Media Create Sales: Week 8, 2014 (Feb 17 - Feb 23)

test_account

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Vitas support is mediocre at best, its software sales makes this quite obvious to everyone (eg. this week no game in the Famitsu Top 30 charts, top selling game ltd at 300k) etc,. We are looking at a system that mostly just gets ports, anime licensed software and visual novels. I wouldn´t call this by any means good support no matter how much you lowered your expectations.
I know what you mean, but i think most of those Vita games are concidered to be multiplatform games instead of ports. Ports, at least to me, indicates an already released game coming to another platform at a later time.
 

sörine

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So passive aggressive. I was just humoured by the notion of a "1st tier hunting game".
We're in a sales thread so I figured it was pretty obvious what I was talking about there. I apologize if I wasn't clear enough and somehow hurt your feelings over it.
 

Prelude.

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sörine;103035725 said:
We're in a sales thread so I figured it was pretty obvious what I was talking about there. I apologize if I wasn't clear enough and somehow hurt your feelings over it.
I'm sure I'm the one with hurt feelings about a certain hunting game.
 

ohlawd

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lol you guys.

hmm I wonder what's Japan's obsession for making wack and terrible MH clones? It took fucking ages until we got something like Toukiden, which plays closer to MH than every other clone combined.
 

Oregano

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You do realise we have been subtracting Knack sales since the beginning of this thread lol
It shouldn't be completely ignored though because if Knack didn't exist/wasn't bundled the sales would likely not be the same. Some people will want the game specifically and some will be satisfied with it for the time being.

You can't just ignore bundles, it's not that simple.

I think Double packs are a similar deal. Buying a double pack doesn't necessarily mean you would have bougt two otherwise but at least some people would.
 

Prelude.

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sörine;103036061 said:
Given your reaction it did seem to strike a nerve. I'm so sorry for the pain I've caused you.
I don't have a preference on a particular Phantasy Star knock off since I don't own a Vita or a 3DS, so you can keep 2nd tiering them, don't worry about me.
 

Psycho_Mantis

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It shouldn't be completely ignored though because if Knack didn't exist/wasn't bundled the sales would likely not be the same. Some people will want the game specifically and some will be satisfied with it for the time being.

You can't just ignore bundles, it's not that simple.

I think Double packs are a similar deal. Buying a double pack doesn't necessarily mean you would have bougt two otherwise but at least some people would.
Funny. I don't remember you saying the same thing when we ignored Knack in the attach ratio. Why now?

We ignore bundles because they blur the picture. If we didn't people might think Knack was a big hit or NSMBU had good legs when in both cases the opposite is probably true.

We were discussing software sales on WiiU. Software that basically comes free with a WiiU (what is it like 3 games for the price of 2k yen) which resulted in an extra 800k sales will obviously we ignored.

Anyway even with that WiiU is still 600k sales behind PSV in software sales.
 

Oregano

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Funny. I don't remember you saying the same thing when we ignored Knack in the attach ratio. Why now?

We ignore bundles because they blur the picture. If we didn't people might think Knack was a big hit or NSMBU had good legs when in both cases the opposite is probably true.

We were discussing software sales on WiiU. Software that basically comes free with a WiiU (what is it like 3 games for the price of 2k yen) which resulted in an extra 800k sales will obviously we ignored.

Anyway even with that WiiU is still 600k sales behind PSV in software sales.
Funny. I don't remember me saying anthing about the attach ratio at all?

Why now? Because I happened to take a look in the thread.

I'm not even trying to argue Wii U is a better software seller than Vita, I'm just saying you can't completely ignore bundles.
 

sörine

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I don't have a preference on a particular Phantasy Star knock off since I don't own a Vita or a 3DS, so you can keep 2nd tiering them, don't worry about me.
No worries. I'm not 2nd tiering anything, the market decides that.
 

shinra-bansho

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Wait people are still arguing against the notion that Nintendo's first party is insufficient in itself to carry a modern console platform? Really? And they're still talking about the bazillion Mario Kart Wii sales as if that audience has been sustained and transitioned? How's that working out for NSMB or Wii Fit or fucking Donkey Kong...

Did I walk into 2012 by accident?
 

Psycho_Mantis

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Funny. I don't remember me saying anthing about the attach ratio at all?

Why now? Because I happened to take a look in the thread.

I'm not even trying to argue Wii U is a better software seller than Vita, I'm just saying you can't completely ignore bundles.
I gave you the reason. If you nothing else to say other than "bu but you can't ignore them" then don't bother replying.

sörine;103040756 said:
No worries. I'm not 2nd tiering anything, the market decides that.
So by that logic COD is the game of the generation.

