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LTTP || Zelda: Skyward Sword || and my vacation from the evil HD consoles [SPOILERS]

The Boat

Member
Oh, I'm holding it. There's no other reason they wouldn't have spec'd the Wii U to automatically upscale Wii games the same way the 360 and PS3 do with last gen games. Wii HD editions incoming.

We already know Wii U upscales Wii games and we also know why it doesn't uprender or add any filters.
Hint: it's for technical reasons.

I have said this a million times... there are a lot of great things in this game. The hand holding is absolutely out of control though. There is not one instance were the game actually lets you discover anything (played to about the third dungeon... after the ship part). I simply cannot play a game were the game constant feels the needs to remind me of my goal, mention obvious clues and just take control away just when I'm starting to have fun.

I recall someone posting their ideas for a next gen Zelda game... something that right after a brief introduction just trust you into the world without holding your hand from that point on (sounded a bit like dark Souls). That's what this series needs. Not more of this bull shit.

This is, as usual, a gigantic exaggeration. Hand holding is the biggest problem the game has in my opinion, but inside the dungeons they very, very, very rarely they tell you anything. Especially as you progress.
It's outside the dungeons that they point out things, ridiculously obvious things, but they point them out nonetheless, probably in the hopes that they were guiding unexperienced players to do the basic things so that they could do them by themselves when the harder puzzles come in the dungeons.
 

Muffdraul

Member
The Wii play control titles numbered 7, one of which never made it over here, two of which the controls were already "done" (Metroid prime 3 -> 1 & 2, NPC Pikmin -> NPC Pikmin 2), and then the horribly botched DKJB and Mario Power Tennis.

Stuff like Mario 64 DS, Starfox 64 3DS, OoT 3DS were quick updates to decade old games just to have something for a new hardware launch. If something like this was happening for Wii U, we would know about it already.

It's entirely possible that they'll do some HD re-releases, but you are completely deluded to count it as inevitable. They're just as likely to release Wii isos on the VC, or nothing at all.

Heh. All you're doing is setting me up for an even sweeter victory when it eventually happens and I get to rub your face deep in it. See you then, friendo.

We already know Wii U upscales Wii games and we also know why it doesn't uprender or add any filters.
Hint: it's for technical reasons.

Whatever created the situation, I don't think it's all that outlandish that they would take advantage of it by doing a few reissues of key games, which they've already established as standard practice.
 

leroidys

Member
Heh. All you're doing is setting me up for an even sweeter victory when it eventually happens and I get to rub your face deep in it. See you then, friendo.



Whatever created the situation, I don't think it's all that outlandish that they would take advantage of it by doing a few reissues of key games, which they've already established as standard practice.

You'll not get to rub my face in anything - I NEVER said it won't happen, but it if it does it sure as hell won't be because the Wii mode on the Wii U is shit. I was just trying to temper your expectations and suggest that you enjoy the game now. Sorry I bothered.
 

Muffdraul

Member
You'll not get to rub my face in anything - I NEVER said it won't happen, but it if it does it sure as hell won't be because the Wii mode on the Wii U is shit. I was just trying to temper your expectations and suggest that you enjoy the game now. Sorry I bothered.

Maybe next time you decide to be a Good Samaritan for someone, consider not being a prick about it e.g. call them "deluded".
 
It took me like a full month to finish. I was around 50-60 hours (can't remember now). I haven't 100%ed it, missing 1 or 2 pieces of heart and that shield you get for beating the boss rush (I suck badly at boss rushes, I couldn't even finish the OoT 3D one). But it would probably be futile to go back now, might as well play Hero mode in a few years, but the fact that it's so goddamn lenghty will put me off it.
 

JoeFu

Banned
I forgot its been a year since this game came out. I remember spending my whole Thanksgiving break plowing through the game. My favorite Zelda, and I really hope the motion controls are used for the next one. I still don't get the hate for it.
 

neoemonk

Member
The only Zelda I've never finished.

Biggest disappointment of last year

I'm not trying to draw attention to this poster in particular, but I've been reading a lot of Zelda threads lately as I just finished Twilight Princess for the first time, and I swear I read the exact same thing from someone about TP.
 

