not A-ranking a mission until you knew the level so well you could do it with one hand.

The reward? A 3D remake of green hill zone, original music and everything, the first of its kind, man oh MAN, that was a trip.

I won't lie though some parts of that A rank 100% challenge legitimately make you want to hit things, like trying to A rank any mission in the underground temple Sonic level. You're just running along and boom, fire or a little ghost pops out and messes up your time/kills your rings, and then you have to judge if you can save the run and still hope to cobble together an A rank...man those were some challenges that Sonic doesn't have much of today...

I was also a Chao madman, I had the super chaos (the chaos Chao, Angel and devil too), Max stats and everything. I remember leaving my GameCube on over night to pass the times.
 

Boogiepop

Member
This is definitely an interesting one. The Gamecube port is actually the game that got me back into Sonic after loving the Genesis games as a child (though Heroes knocked me back out of it, at least until I fortuitously decided to get back in with Colors, which was a very lucky choice). And yeah, overall it's not great. The treasure hunting parts are really bad, and the shooting parts aren't godawful but they certainly aren't much fun, either.

And yet those early Sonic/Shadow levels are legitimately great, which is why I think people cling to the game so much. And I say early because honestly, even the Sonic/Shadow levels kind of drop off, with the pyramid level being awkward with the keys and whatnot, and then anything set in space being pretty janky (despite seeming like the coolest thing ever at the time, Final Rush being a big old tangle of rails, especially with rails being kind of iffy in this game, doesn't make for a good level design, honestly).

I think ProJared actually came to a pretty interesting conclusion: the Chao Garden stuff captured a lot of our attention and time with the game (I know I played a ton of it), and to get stuff for that, you needed to replay levels. And naturally, we chose to replay the best levels, and that kind of further solidified them as being the core of what the game is, despite only being a small part of it. I don't think that absolutely applies to everyone, but thinking back on it, that may honestly have been the case for me.
 

Kyne

Member
everyone remembering it differently.

"You know me the fighting freak Knuckles and we're at Pumpkin Hill. You ready?"
 

Ogodei

Member
#2 GOAT for me, after Metroid Prime and before Smash Melee (at least back in the day when i obsessively ranked my favorite games). It still has a strong place in my heart.

It helps that it was my first Sonic game, so i just took the mech stages and treasure hunting to heart. I was an ace at the treasure hunting stages and had the easiest time there getting all A-rank. For the Gamecube version, me and a friend worked together swapping the same file, since i was good at the mech and treasure stages and he was good at the speed and car stages, also had the patience for raising chao, and we got all A-rank and all emblems between us for that sweet 3D Green Hill Zone.
 

RedSpring

Neo Member
I hope SEGA will revisit the Sonic and Shadow mechanics in this game. I find it way for fun than how Unleashed/Generation Sonic play.
 
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