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[cvxfreak]

Eh, RE4/CV seems far too stretching a comparison honestly. Neither of those games recycled half their assets, neither game jumped genre entirely, and this game was definitely way too low budget by comparison. Maybe in the BH pantheon it ranks ahead of other spinoffs, but it's not core series either... a good analog in another series might be something like DQ Swords actually. Or Luigi's Mansion. High profile spinoff, but a genre divergent, comparably low budget, spinoff all the same.

I can accept if one doesn't consider it a core game. That's up for debate. My original point was that comparing it to the Gun Survivor series makes little sense nowadays because of the big differences. The similarities are superficial. Developed by Cavia? Yeah, but CV and Zero were developed by different studios, too. UC may have reused a lot of assets, but GS4 was entirely new and that didn't stop it from being an unimportant sidestory. UC may seem low budget, but look at RE3's budget compared to CV.

 

[BoilersFan23]

Yeah, it's pretty sad that SCEJ has only announced two "detective" adventure games for this year. They could have the fucking Gran Turismo Portable or a non low budget spinoff SRPG Wild Arms or at least port some ps2 games like Dark Chronicles, Rogue Galaxy, Minna no Tennis,...

They are doing nothing.

There's no GT game on PSP because even Polyphony Digital said themselves would you rather have a GT PSP or a GT on PS3? They just don't have enough resources to make two versions of the game unless another developer were to do GT on PSP instead. And since GT5 is still a ways off, we may never see a handheld GT game. SCEJ tends to not announce games until just before release anyway, so I'm expecting we'll see more PSP games by them (SCEJ seems to mostly be PSP, while SCEE and SCEA are mostly PS3).

 

[jarrod]

That's kind of a different case, imo. ISP was (together with DQ Slime) one of their first games for the new generation of handhelds – at that time they were not sure which plattform will succeed, I suppose.

Sure, I think that's true. It reminds me of Enix's early 32bit support, where they threw lower tier IPs at Saturn, N64 and PS1 before committing whole hog to the latter. I just don't think Horii necessarily has such a hard and fast "only first place" rule as people jump to and if PSP Itadaki had sold better, I think we'd have likely seen more Armor Project releases on it.

Yeah, it's pretty sad that SCEJ has only announced two "detective" adventure games for this year. They could have the fucking Gran Turismo Portable or a non low budget spinoff SRPG Wild Arms or at least port some ps2 games like Dark Chronicles, Rogue Galaxy, Minna no Tennis,...

They are doing nothing.

Minna no Tennis Portable would be a GREAT move imo. Though how did Mingol 2 sell, didn't it sort of disappoint? GTP seems out of reach with PD slaving away on GT5, L5 seems way too busy to take on another SCE project and I kinda question if MediaVision's that eager to jump into Wild Arms again? Though after Wiz-Road tanked, maybe they won't have much choice? :lol

Japan Studio really has seemed to abandon PSP sadly. Hell, their PS3 support isn't all that either actually. :/

I can accept if one doesn't consider it a core game. That's up for debate. My original point was that comparing it to the Gun Survivor series makes little sense nowadays because of the big differences. The similarities are superficial. Developed by Cavia? Yeah, but CV and Zero were developed by different studios, too. UC may have reused a lot of assets, but GS4 was entirely new and that didn't stop it from being an unimportant sidestory. UC may seem low budget, but look at RE3's budget compared to CV.

I can see that. I think RE3 and CV were somewhat closely budgeted though, even if Nextech was contracted to grunt the latter. Both had some pretty expensive looking CG iirc.

 

[ksamedi]

Good to have you back jarrod. Makes these threads a little more lively.

 

[cvxfreak]

I can see that. I think RE3 and CV were somewhat closely budgeted though, even if Nextech was contracted to grunt the latter. Both had some pretty expensive looking CG iirc.

RE3 was definitely lower budget than CV just by virtue of the development platforms. RE3 had 50 people working on it, while CV had 70. And CV was in development even before RE3. I think RE3 is the lowest budgeted mainline RE, or perhaps the original RE. Zero or RE4 were the highest before RE5.

 

[jarrod]

Good to have you back jarrod. Makes these threads a little more lively.

<3 <3

RE3 was definitely lower budget than CV just by virtue of the development platforms. RE3 had 50 people working on it, while CV had 70. And CV was in development even before RE3. I think RE3 is the lowest budgeted mainline RE, or perhaps the original RE. Zero or RE4 were the highest before RE5.

