Oh, I get that, I just mean that you can buy a million for next to nothing already
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Magic: the Gathering |OT9| Kaladesh - Cruisin' Down the Street in my 6/4
- Thread starter SigmasonicX
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Infinite Stars
Member
My main issue is that when confronted with the Eldrazi being loose on Zendikar, she doesn't do the following:
- Try to reach out to Ugin
- Put aside her differences with Sorin to save the Multiverse
- Try to actually do anything to save Zendikar
Instead, she looks at Zendikar for 5 minutes, goes "it's fucked", and then decides to pull Innistrad, a plane that is 99.99% innocent in this beyond being Sorin's Crib, into the Eldrazi warpath.
Things that would have been acceptable as a "Eye for an Eye" Villain:
- Resealing the Eldrazi, then killing Sorin( or reverse order)
- Sealing Ulamog/Kozilek on Zendikar, killing Sorin, putting Emrakul in the moon
- Literally any plan that doesn't involve killing off at least 2 planes.
My point with the Gatewatch is that they let her walk away, but the only characters Nahiri is tied to right now is Ugin and Sorin, and Ugin wasn't the dick that Sorin was.
Oh trust me, I agree. Was Sorin a dick? Absolutely. Was he arguably the closest thing on Innistrad there is to a "Big Good"? Yes, yes he was. Sure, he did it out of self interest, but the system he set up worked for 1000ish years before it encountered a hiccup.
And it's not like he can just make another Avacyn because Avacyn exhausted him at Pre-mending power to make. By Nahiri coming in and screwing everything up she's created a situation worse then Dark Ascension for Humanity, only without any of the structure that allowed them to survive until the Helavault cracked and without the "Get out of Jail Free" card that Avacyn breaking out of the Helavault was.
I feel like that timeline is a bit off. It goes:
- Eldrazi are sealed.
- Nahiri sleeps for millennia keeping watch over the Eldrazi.
- Eldrazi start to stir, she wakes up, stops them from waking up.
- Goes to Sorin asking why he didn't show up when they started waking up, as agreed.
- He says he was busy, she attacks him, he imprisons her in a rock full of demons for millennia.
- Innistrad block happens, she gets out, goes home immediately, sees that the Eldrazi have woken up while she was locked away.
- She goes into full-on "fuck Sorin" mode and plots an intricate and excessive revenge plot.
She's definitely a villain and not a good person, but her motives are understandable from the point of view of someone who was betrayed and tortured for thousands of years. You don't just shrug that off and move on with your life.
- Eldrazi are sealed.
- Nahiri sleeps for millennia keeping watch over the Eldrazi.
- Eldrazi start to stir, she wakes up, stops them from waking up.
- Goes to Sorin asking why he didn't show up when they started waking up, as agreed.
- He says he was busy, she attacks him, he imprisons her in a rock full of demons for millennia.
- Innistrad block happens, she gets out, goes home immediately, sees that the Eldrazi have woken up while she was locked away.
- She goes into full-on "fuck Sorin" mode and plots an intricate and excessive revenge plot.
She's definitely a villain and not a good person, but her motives are understandable from the point of view of someone who was betrayed and tortured for thousands of years. You don't just shrug that off and move on with your life.
Played in a legacy 1k yesterday with D&t.
Played poorly (being my second legacy tournament) and went 0-3 drop.
Lost against shardless sultai, in which I wasn't able to get much of a board presence and he got Liliana out both games and had me saccing my dudes.
Game 2 I drew all 4 thalia and he decayed three and I sacced the last one. It was literally the only creature I drew all game.
Lost to burn, won game 1, was able to get Batterskull out and gain life.
Lost games 2 and 3. Game 2 I was one turn short of getting out Batterskull and he was able to draw into bolt for the kill. Game 3 he drew 2 searing blaze to kill ethersworn canonist and Thalia for the game.
