• Hey Guest. Check out your NeoGAF Wrapped 2025 results here!

LTTP: Suikoden II

JaseMath

JaseMath

Member
For years I've heard nothing but praise for Suikoden II...people placing it amongst the top tier titles that gaming has to offer. Having never played the original Suikoden but needing something new to play, I decided to give it a go anyway.

I'm around 10 hours in and I don't love it. In fact, I find it to be only okay. Admittedly I had high expectations, something in the vein of Chrono Trigger or Final Fantasy VI, but it's just not happening and I'm thinking of stopping instead of forcing it.

The character development is sorely lacking (again–never played the original).
Recruiting is a pain in the ass.
The battle system is dull.
And really overall, the game is just boring.

Am I alone? Is there something wrong with me? In general, I love JRPGs and given the praise, I feel like I have to like Suikoden II, but I just don't. :(
 
I haven't played it yet, but I had the feeling I would experience something like this, which is part of the reason I haven't dug into it yet. I think probably one of the big problems you're running into is the hype (and subsequent pricing before being released on PSN) leads you to believe this must be the best game ever made, and well, maybe it isn't for you.

Just tell me you bought it on PSN or something and you didn't pay like $150 for an OG PSX copy.
 
JasonMCG said:
Am I alone? Is there something wrong with me? In general, I love JRPGs and given the praise, I feel like I have to like Suikoden II, but I just don't. :(
Click to expand...
I don't think so. I think the problem is with the people who set your expectations at "Chrono Trigger". Suikoden II is great, but it's not that great.
 
It's my favorite game ever, but I can see how the whole hype can affect your opinion of it.

10 hours it not much, did you get the HQ already? If you are past that part, and still not feeling it, I'd say to stop, play something else, and maybe give it another chance someday.
 
FrontalMonk said:
I haven't played it yet, but I had the feeling I would experience something like this, which is part of the reason I haven't dug into it yet. I think probably one of the big problems you're running into is the hype (and subsequent pricing before being released on PSN) leads you to believe this must be the best game ever made, and well, maybe it isn't for you.

Just tell me you bought it on PSN or something and you didn't pay like $150 for an OG PSX copy.
Click to expand...

I did; bought it during the last sale for like $5 or something.
 
My only suggestion would be to not go out of your way to try to recruit everyone on your first go, especially Clyde.

It's also a bit of a slow burn story-wise, but I think it picks up a lot in the second half.

Edit: Also yeah, the game gets a lot better once you have your headquarters and can watch it develop and fill with characters.
 
Tiu Neo said:
It's my favorite game ever, but I can see how the whole hype can affect your opinion of it.

10 hours it not much, did you get the HQ already? If you are past that part, and still not feeling it, I'd say to stop, play something else, and maybe give it another chance someday.
Click to expand...
Not yet, but 10 hours is a really long time to ask of a game to get it to click with the player.
 
antitrop said:
I don't think so. I think the problem is with the people who set your expectations at "Chrono Trigger". Suikoden II is great, but it's not that great.
Click to expand...

For me it's the opposite. Suikoden II is one of my favorite games ever and Chrono Trigger is good but not that great.
 
antitrop said:
I don't think so. I think the problem is with the people who set your expectations at "Chrono Trigger". Suikoden II is great, but it's not that great.
Click to expand...

Depends who you're asking. I would heartily recommend S2 over CT. Love both though.

Suikoden 2 has a lot of meat to it, the story, characters, side quests and music are what make the game for me. The battle system might seem flat ( it's an easy game, so a lot of the strategic choices offered later in the game aren't really needed ), but i love the dynamic presentation and the 6-member formations. I'm playing it right now on my Vita ( first revisit in about 10 years ) and i'm still absolutely loving it.

I'd suggest hanging in there just a little bit more OP. Let the field battles mature some more, and see if the base building angle is something you enjoy.
 
JasonMCG said:
Not yet, but 10 hours is a really long time to ask of a game to get it to click with the player.
Click to expand...

I love it. Everything you didn't like, I did. The combat gets fun with Unite attacks and Rune Combos. The big fight in the middle is very memorable. But hey if you don't like it you don't like it, that's fine. I didn't like Chrono Trigger that much so, go figure.