Well, RE3 seems like it was really rushed to market imo, it had a really quick cycle and reused a lot of RE2's tech and assets. I seem to remember Mikami commenting something along that CV was originally planned out as RE3 too, but the Last Escape got the number for marketing reasons? Is that true?

A lot of RE0 and RE4 budgets likely came from platform shifts and engine restarts protracting their dev cycles too. RE2 was probably insanely expensive in it's day too.

 

[Kurosaki Ichigo]

Talking about SCEJ PSP efforts and Media Vision specifically...

PSP Enkaku Sousa: Sana e no 23 Hiai (MediaVision/SCEJ)

5th February, really

Website opened on the 3rd of October, first and last updated on the 8th of October.
http://www.jp.playstation.com/scej/title/enkaku/

Good going SCEJ.

 

[Xisiqomelir]

Sure, Armor Project hasn't touched PSP again because a year and half late port of a ps2 party game only sold 100k+.

That must be the reason.

Feel the pain of Wii owners.

Spoiler

People who respond with "DQX!", you don't get it

 

[Liabe Brave]

This is less the case with minor systems. The userbase tends to... have a certain niche which can make some games get quite high attach rates. SSBM's 1.35 million on a 4 million userbase comes to mind. Or X360's own Blue Dragon was actually over 50% for a while. Original Xbox's DOA3 had a huge percentage as a launch title, and even by the end of the generation was at about 45%.

Though even successful systems like Wii and DS have been known to get some absurd rates. Any of the Wii games over 2.6 million are currently doing better than 33%.

So...Wii Fit and Wii Sports. And despite the mention of the DS, there are actually no games on that system even approaching a 33% attach rate. The examples you named are not the tip of an iceberg; they're creeping up on an exhaustive list. I stand by my "pretty much none" assessment of these numbers.

You're right that the 360 by dint of its very low base has more opportunity for such an outlier, but it's still not likely at all.

Star Ocean 4 has a bundle, so the same logic could be applied to it as Blue Dragon, potentially.

My exception wasn't for special occasion bundles, but for "Buy the system, get a game" setups that lasted for years: Combat, or Super Mario. Bros. I actually do believe SO 4 could sell more than Blue Dragon, but it won't reach anything like its attach ratio.

 

[donny2112]

The 2007 Top 100 came out around January 15, 2008, about 17 days after the end of the reporting period (20071230). We are now ~23 days beyond the end of the reporting period. I hope it comes out with tomorrow's Famitsu. :lol

 

[cvxfreak]

donny, the Top 100 is in the next issue of Famitsu.

 

[donny2112]

Thanks, cvxfreak!

 

[Fafalada]

They just don't have enough resources to make two versions of the game unless another developer were to do GT on PSP instead.

If they put 5 people on porting GT4 to GTPSP since 2004, they could have released it (at least)twice by now. And with team of 200+ on PS3 for what, 3years now, saying they can't "afford the resources" to do that...
Either Kaz is being obsessive controlling over franchise and won't let anyone touch it without his exclusive control (hence two projects can't happen at the same time) or they just plain have issues with how they manage their projects.
Based on what we know from media, I'm partial to the former.

 

[Spiegel]

Famitsu TOP 10

1 NDS Devil Survivor (Atlus)
2 WII Wii Play: Mario Tennis (Nintendo)
3 PS3 Naruto Ultimate Ninja Storm (Bandai Namco)
4 PSP Dissidia: Final Fantasy (Square Enix)
5 PS3 Fallout 3 (Bethesda)
6 NDS Wagamama Fashion: Girls Mode (Nintendo)
7 PSP Monster Hunter Portable 2nd G (Capcom)
8 NDS Rhythm Tengoku Gold (Nintendo)
9 WII Wii Fit (Nintendo)
10 WII Taiko no Tatsujin (Bandai Namco)

 

[jj984jj]

Link: http://www.famitsu.com/game/rank/sokuho/1221434_1796.html

Yay Atlus.