Did I walk into 2012 by accident?
Seems like it lol.
 

test_account

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I don't have a preference on a particular Phantasy Star knock off since I don't own a Vita or a 3DS, so you can keep 2nd tiering them, don't worry about me.
So by that logic COD is the game of the generation.
To be fair, he said that he was only talking about sales, i dont think he ment anything about the quality of the games. I guess it can be discussed if 2nd tier should be used or not as a term in regards to sales since no hunting game come close to Monster Hunter in terms of sales (does that mean that no other hunting game can be concidered 1st tier besides Monster Hunter?), but hes right that those Vita hunting games are less popular compared to Monster Hunter. It would be the same with Call of Duty too, it is the best selling FPS franchise.
 

Apophis2036

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Wait people are still arguing against the notion that Nintendo's first party is insufficient in itself to carry a modern console platform? Really? And they're still talking about the bazillion Mario Kart Wii sales as if that audience has been sustained and transitioned? How's that working out for NSMB or Wii Fit or fucking Donkey Kong...

Did I walk into 2012 by accident?
I would argue NSMBU has done pretty well for a console that's as overpriced and under marketed as WiiU. It basically single-handedly moved 4 million consoles before 3D World hit and moved the rest.

And again I see you are making the mistake of judging WiiU software sales on opening week sales, let's see how Tropical Freeze sells throughout the rest of the year and I have a feeling it's going to do extremely well in the US and EU. It will probably be the third best selling game for the console come the end of the year behind only the two Mario games, not bad at all :).
 

Ty4on

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So by that logic COD is the game of the generation.
CoD isn't?
Wait people are still arguing against the notion that Nintendo's first party is insufficient in itself to carry a modern console platform? Really? And they're still talking about the bazillion Mario Kart Wii sales as if that audience has been sustained and transitioned? How's that working out for NSMB or Wii Fit or fucking Donkey Kong...

Did I walk into 2012 by accident?
Mario Kart will probably be big enough to bring hopes up though.

I played NSMBU today with four others and really wonder how it'd look had the WiiU been released in 2010. Being Nintendo though they'd have zero games available...
 

Oregano

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I gave you the reason. If you nothing else to say other than "bu but you can't ignore them" then don't bother reply.
It is still copies of the game sold. If you are disqualifying them based on the fact that they are were sold for a relatively lower value than normal then we should probably ignore any games that went on sale, or had a budget reprint. The difference is that we have (relatively) hard data for how much was bundled, but that is arguably all the more reason it should be acknowledged.

Ignoring the bundles simplifies the comparison but it isn't the complete picture; The PS4 launch shows that bundles can have a tangible effect on the wider software ecosystem.

I'd appreciate if you didn't reduce my argument like that by the way just as I didn't reduce yours to "bu buts it's confusing".

EDIT: To be fair I may have entered a bit abrasively and I can definitely see your point that the software sales wouldn't be as high without the bundles so it can be misleading without context.
 

RalchAC

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To be fair, he said that he was only talking about sales, i dont think he ment anything about the quality of the games. I guess it can be discussed if 2nd tier should be used or not as a term in regards to sales since no hunting game come close to Monster Hunter in terms of sales (does that mean that no other hunting game can be concidered 1st tier besides Monster Hunter?), but hes right that those Vita hunting games are less popular compared to Monster Hunter. It would be the same with Call of Duty too, it is the best selling FPS franchise.
Still, Rome wasn't built in a day. There are IPs like GE2 or Phantasy Star who may be kinda stagnant (wasn't GE to have an anime?), but we don't know if Toukiden or Freedom Wars can take off. I think Soul Sacrifice is "too niche" due to the aesthetic.

I think the first MonHun game on PS2 sold like 300.000 units. It wasn't until Portable 2nd when sales got really crazy.
 

L Thammy

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Kinda wish that MH talk was banned outside outside of the OT. It seems like it's just a vehicle for console wars bullcrap most of the time. Anyway.

Still, Rome wasn't built in a day. There are IPs like GE2 or Phantasy Star who may be kinda stagnant (wasn't GE to have an anime?), but we don't know if Toukiden or Freedom Wars can take off. I think Soul Sacrifice is "too niche" due to the aesthetic.

I think the first MonHun game on PS2 sold like 300.000 units. It wasn't until Portable 2nd when sales got really crazy.
I don't think that's quite right. When Monster Hunter first game out on consoles it was new and untested. On top of that, though local play has been instrumental to its success, it didn't hit handhelds until G was ported to PSP. The original Portable also had a ridiculous jump over the first two releases (more than doubling the original game despite a similar opening).

Yes, sales had a crazy jump with Portable 2nd (and later with 3rd), but the series had already experienced huge growth.

There's certainly a market for competitors, but people know what a hunting action game by now is and they're all on handhelds. Expecting them to suddenly explode like Monster Hunter did - especially if it's something like God Eater, which is already performing well - is really making a false equivalency. They're more likely to experience normal growth or decline.
 