Brandon F

Well congratulations! You got yourself caught!
Been playing on and off for the past few months. Nearing the end of the game now with only a single dungeon left and whatever sidequests still remain I wish to pursue.

I downloaded a completed save before starting so I can experience 'Hero' mode on my first playthrough, which actually can be a stiff challenge assuming you never use the Heart medal(which allows heart pickups from enemies and plants again). Two issues in Hero mode is that dependency on health potions is crucial at certain moments(forcing some pacing issues to backtrack to town to replenish), but in most cases you needn't bother as checkpoints are constant and death is often more advantageous as a quick way to replenish life. All in all Hero mode feels less like a challenge and instead ends up more tedious. Not well thought out. On the flipside, each blow you sustain can be deadly making sword duels a lot more engaging than I would imagine on Normal mode..at least until you actually land a hit(where it all falls apart).

It's a toss-up on whether this or TP is my least favorite console Zelda. TP had pretty solid dungeons, but I disliked practically everything else surrounding them. SS is a bit more appreciable in its world design, but not by much. The 1:1 sword stuff is poorly executed given that only the first blow takes advantage of the tech, while the bulk of combat becomes a waggle-spam fest while the enemy is stunned. Just terrible. I would have preferred a more consistent need to use refined swings, with stunned hits allowing free criticals possibly, not free reign to unload waggle blows.

The forced padding continually broke my motivation. I have not gotten a real good sense that the world evokes a feeling of exploration or adventure. The constant "gating" via puzzles and gadget-use in the pre-dungeon sections did not come across as an exciting new or interesting 'leap forward' for the franchise as marketed.

My motivation at this point to finish is mostly to see how the plot does wrap up. I do find the cast of characters far more endearing and interesting than in TP, a real step-up. Still, I am not impressed by this outing at all. It's a real bummer as I really do want Zelda to inspire and excite me again.
 

Mike M

Nick N
Man, I have such mixed feelings about Skyward Sword. Seems like for every attempt that was made to freshen up the series, there was a step back from Nintendo's steadfast refusal to adopt standard gaming mechanics and features.

The addition of the stamina meter, the crafting, the actual utility of currency, the item load management, that was all great. The inability to rotate the camera freely, the inability to speed up or skip text, randomly denying access to options (Like turning off the giant Wii remote taking up the right quarter if the screen!) until arbitrary points in the game, the ridiculously long and infantilizing tutorial, and the use of M+ for *pointer controls* were all awful. Really, really awful.

I love Zelda, I like that they took some new directions on the formula, but they need to stop refusing to implement any gaming feature they personally did not invent.
 

Currygan

at last, for christ's sake
I'm not trying to draw attention to this poster in particular, but I've been reading a lot of Zelda threads lately as I just finished Twilight Princess for the first time, and I swear I read the exact same thing from someone about TP.

there's always someone who says this very same thing about a Zelda game

you just need to not listen to them. There. are. no. bad. Zelda. games. besides the CDI ones
 

Hazanko

Banned
I quit this game at a certain point, can't remember where but I know I never did a lake dungeon. I might try getting past that bit, since people are saying it gets better.
 

Hero

Member
Might go through this game again. The biggest gripe I had was the hand-holding (future Zelda's need to have the professional mode disable the obvious hinting) and the speed of text and the (YOU FOUND A TUMBLEWEED FOR THE 50TH TIME) shenanigans you have to go through each time you boot the game up.

I said this in another thread recently but if Nintendo was smart (which they aren't all the time) they would 100% do HD releases of GCN and Wii games. I mean if Sony and other third parties can make money off of crap like Prince of Persia, Devil May Cry, Silent Hill, etc then it's a no brainer. The biggest disappointment would be if they just relegated Gamecube games to Virtual Console releases, which is probably likely.
 

sphinx

the piano man
I was on time to the party with this game, played over Dec/Jan 2012 and somehow only the good stuff remains in my memories.

I tend to forget that the first 1 or 2 temples are pretty poor, that every now and then there is some random annyoing filler and some pointless repeated boss battles.

yet, It feels like it's been growing on me all these months to the point where I am seriously considering a 2nd playthrough, It feels like I want to be in that world again.

Interesting.
 