Then played miracles. Had sanctum out on 6 and 1, bounced the one set on 6 with venser and then terminus with revoker in play naming top.
Overall I am sure I made plenty of misplays, but don't think any of them are that bad. Really need to know other decks better in legacy which is part of the learning curve.
Played poorly (being my second legacy tournament) and went 0-3 drop.
Lost against shardless sultai, in which I wasn't able to get much of a board presence and he got Liliana out both games and had me saccing my dudes.
Game 2 I drew all 4 thalia and he decayed three and I sacced the last one. It was literally the only creature I drew all game.
Lost to burn, won game 1, was able to get Batterskull out and gain life.
Lost games 2 and 3. Game 2 I was one turn short of getting out Batterskull and he was able to draw into bolt for the kill. Game 3 he drew 2 searing blaze to kill ethersworn canonist and Thalia for the game.
Then played miracles. Had sanctum out on 6 and 1, bounced the one set on 6 with venser and then terminus with revoker in play naming top.
Overall I am sure I made plenty of misplays, but don't think any of them are that bad. Really need to know other decks better in legacy which is part of the learning curve.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
That's just bad writing by WotC. Sorin is lawful neutral at best and in no way, shape or form close to good. Nahiri was the villain but you could, shitty writing aside, understand her motivation and just how Sorin didn't give a fuck about Zendikar so meant Innistrad nothing to Nahiri. Despite Nahiri being a villain she did set up Emrakul to be sealed and that's another reason it had to be innistrad and not any other plane.
Lastly remember that Olivia was starting to question Sorin and his commands.
Lastly remember that Olivia was starting to question Sorin and his commands.
The things to keep in mind, Re:Nahiri, is that from her point of view in the span of just a few moments, she finds out that she's no longer an old walker and finds out that her home world has been destroyed (she walks to Bala Ged which was already eaten by Ulamog and his brood and assumes the rest of the plane is in a similar condition).
From her perspective, the Eldrazi are going to go somewhere so rather than have some other unknown planes suffer, she decides to lead them to Sorin's home plane, because if some plane has to die My understanding is that in the artbook it says she expected Sorin to sacrifice himself, but nothing like that was mentioned in the actual story. Much like Kiora leaving Zendikar, it likely got changed sometime between the finalization of the artbook and the actual block story.
I'm curious to see how she's written when she shows up outside of the Eldrazi arc. Everything we know about her is basically tied to the Eldrazi, so there's a lot of potential directions they can go with her now that that's all done with.
From her perspective, the Eldrazi are going to go somewhere so rather than have some other unknown planes suffer, she decides to lead them to Sorin's home plane, because if some plane has to die My understanding is that in the artbook it says she expected Sorin to sacrifice himself, but nothing like that was mentioned in the actual story. Much like Kiora leaving Zendikar, it likely got changed sometime between the finalization of the artbook and the actual block story.
I'm curious to see how she's written when she shows up outside of the Eldrazi arc. Everything we know about her is basically tied to the Eldrazi, so there's a lot of potential directions they can go with her now that that's all done with.
TheBlackMarvel
Member
Starting? He's been persona non grata since Avacyn showed up. The fact she listened to him at all makes no sense.
On this we agree. I mean, I've had this convo on this thread at great length. I'm not on her side.
I feel like she's framed as 'eye for an eye' to a degree, but let's not forget she's batshit insane as well. I question anyone who more agrees with her than just sees her side of it. You're right in that any of the above would make her an 'eye for an eye' villain, or even antihero. But her being crazy just makes her a dangerous threat, and as far as I'm concerned, straight-up villain, even if you can find justification in her anger.
But really, the bolded is the part I take issue with. At no point, to my knowledge, is The Gatewatch ever aware of her or her part in the plot. They didn't "let her" do anything. They straight up don't know about her.