Shengar

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Capcom advertising MH4 save data transfer to MH4G.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gbwk6m8leTk

Oh and 2015 Year Of Vita. Where else would Capcom release Monster Hunter 5? Revitalution is upon us.
Save data transfer from original to G version should the norm. I'm still buttmad that SS Delta don't have this.
lol is that even possible when Nintendo paid a fuckton of money to keep it exclusive on their platform?
 

test_account

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Still, Rome wasn't built in a day. There are IPs like GE2 or Phantasy Star who may be kinda stagnant (wasn't GE to have an anime?), but we don't know if Toukiden or Freedom Wars can take off. I think Soul Sacrifice is "too niche" due to the aesthetic.

I think the first MonHun game on PS2 sold like 300.000 units. It wasn't until Portable 2nd when sales got really crazy.
Sure, that is true, i wasnt saying anything against that :)


Save data transfer from original to G version should the norm. I'm still buttmad that SS Delta don't have this.
lol is that even possible when Nintendo paid a fuckton of money to keep it exclusive on their platform?
Are you sure? According to Famitsu info from December 2013, Soul Sacrifice Delta has a save transfer option from Soul Sacrifice:

"- Transfer save data from Soul Sacrifice into Delta
- When you transfer data over your right arm level will be reset
- To compensate for that, players will start with an item that increases the amount of experience you get
- Raiments, Black Rites, offerings (10 of them) and Lacrima (up to 10,000) will carry over as well as what happened in the game when you cleared it
"

http://gamingeverything.com/soul-sacrifice-delta-details

Unless something changed in developement since that time that i dont know about though, that is why i ask =)
 

Shengar

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sörine;103051547 said:
It's certainly the genre king and top tier in a sales context like it or not. I'm unsure how logic got you to your statement though?
Before you said that Monster Hunter is genre king and top tier because it sold the most (a fact, and fit the context since we're in the sales thread) you question the other poster taste, something which number definitely couldn't define.
Are you sure? According to Famitsu info from December 2013, Soul Sacrifice Delta has a save transfer option from Soul Sacrifice:

"- Transfer save data from Soul Sacrifice into Delta
- When you transfer data over your right arm level will be reset
- To compensate for that, players will start with an item that increases the amount of experience you get
- Raiments, Black Rites, offerings (10 of them) and Lacrima (up to 10,000) will carry over as well as what happened in the game when you cleared it
"

http://gamingeverything.com/soul-sacrifice-delta-details

Unless something changed in developement since that time that i dont know about though, that is why i ask =)
It's not a full data transfer, since your offering is limited to 10 (though I doubt it most people will use offerings more than that) and still no word on both sigils and essence. I don't want to fought Wyverns just for Exterminator Sigil III all over again D:
 

test_account

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It's not a full data transfer, since your offering is limited to 10 (though I doubt it most people will use offerings more than that) and still no word on both sigils and essence. I don't want to fought Wyverns just for Exterminator Sigil III all over again D:
I see. Seeing that the Black Rites transfer over, i would assume that the sigils and essence also carry over, unless that there is a big overhaul and tweaking in what the sigils does from Soul Sacrifice to Soul Sacrifice Delta. But who knows. I agree that it would suck to have to start all the grinding again if the sigils have exactly the same effect in both games. I'm mostly sadden/"annoyed" that Soul Sacrifice Delta hasnt been confirmed for a western release yet hehe :(
 

sörine

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Before you said that Monster Hunter is genre king and top tier because it sold the most (a fact, and fit the context since we're in the sales thread) you question the other poster taste, something which number definitely couldn't define.
I was answering a troll post with a troll post. My comments in this sales thread had to do with just sales, my comments on his garbage drive-by have no bearing on that.
 

DaBoss

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Wait people are still arguing against the notion that Nintendo's first party is insufficient in itself to carry a modern console platform? Really? And they're still talking about the bazillion Mario Kart Wii sales as if that audience has been sustained and transitioned? How's that working out for NSMB or Wii Fit or fucking Donkey Kong...

Did I walk into 2012 by accident?
My rule of thumb: Stay out of Media Create threads from Mondays and Tuesdays since that's the time for console wars and silly arguments to happen. It's been happening for a while now.

I guess the PS4 launch has been making people feel agitated or something.
 

Shengar

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sörine;103056803 said:
I was answering a troll post with a troll post. My comments in this sales thread had to do with just sales, my comments on his garbage drive-by have no bearing on that.
All right, point taken though I can't agree on fighting fire with fire.
 

Kid Ying

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Funny. I don't remember you saying the same thing when we ignored Knack in the attach ratio. Why now?

We ignore bundles because they blur the picture. If we didn't people might think Knack was a big hit or NSMBU had good legs when in both cases the opposite is probably true.

We were discussing software sales on WiiU. Software that basically comes free with a WiiU (what is it like 3 games for the price of 2k yen) which resulted in an extra 800k sales will obviously we ignored.