Nice to see some Skyward Sword love, maybe I'm paying too much mind to the Internet being the Internet but it felt like it had become the common thought that Skyward Sword was bad/a big disappointment. I loved the game to pieces and prefer it over Wind Waker and Twilight Princess, it may even be my favourite 3D Zelda period (I need to revisit Majora's Mask one of these days). I was incredibly impressed with the implementation of the motion controls, too - the most fun I've eve had with motion.
 

leroidys

Member
I'm not trying to draw attention to this poster in particular, but I've been reading a lot of Zelda threads lately as I just finished Twilight Princess for the first time, and I swear I read the exact same thing from someone about TP.

OMG Zelda cycle am confirmed. Good sleuthing.
 

MYE

Member
I'm not trying to draw attention to this poster in particular, but I've been reading a lot of Zelda threads lately as I just finished Twilight Princess for the first time, and I swear I read the exact same thing from someone about TP.

And some people said the same thing about WW when it came out. Others about MM.

I was on time to the party with this game, played over Dec/Jan 2012 and somehow only the good stuff remains in my memories.

I tend to forget that the first 1 or 2 temples are pretty poor, that every now and then there is some random annyoing filler and some pointless repeated boss battles.

yet, It feels like it's been growing on me all these months to the point where I am seriously considering a 2nd playthrough, It feels like I want to be in that world again.

Interesting.

I know what you mean. The game leaves this long-lasting feeling of going through an epic, magical fairy-tale/adventure.
At least to me it did :p
 
Just finished this, had a great time! But... the framerate in the credits - wtf? I thought they'd just do it as video, but clearly the text was scrolling smoothly and the backgrounds were choppy as hell. Luckily the Zelda bits in the credits were smooth, that was a nice touch.

Also, I thought this was gonna be fully orchestrated? There was plenty of artificial performance... sounded like most of it was done with synths. It was particularly obvious when the orchestral credits rolled in - sooo much better than the rest of the game. A bit disappointing that.
 
Well, I just finished the game last night, what an experience. So Wind Waker was the first game my wife ever really played properly (and beat), so we played SS through together. There is something special about sharing Zelda games with a loved one, something about figuring out the dungeons and finding secrets together. Anyway onto my overall thoughts.

So I played it on Dolphin, and to be honest, I'm not sure how people play it on their Wii? The game is absolutely stunning in places, but it's all lost when you play it on a HDTV using the Wii. I'm not sure if it was because I was playing on Dolphin but I found I had to recalibrate the Wiimote every 20min as it would start to act up, so that was one small annoyance.

I love the connection to the other Zelda games with Fi as the essence of the master sword and especially Demise's curse which foreshadows Link's attachment to Ganon.

All in all I put Skyward Sword well above TP, and it's a worthy addition to the franchise.
 

JoeFu

Banned
I can't wait for the next Zelda to come out so Skyward Sword becomes the best one.

I let my friend borrow the game and I think he's liking it, I hope he finishes soon though as I want to replay the game.
 
I stopped playing this game last February, I got to the entrance of the Ancient Cistern dungeon and lost interest and ended up selling it....I just found a copy on clearance for $26.99, so I'm considering giving it another go...if I was bored by the filler and unimpressed by the dungeons up to that point, is there a point to trying to finish it? I guess I'm curious if the back half of the game is more interesting than the first half was.
 

Vibed

Member
I stopped playing this game last February, I got to the entrance of the Ancient Cistern dungeon and lost interest and ended up selling it....I just found a copy on clearance for $26.99, so I'm considering giving it another go...if I was bored by the filler and unimpressed by the dungeons up to that point, is there a point to trying to finish it? I guess I'm curious if the back half of the game is more interesting than the first half was.

Exactly where you stopped was where the game gets good!
 

Chunky

Member
I stopped playing this game last February, I got to the entrance of the Ancient Cistern dungeon and lost interest and ended up selling it....I just found a copy on clearance for $26.99, so I'm considering giving it another go...if I was bored by the filler and unimpressed by the dungeons up to that point, is there a point to trying to finish it? I guess I'm curious if the back half of the game is more interesting than the first half was.
Ancient Cistern is my favourite Zeldungeon.
It's gorgeous, feels more like a natural temple than a straight-up dungeon and is swimming in Buddhist imagery. Nice challenging puzzles as well.
If you don't like it after that, I'd probably give up.
 