 

[schuelma]

Famitsu TOP 10

1 NDS Devil Survivor (Atlus)
2 WII Wii Play: Mario Tennis (Nintendo)
3 PS3 Naruto Ultimate Ninja Storm (Bandai Namco)
4 PSP Dissidia: Final Fantasy (Square Enix)
5 PS3 Fallout 3 (Bethesda)
6 NDS Wagamama Fashion: Girls Mode (Nintendo)
7 PSP Monster Hunter Portable 2nd G (Capcom)
8 NDS Rhythm Tengoku Gold (Nintendo)
9 WII Wii Fit (Nintendo)
10 WII Taiko no Tatsujin (Bandai Namco)

Looks like Taiko got a re-stock

 

[Cosmonaut X]

Famitsu TOP 10

1 NDS Devil Survivor (Atlus)
2 WII Wii Play: Mario Tennis (Nintendo)
3 PS3 Naruto Ultimate Ninja Storm (Bandai Namco)
4 PSP Dissidia: Final Fantasy (Square Enix)
5 PS3 Fallout 3 (Bethesda)
6 NDS Wagamama Fashion: Girls Mode (Nintendo)
7 PSP Monster Hunter Portable 2nd G (Capcom)
8 NDS Rhythm Tengoku Gold (Nintendo)
9 WII Wii Fit (Nintendo)
10 WII Taiko no Tatsujin (Bandai Namco)

Hm.

Either Devil Survivor and Mario Tennis improved a lot over their first day performance (35k and 17.5k respectively) or we're looking at a pretty low week all round.

 

[jj984jj]

You'll probably have to wait until we see numbers for games coming out on the 29th to see some bigger numbers in the top 10 again.

 

[Spiegel]

Hm.

Either Devil Survivor and Mario Tennis improved a lot over their first day performance (35k and 17.5k respectively) or we're looking at a pretty low week all round

Low week

 

[botticus]

Looks like Taiko got a re-stock

Unless there has been another occurrence in January (looks like Garaph is only updated through 122909), I believe this is only the second time a 3rd party Wii game has dropped out and re-entered the top 10, the first being Deca Sports (10->11->10).

http://garaph.info/sqldirect.php?queryid=1215

 

[bttb]

.

 

[cw_sasuke]

Wow, didn`t expect DSi sales to go down so quicky...

 

[Cosmonaut X]

01. [NDS] Megami Ibunroku: Devil Survivor (Atlus) - 57,000 / NEW
02. [WII] Wii de Asobu: Mario Tennis GC (Nintendo) - 55,000 / NEW

Good increase for both, but especially MT - that's a huge pickup over the opening day.

06. [NDS] Wagamama Fashion: Girl's Mode (Nintendo) - 27,000 / 687,000

Would "leggy" be too awful a pun for this?

08. [NDS] Rhythm Heaven (Nintendo) - 26,000 / 1,500,000

1.5 million? Candidate for "greatest increase for a sequel"?

10. [WII] Taiko no Tatsujin Wii (Bandai Namco) - 19,000 / 316,000

...and it's back. Really solid performance for Taiko.

What's the mystery number 27? Hoping for Wii Music ;-)

__. [WII] Castlevania Judgment (Konami) - 3,700 / NEW

Failvania. Terrible idea for the series - a 2D WiiWare installment would have probably performed better.

Hardware low all around - interested to see where it levels out at for each system.

 

[schuelma]

Wii and PS3 hardware are significantly down compared to last year. Shaping up to be a rough first half of the year..

 

[Frillen]

Wow! Will WKC struggle to sell 350k?

 

[schuelma]

Wow! Will WKC struggle to sell 350k?

Probably. Still pretty good I think.

 

[Pureauthor]

Wish Devils Survivor garnered more sales. Oh well.

 

[AyuFanatic86]

Wah, it makes me happy and angry at the same time, looking at how well AC Wii is selling. Angry that a slighty improved port of a NDS-game sells so much...happy that the franchise is well alive. Nintendo, give me a major update nextime you release an AC game, okay?

Speaking of low hardware sales, what´s the next BIG game?

 

[Spiegel]

Famitsu Sales: 01/12 - 01/18

04. [PSP] Dissidia Final Fantasy (Square Enix) - 29,000 / 830,000

Seeing that Crisis Core is at ~800k LTD, 950k seems likely. The next weeks are going to be decisive to see if it can crawl to 1 million.

Crisis Core: 470k -> 132k -> 61k -> 26k -> 14k -> 10k
Dissidia: FF 504k -> 156k -> 97k -> 44k -> 29k ->...

29. [PSP] Musou Orochi: Maou Sairin (Koei) - 7,400 / 150,000

Good legs. The game did 42k first week (worse than the first) and now it's doing substantially better.