Playing the original is not required but recommended. Knowing the backstory of Viktor and Flik helps you understand them better.
 
It's my favorite game as well. I would suggest continue on til you get the HQ. Character development for main character doesn't exist at all. It really is about the other characters and the story
 
5taquitos said:
My only suggestion would be to not go out of your way to try to recruit everyone on your first go, especially Clyde.
Click to expand...

Clyde's an easy recruit; it's his quest that's a pain in the aaaaaaaaassssssss.

Also yes, Suikoden 2 is a great game but after playing it again like...a month ago it has some pretty big flaws that I seemed to gloss over in my memory. I would say that Suikoden 3 and 5 are either on par or superior in a lot of ways to 2. Not like those two games don't have their own problems but I found there to be way more development of incidental and non-super plot relevant characters, with skits and interactions and the like. When you pick up a character in 2, if they're not relevant to the plot they may as well not exist as a character sometimes.

When Suikoden 2 is great it's fucking excellent but when it's bad it drags real bad.
 
The main character is more or less a player analog. CT definitely set the wrong expectations because suikoden 2 has significantly slower pacing by comparison. You take in the overall experience and see how that goes, it might be a bit of a slog, but don't worry, it's worth it.
 
OniBarubary said:
Clyde's an easy recruit; it's his quest that's a pain in the aaaaaaaaassssssss.
Click to expand...

You're right, it's the girl he's after that's a PITA to recruit.

Also, Suikoden 2 had my original waifu:

latest


Eilie da best
 
JasonMCG said:
Not yet, but 10 hours is a really long time to ask of a game to get it to click with the player.
Click to expand...

True. If it's not clicking, don't force it. No game can please everyone.

To me it clicked a lot earlier than 10 hours, but the game got really, really good after I got the HQ. But if you really think it's not worth your time, drop it.
 
I'm not sure how far you in are 10h in, but the game really picked up steam for me after the events in Muse. For some of my friends, it clicked a little earlier, and I enjoyed it out of the gate, but for most people I know that played, that's where things started to get really interesting for them.

I found the battle system enjoyable mostly for its speed and the animations, but I didn't find it to be anything magical (mind you I didn't find Chrono Trigger or FFVI to be "amazing" combat systems either).

Edit: As others note, it can definitely drag in places.
 
JasonMCG said:
Not yet, but 10 hours is a really long time to ask of a game to get it to click with the player.
Click to expand...

Having not played the first one, I think you'll miss out on a lot of fun stuff that is happening in the beginning. Seeing those characters from the first game again and finding out what they did is what keeps you interested for the first several hours. So not having that context makes the early parts pretty boring.

Later on, the old characters just become part of your crew and the story of game doesn't depend on knowing anything that happened before. The action really picks up in the second half as well once your army is doing army stuff.

The game isn't really much like Chrono Trigger, it has a grander scope than that game did. It is more about Nations and peoples, instead of a few heroes (despite totally having a few heroes).
 
Played this for the first time last year and loved every second of it, took me 35 hours to beat.

I didn't get all 108 stars of destiny though (I hate using guides and prefer going into games blind)
 
Suikoden II combined a great story, memorable characters, beautiful aesthetics, and excellent gameplay mechanics to make one of the best jrpgs of all time. That said, if the game is not clicking for you then by all means stop playing it and play one of the many other great jrpgs from that era.
 
I was quite underwhelmed with this game TBH. I played Suikoden 1 before so I could appreciate all the improvements they made, but the whole package just felt mediocre in my opinion.

The music was serviceable and the story had some highlights but I absolutely hated the resolution offered in the "good" ending. The story reminded me of FF Tactic's in a way (main character's friendships), but it never reached the depths I wanted it to.

The battle system was pretty well-paced, but I never felt like my characters were super powerful. The variety of characters was appreciated, but most were wasted potential. I'm in general not a fan of RPGs with tons of playable party members, so I guess my bias may be unfair.