Brofield

Member
The slow text is what pissed me off more than anything, because otherwise I would have tolerated Fi a lot more.

No problems with controls.

And I congratulate this Zelda game to get me to shed four manly tears over the course of how emotionally wrenching it was for me. Likely because of how Zelda is more the childhood friend than the princess. Really wish there was some sort of epilogue following...the demise of Demise (I'm so sorry for that pun), really would have liked to see how the monarchy began and how Hyrule was named.

And the standard Link/Zelda
/Groose
, the later years, that sort of stuff.
 

dave_d

Member
I never had to recalibrate my Wiimote while playing, and I would play for a few hours at a time.

Here's a pair of questions I've been wondering about.(Since I'm one of those that had to recalibrate fairly often.) So I figure I could just ask everybody. Did you have to calibrate a lot? Second, when you were playing in what compass direction in real life were you facing?
 

Kai Dracon

Writing a dinosaur space opera symphony
The slow text is what pissed me off more than anything, because otherwise I would have tolerated Fi a lot more.

No problems with controls.

And I congratulate this Zelda game to get me to shed four manly tears over the course of how emotionally wrenching it was for me. Likely because of how Zelda is more the childhood friend than the princess. Really wish there was some sort of epilogue following...the demise of Demise (I'm so sorry for that pun), really would have liked to see how the monarchy began and how Hyrule was named.

And the standard Link/Zelda
/Groose
, the later years, that sort of stuff.

The story of Skyward Sword was one of my favorite parts of the game, and funny enough, is actually something that was pointed out most often by professional critics as evolving Zelda to a better tier of storytelling.

And it really does. The story, largely, is about how the "legend" of Zelda was first established. And a nice bit of dialog from Fi (for a change) was about how oral history is a most unreliable form of transmitting data across time. In other words: the fact that every Zelda game doesn't line up perfectly is because a legend is just that: an imperfect retelling of whatever real events inspired the legend.

And frankly, because of that Skyward Sword caused some feels and chills at certain points. As it is, effectively, the only "objective" Legend of Zelda. The truth behind the legend, and truth behind the point of origin. Everything else becomes hearsay, distorted tales from later generations. In a sense it is a most clever way to retcon all of the Zelda franchise's history.

Here's a pair of questions I've been wondering about.(Since I'm one of those that had to recalibrate fairly often.) So I figure I could just ask everybody. Did you have to calibrate a lot? Second, when you were playing in what compass direction in real life were you facing?

I didn't have to recalibrate a lot. But, I also sat so that the wiimote was in view of the sensor bar most of the time. There seems to be something of a myth surrounding the game - that it uses gyro calibration only, doesn't use the sensor bar, etc, therefore doesn't work well. Apparently that's not true; the wiimote does ping the sensor bar to check its position in the absolute and auto-calibrates every so often. But a lot of people appeared to have played the game by sitting close to the TV, holding the wiimote down and out of view of the sensor bar, etc.

My compass direction for the Wii/TV in the room is almost straight south. Not sure if that matters, I didn't think Motion+ had a magnetic sensor in it, like PS Move does.

I am sorry if you had a lot of trouble with calibration. It's one of the more divisive issues with the game, since a lot of people honestly had little trouble, but others seem to have a lot of trouble.
 

dave_d

Member
I didn't have to recalibrate a lot. But, I also sat so that the wiimote was in view of the sensor bar most of the time. There seems to be something of a myth surrounding the game - that it uses gyro calibration only, doesn't use the sensor bar, etc, therefore doesn't work well. Apparently that's not true; the wiimote does ping the sensor bar to check its position in the absolute and auto-calibrates every so often. But a lot of people appeared to have played the game by sitting close to the TV, holding the wiimote down and out of view of the sensor bar, etc.

My compass direction for the Wii/TV in the room is almost straight south. Not sure if that matters, I didn't think Motion+ had a magnetic sensor in it, like PS Move does.

Oh, I thought it was mostly gyro calibration and if that were the case then I was wondering if it would pick up the rotation of the earth. So for example if you were on the equator and pointed the Wiimote+ level due east or west you'd expect to see it change 15 degrees every hour. (Or 180 degrees in a 12 hour period) Just brain storming but an hour long play session would be long enough for that to start showing up.(Assuming they don't have a mechanism to correct for it. No idea if they do or not.) Anyway I was facing due west for what it's worth. (And did have to recallibrate quite a bit.)
 

oatmeal

Banned
I really don't like Majora's opening at all. It gets better when you actually leave Clock Town though but all the secret boys club bullshit is boring.