Anyway even with that WiiU is still 600k sales behind PSV in software sales.
?

Its two games for 2k yen. Wii fit cost an additional 2k, which was also the price for its tracker (the software was free, so anyone who bought the wii fit one really wanted specifically wii fit). And those games were digital, so there was little cost on nintendo part by bundling them.

People paid to get those games. You may ignore what You want though.
 

RalchAC

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Kinda wish that MH talk was banned outside outside of the OT. It seems like it's just a vehicle for console wars bullcrap most of the time. Anyway.
If people don't lose their temper I don't think there isn't any reason to ban the discussion.

I don't think that's quite right. When Monster Hunter first game out on consoles it was new and untested. On top of that, though local play has been instrumental to its success, it didn't hit handhelds until G was ported to PSP. The original Portable also had a ridiculous jump over the first two releases (more than doubling the original game despite a similar opening).
[/QUOTE]

When Monster Hunter was released first Phantasy Star Online was already 4 years in the market. The genre wasn't that big, sure, but it existed. MediaCreate 2006 top100 has it at slightly less than 600.000 units, which is good but not jaw-droping. And still, the first Portable game was the third entry in the series (there was the original, G and after that they ported the latter to the PSP*) so they had more oportunities to polish and balance that those news IPs.

That said, I'm sure Soul Sacrifice Delta is not going to set the world on fire like MH did due to its niche artstyle and other things we've already discussed on MC threads, but imo Toukiden or Freedom Wars have a chance to become big. One could be what BF is to CoD in terms of sales, especially since there isn't platform overlap.

First the Vita need to overcome that install base problem or the games need to be release somewhere else though. I won't be surprised if Toukiden Extreme gets a release on a Sony homeconsole tbh, especially if they want to bring it to the West (where the Vita sales are terrible and I don't know if Toukiden sales are good enough)

*I'm not 100% sure if MH Portable was a direct port or had some new monster / contents.
 

Foshy

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Has there even been a big new shipment last week though? Looking at worldwide trends, PS4 always got very sporadic shipments of varying size.

I'm not saying the Japanese market isn't dead, but we need sell-through numbers more than ever in this case to make a statement. PS4 isn't in overabundant supply, it could very well be that 60-70k is all they shipped last week.
 

Chris1964

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Ouch if it is 50 - 60 K

PS4 bomba if so. At least until it gets a better software lineup.
Sony said 370k sold through until March 2. There isn't if. The blog was right. It depends which tracker Sony uses.

Has there even been a big new shipment last week though? Looking at worldwide trends, PS4 always got very sporadic shipments of varying size.

I'm not saying the Japanese market isn't dead, but we need sell-through numbers more than ever in this case to make a statement. PS4 isn't in overabundant supply, it could very well be that 60-70k is all they shipped last week.
There were 40-50k unsold from first week.
 

Psycho_Mantis

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sörine;103051547 said:
It's certainly the genre king and top tier in a sales context like it or not. I'm unsure how logic got you to your statement though?
CoD isn't?


Mario Kart will probably be big enough to bring hopes up though.

I played NSMBU today with four others and really wonder how it'd look had the WiiU been released in 2010. Being Nintendo though they'd have zero games available...
sales =/ quality

?

Its two games for 2k yen. Wii fit cost an additional 2k, which was also the price for its tracker (the software was free, so anyone who bought the wii fit one really wanted specifically wii fit). And those games were digital, so there was little cost on nintendo part by bundling them.

People paid to get those games. You may ignore what You want though.
Hmm so I guess PS4 does not have a bad attach rate but actually the best attach rate in the history of consoles in Japan. Wow. Who would have though that the PS4 was such a sales beast. Oh and that Knack man. For a new IP, 300k+ opening is phenomenal.

We are not ignoring sales but taking into consideration that those sales were gained through aggressive bundling.

When the WiiU has sold 2.9 million units of software of which 800k are from bundling its pretty clear how dire the software situation is on WiiU. I mean PSV software sales are 3.5 million. Puts things into perspective.

Ouch if it is 50 - 60 K

PS4 bomba if so. At least until it gets a better software lineup.
Depends on shipment. If they shipped 60k then its clearly supply constrained.
 

Psycho_Mantis

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As said by Chris, there were still 40-50k left from the first shipment in Japan, so it's not so supply costrained as elsewhere, by far.
??

We have three different figures for shipments though they all have the same sell through. How do you know which one is the most accurate?
 

AniHawk

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As said by Chris, there were still 40-50k left from the first shipment in Japan, so it's not so supply costrained as elsewhere, by far.
my backup theory is that the traditional gaming industry is doomed.

??

We have three different figures for shipments though they all have the same sell through. How do you know which one is the most accurate?
whatever media create says is truth because media create is love