DS 81000
PSP&#12288;48000
Wii&#12288;31000
PS3&#12288;19000
PS2&#12288;7000
360&#12288;7600

Last year:

DS 90,536
PSP 65,278
WII 75,824
PS3 32,264
PS2 12,796
X360 4,437

 

[schuelma]

Speaking of low hardware sales, what´s the next BIG game?

PS3 has some good stuff coming..RE5, Yakuza 3, FF13 demo

And of course DQ9 at the end of March.

 

[test_account]

Wow! Will WKC struggle to sell 350k?

At this drop rate in sales, i think that WCK will probably not reach 350k.

What were Sony's and/or Level 5's sales prediction for WKC by the way, does anyone know? It outsold the first shipment as far as i know, but not that this necessarily shows how the sales expectations are/were.

But i agree with schuelma, the WKC sales are still pretty good even if it wont reach 350k, especially seeing how the other RPG games have sold in this generation in Japan.

 

[AyuFanatic86]

PS3 has some good stuff coming..RE5, Yakuza 3, FF13 demo

And of course DQ9 at the end of March.

What about MH3-demo with MHG?

 

[cw_sasuke]

What about MH3-demo with MHG?

April...just like the FF13 Demo.

 

[schuelma]

What about MH3-demo with MHG?

Hmm..I think the game will do pretty well because of the demo, but I don't know if it will sell any systems.

 

[kottila]

PS3 has some good stuff coming..RE5, Yakuza 3, FF13 demo

And of course DQ9 at the end of March.

And Fragile comes out this week! At least it should get into the top 10 with these low sales.

 

[Minsc]

And Fragile comes out this week! At least it should get into the top 10 with these low sales.

I'm hesitant to take even those odds. Was there ever any shipment #s?

 

[thestopsign]

I'm hesitant to take even those odds. Was there ever any shipment #s?

What did their game on the PS2 did (the one that was supposed to be good), it was something like Venus and Braves?

 

[Spiegel]

What did their game on the PS2 did (the one that was supposed to be good), it was something like Venus and Braves?

Yeah. Venus & Braves

57k first week / 96k LTD

 

[schuelma]

I asked this before, but who thinks Taiki Wii will get higher than DQ:S and at least momentarily take the top 3rd party spot on Wii?

I think it has a pretty good shot. It's already up to 316K and this weeks bump shows there is still a decent amount of demand.

 

[thestopsign]

I asked this before, but who thinks Taiki Wii will get higher than DQ:S and at least momentarily take the top 3rd party spot on Wii?

I think it has a pretty good shot. It's already up to 316K and this weeks bump shows there is still a decent amount of demand.

I'm thinking mid-400k or somewhere around there. Just under Dragon Quest Swords. Depending on how popular the Monster Hunter franchise is, Monster Hunter G might push past DQ:S now that it has the demo of Monster Hunter Tri in it. It's hard to judge anything on that franchise as of now though.

Then of course both Monster Hunter Tri and Dragon Quest X will blow by it.

 

[jj984jj]

Yeah. Venus & Braves

57k first week / 96k LTD

7 didn't have such a great start though. This is also a very different game, I hope it does well. It certainly turned out different from what I expected when it was announced as a RPG from this team and tri-Crescendo.

 

[JoshuaJSlone]

02. [WII] Wii de Asobu: Mario Tennis GC (Nintendo) - 55,000 / NEW

This one surprises me a bit. You may remember I previously noted that for the Wii versions of DKJB and Pikmin, the first week number was about 10% of the original's lifetime number. I said at the time that perhaps it was looking too deeply into things to expect that to continue, but it still surprises me that the next game does better than 10% when it missed the holiday rush. GCN Mario Tennis hit 377K, so this is about 15%. Maybe Nintendo-made motion-controlled tennis is drawing a bit more attention from a crowd that eats Wii Sports up?

 

[botticus]

I asked this before, but who thinks Taiki Wii will get higher than DQ:S and at least momentarily take the top 3rd party spot on Wii?

I think it has a pretty good shot. It's already up to 316K and this weeks bump shows there is still a decent amount of demand.

I was going to say if we see a couple more 15k+ weeks, it has a good shot at it, but looking back on the DS titles, they were below 10k very quickly and also started slower than Taiko Wii. I don't see why Taiko Wii can't hit 500k by the end of the year.

Maybe Nintendo-made motion-controlled tennis is drawing a bit more attention from a crowd that eats Wii Sports up?