100% agree.

After you finish the bombers club stuff, the game opens up and becomes amazing...but that first hour or so is annoying as shit.
 
Here's a pair of questions I've been wondering about.(Since I'm one of those that had to recalibrate fairly often.) So I figure I could just ask everybody. Did you have to calibrate a lot? Second, when you were playing in what compass direction in real life were you facing?

I don't think I ever had to recalibrate. I would say I was facing roughly West while playing. Like Kajima, I sat so that the Wiimote could see the Sensor bar pretty much at all times. So I don't know if that made a difference. I also have to wonder if some of the people who had to recalibrate a lot didn't realize how some the controls worked. Like the beetle and stuff, center was based on where ever the wiimote was pointing/angled when you initiated use of the item. So if you launch it with the wiimote pointing down and then go to point it at the tv thinking that'll center it, it won't. In talking to people it seemed like a lot of people did not realize this. I'm not saying you didn't btw dave_d just one theory for some people's issues.
 

sphinx

the piano man
Majora's Mask beginning, up until you get back the ocarina is the most intimidating episode ever in any Zelda game.

if you don't get the ocarina in time (and times flies by extremely fast), it's game over (I think? I turned the console off out of frustration) and you lose over an hour of progress...

it's like they sent the message "In this game you can't be fucking around, get your shit together or go play Mario party or something"
 
Can someone please answer this, when selecting items from the B-wheel, for you did it not act like when you start aiming a weapon? Like when you take your bow out it uses whatever orientation you're holding the remote and makes that the center of the screen. But selecting an item it wouldn't do that, so I'd be pointing to the side. Got annoying at some points, was that just a bug for me?
 

Vibed

Member
Can someone please answer this, when selecting items from the B-wheel, for you did it not act like when you start aiming a weapon? Like when you take your bow out it uses whatever orientation you're holding the remote and makes that the center of the screen. But selecting an item it wouldn't do that, so I'd be pointing to the side. Got annoying at some points, was that just a bug for me?

That's not a bug. I personally didn't find that that annoying, but I always had my cursor pointed at the screen.
 

Easy_D

never left the stone age
I never had to recalibrate my Wiimote while playing, and I would play for a few hours at a time.

I had to do it a few times. But other than that it was fine. Don't get the complaints about the controls not working, maybe there are some shitty Motion+ controllers out in the wild. But I never had any issues with my amazing LE Golden Wiimote+ :)
 

Laughing Banana

Weeping Pickle
It feels like I am the entire person in the whole world wide universe that actually enjoys the tadpole collecting, hahaha. It's really relaxing for me.
 
The story of Skyward Sword was one of my favorite parts of the game, and funny enough, is actually something that was pointed out most often by professional critics as evolving Zelda to a better tier of storytelling.

Oh, absolutely. It made me all the more invested in the game, in every way.

I didn't have to recalibrate a lot. But, I also sat so that the wiimote was in view of the sensor bar most of the time. There seems to be something of a myth surrounding the game - that it uses gyro calibration only, doesn't use the sensor bar, etc, therefore doesn't work well. Apparently that's not true; the wiimote does ping the sensor bar to check its position in the absolute and auto-calibrates every so often. But a lot of people appeared to have played the game by sitting close to the TV, holding the wiimote down and out of view of the sensor bar, etc.

I also play sitting in plain view of the censor bar and barely had to recalibrate ever. Yeah, the game uses the censor bar to auto-calibrate. In the very rare cases where Link went a bit crazy on me all I did was point the wiimote at the bar and it fixed itself. Pretty simple.

It feels like I am the entire person in the whole world wide universe that actually enjoys the tadpole collecting, hahaha. It's really relaxing for me.
I like it and my brother likes it. We would like to buy you a drink.
 

leroidys

Member
It's definitely shorter, but I disagree that it's less tedious than Twilight Princess. I don't actually mind having to do the things that are part of TP's opening.