I didn't like leaving Innistrad at the end of Avacyn Restored as being in pretty dang good shape comparatively to the start. But the pendulum has swung a little too far in the opposite direction with Eldrich Moon, and it feels less in trouble and more proper-fucked. I am anticipating the third block on the plane to see how they bring it back some.
TheBlackMarvel
Member
Thing is, I don't trust WOTC to be able to pull that off in a satisfactory manner.
I honestly believe the best action for them is to have a block that shows the plane's final collapse so we get a real feel for what the Eldrazi are capable of, and so that there's some sort of actual stakes once they take them off ice again. I know they're overexposed right now, but they just don't feel like the plane-ending menace they're supposed to if this ragtag bunch of 'walkers are able to just thwart them at every turn. It originally took three pre-mending 'walkers and a crazy amount of planning to sleep them before. Now it took like 4 of these newer, weaker kind to literally kill two and 5 to put the last one to sleep (willingly even!).
But Innistrad is so popular (and don't get me wrong, I also like it) that I think they'll "save it" somehow and continue on.
Metroidvania
People called Romanes they go the house?
Considering both the 'nature' of the block, as well as their inability (IMO, mind) to pull off the Nahiri/Emrakul angle in a successful fashion, I don't see them returning for a while, if at all.
Plus, from a product standpoint, visiting a realm for a 3rd time in such as short time frame would both have potential for burnout, as well as a risk of not having established enough Chekov's whatevers to get the plane back and sorted out.
Sure, they left Thalia alive with Sigarda, but compared to someone like Avacyn, and Emrakul still being around, the plane's kinda effed.
Also, side-note, does Jace get Sorin out of Nahiri's anti-planes-walk macguffin after Olivia leaves him there?
Oh man, I don't think they're coming back anytime soon. They could do it in like 10 years and that would be sufficient. I would guess we'll get occasional peeks in here or there for Commander releases.
I don't recall Jace getting him out. It seemed to me that Sorin was left as a cliffhanger. He'll be back.
Metroidvania
People called Romanes they go the house?
Yeah, if he's not dead, he'll be back. Possibly as Emrakul-influenced if he doesn't get discovered.
This prompted me to read over the Avacyn 'final moments' story bits, and....urgh. I get the whole self-doubt angle, but they do not play off the interplay of Avacyn-on-Crypoliths and 'Avacyn's original purpose' well, at all.
She fluctuates from 'purge the plane' back to 'purge the vamps' due to recovering from the madness temporarily, but then the cryptoliths have her see sorin as some 'horror-leech' or w/e, and justifies that as her excuse to keep fighting him?
Like, that whole aspect about the humans being the underlying problem just gets lost? And the 'irrational madness' that overtook the one mother who started this whole thing just gets lost?
(Admittedly, this is somewhat nitpicky, but I liked Avacyn, dangit.)
SigmasonicX
Member
Sorin is still sealed in stone. It'd be amazing if a Commander deck had a Sorin card that was a Legendary Creature - Vampire Wall.
TheBlackMarvel
Member
There are so many wasted storytelling opportunities in Magic.
Avacyn was my favourite character.
That would be incredible.
Familienoberhauptvogel
Banned
Kent Ketter ended up getting kicked from his team anyway.
charlequin
Banned
As with Ravnica, there is literally nothing that could cause them not to go back for a third Innistrad block down the road.
Yeah I'm pretty upset about what happened with Avacyn. Again, I really hated how they basically redid the Crovax/Selenia schtick. Sorta. Both were bad.
Yep, I don't understand some of the posts in this thread sometimes. Them not going back to Ravinca is like Nintendo never making another Mario game.
Yep, I don't understand some of the posts in this thread sometimes. Them not going back to Ravinca is like Nintendo never making another Mario game.
RIP Legacy- SCG just announced that next season/year, They aren't going to do Legacy Classic events anymore unless there doing a Legacy Open or a Team Constructed Open, and they are down to 1 Legacy Open and 1 Team Constructed (Standard/Modern/Legacy) next season
http://www.starcitygames.com/article/33951
http://www.starcitygames.com/article/33951
Who wants to buy some duals?