For similar reasons I can see Tennis significantly outperforming Pikmin when they launch together in the US even though the opposite was true of the original versions.

 

[Osuwari]

This one surprises me a bit. You may remember I previously noted that for the Wii versions of DKJB and Pikmin, the first week number was about 10% of the original's lifetime number. I said at the time that perhaps it was looking too deeply into things to expect that to continue, but it still surprises me that the next game does better than 10% when it missed the holiday rush. GCN Mario Tennis hit 377K, so this is about 15%. Maybe Nintendo-made motion-controlled tennis is drawing a bit more attention from a crowd that eats Wii Sports up?

or maybe the original game underperformed badly on the dying GC and the numbers of the re-release look better because of that.

mario tennis 64 was very close to 1 million and look how the sequel dropped off. golf/strikers/baseball didn't have such big drop offs between sequels (partly because the originals didn't clear 500k iirc).

 

[Link]

Wii and PS3 hardware are significantly down compared to last year. Shaping up to be a rough first half of the year..

At least in terms of Japan, the Wii is going to be looked at as a tragic tale by future generations. So much potential essentially buried because third parties decided not to try. It's basically turning into the same situation the GC and N64 were in: first party blockbusters surrounded by half-hearted or niche third party efforts with an occasional big third party game. Sales are being affected severely by this, and they are only going to keep sliding.

 

[frankie_baby]

At least in terms of Japan, the Wii is going to be looked at as a tragic tale by future generations. So much potential essentially buried because third parties decided not to try. It's basically turning into the same situation the GC and N64 were in: first party blockbusters surrounded by half-hearted or niche third party efforts with an occasional big third party game. Sales are being affected severely by this, and they are only going to keep sliding.

Yes sales are down at the moment but nintendo still have pretty much all the cards to play, theres massive scope for price cuts, they could release new colours and the line up for this year is fantastic (and for japan at least it blows the competition out of the market), maybe it wont do stellar numbers and to be honest i doubt any home console will in japan ever again but its far too short sighted to say they will slide

 

[jarrod]

I was going to say if we see a couple more 15k+ weeks, it has a good shot at it, but looking back on the DS titles, they were below 10k very quickly and also started slower than Taiko Wii. I don't see why Taiko Wii can't hit 500k by the end of the year.

Agreed. Taiko DS is past 500k now, the sequel past 400k, and Taiko Wii is outperforming them both significantly. Screw 500k, I'll stir the pot and say it outsells MGS4 eventually. :lol

 

[schuelma]

At least in terms of Japan, the Wii is going to be looked at as a tragic tale by future generations. So much potential essentially buried because third parties decided not to try. It's basically turning into the same situation the GC and N64 were in: first party blockbusters surrounded by half-hearted or niche third party efforts with an occasional big third party game. Sales are being affected severely by this, and they are only going to keep sliding.

I know you love to do this, but come on man. Sales are probably going to be down for the first part of the year, but Nintendo has many cards to play and 3rd party support, contrary to your doom and gloom posts is going to be significantly better in 2009. Significantly. Monster Hunter 3, Tales of Ten, Samurai Warriors 3, Crystal Bearers (not confirmed but I imagine it's this year if a new trailer is coming out)...that's already a significantly better lineup than 2008, and we're barely into the new year.

I'd also add that Wii Sports Resort/Motion + could be very big, and at the very least I expect it to have much more of a impact than Wii Music/Animal Crossing.


Edit- I'd add that sales are down in this period for PSP and PS3 as well.

 

[Eteric Rice]

At least in terms of Japan, the Wii is going to be looked at as a tragic tale by future generations. So much potential essentially buried because third parties decided not to try. It's basically turning into the same situation the GC and N64 were in: first party blockbusters surrounded by half-hearted or niche third party efforts with an occasional big third party game. Sales are being affected severely by this, and they are only going to keep sliding.

Yeah, but at least things aren't looking so grim from Japanese game developers. They seem to be slowly turning towards the Wii. If only Square-Enix, Atlus, and Capcom would go full throttle on it, we'd be pretty much set.

 

[schuelma]

Agreed. Taiko DS is past 500k now, the sequel past 400k, and Taiko Wii is outperforming them both significantly. Screw 500k, I'll stir the pot and say it outsells MGS4 eventually. :lol

Yeah I could see that if it has anywhere near the legs the DS and PS2 titles had. I originally thought it was going to be a lot more front loaded, but this weeks numbers kind of shot that theory to hell, at least temporarily.