Slinghshot training, sword training, goat herding, fishing, monkey robbing... There's just too much and almost none of it is necessary for anyone who has ever played a video game before, let alone a Zelda game.

I had to do it a few times. But other than that it was fine. Don't get the complaints about the controls not working, maybe there are some shitty Motion+ controllers out in the wild. But I never had any issues with my amazing LE Golden Wiimote+ :)

I had to calibrate almost every time I used a ranged item, and sometimes it simply wouldn't recalibrate correctly no matter what (beetle veering hard right nonstop).
 

Chuckpebble

Member
I got a little salty with this game when I first started hero mode. Turns out you could keep all of your treasure when starting the new file and then sell it for cash and use it for some quick upgrades in hero mode.

Then I tried going to that secret shop and buying a bunch of treasure to sell in the new file.
-talk to statue
-buy ONE item
-leave the cave
-repeat

That was frustrating, but I have been having fond memories of the game again since, guess I'll be revisiting it again after the holidays. Man, I really loved some of those bosses.
 

Madouu

Member
Slinghshot training, sword training, goat herding, fishing, monkey robbing... There's just too much and almost none of it is necessary for anyone who has ever played a video game before, let alone a Zelda game.

I'm playing through Twilight Princess right now for the first time (having more or less played all of the previous Legend of Zelda entries) and the feeling I get when reading your post is that you're a bit over-exaggerating the issue. Sure, I definitely don't need slingshot or sword training, but I really appreciated those sections in the game, because it took me less than a minute or two to accomplish them and more importantly because they fit in with the story perfectly and they are executed in such a charming way (the characters writing, the expression on their faces ...) that you just want to relax and enjoy the ride.

The other option to satisfy "experienced" players would've been to have a skippable/separate tutorial but I would be sad if they went for this kind of design choice. Yes, I know goat herding final function is to train the player to control Epona efficiently but this is done in such a seemless and charming way that even if I do not need that training, I still enjoy the experience. I'll be thinking of it as if I were indeed herding rather than thinking "Bah! to hell with this tutorial, give me a real challenge"

Then again, I'm also somebody who will always play through the tutorials missions/campaigns in all the games I decide to play, so yeah I understand how it would annoy others. Still, I think I can say that Zelda games are up there with the best games series when it comes to introducing new game mechanics. In a way, everything is a tutorial for the next dungeon room where a puzzle of a tad slightly higher difficulty awaits.

disclaimer: I haven't played Skyward Sword yet.
 

Woffls

Member
I think I'm gonna' play this again over Christmas. I can't believe it's been a year already! It's my favourite Zelda game since Majora's Mask for sure, and a second play-through might move it up to second place. Such a brilliant game.
 

Easy_D

never left the stone age
Slinghshot training, sword training, goat herding, fishing, monkey robbing... There's just too much and almost none of it is necessary for anyone who has ever played a video game before, let alone a Zelda game.



I had to calibrate almost every time I used a ranged item, and sometimes it simply wouldn't recalibrate correctly no matter what (beetle veering hard right nonstop).

But calibrating ranged items was just a matter of pointing in the middle and pressing down on the d-pad. That was never really an issue for me.
 
I didn't have any major issues with the controls - I thought they worked within the limitations of MotionPlus really nicely, better than any other game. However I do think they got one thing slightly wrong:

The fact that you were always slightly off-centre if you brought up a weapon/item for the radial menu. It was very easy to be centred for stuff like the first person view/dowsing and the pointer on the map - you just ensure you're pointed at the centre before hitting C or +. However with the radial menu I'd always start in the centre, hold B, then tilt in a direction to select an item, and which point the game treats that position as the centre point, which is obviously not gonna be in the centre. It should treat the centrepoint as where you were pointing as you held down B, not where you let go.
 

Randdalf

Member
Does anyone who has the WiiRemote+ as opposed to the WiiRemote + MotionPlus not have to calibrate it as much? I find that my WR + MP combo loses calibration quite quickly.

I just completed the first silent world, a bit easy but quite tense and fun. It's terrifying when if you get discovered, I didn't realise I was holding the A button down and then I ran out of stamina so they got me.
 
I bought a Remote+ specially for this game, mostly because the M+ attachment looks bloody awful. I can't say if that helped as I don't have a M+ to compare, but at no point during the game did I feel like it required recalibration.
 
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