Considering they pretty much barely stream events as is it lately, whatever.
Wulfric
Member
Nooooo... I just played the Legacy event the other weekend. That's a terrible loss. While I was at the Open I got the feeling people really enjoyed playing legacy outside of their local meta of maybe a dozen people. Taking this away seems like slapping a kid's ice cream cone to the ground.
Ironically enough, SCG has legacy and vintage on weekly sale this week. Coincidence? I think not.
In other news, SCG posted this really spoopy article about creepy modern cards. The first person stories are neat, albiet slighly unnerving. They're like the endings in the Choose-your-own adventure Goosebumps.
Well, I guess Wizards got their wish. At the expense of the intrigue of the game and the enthusiasm of their most dedicated players. How much longer will Modern last, I wonder?
Modern doesn't have the RL
They gave more reprints this year than any year since 1995. Conspiracy 2 and Eternal Masters helped, but the reserved list and Wizards refusal to break it means that it's impossible for Legacy to grow, only to shrink.
charlequin
Banned
Forever, because this means the only serious competitor to it as a format won't remain so?
Infinite Stars
Member
With Legacy dying all but officially now, I'm hoping this means Wizards can take a long hard look at Modern and try to enforce their rules/ideas better. If Legacy can't exist in paper, Modern is the oldest competitive paper format(Besides Vintage, because lol Vintage). I don't think using this as a reason to "fix" modern would be a bad idea.
Metroidvania
People called Romanes they go the house?
True enough, I meant it more in a 'story left to tell' sense. It came off with more finality than I intended.
Obviously the Emra conversation (and her still being in the moon) is one of the more obvious 'return to plane' moments to be considered, not to mention Sorin's vengeance on Nahiri if/when he gets out.
charlequin
Banned
Nothing, as long as the jackasses in Hasbro Legal are still holding the reins.
I mean pricewise, secondary market. Are they going to drop? Are they going to hold steady? Slowly fall into obscurity or rise due to EDH?
The switch to two day events was a massive error that they're still paying for, despite what Cedric will claim. https://www.reddit.com/r/MTGLegacy/...hat_they_came_very_close_to_having_to/d9g2tlo
I think TCGPlayer expanding their services is really hurting SCGs selling business. Their cart optimization, their shipping options, and now their buylist all directly compete with SCG, and give me no reason to even consider shopping there.
Many other sites have advantages- Cardkingdoms insane grading means you can buy SP cards and get things I would consider NM, CapeFear and Isle of Cards are tied in to MTGO stores, allowing you to sell them one form for the other, ChannelFireball has goodwill from all the free videos and articles. SCG has none of this- I can't imagine a reason I'd buy cards from them now
Eternal Masters was made by Wizards, StarCity controls the SCG Tour. They have nothing to do with each other.
Remember, Legacy was basically dead before the SCG series started. Its popularity and at the time innovative streaming was what led to legacy cards exploding in value over a short period of time. Wizards have been providing the same level of support- 2 to 3 GPs a year since 2009- but we have had such explosive growth in player base in that time that it seems like Legacy has been shuffled off to the side.
Generally speaking, I try to source singles locally when I can. When i can't, I use SCG if it's time-sensitive. I't s got nothing to do with their service; they just happen to be relatively close, so shipments from them are typically here the next day or in 2 days even when I choose the cheapest shipping option.
When time isn't an issue, I'll generally compare between channelfireball, tcgplayer and coolstuffinc and buy from one of them.
In this area, there's actually a lot of people that play Legacy casually. Plenty of them go to tournaments when they do pop up, but otherwise they just play their legacy decks between rounds of other events; or even when they're just hanging out. There's also a good number of people who play formatless casual decks that are tuned, but not really designed for any wider meta. Reprints help them out, too.