This is just another game where the rose tinted glasses of other player's nostalgia hyped the experience too much before I played it. It's not a bad game, but I don't think it belongs on the same shelf as some of the best classical RPGs like some people seem to claim. If I could choose, I'd have spent my 50+ hours of limited gaming time elsewhere.
 
Anyway, can someone suggest me a good, complete guide for Suikoden 1?
Something like "go here, take this, talk with this character" etc, without many comments.
I was following a guide the first time I tried the game but it was like reading a novel.
 
crashnburn said:
The music was serviceable
Click to expand...

Honestly I thought the music was forgettable except for Luca's fight theme which fight him fucking perfectly because it's this atonal, arhythmic song that sounds like someone was slamming their hands on a piano to try to force music out of it. It was incredibly fitting and added a lot of intimidation to his aura.

Ludens said:
Anyway, can someone suggest me a good, complete guide for Suikoden 1?
Something like "go here, take this, talk with this character" etc, without many comments.
I was following a guide the first time I tried the game but it was like reading a novel.
Click to expand...

Baaaaaa ha ha ha ha I know the exact guide you're talking about cause it's the one I used.
 
Im with you OP. I thought it was "good" but not "ZOMG" GOAT!

The middle boss and the final boss (final final) was really good.
 
The combat won't get better. It's extremely basic without many interesting wrinkles.

The heart of the Suikoden series is getting your castle and recruiting enjoyable characters and watching them interact with each other. The political manuevering also tends to be pretty good. If none of that appeals to you, then yeah you are better off stopping.

crashnburn said:
The music was serviceable and the story had some highlights but I absolutely hated the resolution offered in the "good" ending. The story reminded me of FF Tactic's in a way (main character's friendships), but it never reached the depths I wanted it to.
Click to expand...

I've never even see the good ending, because I was so satisfied by the "bad" ending that I never sought it out. The entire game has a poignant tone that the good ending does not match. The bad ending is the perfect conclusion.
 
crashnburn said:
I was quite underwhelmed with this game TBH. I played Suikoden 1 before so I could appreciate all the improvements they made, but the whole package just felt mediocre in my opinion.

The music was serviceable and the story had some highlights but I absolutely hated the resolution offered in the "good" ending. The story reminded me of FF Tactic's in a way (main character's friendships), but it never reached the depths I wanted it to.

The battle system was pretty well-paced, but I never felt like my characters were super powerful. The variety of characters was appreciated, but most were wasted potential. I'm in general not a fan of RPGs with tons of playable party members, so I guess my bias may be unfair.

This is just another game where the rose tinted glasses of other player's nostalgia hyped the experience too much before I played it. It's not a bad game, but I don't think it belongs on the same shelf as some of the best classical RPGs like some people seem to claim. If I could choose, I'd have spent my 50+ hours of limited gaming time elsewhere.
Click to expand...

I totally agree. It's a big reason Chrono Cross fails in what otherwise is a stellar game. I'll gladly take a handful of fleshed out characters versus the 100+ disposable characters something like Suikoden 2 has.
 
Just out of interest where are you in the game?

It's a slow start but it gets far better very quickly. As it was already stated it doesn't start to pick up until after the events at Muse and you head to South Window.

Suikoden V you need about 20 hours before things get interesting.


Suikoden 2 is my favourite game of all time, only Okami comes close to matching it. I did play FFVI and Chrono Trigger but they were meh by comparison.
 
JasonMCG said:
Not yet, but 10 hours is a really long time to ask of a game to get it to click with the player.
Click to expand...

I think for modern games this is mostly true, but I tend to find old school RPG's can easily take that long before it clicks with you. Most of the major RPG's that come to mind that I list among my favorites all took 10-15 hours to really kick into gear.

As my avatar would suggest, Suikoden II is one of my favorite games ever, easily in my top 5. I found recruitment and the subsequent upgrades to the HQ to be my first foray into sidequests, and I loved every second of it. I managed to get all 108 stars on my first playthrough (and this is before internet guides even existed). It absorbed me like no other game before it. And in all honesty, I haven't played a game since that truly captures that recruitment mechanic for me. From what I've read, Cosmic Star Heroine might scratch that itch.
 
Lucreto said:
Just out of interest where are you in the game?

It's a slow start but it gets far better very quickly. As it was already stated it doesn't start to pick up until after the events at Muse and you head to South Window.

Suikoden V you need about 20 hours before things get interesting.


Suikoden 2 is my favourite game of all time, only Okami comes close to matching it. I did play FFVI and Chrono Trigger but they were meh by comparison.
Click to expand...

I just completed the 3rd "major" battle, the one
in Muse City.
 
Ralemont said:
The combat won't get better. It's extremely basic without many interesting wrinkles.

The heart of the Suikoden series is getting your castle and recruiting enjoyable characters and watching them interact with each other. The political manuevering also tends to be pretty good. If none of that appeals to you, then yeah you are better off stopping.
Click to expand...

I don't think that the battle system in Suikoden II is any simpler than Chrono Trigger or Final Fantasy VI. I'd understand if we were comparing it to more modern games, but it's basically a 16-bit style JRPG with better production values.
 
5taquitos said:
I could have sworn there's a scene towards the end that implies
that Eilie spends the night in Riou's room
, but it's been a while since I've played it.
Click to expand...

I think, depending on your relationship with Nanami
it's either her or Nanami who spends the night with you
. Like you said though, I can't remember much about it.

Lucreto said:
Suikoden V you need about 20 hours before things get interesting.
Click to expand...

I love Suikoden V, tied for my fave Suikoden game, but this is so painfully true. It has the worst paced LONGEST opening to a game I've ever played. I think you could beat Suikoden I by the time you get a fucking castle.
 
JasonMCG said:
I totally agree. It's a big reason Chrono Cross fails in what otherwise is a stellar game. I'll gladly take a handful of fleshed out characters versus the 100+ disposable characters something like Suikoden 2 has.
Click to expand...

Both Cross and Suikoden 2 have a handful of fleshed out characters. It's better to think of everyone else outside the main group as side quests.
 
JasonMCG said:
The character development is sorely lacking
Click to expand...

What the fuuuuuuck. Some of the main story characters are very well developed. Better than in 99% of JRPGs. Don't let the "filler" characters fool you. Though I guess I can see the development is not that obvious from the first 10 hours.

You really should be hooked by now but I guess you could try playing till you get the castle (not that long IIRC) and if you still don't like it then the game is just not for you I guess.

Personally I think Suikoden 2 is top 5 JRPGs ever made, even beating out Chrono Trigger and most Final Fantasy games (only 6, 7 and 12 are around the same level imo).
 
The game heavily focuses on the story of the main hero, Joey, and Nanami.

The 3 of them will advance to not be the same people you started out with. Night and day.

The story is actually well paced, but it's long. So in the start of it you think nothing is happening, or enough is, and have only scratched the surface. The amount of over the top well executed events that will take place keep piling on.

It's hard to not gush over this game without doing spoilers.

Yes it's a lot to ask of a player to dive in 10+ hours before it "clicks", but this one delivers in spades once you complete it. I wouldn't go for the "true ending" you first go around. Just youtube that ish later, and enjoy the game without going out of your way to find ALL 108 stars of destiny.

The combat gets better too. Bosses become tougher. Team management has to be well put together. Runes being used.

Soundtrack is out of this world. You should have no qualms there.

The game is damn big. The world, the side content, etc. It's a lot to undertake if you aren't in the mood for a big old 50+ hour JRPG.

The game will advance in ways you didn't think are possible. It throws a LOT of cliches found in games and general media writing out the window.

Don't give up on this. You'll thank GAF Hivemind once you complete it.
 
I'm replaying the game, and it has solidified its place in my top 5 (or maybe even top 3).

I think the greatest thing is that it's SO DAMN POLISHED. There's seriously more pixel animation in this than any other game short of a fighting game. Like, every little scene has specific animation. Even the random NPC:s have animation to turn to face you while they sit at a table. This and the fantastic environments makes everything feel so alive. I'd somewhat understand if someone felt Suiko 1 was underwhelming - I just finished it and it definitely feels basic now.

The music is also fantastic, I don't know where you're coming from. "Orrizonte", "La Passione Commuove la Storia", "Theme of a Moonlit Night", "Beautiful Morning", and specific remixes throughout. It's crazy.