Ya the buylist is huge for me and I imagine will be for many others. I've already sold $500+ on tcgplayer whereas I'd normally wait for an open and sell only if they were giving good offers.
Having cheap/free shipping on commons and uncommons is another reason I go to tcgplayer first over scg. I just can't stomach spending $5 on shipping for like $10-15 worth of cards. Especially when those cards are already cheaper.
Not surprising. They always get way less entrants and give fixed payouts. I'll probably be working to sell off my legacy collection over the next month or two.
I am Error
Member
Quoting myself for context
Today my brother finally received his 'missing' booster pack from WotC. Took them a bit more than three weeks, but I'm happy he got what he paid for.
Today my brother finally received his 'missing' booster pack from WotC. Took them a bit more than three weeks, but I'm happy he got what he paid for.
I typically use TCGPlayer, eBay, or CoolStuffInc. CoolStuffInc doesn't seem to adjust all their pricing as frequently as other sites so you can find good deals on the odd card and the increasing discount percentage off as you go up in reward tiers is pretty nice for those cards that are priced the same everywhere and/or big purchases. If Channel Fireball offered the same deal on shipping that CoolStuffInc does(Free Shipping on any cart over $100, doesn't have to include just singles) I'd probably buy from there more frequently than I do, sealed product in particular. Hell, if more sites had a reward system similar to CoolStuff I'd at least consider them more often than I do.
Wulfric
Member
Yeah, SCG is kind of expensive for what it's worth. Prices on modern singles are a joke. Unless you're buying NM old-school foils or ABUR duals/P9 and want to be 120% it's legit, it's cheaper to go on tcgplayer. Heck, Abugames is cheaper sometimes. Even CFB has free shipping on singles.
I'd also say that SCG Premium doesn't really make sense anymore. When they launched it, Brainburst (now TCGPlayer) had a premium service, with all the top pros like Kai and Zvi writing for it. Now that articles are less important than videos, and CFB has been taking a lot of SCGs former writers who are now more successful Magic Players (BBD being the most obvious example) and having them put out content for free, I can't imagine who this service is for- the classic PTQ grinder is dead (thanks to PPTQs and RPTQs)!
Wulfric
Member
See, that's one thing I never quite understood. Why do some people prefer the old PTQ model? Is it because you didn't have to go to an additional RPTQ to hopefully get the Pro Tour invite?
I'm not a serious grinder (maybe 4 PTQs per year) by any means, but I like the PPTQ system because of the increased competition while still getting to play in a smaller 30-40 person event. Eventually I started making friends in that circle since we kept running into each other in surrounding cities! xD
charlequin
Banned
Yeah, at this point its biggest impact seems to be making relevant discussions happen six weeks after the article goes live instead of right away because nobody has access to the info at the beginning.
I don't think people are actually complaining about the changes. There is some romanticism about piling into a car for 8 hours to travel to a PTQ, and the old system allowed you multiple chances to qualify- the new system gives you ample time to win a PPTQ, but only one shot a season at a RPTQ, and the new system means that if you live in Perioria IL or Bumfuck NE you are definitely going to be flying to go to the RPTQ, but for anyone over the age of 20, the new system is great.
The grinding aspect of magic was at it's worse in 2010/2011 when they announced that PWPs was a path to the Pro Tour and included incentives like triple points for playing in large FNMs that lead to people loosing sanity over grinding when they were doing FNM, then hoping on a bus or train to a SCG/PTQ every single weekend in the hopes that they would get enough points to qualify. It's a good thing this lasted exactly 1 PT season.
There was a point there was a lot of good content there. It's long since passed for the reasons you stated. There's just better content elsewhere for free. Them dropping BBD was such a stupid move.
Here's some parasitic partner dudes
I'm pleased with how the images I found feel like they compliment the designs
There's neat combos there - if Alpharn gets killed early, Omegar can fuck up the board and keep your creatures safe.
You mean stupidly overpowered and imbalanced?
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