And at ten hours in, is there really nothing that has gripped you in terms of events?
Pohl? Pilika? Alex's quest? Jowy being thrown out of his home? The "die pig!" thing?

There's tons of depth to the battle system, with unites, multiple runes, rune slots for weapons, counter attacks, formation considerations etc etc. Few turn based games come close. Although it's rarely so hard that you need it.

The only real downside I can think of currently is that it's usually far to go to any given place, and it's sometimes hard to tell how to advance the story.
 
Quite frankly, you're not far enough into the game to make a good judgement. The pieces are still being laid in place. The great things that people say about the game don't materialise until later in it. So keep at it.

And it's Clive, guys. Not Clyde.
 
antitrop said:
I don't think so. I think the problem is with the people who set your expectations at "Chrono Trigger". Suikoden II is great, but it's not that great.
Click to expand...

Opinions, opinions. IMO Suikoden II is way greater.

I get your point though, and this is something OP should be aware of, by general consensus, CT is just in an untouchable tier.

Suikoden II is slower-paced.

Suikoden II is greatly enhanced by having played and finished Suikoden I since there are a lot of references and returning characters.

Suikoden II is a political drama with fantasy elements, a lot of people are not into the politics part.

And in the end, don't feel bad for not liking something a lot of people praise. I don't think you're doing something wrong OP, it's just not your cup of tea.
 
Mcdohl said:
Opinions, opinions. IMO Suikoden II is way greater.

I get your point though, and this is something OP should be aware of, by general consensus, CT is just in an untouchable tier.

Suikoden II is slower-paced.

Suikoden II is greatly enhanced by having played and finished Suikoden I since there are a lot of references and returning characters.

Suikoden II is a political drama with fantasy elements, a lot of people are not into the politics part.

And in the end, don't feel bad for not liking something a lot of people praise. I don't think you're doing something wrong OP, it's just not your cup of tea.
Click to expand...

Good to see you McDohl
 
I think S2's biggest fault is the english translation is GARBAGE. The first game's is serviceable, but 2 is nothing but exclamation points, ellipses, weird phrasing, and a few untranslated text boxes.

It's biggest strength is the story and the villain, who is an unrepentant psychopath, but an interesting one. Plus the Headquarters and army building, which I love.

Besides that, it's one of my favorite games of all time, from one of my favorite series of all time. I am one of those nuts that spent like 90 bucks on a used copy, just so I could fill that out. The only game I don't have is the DS one, not counting the JP only Suikogaidens. Hell, I even like the 4th game a lot even though it is very clearly the worst.

It's a shame Konami will never make a Suikoden 6. We haven't gotten a game set in Harmonia yet.

But I think if you're not into the second game, give the third a try. It's cheap on PSN, has some great characters, plus one of the main characters has a griffon named Fubar as his best friend/mount.
 
It sucks that it takes so long, comparatively, but Suikoden 1 and 2 shouldn't be judged before you get the HQ. That to me is the hook in those games.

(I mean you can judge them and deem them boring, but to qualify for a good college try at the game it includes a bit into the HQ.)
 
benny_a said:
It sucks that it takes so long, comparatively, but Suikoden 1 and 2 shouldn't be judged before you get the HQ. That to me is the hook in those games.

(I mean you can judge them and deem them boring, but to qualify for a good college try at the game it includes a bit into the HQ.)
Click to expand...

That's when the game opens up.
 
I really like Suikoden 2, but the NA version at least always seems to get a big pass for having a really shitty localization. I think the game's reputation has been inflated by its rarity (not the case anymore) and that it was one of the last old-school 2D console JRPGs.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

LTTP: Pokemon Channel
LTTP 
6
56
uncreativename replied
LTTP: Gothic
LTTP 
21
408
Sentenza replied
LTTP: Titan Quest
LTTP 
37
681
TintoConCasera replied
That Descent II Soundtrack....
8
277
Darkmakaimura replied
  • Poll
LTTP: Doom: The Dark Ages
Opinion LTTP 
43
462
DragonNCM replied
Top Bottom